Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders losing their sparkle?

[Taibhse]

Just a heads up to other UK collectors..

For quite some time I have been a staunch fan of Forbidden Planet(.com) here in the UK.. they do not have the cheapest prices, but the Customer Service has generally been good and I felt they were a safe pair of hands for my orders.. however recently things appear to have been going a bit Pete Tong.

I have quite an extensive list of Pre-orders logged with them currently, in no small part due to their No Deposit policy.. however the delay between release dates in the UK, compared with the USA, has meant I have been keeping a closer than usual watch on release details and this has sprung a rather disagreeable surprise.

Sideshow's Clone Trooper Deluxe: 501st figure is readily available on their store and was due to ship end of March / beginning of April here in the UK according to FP.. however I have just discovered that the figure has now been listed as Sold Out on Forbidden Planet(.com)'s website and I have been sent an email claiming the release date has been postponed until "late May or early June"

Now I have to ask myself this.. If the figure is available from Sideshow and marked as Sold Out on Forbidden Planet(.com)'s website.. why am I being told the release is postponed.. and more importantly why has my Pre-order not been fulfilled.. because it looks as though some people have had their orders fulfilled.. how else do you get from Pre-order to Sold Out status?!.. WTF is going on!


(I can haz break from wall of text?)

This has happened once before with FP.. on the Kotobukiya Batman Black Costume ArtFX Statue.. there was a wait list.. I was on it.. there was a re-release pre-order.. I was on it.. the figure was then advertised as in stock on the FP website... but I never received my order.. and the figure then sold out.
Lair of The Octopus made a Super Alloy Batman sale and I cancelled my Kotobukiya Pre-order with FP, since it obviously was not going to be fulfilled (not so smart of FP).

The reason the Kotobukiya story is important is because it sets the precedent.. if I had not been watching what was going on, I could have been completely unaware that without notification or explanation, my Pre-order was quietly just shelved.

Now, on a Kotobukiya Batman Black Costume ArtFX Statue this is a relatively small matter.. but on Hot Toys and Sideshow figures, it now appears I could find that, after months of patient waiting with a Pre-Order, I am suddenly having to try to source an 'in demand' figure on the aftermarket at eye-watering prices, because my Pre-order has simply not been honored.. and that is scary!!!

* Also on my Pre-orders with FP and yet now sold out (with no shipping notification) -
Jakks Pacific 501st Clone Trooper
Pop! B9 Robot

* On Pre-order and marked as in stock at Forbidden Planet(.com) but not shipment notified, until I kicked off yesterday.. Sideshow Commander Wolffe

Will I be watching the processing of my FP Pre-order for Hot Toys War Machine Mark II (listed as available from 6th April) like a hawk.. Dang right!

..and I will probably be moving my Clone Trooper Deluxe: 501st order direct to Sideshow.. if I can't trust a Pre-order to be fulfilled, there is no point in not ordering direct.. plus I will get Reward Points.

Forbidden Planet(.com) pull your finger out.. or watch almost £2k of Pre-orders get cancelled and placed with someone else.

*Rant Over*
.. Furiosity status returned to 'Grumpy'

 

[Sixx]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

I had a problem with them a couple of years ago. Had the Koto X-Force Archangel pre-ordered with them. Just before it was due to be released my order was cancelled with no notice. haven't used them again since

 

[BagginsOfBagEnd]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

I pre-ordered two Hobbit statues from them last year, then they decided they weren't having them in. I only found out by checking on the order in the account section after I knew the items had been released....apparently the statues had been 'discontinued and were no longer available', however they never bothered to let me know this (very good of them ) so I had to email them to find out what they were playing at! Needless to say I have not preordered from them since!

 

[Sixx]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

Sounds like exactly what happened to me. when I spoke to them and said that some form of communication would have been nice, they didn't seem to think they had to let me know

 

[Taibhse]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

Sounds like exactly what happened to me. when I spoke to them and said that some form of communication would have been nice, they didn't seem to think they had to let me know

Yup, you would think that good communication with Pre-order customers would be a priority..because customers who Pre-order are likely to spend considerably more with Forbidden Planet, than those who do not.

I didn't mention it in the opening post, because it was a fairly heavy wall of text anyway, but the other irritation with FP(.com) as you and Baggins mentioned, is when FP decide they are not in fact going to stock an item after all.. despite taking Pre-orders.

The email FP send out to customers under these circumstances, tends to suggest the product is 'cancelled' by the manufacturer, which implies that it will not be available from any other retailer.

Not only this is a bare faced economy with the truth, if the product has not been cancelled by the manufacturer.. it is also commercially counter-productive.. When customers discover their Pre-order is not going to be honoured and FP is effectively trying to prevent them from ordering the item elsewhere, this pretty much ensures that products from that company will never be Pre-ordered by those customers through Forbidden Planet(.com) again and it undermines FP's standing with the customer at the same time.

That 'cancelled product email' situation has happened to me twice with FP.. First with a Pre-order for Big Chief's Doctor Who Dynamix Figure and second, with a Pre-order for Toynami's Shogun Bender.. in the end I bought the Big Chief figure direct and the Toynami Bender from BBTS.

.. and I discovered what was really going on, here on Sideshow Freaks.. possibly the best source of Toy news on the interwebz!

 

[Captain Hindsight]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

I can probably answer most of that.

1) US get their stuff before the UK so it showing as in stock at Sideshow but postponed at FP is not unusual. They haven't received it yet that's all.

2) The item now showing as sold out and the release date moving is the same. They have so many that they order and when they have pre-orders to match that number it shows as sold out, even if it hasn't been received by FP yet. They've sold out of their order number by people placing pre-orders.

3) Sideshow are renowned for short shipping trade. FP order 50, they take 50 pre-orders and then only receive 40. The last 10 people to pre-order miss out. It's not great but that's why they don't charge for pre-orders. If you want guaranteed stock get your pre-order in as soon as it's on their site and should be fine. Alternatively use the grey importers and pay a deposit, they seem to be able to guarantee numbers coming in through their own suppliers.

Unfortunately FP remove the expected release date once the sold out page goes up but you're reading too much into it, they've just sold out of the number they have ordered from Sideshow, in pre-orders.

It's not ideal, but as I said, if you pre-order straight away you shouldn't have any issues, I never have.

 

[Taibhse]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

I can probably answer most of that.

1) US get their stuff before the UK so it showing as in stock at Sideshow but postponed at FP is not unusual. They haven't received it yet that's all.

2) The item now showing as sold out and the release date moving is the same. They have so many that they order and when they have pre-orders to match that number it shows as sold out, even if it hasn't been received by FP yet. They've sold out of their order number by people placing pre-orders.

3) Sideshow are renowned for short shipping trade. FP order 50, they take 50 pre-orders and then only receive 40. The last 10 people to pre-order miss out. It's not great but that's why they don't charge for pre-orders. If you want guaranteed stock get your pre-order in as soon as it's on their site and should be fine. Alternatively use the grey importers and pay a deposit, they seem to be able to guarantee numbers coming in through their own suppliers.

Unfortunately FP remove the expected release date once the sold out page goes up but you're reading too much into it, they've just sold out of the number they have ordered from Sideshow, in pre-orders.

It's not ideal, but as I said, if you pre-order straight away you shouldn't have any issues, I never have.

Got to disagree with you on 2. Captain Hindsight.. FP have indeed recently started to use a 'Pre-order sold out' notification on their website (Hot Toys Starboost) which is a good thing .. but it is not something I have noticed in the past.
It is possible it has been used and I did not see it (on figures I was not interested in) but in that case it has not been a consistent policy..I have been very quick on FP's Hot Toys Iron Man Pre-order announcements and the change of status designation on Starboost was unexpected enough, for me to make a note of it.

I take your point on getting in early on a Pre-order, but my Pre-orders shelved by FP have been a mix.. some long standing and some approx 1- 2 months before expected shipping.
My main point was, if the product is still available though Sideshow, I'm not seeing why FP would only get 40 of their 50 pre-orders shipped.. or why there is such a massive delay before the next shipping date.

I cancelled the Clone Trooper Deluxe 501st figure Pre-order at FP ..and re-ordered direct from Sideshow. It was simply too risky to wait and hope FP honoured the postponed shipping date in June.. if Sideshow sold out in the meantime and FP failed to deliver for a second time, I would be left looking at after market prices.. not happening!

 

[Captain Hindsight]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

Looks like they've just changed the wording from Sold out to Sold out to pre-order to me.

I understand your concern though and if they ever fail to deliver for me I'll probably be annoyed enough to go elsewhere too. Thus far no problems however and I'm not keen on paying deposits because, well, look at what happened with Mother's Basement.

Sideshow have been known to short ship, I don't think it has any relevance to how many they have in stock. They aren't going to eat into their own stock to supply suppliers because that would eat into their profits.

 

[Taibhse]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

Looks like they've just changed the wording from Sold out to Sold out to pre-order to me.

I understand your concern though and if they ever fail to deliver for me I'll probably be annoyed enough to go elsewhere too. Thus far no problems however and I'm not keen on paying deposits because, well, look at what happened with Mother's Basement.

Sideshow have been known to short ship, I don't think it has any relevance to how many they have in stock. They aren't going to eat into their own stock to supply suppliers because that would eat into their profits.

Yup, I may not have been concise enough.. what I meant was, in the past I am used to seeing FP leave figures as Pre-orderable right up until the shipping date (whether that date is postponed or not) and then change it either to 'Sold Out'.. or just the 'Web Price' and a purchase button, meaning it is in stock and available.. but I had not seen the 'Sold Out To Pre-order' designation before, however its a good idea to have that designation, since customers will not be placing Pre-orders that have no hope of being fulfilled, since this benefits no-one and just annoys the customer.

Fair point about Sideshow protecting their stock allocation.. it was one of the reasons I was not prepared to risk missing out, by trusting FP's second delivery forecast.

 

[Captain Hindsight]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

its a good idea to have that designation, since customers will not be placing Pre-orders that have no hope of being fulfilled, since this benefits no-one and just annoys the customer.

That would never happen, they don't just leave the pre-order open until stock arrives because they already know what they've ordered. It works like this.

1) Sideshow announce a new product.

2) FP order, through Amerang I believe, although it could be direct, the number they want and they have a very small window in which to do this, right after the product is announced. That's it, it would be only rare circumstances in which they could later ask for more.

3) A long time later, and this is after Sideshow have already got their stock and started selling, the UK suppliers like FP get their stock in.

At this point they may get less than they asked for, in which case the order status that was still accepting the day before may go to sold out as they don't have enough to fulfil.

Nothing you have mentioned is new or suspicious, I've seen the sold out message on pre-orders many times in the past. They ask for 50, they allow 50 pre-orders and no more. They end up getting 40 and any pre-orders made after 40 miss out. This has always been the case to the best of my knowledge.

Order as soon as the product is up for pre-order and you'll be fine.

You need to remember that these are limited edition items so if Sideshow receive a load more orders from trade than normal they can't simply make more to meet demand, they just short ship everyone in equal measure.

Why this doesn't appear to affect the grey importers I'm not sure.

 

[Taibhse]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

That would never happen, they don't just leave the pre-order open until stock arrives because they already know what they've ordered. It works like this.

1) Sideshow announce a new product.

2) FP order, through Amerang I believe, although it could be direct, the number they want and they have a very small window in which to do this, right after the product is announced. That's it, it would be only rare circumstances in which they could later ask for more.

3) A long time later, and this is after Sideshow have already got their stock and started selling, the UK suppliers like FP get their stock in.

At this point they may get less than they asked for, in which case the order status that was still accepting the day before may go to sold out as they don't have enough to fulfil.

Nothing you have mentioned is new or suspicious, I've seen the sold out message on pre-orders many times in the past. They ask for 50, they allow 50 pre-orders and no more. They end up getting 40 and any pre-orders made after 40 miss out. This has always been the case to the best of my knowledge.

Order as soon as the product is up for pre-order and you'll be fine.

You need to remember that these are limited edition items so if Sideshow receive a load more orders from trade than normal they can't simply make more to meet demand, they just short ship everyone in equal measure.

Why this doesn't appear to affect the grey importers I'm not sure.

I understand what you are saying.. however 2. just does not hold up.. Hot Toys Iron Man Mark 42 is still up for Pre-order at FP.. I Pre-ordered mine back in July 2013.. Hot Toys Iron Man Igor, still up for Pre-order at FP.. my Pre-order dates to October 2013.. Sideshow Imperial Probe Droid, still up for Pre-order at FP.. my Pre-order dated 7th December 2013

.. that does not strike me as FP having a "very small window.. right after the product is announced" or if they do, then something is clearly amiss.. see what I'm saying?

Now you could suggest that the reason those figures are still up for Pre-order is that FP still has quota available.. but then we are back with my original comment which is, if I can place a Pre-order, then it should be fulfilled.. yet if FP get short shipped then the quota is irrelevant.. in which case a couple of months after the product announcement, I should simply order direct ..because on a 'fulfill earliest orders first' basis, I risk not getting my Pre-order fulfilled.. which is what appeared to happen with my Sideshow Clone Trooper Deluxe: 501st Pre-order.

Fundamentally the problem is this.. the bits of your post I have highlighted, mean that as long as quota is 'available' then yes, FP do leave Pre-orders open until stock arrives.. at which point as you say, FP may discover that a 'quota based order status' and the actual delivery do not match.. which unfortunately, as far as the customer is concerned, looks no different to 'just leaving the Pre-order open until stock arrives'.

 

[Captain Hindsight]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

.. that does not strike me as FP having a "very small window.. right after the product is announced" or if they do, then something is clearly amiss.. see what I'm saying?

No idea mate, sorry.

It's as I wrote it, that's how it works, simple as that. They have those figures you mention up for pre-order still because they have not yet had enough pre-orders to match the order they put in. There is no conspiracy theory here. They do have a small window in which to put in their order, I'm not guessing about that, it's a fact.

If you get a trade account with Amerang, a figure is announced by Sideshow and then you have a few weeks to put in an order. After that you've missed your chance. If Amerang get less than they ordered once the product arrives they short ship everyone in equal measure. Sideshow products are so popular it is very rare if ever, that you will get the chance to order more once your original order has gone in.

Not much more to say here.

 

[Taibhse]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

No idea mate, sorry.

It's as I wrote it, that's how it works, simple as that. They have those figures you mention up for pre-order still because they have not yet had enough pre-orders to match the order they put in. There is no conspiracy theory here. They do have a small window in which to put in their order, I'm not guessing about that, it's a fact.

If you get a trade account with Amerang, a figure is announced by Sideshow and then you have a few weeks to put in an order. After that you've missed your chance. If Amerang get less than they ordered once the product arrives they short ship everyone in equal measure. Sideshow products are so popular it is very rare if ever, that you will get the chance to order more once your original order has gone in.

Not much more to say here.

Ok, I'm obviously still not being clear enough.

I am not saying there is a conspiracy.. I'm saying that if FP work from a quota based on their original order, then Pre-orders are in effect left open until stock arrives (because there is 'availability' under the expected quota from FP's 'short window' order with Amerang).. unless either the figure is a great deal more popular than expected, or FP have been given a restricted original quota by Amerang for another reason (ie. a genuine limited edition).. in which case, it is possible the figure will get designated 'Sold Out To Pre-order' (eg. Hot Toys Starboost).. but this designation is much less common than you are implying.

However since the customer and FP have no way of knowing in advance whether the quota will be fulfilled or short shipped by Amerang, the effect is exactly the same, in real terms, as FP leaving the Pre-orders open until stock arrives.. from the customer's perspective.

So, if the customer has not Pre-ordered in the first couple of months after the release announcement by FP, then in fact because of the 'oldest order first' system, the customer would be well advised to order direct, to avoid falling foul of a short shipment by Amerang.. because the customer will have absolutely no way of knowing where their Pre-order is on FP's order quota timeline, if the customer orders later.

.. and your second to last comment appears to confirm that it would be very unwise for customers to rely on any 'wishful thinking' second shipment date, issued by FP.

Hope that clarifies the points I was trying to make.


At any rate I will find out in the next day or so, whether you are correct about the importance of Pre-ordering early with FP.. because the Hot Toys War Machine Mark 2 Pre-order was open up until this weekend (the expected delivery date was 6th April)..the delivery did arrive over the weekend, at which point the designation promptly moved to 'Sold Out'.
Since I Pre-ordered pretty much as soon as FP announced the figure (Pre-order dated July 2013) lets hope there is no problem with my order, because if there is.. all my other Hot Toys and Sideshow Pre-orders will get moved from FP, direct to Sideshow.

On a positive note, my Sideshow Commander Wolffe arrived from FP this morning.. and its awesome!

 

[Captain Hindsight]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

It's not that uncommon for them to sell out on pre-orders. I currently have the Batman PF and the Superman PF pre-ordered, both have sold out. Same story with the modern age Batman bust. Same story with the comic book Black Widow statue.

I only found those with a quick search.

 

[Taibhse]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

It's not that uncommon for them to sell out on pre-orders. I currently have the Batman PF and the Superman PF pre-ordered, both have sold out. Same story with the modern age Batman bust. Same story with the comic book Black Widow statue.

I only found those with a quick search.

Unfortunately I do not collect statues, which would explain why I have not seen those designations (aren't a lot of PF's limited editions?).. I notice you did not list any Action figures, which I do collect.


I am also now in a position to comment on your assertion that pre-ordering 'early' with Forbidden Planet(.com) means I should have nothing to worry about and FP will fulfill the order.. you appear to be very wrong.

I mentioned in an earlier post that I had a Pre-order with FP for the Hot Toys Wart Machine Mark 2 dated from July 2013, just after FP announced the Pre-order.
Due to the problem with my unfulfilled Pre-order for a Sideshow Clone Trooper Deluxe (501st) I questioned FP as to whether my Pre-order for the War Machine Mark 2 was going to be fulfilled, this was done last week.. before the expected delivery date (6th April).. I received an email from FP saying that the delivery was expected at the weekend and they would be able to update me after that.

The Pre-order designation for the War Machine Mark 2 was changed to 'Sold Out' over the weekend, so on Monday I sent an email requesting confirmation my Pre-order was being processed for shipping.. today I received an email from FP stating no stock was available and they had a new shipping date of '"middle / end of May'".

So despite having Pre-ordered soon after the figure was announced by FP in July 2013 and despite having reminded FP about my order a couple of days before some stock was delivered last weekend.. I know they received stock, because the figure is listed as a Sold Out designation NOT 'Release Date Postponed' or 'Sold Out To Pre-order' but SOLD OUT.. I must therefore presume my Pre-order is not going to be fulfilled ( you mentioned earlier that the chances of a second delivery are virtually non-existent), to ensure I can actually source a WM Mk 2 at retail from another supplier, rather than aftermarket prices

.. Furiosity level raised to 11.


So Forbidden Planet(.com) will be seeing my money walking away, as I cancel my other Pre-orders.. and re-order with Sideshow, plus of course no new Pre-orders with Forbidden Planet(.com), since Forbidden Planet(.com)'s Pre-order system appears to have no logical rules whatsoever.. no matter how early you book.

 

[Collectorcol]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

Haven't used them for years. Too expensive.

Zavvi have just cancelled my pre-order with no notice.
It was an obvious misprice but an email would if been nice.

Trusted U.K retailers are few and far between.

 

[Captain Hindsight]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

Everything you're having a rage over is purely assumption, you don't know what you think you know. Aside from that I can't be bothered repeating the same thing over and over again as you clearly don't understand how it works, or more likely, don't want to listen.

I'm wrong, you're right, whatever. I still receive all my orders despite being wrong so no problem for me.

By the way, when I said order straight away I meant within a few days of the product going up, not the 3 months that you're referring to here. This product was announced in April so ordering in July is not what I would call "just after".

 

[Collectorcol]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

Wow! I know nothing about advertising and Taibhse knows nothing about retailers.
At least we know who to seek out for advice now.

I remember you calling ME argumentative

 

[Captain Hindsight]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

Wow! I know nothing about advertising and Taibhse knows nothing about retailers.

True dat.

I work in digital marketing, I'm involved with online advertising for a living, I have an affiliate account with Forbidden Planet, I have a trade account with Amerang. Of course you guys know more than me though because you have more post counts on a forum.

Keep on slagging me off Col, as long as it makes you feel better I don't mind. Every time I try and help someone out you turn up to have a pop at me. I've told the guy how it works and after all that he comes back and says that I appear to be very wrong. And I'm the argumentative one?

Think I'll give the forum a miss from now on, I'm not in with the popular crowd so my opinion isn't wanted, clearly.

 

[Taibhse]

Re: Are Forbidden Planet(.com)'s No deposit Pre-orders loosing their sparkle?

True dat.

I work in digital marketing, I'm involved with online advertising for a living, I have an affiliate account with Forbidden Planet, I have a trade account with Amerang. Of course you guys know more than me though because you have more post counts on a forum.

Keep on slagging me off Col, as long as it makes you feel better I don't mind. Every time I try and help someone out you turn up to have a pop at me. I've told the guy how it works and after all that he comes back and says that I appear to be very wrong. And I'm the argumentative one?

Think I'll give the forum a miss from now on, I'm not in with the popular crowd so my opinion isn't wanted, clearly.

With the greatest respect, we are having a robust debate about the virtues or otherwise of Forbidden Planet(.com)'s Pre-Order system.. We are all entitled to an opinion on the Customer Service we have individually received.. and what we think of a Retailer who leaves the Pre-Order status of a product open for a year, despite (according to your earlier comments) knowing they may be seriously short shipped by their Distributor.
Frankly, the suggestion that anyone who orders more than a a couple of days after a product is announced by FP, should then suck it up a year later, if they do not get their Pre-order honoured, I find totally unacceptable.. this is not a limited edition of 100 figures Urban Vinyl art release and even if it were, those get marked as sold out (often within minutes of release).

In fairness, I went back and checked my FP promotional emails from 2013.. although I found an Iron Patriot promotion from 29th April, the earliest FP email mentioning War Machine Mark 2 I could find was from mid-May.. so I will withdraw my claim that I Pre-ordered 'just after' the UK release announcement and I apologise for my error.

In truth I probably didn't register that original email, since it was during the period when I was finding a new home and moving house, meaning the War Machine order was placed very soon after I had completed that process.. however I still stand by my comment that if I Pre-ordered nine months ago, I am entitled to expect to receive a product I could have ordered direct much, much more recently.. FP's logistical issues are not the customer's problem.. especially if FP leave the item available to Pre-Order for a year.

..interestingly, Forbidden Planet(.com) have now changed the Status on War Machine Mark 2 back to Pre-Order!.. with a date for stock of 15th May.. so I have decided to give them a chance to redeem themselves.


You should not feel that your opinion does not have value or vacate the forum, just because someone with a higher post count growls at you.. your opinion is just as valid as mine.