<BEASTMASTER>
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Re: <BEASTMASTER> CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Quick Solo wig swap test
Quick Solo wig swap test
CUSTOMIZINGS
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Re: <BEASTMASTER> CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Wait -- Solo looks like Indy. Can that be?
Great stuff happening here -- and I love your project list.
Wait -- Solo looks like Indy. Can that be?
Great stuff happening here -- and I love your project list.
The Rogster
Super Freak
Re: <BEASTMASTER> CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Haha awesome!
Haha awesome!
Rogerbee
Super Freak
Re: <BEASTMASTER> CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
I'd say you've pretty much nailed it. You're at that point where only you would really notice any more differences. I'd get one printed so you can see it in true 3D and then take it from there.
I'd say you've pretty much nailed it. You're at that point where only you would really notice any more differences. I'd get one printed so you can see it in true 3D and then take it from there.
Rogerbee
Super Freak
Re: <BEASTMASTER> CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Sweet, could you try an Empire look?
Quick Solo wig swap test
Sweet, could you try an Empire look?
<BEASTMASTER>
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Re: <BEASTMASTER> CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
I doubt I'll do Empire as I'm only working on ANH and one Han is enough for me Just spent a few hours modeling the fedora hat. I used a side reference of Indy to get the proportions right, then eyeballed the rest.
I doubt I'll do Empire as I'm only working on ANH and one Han is enough for me
Just spent a few hours modeling the fedora hat. I used a side reference of Indy to get the proportions right, then eyeballed the rest.
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Re: <BEASTMASTER> CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
takemymoney.jpg
Just as long as you print it out big to account for shrinkage in the mold. . . that's money, baby.
And please size it bigger than the HT head. WGP made that mistake of sizing it against the HT and it came out much too small.
takemymoney.jpg
Just as long as you print it out big to account for shrinkage in the mold. . . that's money, baby.
And please size it bigger than the HT head. WGP made that mistake of sizing it against the HT and it came out much too small.
The Rogster
Super Freak
Re: <BEASTMASTER> CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Make the front of the brim come down in like a "u" shape, then it'll be right on!!
Make the front of the brim come down in like a "u" shape, then it'll be right on!!
Rogerbee
Super Freak
Re: CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Was the crown higher than that in Raiders? You never really see that hat at enough of the right angles to really judge. The other trouble is that there is no proper 1/6 Raiders hat that you can really refer to and say "That's the one, make it like that.".
The other thing you've definitely got to do for the one you print is to get that focal length dead on, as I said, 120mm will be the best (I know this because I spoke at length with a professional photographer who took reference shots of a model who was later reproduced as a 3D model. I couldn't fathom why what I rendered didn't look like what he'd done when it was the same source, then he told me about the focal length and it all clicked.) , otherwise what gets outputted will look odd like the WGP did.
Get every element on the money and this could well be the definitive Indy
Was the crown higher than that in Raiders? You never really see that hat at enough of the right angles to really judge. The other trouble is that there is no proper 1/6 Raiders hat that you can really refer to and say "That's the one, make it like that.".
The other thing you've definitely got to do for the one you print is to get that focal length dead on, as I said, 120mm will be the best (I know this because I spoke at length with a professional photographer who took reference shots of a model who was later reproduced as a 3D model. I couldn't fathom why what I rendered didn't look like what he'd done when it was the same source, then he told me about the focal length and it all clicked.) , otherwise what gets outputted will look odd like the WGP did.
Get every element on the money and this could well be the definitive Indy
<BEASTMASTER>
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Re: CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
I'm confused with the whole shrinkage thing as some people say only a small percentage shrinks and doesn't make much difference. Not sure what happened with the WGP head though it came out very small from the images I saw. The advantage having a 3d printer is I can always print another if the size is off
Cheers Rogster, tweaked the hat..
I'm confused with the whole shrinkage thing as some people say only a small percentage shrinks and doesn't make much difference. Not sure what happened with the WGP head though it came out very small from the images I saw. The advantage having a 3d printer is I can always print another if the size is off
Cheers Rogster, tweaked the hat..
Rogerbee
Super Freak
Re: CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Hmm, now I look at it, the shape of the brim makes the crown look taller. Maybe you have actually nailed it now. I've only really got Trev's to go by. Shrinkage is more what happens when the printed head has a mould taken off it and is then cast. Some of Trev's heads look big because it looks as though he allowed for shrinkage, but it didn't shrink quite as much as he thought when it was cast.
Hmm, now I look at it, the shape of the brim makes the crown look taller. Maybe you have actually nailed it now. I've only really got Trev's to go by. Shrinkage is more what happens when the printed head has a mould taken off it and is then cast. Some of Trev's heads look big because it looks as though he allowed for shrinkage, but it didn't shrink quite as much as he thought when it was cast.
IndianaPaul
Super Freak
Re: CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Wow, looks great. Only thing I see is that the nose seems like it should go out further. It looks too small (squashed in one dimension) in the side profile. That could just be me, though. I'm not comparing it to anything. I guess a good reference to check it would be from Raiders when he's talking to Belloq after the market fight, might get a good side profile there.
Wow, looks great. Only thing I see is that the nose seems like it should go out further. It looks too small (squashed in one dimension) in the side profile. That could just be me, though. I'm not comparing it to anything. I guess a good reference to check it would be from Raiders when he's talking to Belloq after the market fight, might get a good side profile there.
The Rogster
Super Freak
Re: CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Awesome! If you're going for Raiders, make the pinch tighter on the crown and it'll be perfect. This will be the best Indy by far! :0
Awesome! If you're going for Raiders, make the pinch tighter on the crown and it'll be perfect. This will be the best Indy by far! :0
The Rogster
Super Freak
Re: CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Oh and I agree with indianapaul about the nose, that's a minor fix
Oh and I agree with indianapaul about the nose, that's a minor fix
Rogerbee
Super Freak
Re: CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Here's something good, a profile of his head and the hat:
Here's something good, a profile of his head and the hat:
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Re: CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Shrinkage depends on what kind of silicon you use for your mold. Resin heats up as it cures/mixes, and it will cause the silicon to distort. Silicon is available in different hardnesses. So, the harder your silicon the less affected it will be by the heat from the resin and it will distort less. I've found that it always distorts vertically across the face, making the face slightly narrower, and you lose the roundness of the jaw/cheek area. It's most noticeable after you pull 10 or so casts. The first 5 or so, you'd be hard-pressed to see any difference from your original. This PDF from Smooth-On can explain it better. You'd probably want something around 40A.
I've forgotten the numbers by now, but there was a green silicon that I used that was hard(er) and a pink silicon that was softer. And I noticed much less distortion in the green silicon mold.
The way I always saw shrinkage work is like if the nose was a hinge for the two sides of the face, each side kinda curves inward. Shrinkage is most affected by the widest part at the front of the cheekbones. So, if I were a sculptor and printed out a head, I would make the jaw/cheek area, maybe 5% wider than it ought to be. Maybe only barely noticeable in your sculpt in digital form, but it will be enough to account for inevitable shrinkage.
So, I think what you've been hearing is that the cast shrinks maybe only .25%, but on each successive casting, you see that .25% start adding up, and by the time you get to that 15th or 20th casting, you start to see that noticeable distortion.
If you do do the castings yourself, I would strongly recommend Smooth-On 326, it's a clear-ish resin that you can tint to a skintone, very good quality, captures detail nicely. OR if you send it out to a casting service, I recommend these guys. Sometimes they're a bit slow, but the castings are great.
Also, I just saw this silicon, I can't recall if it's what we were using, but it specifically states one of it's uses is resisting shrinkage when molding with resin.
I'm confused with the whole shrinkage thing as some people say only a small percentage shrinks and doesn't make much difference. Not sure what happened with the WGP head though it came out very small from the images I saw. The advantage having a 3d printer is I can always print another if the size is off
Shrinkage depends on what kind of silicon you use for your mold. Resin heats up as it cures/mixes, and it will cause the silicon to distort. Silicon is available in different hardnesses. So, the harder your silicon the less affected it will be by the heat from the resin and it will distort less. I've found that it always distorts vertically across the face, making the face slightly narrower, and you lose the roundness of the jaw/cheek area. It's most noticeable after you pull 10 or so casts. The first 5 or so, you'd be hard-pressed to see any difference from your original. This PDF from Smooth-On can explain it better. You'd probably want something around 40A.
I've forgotten the numbers by now, but there was a green silicon that I used that was hard(er) and a pink silicon that was softer. And I noticed much less distortion in the green silicon mold.
The way I always saw shrinkage work is like if the nose was a hinge for the two sides of the face, each side kinda curves inward. Shrinkage is most affected by the widest part at the front of the cheekbones. So, if I were a sculptor and printed out a head, I would make the jaw/cheek area, maybe 5% wider than it ought to be. Maybe only barely noticeable in your sculpt in digital form, but it will be enough to account for inevitable shrinkage.
So, I think what you've been hearing is that the cast shrinks maybe only .25%, but on each successive casting, you see that .25% start adding up, and by the time you get to that 15th or 20th casting, you start to see that noticeable distortion.
If you do do the castings yourself, I would strongly recommend Smooth-On 326, it's a clear-ish resin that you can tint to a skintone, very good quality, captures detail nicely. OR if you send it out to a casting service, I recommend these guys. Sometimes they're a bit slow, but the castings are great.
Also, I just saw this silicon, I can't recall if it's what we were using, but it specifically states one of it's uses is resisting shrinkage when molding with resin.
<BEASTMASTER>
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Re: CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Great! Thanks for the feedback guys, if anyone knows indy better its on this forum regarding the nose, I measured it to that side image and it matches up good. I think because his nose is slightly bent it looks smaller from his right side as it squashes in more, though looks longer on his left side as its stretching over to the right a little. Though the pic did show the hat was too tall and ear was out of place, so I amended that.
Sweedingheat: Thanks for the casting info I had some silicone for casting metal which I've had for years but never used, so decided to mold my DC head last night. Dam! Never knew it could get so messy as its like paint. I ended up using almost the whole tin and kept running out and having to mix more etc. I've yet to see the result so will start opening it up today. The silicone is pretty solid as it is for high temperature. I bought a white polyurethane resin that was recommended in a model shop so if the mold is ok I'll try this out and see if there is shrinkage compared to the master. Only thing about cutting it out is removing the supports. I put one right at the front of the nose :\
You know looking at other peoples figures I always thought the Trevo head looked pretty big, though on my figure the head size looked perfect! Could be more to do with the neck. If I can find pictures I'll post them up.
Great! Thanks for the feedback guys, if anyone knows indy better its on this forum
regarding the nose, I measured it to that side image and it matches up good. I think because his nose is slightly bent it looks smaller from his right side as it squashes in more, though looks longer on his left side as its stretching over to the right a little. Though the pic did show the hat was too tall and ear was out of place, so I amended that.
Sweedingheat: Thanks for the casting info
I had some silicone for casting metal which I've had for years but never used, so decided to mold my DC head last night. Dam! Never knew it could get so messy as its like paint. I ended up using almost the whole tin and kept running out and having to mix more etc. I've yet to see the result so will start opening it up today. The silicone is pretty solid as it is for high temperature. I bought a white polyurethane resin that was recommended in a model shop so if the mold is ok I'll try this out and see if there is shrinkage compared to the master. Only thing about cutting it out is removing the supports. I put one right at the front of the nose :\
You know looking at other peoples figures I always thought the Trevo head looked pretty big, though on my figure the head size looked perfect! Could be more to do with the neck. If I can find pictures I'll post them up.
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Re: CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Yeah, you'll have to show us what the white resin looks like. The WGP was a white resin, and honestly, it was not very good. It's hard to see the detail, plus it felt powdery and brittle, which is why I think some people say that resin is fragile. In my experience, resin is very solid and strong, of course if you drop it, it will get damaged, but I've really only ever used Smooth-On 321 and 326 and both felt very durable and strong. I've dropped one or two heads on the ground and you only get a small chip or scuff, it's not like the thing shatters or something.
If you can swing it, I'd get the 326 (clear resin) and tint it to skintone with the SO-Strong Fleshtone tint. It already starts off looking realistic and it's much easier to paint. I think a lot of the painters on this board would agree it's much easier and you get better results when you start with a skintone head as you just have to add some blushing and a few tones to get that realistic look and when you don't have to mix up a skintone color it saves time.
In any case, the sculpt is looking great and it looks like you're on the right track.
Yeah, you'll have to show us what the white resin looks like. The WGP was a white resin, and honestly, it was not very good. It's hard to see the detail, plus it felt powdery and brittle, which is why I think some people say that resin is fragile. In my experience, resin is very solid and strong, of course if you drop it, it will get damaged, but I've really only ever used Smooth-On 321 and 326 and both felt very durable and strong. I've dropped one or two heads on the ground and you only get a small chip or scuff, it's not like the thing shatters or something.
If you can swing it, I'd get the 326 (clear resin) and tint it to skintone with the SO-Strong Fleshtone tint. It already starts off looking realistic and it's much easier to paint. I think a lot of the painters on this board would agree it's much easier and you get better results when you start with a skintone head as you just have to add some blushing and a few tones to get that realistic look and when you don't have to mix up a skintone color it saves time.
In any case, the sculpt is looking great and it looks like you're on the right track.
Rogerbee
Super Freak
Re: CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Yep, it's definitely going great guns and I'm really looking forward to the finished result. If you want good Harrison Ford reference then the film for you is Blade Runner as he was shot from all the right angles, including plenty of profiles. The Raiders shot I posted was one of very few from that movie, I guess Spielberg isn't big on profiles!
Yep, it's definitely going great guns and I'm really looking forward to the finished result. If you want good Harrison Ford reference then the film for you is Blade Runner as he was shot from all the right angles, including plenty of profiles. The Raiders shot I posted was one of very few from that movie, I guess Spielberg isn't big on profiles!
Re: CUSTOMIZINGS Indy, Solo, Drake, Bond etc.
Just found your thread and subscribed, Beastmaster. I'm constantly startled by how many really fine zBrush portrait artists are members here now. That Ford has been great in each iteration. Fascinating to watch it age.
Using old silicone is a dubious way to start, but at least you've gotten a taste of what you're in for. If you don't have a vac chamber to de-gas the silicone, you'll want one soon. You can't pressure-cast your resin if the mold has air bubbles because the resin will find the bubbles and flood into them. It's hilarious, but only once. I can share links to some fairly affordable vac and pressure equipment if you like. Once you have a way to de-gas your molds and use pressure for casting, you'll find that slow-curing silicone and resin is worth the wait. It's the way to get the most bubble-free, crisp castings.
I'd like to chime in as others have in support of Smooth-On products. If you are located near an actual Smooth-On store, they are very helpful. Each time I visit, I learn something from the staff.
Just found your thread and subscribed, Beastmaster. I'm constantly startled by how many really fine zBrush portrait artists are members here now. That Ford has been great in each iteration. Fascinating to watch it age.
Using old silicone is a dubious way to start, but at least you've gotten a taste of what you're in for. If you don't have a vac chamber to de-gas the silicone, you'll want one soon. You can't pressure-cast your resin if the mold has air bubbles because the resin will find the bubbles and flood into them. It's hilarious, but only once. I can share links to some fairly affordable vac and pressure equipment if you like. Once you have a way to de-gas your molds and use pressure for casting, you'll find that slow-curing silicone and resin is worth the wait. It's the way to get the most bubble-free, crisp castings.
I'd like to chime in as others have in support of Smooth-On products. If you are located near an actual Smooth-On store, they are very helpful. Each time I visit, I learn something from the staff.
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