This is my fundamental problem with not even bothering with the MCU since everything has to be buddied up with everything else.
Anyway, here's hoping for the best.
Hawley's Doctor Doom
- Thread starter Victοr
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This is my fundamental problem with not even bothering with the MCU since everything has to be buddied up with everything else.
Anyway, here's hoping for the best.
Kamandi
Super Freak
Squirrel Girl in this movie or fail.
Anna Kendrick is waiting by the phone.
There was a time fanboys were screaming for this kind of thing.
My point is FF has had 3 craptactular stand alone films and they all sh t the bed. The last one was so bad some of the cast didn't even sit through the premier.
Marvel MCU has rehabed problem characters already and it could even be a plus to some other films. Seeing Spidey team up with Johnny as a peer instead of a mentor (Stark) would bring out the smart-*** in both characters.
cmiller99
Super Freak
I saw an article where Hawley it's not going to happen until he has an idea that he thinks is good enough to work with. So that could be a few years maybe, seeing as he's doing this Doom movie now.
CallMeTheDoctor
Super Freak
Don't much care for Doom, but I enjoy Hawley's work on Fargo and Legion. So I'll give it a go.
I guess it's a sequel to this:
That's what I've heard. I also got a scoop on the opening scene:
Interesting... https://www.cbr.com/mads-mikkelsen-doctor-doom-movie/
The Clown Prince of Crime
Super Freak
Same old generic response, "Complex character, multiple layers, blah blah ...hasn't been done yet...blah blah.. interesting."
GTFOH. ..
The only Doom that matters.
GTFOH. ..
The only Doom that matters.
MCU Doom would be far too neutered for me to get excited. At least this has a chance of being actually good. It could also be spectacularly bad, but eh, I'll take my chances.
Biojex
Super Freak
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IF Mads is casted then I will get excited. Until then...I wait.
I do hope they go with him, truth be told. He has the voice and the brown eyes. He is a bit more... gruff than Victor ever was, but eh, I can let it slide. I just hope they do away with the 616 origin, because it's one of the worst in capes. Great character, damn awful origin.
The Clown Prince of Crime
Super Freak
Is that the one where he accidently burns his own face?
Kinda. Here's the greentext version:
>Doom's a gypsy
>his tribe moves from place to place
>his mom does weird **** like summoning demons
>villagers get scared
>"waaaaah, why do they hate us"
>his mom ****s up a spell and kills all the babies in Latveria
>the villagers get angry and kill Cynthia
>"waaaaah papa, why do they hate us"
>Baron's wife is ill so he calls on Doom's pops
>Doom's pops fails
>Baron hunts him down
>Pops freezes to death
>Doom sweas REVENGE
>years later an American Scout comes
>he notices Doom and gives him a scholarship to the same Uni as Richards
>makes him work for the US millitary as well
>Doom goes there
>he wants to save his momma from Hell
>Reed says "hey those calculations are wrong"
>"REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE get outta my face Ameritard REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE"
>machine blows up
>gets expelled
>stray-monk-pretending-to-be-a-drunk finds him and makes him go to Tibet
>takes over an order of monks
>puts the hot mask on
>goes to Latveria
>starts a revolt
>kills the Baron
>becomes King
Now that we've got that out of the way, just let me point out the problems in this mess:
1. No gypsy looks like Doom or his mother. The "travelling nomads" aren't the romanticized American version. They look like this:
This particular guy is from here. He and his wife stole achild, passed it off as theirs and were trying to sell it. Stealing kids and then selling them for organs in the Black Market is pretty common practise by them around these parts.
2. Where did a Gypsy man who lives in the Balkans get a surname like "Von Doom"?
3. If you alternate between countries every few months, why the hell would you love Latveria enough to take it over? Why not try a different country? Surely you've stayed in others as well. And it's not like Eastern Europe has any major defenses. All the neighboring countries would've been the same.
4. Where the hell did a poor, Eastern European country get a Baron and rulling Royal Family? We barely have functioning governments here, let alone Kings & Queens.
5. Why the hell would the Baron ask a random gypsy to cure his wife? Didn't he have a Royal Doctor? Couldn't the Baron import one from say, Germany? Was Werner that good of a Doctor? Where did a travelling gypsy become such a good Doctor? Did the Baron count on his mystical knowledge? Even if that were true (which is not since Werner condemns Cynthia's occult studies), why would you trust the man whose wife killed all the babies of your nation?
6. What is an American Scout doing in the damn Balkans? A Gypsy Camp of all places? Am I seriously to believe that the US doesn't have enough geniuses already? That they're so desperate that they're outsourcing to Eastern Europe? Even if it's just a case of "we'll give him a bed and he'll give us killer robots", Doom's best feats were little ice bombs. Reed was building... God knows what during that time. Stark had graduated from MIT at 15.
7. Am I seriously to side with the witch who KILLED BABIES instead of the villagers? Racist portrayal of the people here aside, it makes a lick of sense. If you play with fire, you'll get burned. You can't blame the others for pushing you away so they do not get burned too... I know Marvel loves them an "underdog" story, but to portray everyone as stupid fools and the gypsies as the unsung heroes is beyond insulting. It's like making a Black Panther flick where Hunter beats T'Challa and leads Wakanda to greatness.
Needless to say, I prefer the Ultimate Origin. He's a descendant of Dracula and his father grooms him to become a modern conqueror by ten. He's much more laid back during his time at Baxter with the F4, and doesn't have the third-person speak. He still has the Doom-isms, but is actually even more heroic than the 616 version, as he willingly gave himself up to the Zombie Dimension to protect his world. The Goat Legs that people ridicule were added because according to folklore, people touched by the Devil developed such deformities, which makes sense considering the whole Dracula thing.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, that while 616 Doom had more ******y, Ult!Doom was actually better developed and showed a whole lot of promise. Plus,his Latveria was beautiful, not like the ugly, melancholic 616 Version.
batfan08
Super Freak
I just want a gritty, realistic version of Doom. Basically, an Eastern European dude in a velvet track suit that hates Reed Richards because he wouldn't buy one of his used cars from "DOOM'S CAR KINGDOM," and for suggesting that, if you're trying to sell people cars, "Doom" probably shouldn't be the first word on people's minds. Doom takes offense to this slight, as well as Sue rejecting several of his advances. Naturally, he takes all of his frustration out on a Bulgarian prostitute who he's paid to look like Sue while he gets off in a Doom inspired gimp mask. He then goes home and tinkers with his Roomba.
The next day, he argues with a guy who says he sold his 17-year old son a lemon, threatens to have some of his "boys" come down if he doesn't get the **** off his lot, and counts the day's earnings in his little back office.
The next day, he argues with a guy who says he sold his 17-year old son a lemon, threatens to have some of his "boys" come down if he doesn't get the **** off his lot, and counts the day's earnings in his little back office.
The Clown Prince of Crime
Super Freak
That's a great read and I appreciate that you took the time to analyze and explain all that. 
Having said that, this is where you lost me...
Wouldn't it be easier and maybe more interesting if they make Doom Fidel Castro? An educated young man who came from a wealthy family, who traveled the world, hated the dictator who ruled his country, so he was imprisoned for opposing him, but eventually returns to his home land with 70 men to start a revolution and 3 years later he takes over the country, thus becoming a ruthless dictator who may or may not believe he's doing the right thing.
I'm not sure how you fit the goat legs, Dracula, and the devil in there though
Having said that, this is where you lost me...
Wouldn't it be easier and maybe more interesting if they make Doom Fidel Castro? An educated young man who came from a wealthy family, who traveled the world, hated the dictator who ruled his country, so he was imprisoned for opposing him, but eventually returns to his home land with 70 men to start a revolution and 3 years later he takes over the country, thus becoming a ruthless dictator who may or may not believe he's doing the right thing.
I'm not sure how you fit the goat legs, Dracula, and the devil in there though
Wouldn't it be easier and maybe more interesting if they make Doom Fidel Castro? An educated young man who came from a wealthy family, who traveled the world, hated the dictator who ruled his country, so he was imprisoned for opposing him, but eventually returns to his home land with 70 men to start a revolution and 3 years later he takes over the country, thus becoming a ruthless dictator who may or may not believe he's doing the right thing.
I'm not sure how you fit the goat legs, Dracula, and the devil in there though
I had to worry abou the word limit, so I didn't explain it properly. In the Ult!Verse, Doom's father sits him down on his 10th birthday and goes on a rant about how he's a descendant of Vlad Tepes. He doesn't allude to Dracula being a Vampire, and basically lectures Victor about Eastern European MIGHT(!) and the importance of how your enemies percieve you. He then explains how the descendants scattered across Europe, and how his forefathers married into the Van Damme family in Belgium. After that we see snippets of Doom's childhood, with Werner abusing him (hitting him, making him learn the entire family tree, centuries back) to turn him into a conqueror.
After that we see him at Baxter, where he is more easy going. He respects the "Mole Man" (genius teacher at Baxter here) and considers him a super-genius, and it's actually him who snoops around Reed's room. Reed notices his scribbles and they strike a partnership. He hangs out with Reed, Sue and Johnny after that. He's the jack-*** of the group. The the accident happens, Doom turns into Goat-Doom, builds a shanty town in Belgium, names it the Keep, gets BTFOed, and then somehowhe's King of Latveria.
The Ultimate Origin has some holes, but at least it gave us a modern and realistic take that actually humanized Doom. He did suffer abuse and was molded to become what he is, and he's a petty, vindictive *******, but not a guy who throws kids in Hell and then pretends to be an honorable man. The 616 origin can't work, because aside from everything being contrived as hell, it's just cheesy all around. Suspension of disbelief simply cannot work here.
What you're proposing is good enough, but Doom's whole thing is that he's both a sorcerer and a scientist. Take the former away and he becomes Lex Luthor: Eastern Europe Edition. Just mix stuff from the 616 origin with stuff from the Ultimate origin and you're free to go. Basically:
1. Keep the name & family stuff from Ultimate. "Von Doom" is a germanic surname with an English word in it! It's not just cheesy, it's downright stupid. And as I've said already, the "groomed to rule" is better than "gypsy somehow is the smartest person in the world" and whatnot.
2. Keep the "mom goes to hell" from the 616. Nobles were into that ****, so just have her be a woman who lusts for power, whose occult studies go awry. I don't think Doom should try and save her, as she was probably compliant to his abuse. it should reinforce his cold demeanor in a "if you're not cautious, well..." way.
3. Keep the revolution from the 616. Have him just grow tired of the way Democracy works and try and take over the land. He shouldn't be a "freedome fighter", but a legit dictator who attempts a coup. Have him manipulate the "freedome fighters" from the shadows, and as soon as the war is over, he stabs them in the back and crowns himself King. Doom's a *******, and he should be portrayed as such.
There are more stuff you could do, but these are the 3 most important for me.
No way! The most logical backstory is to make him an antisocial blogger. Make it so!
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