HBO: The Last of Us

[R_R_X]

The episode was good, but I don't blame anyone rolling their eyes at the more hysterical reactions around it.

I've read comments like this is HBO's best hour of television, that it's perhaps the best romance ever told on TV, that it's made people cry for a whole hour, that this episode alone makes the show 100% better than the game...

It is a good episode we can't deny that but these melodramatic reactions are starting to feel phoney and I wouldn't say it's the best thing HBO has ever put out when The Sopranos, The Wire, Deadwood, Brothers in Arms, The Leftovers, Chernobyl and of course the first few seasons of Game of Thrones exist.

Also it's funny how people don't want you to compare the game to the show but then almost every comment praising the show, specifically this episode is devaluating the game and treating it's medium as the lesser of the two, we're also seeing the original fans being labelled as toxic for being letdown by the fact they completely erased one of the best portions of the game which would've made for excellent television, I liked the episode and I think Bill's backstory is better than what's in the game but I didn't like that Bill died and we lost some of the most iconic, funny and humanzing moments between him, Joel and Ellie.

 

[Rayman]

Maybe I'm misunderstanding here. Are you saying mass reactions = good?

Oh my no, for gods sake, the hell no. Well, not in my opinion though. I don’t like Iron Man (as a whole, I’d consider him my actual nemesis if he were a true being), I consider Interstellar the worst Colombian soap opera of them all (even Shakira’s was better imo), and… I shall stop, I guess those opinions are enough to become unpopular in here already (I mean planet Earth, not only this forum).

I do consider though that I’m the strange one, that I may be wrong, that I’m entitled to an opinion but it’s no more than that. People are in their right to like Iron Man, and the amount of love and joy it seems to generate is what matters imo. So kudos to those who like him. It. Whatever.

All I was saying is…(unlike Iron Man) it’s an inoffensive story, about inoffensive people (unlike Iron Man), trying to show the joy and love there’s still to hold on to even after the apocalypse. It’s a little spark of hope. And well… if it’s well written, stellarly acted, and even here most of us seem to really like it… then what’s the deal? Even if it’s not The Wire or Sons of Anarchy, it’s its own thing, they’re trying hard and seem to be succeeding for most of us.

Guess I’m a positive kind of guy. Not unlike Iron Man. Oh shoot…

 

[ArtDamage]

I'm not sure I understand all the pearl clutching at people not seal clapping at this last episode.

Enjoy it all you want doesn't make people with legitimate criticisms negative. As you said most thought it was pretty good. I think its more than fair to point out its shortcomings though.

 

[Rayman]

I'm not sure I understand all the pearl clutching at people not seal clapping at this last episode.

Enjoy it all you want doesn't make people with legitimate criticisms negative. As you said most thought it was pretty good. I think its more than fair to point out its shortcomings though.

Not saying it wasn’t fair to point out its shortcomings at all. I’ve been part of the discussion all along. But as much as those can be pointed out, so can its accomplishments, which are quite a few actually.

Bare in mind though: even if you take my ironic positivism (which meant ignoring all Iron Man comments) as a literal statement, that does not mean any or everyone else is negative. That’s a fallacy. I loved Asta’s opinion, also RRX’s.

It’s the moment it becomes an ironic conversation about wether it will get the Emmy because of this or that… that it just becomes not productive at all imo. Or stating it being well received as a mostly negative thing or a special reason to look for the mistakes. I don’t correlate those things ever. Seems like sometimes we can’t just enjoy and savor the good things.

Back into the actual topic though… I do hope Chapter 4 gives us more of Joel and Ellie. Up to this point it seems it’s more about the world and the love stories than it‘s about them, that’s obvious. Maybe that’s their point though. A mainline love story about Joel and Ellie, slowly built up (too slow maybe? We shall see), with a love story per chapter (C1: Sara, C2: Tess, C3: Bill). It’s also everything Joel’s lost, so they’re building up sth there.

We shall see how it develops. If they start focusing more on the present story, once the world and Joel‘s character are more built up, or if they’ve changes the focus more towards the world instead of Ellie and Joel.

 

[Gipetto0812]

I've read comments like this is HBO's best hour of television, that it's perhaps the best romance ever told on TV, that it's made people cry for a whole hour, that this episode alone makes the show 100% better than the game...

It is a good episode we can't deny that but these melodramatic reactions are starting to feel phoney and I wouldn't say it's the best thing HBO has ever put out when The Sopranos, The Wire, Deadwood, Brothers in Arms, The Leftovers, Chernobyl and of course the first few seasons of Game of Thrones exist.

Also it's funny how people don't want you to compare the game to the show but then almost every comment praising the show, specifically this episode is devaluating the game and treating it's medium as the lesser of the two, we're also seeing the original fans being labelled as toxic for being letdown by the fact they completely erased one of the best portions of the game which would've made for excellent television, I liked the episode and I think Bill's backstory is better than what's in the game but I didn't like that Bill died and we lost some of the most iconic, funny and humanzing moments between him, Joel and Ellie.

100% agreed!

It was a good episode no doubt about that. But no part of it made me cry, tear up or at all think it was the best thing ever on TV. Way more other shows, even on regular network television, have struck the cords for me and even gotten me to tear up closer than this ONE episode.

I've even seen reviews where ppl are saying that they wish they didn't kill off Bill and Frank b/c they would've watched a whole spinoff just about them What more would there be to see? An even slower version of the aging montage we already got but instead spread over 2-3 months of episodes? Seeing Frank actually fix up those shops? Watching Bill set traps and sitting at his multiple screens seeing the clickers get killed by them?

I get that ppl liked the episode, but man some of these reaction, like you said, feel phony and not really genuine at all. One reviewer started to tear up during their spiel about the relationship aspects then turned off the water works immediately like a switch when they got to their next point in their review

I'm glad the show is popular and reaching a lot of ppl, but I'm just not seeing what is SO great about this episode that ppl who got screeners saying this is the best episode of the whole season? Really? That is hard to believe.

 

[Rayman]

100% agreed!

It was a good episode no doubt about that. But no part of it made me cry, tear up or at all think it was the best thing ever on TV. Way more other shows, even on regular network television, have struck the cords for me and even gotten me to tear up closer than this ONE episode.

I've even seen reviews where ppl are saying that they wish they didn't kill off Bill and Frank b/c they would've watched a whole spinoff just about them What more would there be to see? An even slower version of the aging montage we already got but instead spread over 2-3 months of episodes? Seeing Frank actually fix up those shops? Watching Bill set traps and sitting at his multiple screens seeing the clickers get killed by them?

I get that ppl liked the episode, but man some of these reaction, like you said, feel phony and not really genuine at all. One reviewer started to tear up during their spiel about the relationship aspects then turned off the water works immediately like a switch when they got to their next point in their review

I'm glad the show is popular and reaching a lot of ppl, but I'm just not seeing what is SO great about this episode that ppl who got screeners saying this is the best episode of the whole season? Really? That is hard to believe.

It did make my wife cry a bit though. She knows nothing about the games (she got scared even when I played it and she binge-watched), so she has a bit of a different take on the series. I like having that other sided view too. Guess a lot of people also didn’t expect that kind of story in a “zombie series” and got caught off guard. She definitely didn’t expect that, at times she looked at me like… is this TLoU?

It sure isn’t the best thing ever, and in no ways would that story be better in more minutes: it’s very well told the way it was. Overreactions in my opinion are just that: overreactions. The hype of the day. Next morning it’s something else. I don’t find the need to give them more credit. I tend to ignore those the same way I ignore the other kind of reactions this episode got on IMDB, Rotten Tomatoes and so on.

It’s a shame though we’ll have no more Bill. Not because of its character itself or what it meant in the game, but because of how good Offerman portrayed it. I do believe his acting was the best part of the episode, I do believe most of us agree with that.

I do hope it’s not the best episode though, as I feel like the series needs a more intimate, Joel and Ellie episode.

 

[chrisstbh]

Really didn’t think the Bill section of the game was all that great .

 

[ArtDamage]

It’s the moment it becomes an ironic conversation about wether it will get the Emmy because of this or that… that it just becomes not productive at all imo. Or stating it being well received as a mostly negative thing or a special reason to look for the mistakes. I don’t correlate those things ever. Seems like sometimes we can’t just enjoy and savor the good things.

Its very much the reality of content creation whether you'd confront it or not No one was digging for reasons to hate it because people like it. What? Lol I'm increasingly unsure what your issue with the criticism is despite starting your post with saying you don't have an issue. Other than that people not liking it as much seems to have rubbed you the wrong way.

Everyone enjoyed the episode, it just didn't make everyone's year. Let's move on.

 

[ArtDamage]

100% agreed!

It was a good episode no doubt about that. But no part of it made me cry, tear up or at all think it was the best thing ever on TV.

I get that ppl liked the episode, but man some of these reaction, like you said, feel phony and not really genuine at all.

I'm glad the show is popular and reaching a lot of ppl, but I'm just not seeing what is SO great about this episode that ppl who got screeners saying this is the best episode of the whole season? Really? That is hard to believe.

Man I hope that isn't the case. If executed well the finale should be pretty gut wrenching. The Winter section should be pretty solid as well so I'd be very surprised if this charts in the best episodes, but we'll see.

 

[R_R_X]

I'm glad the show is popular and reaching a lot of ppl, but I'm just not seeing what is SO great about this episode that ppl who got screeners saying this is the best episode of the whole season? Really? That is hard to believe.

Man I hope that isn't the case. If executed well the finale should be pretty gut wrenching. The Winter section should be pretty solid as well so I'd be very surprised if this charts in the best episodes, but we'll see.

Yeah if this episode really turns out to be the best of the season and the one that makes people emotional then they will have utterly failed in telling the story about Joel and Ellie.

 

[Wor-Gar]

I'm glad the show is popular and reaching a lot of ppl, but I'm just not seeing what is SO great about this episode that ppl who got screeners saying this is the best episode of the whole season? Really? That is hard to believe.

For most of the people who got screeners, this episode has special resonance more than others.

See: Emmy Awards

 

[darthviper107]

Really didn’t think the Bill section of the game was all that great .

For the show it wouldn't have been all that great if they had just done what the game did. It's funny that some people are saying the episode of the show was a waste of time without any purpose but that the game version would have been better?

 

[Otomofan]

I have zero interest in this property. I don't play video games and I hate zombie stuff, so it's a double strike for me. Triple strike if you account ol' Derpy Mormont being the star.

BUT....I watched a Drinker video the other day praising this episode, so I decided to check it out. I skipped the beginning so I could just watch the bottle episode about Ron Swanson and White Lotus fellow and see what all the fuss was about.

It was nice. It was a sweet story. I get it. I get why people that demand "representation" are losing their minds over it. Of course it reminded me a bit of Brokeback Mountain, which people similarly lost their minds over almost 20 years ago. I that that was a fantastic movie, but this was nicer and sweeter.

But then I looked at wikipedia and saw this:

In 2023, Bartlett appeared in the HBO post-apocalyptic drama series The Last of Us, portraying Frank in the episode "Long, Long Time". The episode received universal acclaim and was widely considered to be the best of the show's first season, as well as one of the best episodes of television overall.

Whoa there, Nellie....rein it in a bit. It was a nice, touching hour of television, but in no way, shape, or form was it "the best episode of television overall." Good lord, people are so prone to hyperbole these days.

Maybe it'll get a writing Emmy or a best guest star Emmy, but it'll be forgotten soon after. I don't know what planet people are living on if they've somehow managed to never see a gay love story on TV.

Anyway, it's nice to see the Freaks here having more tempered reactions. It was a decent hour of TV, but it wasn't life-changing. Whoever wrote that exaggeration on wikipedia really needs to get a grip.

 

[ScoutingForToys]

For the show it wouldn't have been all that great if they had just done what the game did. It's funny that some people are saying the episode of the show was a waste of time without any purpose but that the game version would have been better?

I don't know what they did in the game, but all this stuff with Bill and Frank, though it was well done, is rather pointless to the story.
You could have removed their entire section and replaced them with Bill's note and the impact on the story would be the same.
It was a little self contained story that made no difference to the overall story of the series.

 

[Wor-Gar]

I like the tag that connects the episode to Joel -- the whole "don't be like I was" warning -- but I agree it was a really extended way to make that point. A point that could have been made much more economically... but then, that wasn't the true point of that episode.

I'm ready to move back into the story at hand. I view this as an outlier, but a very well-told story.

 

[choombaz]

One of the main points that I learnt from screenwriting classes is that you should constantly echo your themes. This episode was a mirror to the relationship between Joel and Ellie, Bill is the Joel substitute and Frank is Ellie, a character comes into another characters life and helps mend some mental wounds that they have. The fact that it was a whole episode detour just feels like the current state of television, slow build like Better Call Saul or Andor.

And the whole emmy fishing business, I’m sure the Chernobyl dude is just trying to make up for all the truly awful films he made before becoming classy
OR I’m just fishing for an argument LOLZ

 

[darthviper107]

I don't know what they did in the game, but all this stuff with Bill and Frank, though it was well done, is rather pointless to the story.
You could have removed their entire section and replaced them with Bill's note and the impact on the story would be the same.
It was a little self contained story that made no difference to the overall story of the series.

You could do the same thing with pretty much any part of the story. Part of the value of a story is in the telling of it, and it's not pointless to the story if you think about it at all. Certainly it's more impactful than what was originally done in the game.

 

[darth dennis]

Still digging the show, thought the episode was really good. Like someone else said, I would've liked to have seen a bit more build up of the relationship. Bill reluctantly letting Frank stay, them being standoffish for a bit, Frank earning trust, them falling in love and the rest. The piano was a great Segway to the love story and could've been used after a bit more tense build up (days, weeks, months that pass in minutes on tv).

Also, not the best hour of television as long as Ozymandias exists. Had to look up the spelling and it still has a 10.0 on IMDB's ratings. Battle of the *******s ranks up there as well...

 

[ArtDamage]

And the whole emmy fishing business, I’m sure the Chernobyl dude is just trying to make up for all the truly awful films he made before becoming classy
OR I’m just fishing for an argument LOLZ

Wow went to take a look and he has written some crap

He didn't really hit my radar until Chernobyl. I guess Hangover 2 was  okay but yeah the rest ooof lol

 

[chrisstbh]

I don't know what they did in the game, but all this stuff with Bill and Frank, though it was well done, is rather pointless to the story.
You could have removed their entire section and replaced them with Bill's note and the impact on the story would be the same.
It was a little self contained story that made no difference to the overall story of the series.

Made no impact on the story of Joel and Ellie but added to the story of the world it's set in. But to be honest the Bill segement in the game didn't do much for Joel and Ellie's story either, so it is what it is.