InArt: The Lord of the Rings - Gandalf 1:6

[BrooklynWolf X]

Yeah honestly I requested and paid my invoice early because I thought it was just around the corner. I was planning to pay my Pennywise early as well, but if there's another month + between Reviewers batch to "batch 1" then I may just hold off. I kinda expected a shipping noticed by this point.

With IA’s figures, I was hoping things would change with regards to the “reviewers batch to batch 1 cycle” that dominated the YT space over the past few years.

It sucks on many levels: smaller YTers like me have to struggle to find an audience unless I’m willing to pay way over MSRP to get it FIRST, or “sell my soul” like Justin did with TW just to get it FIRST at a discount or free. It’d be nice if collectors around the world received their figures at the same time because…well, waiting sucks

I’m just b****ing at this point, so please don’t mind me. But damn if I wasn’t getting super frustrated at this point.

 

[BrooklynWolf X]

Yeah honestly I requested and paid my invoice early because I thought it was just around the corner. I was planning to pay my Pennywise early as well, but if there's another month + between Reviewers batch to "batch 1" then I may just hold off. I kinda expected a shipping noticed by this point.

Btw, if you have the funds now, I’d say pay it off just to get it out of the way. Wouldn’t want to get caught off guard when it is ready to ship out yknow? Having cleared both invoices for Gandalf and GAMETOYS Cloud feels good….


….despite them still being held hostage by their respective factories

 

[Nick D]

It isn’t present.

The eyes will always look inadequate if they stick to uniformity amongst their PERS.
Until companies produce PERS individually based directly on the figure they’re for, this will always be an issue.

When I look at the InArt Joker sculpts in hand, the eyes and eyelids throw everything off, without a magnifying lens, without bright light.

You simply cannot have a standard set of eyes across a multitude of characters, that’s an extreme disservice to any bit of detail you aspire to achieve.

OT posted a comparison of prototype Gandalf next to production, the only excuse this is met with by people is that most won’t see it. Which is the wrong way to look at things. There is far more detail on the proto iris, as well as no insanely thick inner eyelids or deep set eyes.

As far as eye’s seeing minute details, maybe yours don’t but mine certainly do.

As I’ve stated above, if you don’t care for accuracy or striving for perfection then that is fine, but what I don’t understand is how, when I ask that they improve it’s an issue to everyone here, but when Viper says this, it’s praised?

Obviously we aren’t there yet for absolute perfection, but we sure can get close if we strive for it, chasing something that’s extremely difficult to achieve brings improvement no matter what. We’re in a golden era for custom sculpts due to 3D printing, it’s on the rise now. All of the previous years have made this possible, if everyone decided the DX11 was the stopping point we wouldn’t have sculpts like these:

These custom sculpts look absolutely killer when the right artist paints them, I mention how flawed InArt Joker is, I’m met with excuses on how it needs to be lit, that simply isn’t the case with a custom Joker sculpt painted and haired by the right artist. Sure, I’m comparing a mass production piece to a hand painted custom, but people are acting like there isn’t a major difference in quality between custom and what InArt has produced.

The proto InArt Joker is essentially a custom because it was hand painted and haired by Viper for promo shots.

One thing I will say that is good, is that InArt produces enough to where a pre order isn’t necessary, allowing you to see in hand photos and videos of what you will get. There was tons of Joker sets available to purchase later. You go on eBay after release and Joker sets are now able to be bought for around the same price people paid during preorder.

They’ve hit a ceiling regarding price, people don’t want to pay more than InArt initially charged.

 

[Nagoya]

@Nick D I didn’t follow the Joker thread much but always liked reading your comments because you honestly raise great points.
Unfortunately I think it will take a lot of time until companies, designers, and factories can meet the high level of detail you wish was being pursued. Right now, at least as someone who is young and still pretty new to the hobby, I think the hobby is in a great place compared to other similar markets where, yeah it’s sadly gotten extremely expensive, but there’s now an overarching high quality present from the cheapest third party figures to the highest end customs. With obvious exceptions of course.

But it can’t be overstated that HT and InArt are serving the most important area of the hobby though, which is where price and quality are balanced as much as possible and where most people in the hobby are going to be spending their money on. Obviously there are still plenty of improvements these companies could make, which hopefully the limited factory situation would be able to successfully accommodate, but the amount of R&D and production costs are already likely to be at a maximum that these companies are willing to spend to serve an admittedly niche hobby. I’m sure there’s plenty of research done by the companies to target as many customers as possible, and catering via custom-level details and costs is just not going to net them the most amount of money they think they’ll get right now. Hell, I would be surprised if HT hadn’t considered their Artisan line many times before, but were too timid about the actual sales numbers before InArt proved that assumption wrong.

(Only after I wrote this did I see you mention that InArt has virtually hit the price ceiling and I completely agree).
Maybe companies will be more willing to invest in looking at pricier models—to better gauge profits while appeasing customers in that higher budget area—in the future if InArt continues to be a great success after they’ve essentially raised the price ceiling already.

But my real point is, there’s a decent balance in being able to buy nice things no matter what your budget is. It would definitely be a shame if the customs scene started being disrupted by huge companies.

OT posted a comparison of prototype Gandalf next to production, the only excuse this is met with by people is that most won’t see it. Which is the wrong way to look at things. There is far more detail on the proto iris, as well as no insanely thick inner eyelids or deep set eyes.

View attachment 663598
As I’ve stated above, if you don’t care for accuracy or striving for perfection then that is fine, but what I don’t understand is how, when I ask that they improve it’s an issue to everyone here, but when Viper says this, it’s praised?

Like I said, your ideas raise great points, and I apologise if I’m missing the one being made here, but this Gandalf comparison really isn’t a great way to demonstrate anything. The lighting is so specific in the proto pics, and there’s probably even some level of photoshop at play to make the irises appear brighter. The angles are off enough that the eyelids appear as very different looking shapes. It does prove your point that minuscule difference can greatly impact the level of perceived quality, but it’s virtually impossible to make a perfectly direct comparison for stuff like this.

Either way, no matter how “perfect” a figure captures a person or character, there is still subjective opinions to consider. Thinking about how models taken directly from games are met with criticism here, and varying preferences can cause people to be satisfied with what I might consider laughably inferior, there’s no way a single company or single product are going to make everyone see something that’s perfect. Not to say that might not make it any less worth pursuing.

 

[Nick D]

I agree with the points you’ve made bro 100%.

We’re around the same age, 25 right?
Although I’ve watched this hobby grow since 2008 when TDK released, so to watch the progress between mass production and customs is amazing to see as I’ve grown up.

The fact that InArt wants to strive for perfection is what I admire about them as a company, a new one in this scale at that, just getting their feet wet.

They’ve got a ways to go before they’ll master prototype & production, which is why any figure we buy from them currently, has to be understood that we are dealing with essentially test figures until they master their craft, which means customers voicing their opinions while InArt is at their premature stage, where they’ll actually listen to us, is why we do need to be opinionated. They may very well continue to listen once they’ve grown but that has yet to be seen, get your thoughts in while you can you know?

Nothing wrong with it to some degree. However since we have indeed met a ceiling on price regarding mass production for 1:6, when they do learn to make the quality match, they won’t be able to charge much more. Not many people will spend 1.5-2k for an upgraded Ledger Joker from them, so any upgrades would almost be for free in that sense. This is why they shouldn’t have come out the gate with a 1k release while still wanting to improve. Gandalf & Aragorn for around $500 is their sweet spot, giving them room to make improvements and perhaps charge slightly more, but people won’t pay 1k+ for a mass produced Gandalf regardless of the upgrades they may make in the future.

The fan base doesn’t support it like Batman fans do. LOTR collectibles, is as niche as horror is in that regard.

I understand most people won’t pay 1k+ each for a couple Ledger Joker sculpts like I will, nothing wrong with that, hell I don’t blame you, the world’s economy is trash for our youth.

I won’t be purchasing their LOTR line, even though I grew up on the films. It’s just not the direction my collection goes. 1:6 is too expensive, gotta be picky. I still want to see this line kick ***, because it deserves it. What they’ve already achieved with the clothing is fantastic on Gandalf, I am in no way trying to discredit that by any means. I want to see every figure released strive for perfection regardless if I will own it, otherwise, why make them?

Imagine figures in 2030, if it continues on a consistent upward trajectory, figures will surely be mind blowing, to the point it’s hard to even fathom, that Joker sculpt I posted above that I have ordered, I have a hard time seeing it topped, but it will be.

 

[BrooklynWolf X]

It isn’t present.

The eyes will always look inadequate if they stick to uniformity amongst their PERS.
Until companies produce PERS individually based directly on the figure they’re for, this will always be an issue.

When I look at the InArt Joker sculpts in hand, the eyes and eyelids throw everything off, without a magnifying lens, without bright light.

You simply cannot have a standard set of eyes across a multitude of characters, that’s an extreme disservice to any bit of detail you aspire to achieve.

OT posted a comparison of prototype Gandalf next to production, the only excuse this is met with by people is that most won’t see it. Which is the wrong way to look at things. There is far more detail on the proto iris, as well as no insanely thick inner eyelids or deep set eyes.

View attachment 663598


As far as eye’s seeing minute details, maybe yours don’t but mine certainly do.

As I’ve stated above, if you don’t care for accuracy or striving for perfection then that is fine, but what I don’t understand is how, when I ask that they improve it’s an issue to everyone here, but when Viper says this, it’s praised?

Obviously we aren’t there yet for absolute perfection, but we sure can get close if we strive for it, chasing something that’s extremely difficult to achieve brings improvement no matter what. We’re in a golden era for custom sculpts due to 3D printing, it’s on the rise now. All of the previous years have made this possible, if everyone decided the DX11 was the stopping point we wouldn’t have sculpts like these:

View attachment 663599
View attachment 663600

These custom sculpts look absolutely killer when the right artist paints them, I mention how flawed InArt Joker is, I’m met with excuses on how it needs to be lit, that simply isn’t the case with a custom Joker sculpt painted and haired by the right artist. Sure, I’m comparing a mass production piece to a hand painted custom, but people are acting like there isn’t a major difference in quality between custom and what InArt has produced.

The proto InArt Joker is essentially a custom because it was hand painted and haired by Viper for promo shots.

One thing I will say that is good, is that InArt produces enough to where a pre order isn’t necessary, allowing you to see in hand photos and videos of what you will get. There was tons of Joker sets available to purchase later. You go on eBay after release and Joker sets are now able to be bought for around the same price people paid during preorder.

They’ve hit a ceiling regarding price, people don’t want to pay more than InArt initially charged.

I really tried to avoid participating in this on going convo because it’s literally gonna go nowhere. But I’ll say my final piece:

I don’t think you were getting pushback because your desire of even MORE accuracy. You got pushback for multiple reasons:

1-some of your earlier posts about people’s displays, wasting money etc etc…came off as egotistical and implied YOUR humble collection is better than 90% of people on this forum and elsewhere.

2-it’s one thing to point out flaws and give out constructive criticism. It’s another when you STRONGLY imply or flat out say a figure, and in this case Joker and Gandalf are FLAWED to the point we’re blind to its imperfections and have defended IA’s decisions. When you do that, YOU INVITE people to debate. YOU INVITE people to disagree. Some, if not most, SEE YOUR POV, but also understand that these are MASS PRODUCED and concessions have to be taken.

3-And to further your point, you’d go as far as to even discredit Vipers reputation based on one mistake whilst ignoring his other achievements. And to further FURTHER your point, you’d purposely find poorly lit and posed pics of Joker. Sort of what you just did right now with Gandalf.

You posted a comparison pic of the proto and final.

TWO different angles where the bottom lids don’t appear as thick as the other. Meanwhile when I’ve posted pics TWICE illustrating Ian’s bottom eyelids match those of the figure. Yet you ignored that and continued with your narrative. Dude, you’re not making your arguments in good faith when you’re cherry picking the “worst” examples to make a point.

Being challenged and disagreed with is NOT the “pushback” that you’re making it out to be. And not gonna lie, it’s skirting dangerously close to gaslighting anyone that calls out falsely made claims as ‘attacking you”. Please be mindful of that behavior. It’s not cool.

As for why Viper is praised? Because he did in fact take MASS PRODUCED 1/6 figures to a new level, when we’ve been getting nothing but 70’s for FIFTEEN YEARS. Im definitely not the type to go scouring the internet to pay HUNDREDS if not THOUSANDS for a free lance artist to sculpt a portrait OR make 1/6 socks. If you or anyone else does that, more power to you and them. But that ain’t me. Does that make me less of a collector? Umm..no? It just means my definition of ‘pursuing perfection’ is different than yours.

And the argument you had ‘with properly lit’ portraits…your logic kinda blows my mind.

Am I to understand that custom portraits are SO amazing that they’re immune to bad lighting? My dude, Everything on this planet can look crappy AF without proper lighting. Actors (yknow, the people playing these characters we buy figures of??), vehicles, robots, EVEN TOYS.

You’d have a strong case on your hands if that photo of yours had crappy lighting…but that’s isn’t what happened here right? It’s…hmmm, how do you put it…

Oh, right, it’s PROPERLY LIT. Kinda like…the other properly lit photos of IA’s Joker?? Kinda funny how that works don’t cha think?

(Cont. in another post…this wall of text is an assault on the eyes. Apologies to everyone)

 

[BrooklynWolf X]

You say you have an eagle eye for details…I believe you. When Aragorn was revealed and went up for PO, just about EVERYONE were praising IA for finally giving us a Viggo sculpt we can proudly display.

YOU were the ONLY one to point out the missing scar ON his lip. Literally…the ONLY one. Coincidentally also the only one to think it’s egregious enough to warrant…a custom sculpt…for a scar. A scar I never noticed despite watching the trilogy almost ONCE a year.

Neither did the other hundreds that went ape**** over IA’s reveal.

And…now you’re moving goal posts from “eyelids” to a missing scar…to suggest that we collectors need to demand better because Vipers promise of accuracy and detail are false because…the scar on his lip isn’t clearly visible? And you’d go so far to suggest we should replace IA’s portrait with someone’s 3D printed ‘visible scar on lip’ Viggo portrait??

Like…what even am I reading here? With IA’s Aragorn, it’s gonna “open the doors for more ‘Far More Accurate’ sculpt”…like…even if IA’s Aragorn looked like ****, why wait until IA’s version comes out? What was stopping those freelance artists from making Viggo sculpts over these past few years??

BRO HELP ME MAKE THIS MAKE SENSE

Firstly, scar or no scar, it doesn’t make or break the portrait. It’s not a character defining trait. NO ONE else gave a crap about the scar…or didn’t care enough to notice it. They didn’t look at those proto pics and say “oh wow, it looks so good! But…no scar on the lip. Ah damn! Guess I’lol pass on this and commission an artist to make one for me! DAMN YOU IA!”

Secondly, and I’m bringing this back to joker…for the last time.

You’ve always ignored this picture. You and the other member that legit said IA’s PERS are HT circa DX01/DX11 level quality (this blows my mind as well):

You’re gonna tell me THIS photo of InArt’s Joker-

-Doesn’t at LEAST look beautiful? If beautiful is too “extreme of an adjective”, what about “good looking”?? No? How about decent? I keep pressing on this because up till now you’ve shown nothing but poorly lit and posed pics of this figure to ‘prove a point’. So now I’m reusing a pic @hologram posted in the joker thread and I’ve yet to see you comment on it.

The figure in that picture…I own that figure. I didn’t reach out to an artist on FB to sculpt and paint that for me. I purchased THAT figure from OSK.

Although it’s not my pic, but if I wanted mine to look like that, all I gotta do is adjust the eyes and mine will look exactly like the one in this pic. I didn’t need to spend another 1k for a custom. I didn’t spend 1k for a repaint. It’s STOCK.

If you legit think the PERS on InArt’s joker-

Is not a major improvement over THESE jokers-

Seriously, if you and anyone else TRULY feel InArt’s PERS looks like or invokes anything similar to THOSE…I am speechless. I legitimately have nothing else to say.

I will no longer participate in anymore debates over eyelids or PERS. I sincerely hope you’ll move on from this as well. We get it, you’re not happy with InArt.

 

[lilgigs]

@BrooklynWolf X Just ignore his posts honestly. They will never be happy and it isn't worth engaging with someone who starts off by insulting people's taste and collection. You will definitely be way happier.

 

[FlyAndFight]

View attachment 663481

There's two pics that fellow Freaks have posted that always make me laugh when I see them.

This is one of them.


The other is that smiling HT ROTJ unmasked Vader.

 

[Nick D]

That pic of the InArt Joker is a repainted sculpt for starters, isn’t stock paint.

I still own my InArt Joker set, will be repainting the main sculpt myself.

I certainly explained my reasoning for what I said about collections, I stated -

I have no qualms with what someone wants to purchase, how could I? Why would I? It’s none of my business, what I did say is to buy what you like but that having a collection that overflows to the point of having to rent storage, unable to properly look after figures with dust, not being able to enjoy your collection because you can’t display it how you’d like, etc..

I also stated how people are free to do as they please and my word wasn’t law.

Here, I said if accuracy & details aren’t an issue to you, my thoughts don’t concern you. The scar matters to me because it’s a part of the actors face, not the character. It’s the equivalent of missing the mole in Christian Bale’s corner of his right eye. Viggo got that from a barbed wire accident as a kid, if you don’t notice it does that make it not there? I’m sure IA would’ve loved to add it had they noticed it went further than they thought. They want to capture details their competition doesn’t, that’s their M.O.

That wasn’t my comparison pics of the InArt Gandalf but rather OTs comparison photos he combined. Sure the angle isn’t spot on, but you can clearly see that the production irises aren’t anything like the prototype, this is a fact regardless of how it’s lit.

 

[Nagoya]

I love this thread lol. Can I play both sides?

If InArt made a Jokor, and for the sake of this thread, a Gandalf, that looked as close to realism as possible like that Yuan Ledger sculpt seems to be, we’d be singing a completely different tune. There are clearly products out there that capture likeness to such a high level of detail that we don’t even realise every speck, line, and blemish is an intentional feature designed to perfectly replicate who the sculpt is trying to portray.

But wait. Obviously, it isn’t realistic to expect this to happen with mass produced figures. And it would be silly to scream bloody murder every single time a deviation from source/reality is found. But pointing out the absence of those minute details is really no stranger than the legitimate observations of InArt’s exclusion of Gandalf’s patterned trousers. They’re just not obvious components that you think about unless you know they’re missing.
For the majority of us though, including me, those things are pretty inconsequential to the final product and it’s pretty easy to shrug them off as unnecessary. There’s a level of acceptance every individual has when it comes to minor inaccuracies that we either don’t mind or don’t notice because we’re beyond happy seeing other things be prioritised which are incredibly more obvious… and clearly InArt knows where to prioritise; Gandalf and Aragorn specifically are looking like the best looking mass produced figures we’ve seen so far.

Nick honestly makes a good point that InArt is still essentially new to the game yet possesses a unique opportunity to strive towards making those minor “adjustments” without really harming their production times or costs. Instead, they’re glossing over some of those incredibly tiny details with simple fixes like other companies have done. They’re still making incredible figures and it’s pretty foolish to think they’re failing at their own alleged M.O. at capturing figures in a higher quality and greater level of detail. And again, most of us might not admit some of their chosen omissions are technically “errors” depending on what level you really believe constitutes as such, and the question of diminishing returns definitely comes into play, but if some “issue” is present that can be “fixed” via a google image search of the source material and a 10 minute change in a 3D modeling software to add a more accurate scar, why not fix it, even if not everyone notices and appreciates it?

InArt clearly sees collectors will pay for higher detail and we would only benefit from them going one small extra mile. It would be unique of them to embrace that side of the hobby, and it’s an interesting perspective to wish they would take it, regardless of already existing trends and actual viability, now that they’re making headway into the market. I just know I’m not really going to complain much if they don’t, and I personally don’t give a damn if Gandalf’s trousers or Aragorn’s lip is missing a lines or two, lmao.

 

[Nick D]

Exactly, it’s a small inclusion that I mention, because I love details, not everyone does, I get it, it’s the artist eye to notice these things.

It doesn’t automatically make all the other details they got right irrelevant, just why stop there? InArt as a brand is clearly obsessed with details like I am, possibly not to the same extent or having to cut corners due to not having the labor yet capable to produce to that level, we don’t know.

Custom artists exist because they pick up on missing details and that’s how money is made, I’m not expecting custom quality out of InArt for half the price.

What I am expecting is that they develop the skill over time to get closer with production to their prototypes, or not have drastic differences say in Gandalfs prototype PERS in promo pictures, over promising is a thing. These prices are increasing which makes it difficult to let it slide time after time when you eat the price because you’re sold on the prototype images.

I offered a suggestion, to avoid preordering if you’re unsure of production quality if you can. If it’s extremely limited and of a character most people want, you can’t really do this safely.

We had no clue the InArt Joker release would be as widely available after release for basically the same price of preordering it, now we do.

 

[Raleig.h]

Custom artists exist because they pick up on missing details and that’s how money is made, I’m not expecting custom quality out of InArt for half the price.

Custom artists are inaccurate as hell quite a bit, they are no saints. I don't even think they would catch Aragorns lip scar.

 

[Rzeznikk]

Custom artists are inaccurate as hell quite a bit, they are no saints. I don't even think they would catch Aragorns lip scar.

They must not be "true artists" cause ya know, that "artists eye" lol

In seriousness though, Dean picked up on it.

 

[Nick D]

Varying degrees of what one would call an artist.

 

[Raleig.h]

we're probably thinking of the same people here lol

 

[Rzeznikk]

They must not be "true artists" cause ya know, that "artists eye" lol

In seriousness though, Dean picked up on it. View attachment 663778

Using my "artists eye" I found a pic of InArts Aragorn and brightening the image it looks like the scar is ever so subtle on his lip here:

 

[Raleig.h]

Using my "artists eye" I found a pic of InArts Aragorn and brightening the image it looks like the scar is ever so subtle on his lip here:
View attachment 663783

A little hard to tell, I just cant wait to have this piece in hand, its gonna be epic.

 

[Rzeznikk]

A little hard to tell, I just cant wait to have this piece in hand, its gonna be epic.

Very subtle

 

[BrooklynWolf X]

That pic of the InArt Joker is a repainted sculpt for starters, isn’t stock paint.

I still own my InArt Joker set, will be repainting the main sculpt myself.

I certainly explained my reasoning for what I said about collections, I stated -

I have no qualms with what someone wants to purchase, how could I? Why would I? It’s none of my business, what I did say is to buy what you like but that having a collection that overflows to the point of having to rent storage, unable to properly look after figures with dust, not being able to enjoy your collection because you can’t display it how you’d like, etc..

I also stated how people are free to do as they please and my word wasn’t law.

Here, I said if accuracy & details aren’t an issue to you, my thoughts don’t concern you. The scar matters to me because it’s a part of the actors face, not the character. It’s the equivalent of missing the mole in Christian Bale’s corner of his right eye. Viggo got that from a barbed wire accident as a kid, if you don’t notice it does that make it not there? I’m sure IA would’ve loved to add it had they noticed it went further than they thought. They want to capture details their competition doesn’t, that’s their M.O.

That wasn’t my comparison pics of the InArt Gandalf but rather OTs comparison photos he combined. Sure the angle isn’t spot on, but you can clearly see that the production irises aren’t anything like the prototype, this is a fact regardless of how it’s lit.

The photo I used was more about making a point with I the PERS…the same exact PERS you keep using as a knock against IA’s Joker. Repaint or ‘not stock’ should have no bearing on it.

But ok, I’ll give you that. You want stock right? How’s this?

Once again, not a commissioned sculpt. Not repainted. STOCK. Took me 5 mins to light the figure.

to replicate the pose and eye placement of the pic I posted earlier, I LITERALLY took this out of storage and snapped this photo a few mins ago.

You wanna repaint yours, cool. I personally see no reason to. But if you’re THAT dissatisfied, well, I think it’s a shame. Because it looks phenomenal to me.

Once again, you PURPOSELY picked an unflattering picture of Gandalf’s eyes. And you want me and others to see your POV? How? When all you’ve done is repeatedly tried to build a false narrative by cherry picking the ugliest and unflattering pictures to ‘build a case’. Wanna talk about irises? Do a fair comparison like so:

Since Gandalf released, we’ve had DOZENS of blogger photos featured in this very thread. We’ve had 3-4 video reviews with extreme close ups. ALL have made Gandalf look OUTSTANDING.

Out of ALL of those, you ran with this:

….so you SEE why you get pushback right??

Stop being disingenuous. Wanna engage in a proper conversation and debate? Here’s one tip:

STOP USING ****** pictures.

I have no issues with you as an individual. I don’t know you personally. I’d like to think you’re a nice person with a loving family and have tons of friends.

But Ive decided to not engage with you any further. Because.you.are.not.debating.in.good.faith.

Agree to disagree is the only option here.