Joker: Folie à Deux

Nick D · Oct 8, 2024

ironwez20 said:
Now he confirms that his joker was never meant to be the joker. Bro that’s so dumb . Not only is it a waste of time but the “real” joker is just then some copy cat non original dude who didn’t come up with his clown persona on his own.

lol WB is the dumbest studio ever

The Director can’t even defend his own film,
this wreaks of self sabotage. WB may be dumb, but ultimately it was Phoenix & Phillips who drove it home.

Also,
Phoenix rubs me as the type to purposely do a sequel to something that got too popular for him, with intent to dismantle it. Brilliant actor, not sure that I like his personality. The guy has a distaste for sequels, which is why he wasn’t in any, until now.

crows · Oct 8, 2024

Nick D said:
The Director can’t even defend his own film,
this wreaks of self sabotage. WB may be dumb, but ultimately it was Phoenix & Phillips who drove it home.

Also,
Phoenix rubs me as the type to purposely do a sequel to something that got too popular for him, with intent to dismantle it. Brilliant actor, not sure that I like his personality. The guy has a distaste for sequels, which is why he wasn’t in any, until now.

not only that
he's ruined a couple of projects by walking away in the last minute.
he's definitely sabotaged projects before.
yes he's the king of guy to do this:

Joaquin Phoenix Had So Many Ideas for ‘Joker: Folie à Deux,’ Todd Phillips Rewrote Entire Scenes on Napkins
"We would just tear the script up and start all over," Phoenix's co-star Lady Gaga said

.My line about Joaquin is that he’s the tunnel at the end of the light,” Phillips told Vogue. “You think, OK, this scene works, let’s just go shoot it. And Joaquin’s like, ‘No, no, no, let’s just have a quick meeting about it,’ and it’s three hours later and you’re rewriting it on a napkin.”
https://www.indiewire.com/news/gene...joker-folie-a-deux-script-napkins-1235043993/

Frenchy · Oct 8, 2024

xipotec said:
The first film was a terrible film and Joker in name only ....

As with so many of these film people latched onto what was ment to be a pathetic , narcissistic wacko weirdo, and unfortunately total misunderstood what he was doing.

Due shot a "innocent" man on TV , a **** head but mostly a figment of Arthur's repressed and important rage at a society he was not accepted by.

It's a revenge fantasy for misfits who cannot seem to cope with the realities of the world we live in.

The Joker he was not, he was a pale imitation of Travis Bickle and if your upset the horrible psychopath didn't win, you should probably be on a couch talking about it to someone,

But it's fiction, many people have sympathy for Hannibal Lester, or the or the 1st Terminator who massacres a police station or Alex of Clockwork Orange.

GaryPool · Oct 8, 2024

People are just angry he's the best Joker and can't accept it.

Frenchy · Oct 8, 2024

chrisstbh said:
View attachment 731402

I doubt Nolan asked Phillips anything, that's not his style

But Phoenix is acting erratically at the moment.
On Napoleon :
https://variety.com/2023/film/news/...d-out-napoleon-shoot-ridley-scott-1235683371/

Andan anbother movie :

The Oscar-winning actor Joaquin Phoenix has dropped out of a new gay drama, directed by Todd Haynes, just five days before filming was set to begin :

https://www.theguardian.com/film/article/2024/aug/09/joaquin-phoenix-exit-todd-haynes-gay-drama

crows · Oct 8, 2024

Frenchy said:
I doubt Nolan asked Phillips anything, that's not his style

But Phoenix is acting erratically at the moment.
On Napoleon :
https://variety.com/2023/film/news/...d-out-napoleon-shoot-ridley-scott-1235683371/

Andan anbother movie :

The Oscar-winning actor Joaquin Phoenix has dropped out of a new gay drama, directed by Todd Haynes, just five days before filming was set to begin :

https://www.theguardian.com/film/article/2024/aug/09/joaquin-phoenix-exit-todd-haynes-gay-drama

i didn't hear that it was Nolan
but that James gunn added that ending.
I read that he asked to have the new ending

R_R_X · Oct 8, 2024

GaryPool said:
People are just angry he's the best Joker and can't accept it.

roan · Oct 8, 2024

Nick D said:
That’s the best part, sadly.

Yikes. That’s horrible.

roan · Oct 8, 2024

Would love this figure, probably one of my favorite scenes from the movie, but after this sequel I’m not so sure anymore. Sigh.

GaryPool · Oct 8, 2024

roan said:
Would love this figure, probably one of my favorite scenes from the movie, but after this sequel I’m not so sure anymore. Sigh.

View attachment 731429

It doesn't take away or change how powerful that scene was - if you enjoyed that scene definitely get it for that representation, the figure represents that moment of time in that film.

Wor-Gar · Oct 8, 2024

Joker 2019 was a really good movie -- but I'm not sure its strong enough to survive a bad sequel.

As far as a rendition of "the Joker", this was never going to be the 'crime lord Joker who confronts Batman'. But as a study of how, in the real world, a Joker-like figure might emerge, it is fascinating. I personally just think the sequel drove him into the ground rather than further explored this character growing even more into something terrible for society.

But hey, I can only take what they serve... and then decide if I want to eat it.

GaryPool · Oct 8, 2024

Wor-Gar said:
Joker 2019 was a really good movie -- but I'm not sure its strong enough to survive a bad sequel.

As far as a rendition of "the Joker", this was never going to be the 'crime lord Joker who confronts Batman'. But as a study of how, in the real world, a Joker-like figure might emerge, it is fascinating. I personally just think the sequel drove him into the ground rather than further explored this character growing even more into something terrible for society.

But hey, I can only take what they serve... and then decide if I want to eat it.

That's a really fair take.

I personally think it's strong enough to survive any bad views of the second film, but then again I genuinely really love the first film.

I also completely view it as an Arthur Fleck film, and never have viewed it as a Joker character or film, probably why I was on board with getting the JND Arthur Fleck statue. But then again, I'd love to own the Oh Dae-Su statue also of an absolute tragic character as well, so I can easily overlook what others dislike about that.

Fleck/Joker does absolutely nothing that a Joker character would do, he wore clown makeup and that's it. What else did he do in the first film that is 'Joker'? Genuinely nothing.

I think the reason the film survived as much as it did outside of that is because it had those incredulously brilliant and iconic scenes like the bathroom moment (funnily enough that was the moment his Joker persona came out and a bathroom scene in Joker 2 took it away, cool symmetry), so even if I personally were to have disliked the second film, nothing in the world could make me change how I viewed those scenes.

Tldr: og bathroom scene is too kino to not get a dollie to represent it

Wor-Gar · Oct 8, 2024

The train shooting and the last 25 minutes of Joker 2019 will always be riveting to me, nothing will take that away.

But it's a hard film to run back to and watch from beginning to end. It's draining. It puts you in a strange mood. You really have to be prepared for it on repeat, I think. Because its so harsh, it's also easier for people to 'let it go'... especially after the sequel.

Nick D · Oct 8, 2024

It’s a treat to have the ability
to separate the two, in some instances
I can, here unfortunately I cannot.

Instead of picturing Phoenix painting his bloodgrin, and looking towards what possibilities this future might entail..

My image is smeared by the immediate thought of Joker lasting 10 seconds with Harley, cried like a baby more times than I’m comfortable counting here, kissed his cellmate on the mouth with intent to humiliate, *****, drug back to his cell with dirty white boxers with the camera fixed at the appropriate height. A shanking that felt like it went on as long as his suffering did, just cold in every conceivable way.

The People vs. O.J (Joker and Harvey Dent edition). Worried you may have gone too far in humanizing him, so you put him on a televised trial. The unanimous decision was made almost instantly, so why do we sit through it?

Because you’re padding out runtime,
further attempting to humanize him despite slapping wrists of those attempting to follow your convoluted fizzled out story. Your stupid story mentions how Harley is pregnant by him, what’s the goal there Todd?

crows · Oct 8, 2024

Joker: Folie à Deux.... GOT SHANKED IN THE BACK GOT SHANKED IN THE FRONT

GaryPool · Oct 8, 2024

Wor-Gar said:
The train shooting and the last 25 minutes of Joker 2019 will always be riveting to me, nothing will take that away.

But it's a hard film to run back to and watch from beginning to end. It's draining. It puts you in a strange mood. You really have to be prepared for it on repeat, I think. Because its so harsh, it's also easier for people to 'let it go'... especially after the sequel.

Yeah, I don't think those scenes were expected, they're very harrowing.

I've always loved bleak films and stories, I watched Joker 6 times in the cinema when it originally came out, I won't retread all the reasons why I loved it, but it was the absolute correct concoction of the sum of all its parts.

That train scene in particular is brilliant, it's unnerving and awful to watch, he acts in self-defence... Then he follows and unloads on the last guy, runs away and has a cathartic metamorphis in the bathroom. That's the moment when he turns from a wholly sympathetic person to troublesome, he becomes someone else in that moment that has crossed the line for him to kill again. In isolation that scene regardless of representing the Joker or not is just an incredibly well-shot and thought out moment in a film heightened by Hildur Gudnadottir's score.

But that last 25 minutes is pristine. Again, the score really heightens it.

R_R_X · Oct 8, 2024

Wor-Gar said:
Joker 2019 was a really good movie -- but I'm not sure its strong enough to survive a bad sequel.

As far as a rendition of "the Joker", this was never going to be the 'crime lord Joker who confronts Batman'. But as a study of how, in the real world, a Joker-like figure might emerge, it is fascinating. I personally just think the sequel drove him into the ground rather than further explored this character growing even more into something terrible for society.

But hey, I can only take what they serve... and then decide if I want to eat it.

The first one is supposed to be a tragic tale of a mentally ill man unravelling and turning into a monster because of how society treated him. One could argue he ends up even more broken by the end of the film but in a weird way he's triumphantly broken. It's like a train wreck, it's horrible to see him go down this path but we just can't look away.

Then along came the second one, and it doesn't add anything to the first, it actively takes away from it by undoing Arthur's arc and just leaving him plain broken. Hell you could watch the first film backwards and you'd probably get the same experience as the second one... Minus the musical, **** and Temu Ledger shanking Arthur.

So if you're going to serve me the same dish but with **** on top as some sort of artistic statement, I'm going to send it back too.

Wor-Gar · Oct 8, 2024

Is anyone here planning to bash a 1/6th Joker in 'crawling away' position with soiled underwear hanging off him?

I wonder what the hell your guests would say if that were prominently displayed? I can see Phoenix liking that idea.

Nick D · Oct 8, 2024

This is The Joker I’ve wanted to see.

He didn’t look the part at the time of shooting Begins, but I can’t think of a more talented known actor that looks the part and has the chops to pull it off.

Wor-Gar · Oct 8, 2024

You love that man.

Joker: Folie à Deux

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