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Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

Well this long time fan thinks it's fantastic news. Not sure about Chibnall as showrunner, but after watching some interviews with Whittaker she seems to have the same fun and lively energy about her as Tennant, Smith, and Capaldi. So I think she could be great. And I think they really needed to do something bold and interesting with the casting at this point to re-energize the show.

Why is it a bold move to change an established male iconic character to female? I don't want 50 plus years of 'who lore' changed just to suit a small minority..the nets in meltdown since the announcement...and not in a good way! Even reading the statement by the BBC on Whittaker's appointment is pretty cringey PC BS. As for Whittaker as an actress...the less said the better. I was really hoping for Ivanno jeremiah who would have been a breathe of fresh air! He's fantastic in Humans..
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

Totally stupid idea.
I've watched this show for ever. I can say with all sincerity that I will not watch this next series if Who .
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

Big Chief responded on Twitter that a Thirteenth Doctor figure will definitely get done.

But the Thirteenth Doctor hasn't been cast yet?...we'll have to wait until this cosplaying wannabe female Doctor timelord/lady imposter is exterminated by low viewing figures..
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

Why is it a bold move to change an established male iconic character to female? I don't want 50 plus years of 'who lore' changed just to suit a small minority..the nets in meltdown since the announcement...and not in a good way! Even reading the statement by the BBC on Whittaker's appointment is pretty cringey PC BS. As for Whittaker as an actress...the less said the better. I was really hoping for Ivanno jeremiah who would have been a breathe of fresh air! He's fantastic in Humans..

Look at the disparity between the BBC's words and Capaldi's comments - the former emphasizes the boldness, the time for change, etc all that happy horse manure - while the latter comments on her as an actress, lists the reasons why she is qualified.

If that doesn't speak volumes, I don't know what does. It shows the mindset here, and what is being broadcast by BBC. It's been very apparent Capaldi hasn't liked the Doctor they wrote for him, and, for the short of it, they've progressively Tumblr-ized the show through his seasons. That doesn't seem to be him in reality. Each Doctor is in some capacity representative of their actor.

If female Doctor would have been introduced 3, 4 years ago, I think it would have been totally fluid and just would have worked without a hitch. Kind of the way Star Wars did it with Rey (though that was already pushing the tipping point with society). I have NO problem with a female actress taking the role. There was a time I really liked the idea of Hayley Atwell as the Doctor. I have no problem with people of different beliefs, sexualities, whatever - live and let live. What I have a problem with is shoehorning these aspects into a show JUST to appease a very vocal group of people. It's this wild paradox, people want these aspects in shows and movies, but forcing them in diminishes the value of the individuality in each one.

Could you imagine having to write for a show where, before you get to even take the pen cap off, you HAVE to include a character that is X, Y, or Z? That's the attitude this show has taken, and it's unfortunate. It feels forced. Let those traits naturally be written in. Do we even need to discuss relationships? Nah. Then let's spend more time on other characterization. Yes? Okay, how do we write whether they are straight or gay based on everything? Can this character work better as a woman, okay let's do that (Ripley anyone?). Should this character be black, tan, white, purple? Yes/no, the setting does/doesn't support that. Stop restricting writers.

Sorry for the rant. It's been building up for a while since I've been watching the most recent season on DVR. This seems to be the only place where discussion remains pretty even keeled, so I knew it was safe to explore it a bit.
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

Why is it a bold move to change an established male iconic character to female? I don't want 50 plus years of 'who lore' changed just to suit a small minority..the nets in meltdown since the announcement...and not in a good way! Even reading the statement by the BBC on Whittaker's appointment is pretty cringey PC BS. As for Whittaker as an actress...the less said the better. I was really hoping for Ivanno jeremiah who would have been a breathe of fresh air! He's fantastic in Humans..

Well clearly it IS bold or it wouldn't be this huge, controversial thing that everyone is talking about right now. And personally I've just never seen the Doctor being male as what made the character so iconic. In fact it's probably pretty far down the list.

And on a show where all kinds of crazy, ridiculous things happen all the time, an alien Timelord regenerating into a woman doesn't really seem farfetched to me at all.

It's not about being "PC", it's about doing something fresh and different and new.
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

It's been very apparent Capaldi hasn't liked the Doctor they wrote for him, and, for the short of it, they've progressively Tumblr-ized the show through his seasons. That doesn't seem to be him in reality.

You know what, I think I could have maybe even liked Capaldi if there hadn't been all this other stuff pissing me off. There were some scenes when I got a brief flicker of the feelings I used to have towards this character / show.

I have no problem with people of different beliefs, sexualities, whatever - live and let live. What I have a problem with is shoehorning these aspects into a show JUST to appease a very vocal group of people.


:exactly:
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

Well clearly it IS bold or it wouldn't be this huge, controversial thing that everyone is talking about right now. And personally I've just never seen the Doctor being male as what made the character so iconic. In fact it's probably pretty far down the list.

And on a show where all kinds of crazy, ridiculous things happen all the time, an alien Timelord regenerating into a woman doesn't really seem farfetched to me at all.

It's not about being "PC", it's about doing something fresh and different and new.

It's the timing, I believe, Dave. More than anything. Right now we throw about PC and forced left and right because that's the climate. And because that's the current climate, people are more likely to be polarized (I can't even stand to watch the news anymore because of how biased and blinded by affiliation people are). Like I said above, I think having a female Doctor was inevitable, but had it been done a few years back, it wouldn't have been this big deal, it would have flowed better and not be "questioned". I hope the show is good! I hope the new showrunner takes this into a new, really good era. But I fear the trend that has been set by Moffatt's last seasons is more in line with appeasing a select audience.
You know what, I think I could have maybe even liked Capaldi if there hadn't been all this other stuff pissing me off. There were some scenes when I got a brief flicker of the feelings I used to have towards this character / show.




:exactly:
There are so many moments that show him as a good Doctor. When he describes the future of the space program, the Zygon speech, figuring out where his portrait came from, sending off the monsters in the subway, when he breaks the fourth wall to talk to the audience (about the what you hear in the dark, the boostrap paradox), to name a few. I loved him as the Doctor, but not perhaps how they handled him always.
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

Well clearly it IS bold or it wouldn't be this huge, controversial thing that everyone is talking about right now. And personally I've just never seen the Doctor being male as what made the character so iconic. In fact it's probably pretty far down the list.

And on a show where all kinds of crazy, ridiculous things happen all the time, an alien Timelord regenerating into a woman doesn't really seem farfetched to me at all.

It's not about being "PC", it's about doing something fresh and different and new.

I wouldn't call it bold..it's just the 'PC brigade' wanting to change every well established iconic male character to female...which is getting a little tiresome. Being bold would have been the BBC creating a brand new series about a time traveling lady called fred! No for me the Doctor will always be a male Timelord and not this awful piece of sensationalist casting...
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

It's the timing, I believe, Dave. More than anything. Right now we throw about PC and forced left and right because that's the climate. And because that's the current climate, people are more likely to be polarized (I can't even stand to watch the news anymore because of how biased and blinded by affiliation people are). Like I said above, I think having a female Doctor was inevitable, but had it been done a few years back, it wouldn't have been this big deal, it would have flowed better and not be "questioned". I hope the show is good! I hope the new showrunner takes this into a new, really good era. But I fear the trend that has been set by Moffatt's last seasons is more in line with appeasing a select audience.

Oh I'm sure some fans would have revolted just as much if it was done a few years ago too.

And I can understand the argument about not changing an established character like Bond or Superman or whatever. But when we're talking about a 2000 year old alien Timelord who flies around in a magic box and has been played by over 12 different actors, I would think the rules could be a little more flexible. And the idea that it's fine for him to regenerate into males of varying ages and personalities, but can never be a woman, just seems silly to me.

And if it makes some feel better, there's always the possibility this may only be the result of his new cycle of regenerations given to him at the end of TOTD, and not something he was always capable of. They've already bent the rules quite a bit just to keep him around this long, so I don't see why this would be so horribly out of bounds.
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

They should make her lesbian to bring about the nerd end times :lol
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

Look at the disparity between the BBC's words and Capaldi's comments - the former emphasizes the boldness, the time for change, etc all that happy horse manure - while the latter comments on her as an actress, lists the reasons why she is qualified.

If that doesn't speak volumes, I don't know what does. It shows the mindset here, and what is being broadcast by BBC. It's been very apparent Capaldi hasn't liked the Doctor they wrote for him, and, for the short of it, they've progressively Tumblr-ized the show through his seasons. That doesn't seem to be him in reality. Each Doctor is in some capacity representative of their actor.

If female Doctor would have been introduced 3, 4 years ago, I think it would have been totally fluid and just would have worked without a hitch. Kind of the way Star Wars did it with Rey (though that was already pushing the tipping point with society). I have NO problem with a female actress taking the role. There was a time I really liked the idea of Hayley Atwell as the Doctor. I have no problem with people of different beliefs, sexualities, whatever - live and let live. What I have a problem with is shoehorning these aspects into a show JUST to appease a very vocal group of people. It's this wild paradox, people want these aspects in shows and movies, but forcing them in diminishes the value of the individuality in each one.

Could you imagine having to write for a show where, before you get to even take the pen cap off, you HAVE to include a character that is X, Y, or Z? That's the attitude this show has taken, and it's unfortunate. It feels forced. Let those traits naturally be written in. Do we even need to discuss relationships? Nah. Then let's spend more time on other characterization. Yes? Okay, how do we write whether they are straight or gay based on everything? Can this character work better as a woman, okay let's do that (Ripley anyone?). Should this character be black, tan, white, purple? Yes/no, the setting does/doesn't support that. Stop restricting writers.

Sorry for the rant. It's been building up for a while since I've been watching the most recent season on DVR. This seems to be the only place where discussion remains pretty even keeled, so I knew it was safe to explore it a bit.

Very well said.

This was always inevitable, and as such, even though I was one who didn't see anything wrong with the current male character format, and so didn't see it as needing to change, it was always going to happen at some point. And I just hoped that when it did, it would be done because they had someone so undeniably Doctor-ish that gender didn't even really come into it. That we wouldn't get the 'female Doctor', but instead a new Doctor that just so happens to be played by a female actress, but that this was the least interesting thing about the choice, and not the focal point. That the casting was personality rather than gender based at the heart of its reasoning. And that's why I'm unconvinced by this because from what is being said by those involved the whole point was to cast a female Doctor rather than just to cast the Doctor, that was their 'bold move', and that is a big difference, as far as intent goes. And it's a difference that slightly bothers me, to be honest.

Add that to my personal opinion that Jodie Whittaker is a rather bland performer (not at all bad, just bland), and I'm just not convinced she has the presence, personality or gravitas to truly sell the part. She strikes me a bit along the lines of Peter Davison, fine, does the job, but just a bit unexciting really (I would have felt the same way about Kris Marshall, just for the record). And if all you are is the next Doctor, you could get away with that. If Whittaker had been the second female to be cast as the Doctor, it wouldn't be an issue, because the battle for acceptance would have already been fought, and everyone would have moved on, one way or another. But the first female in the role needs to be a bit special, they need to be like Tom Baker or David Tennant or Christopher Eccleston, someone who becomes unquestionably the Doctor in the majority public mindset pretty much right from the off, and I'm unconvinced that Whittaker has the chops to deliver that.

Anything less, and if ratings drop and people are indifferent, then the road may soon become very bumpy indeed. My worry is that Jodie Whittaker just isn't capable of helping deliver that gigantuan task, and of establishing the true validity of a female as the Doctor in the way that will be required for such a change to be seen as worthwhile and not just a bit of stunt casting or gimmickry. It's not fair, but neither is much of life. she has the hardest job in the role since Patrick Troughton took over and originally had to try to sell the idea that the Doctor isn't just William Hartnell, but can change and become someone entirely different. I hope she surprises and proves me wrong, but right now, she just doesn't inspire much confidence personally, and if it goes wrong - and I truly hope that it doesn't - I hope she's prepared, because things could get very ugly indeed, and she may end up as the new series equivalent of Colin Baker, and unfairly eviscerated and scapegoated just as much, from both sides of the divide. Because the press and the general public are fickle, and any sniff of weakness and they will turn. And most of those crowing this a victory and gloating today won't be there and will no longer care, because a great many of them don't even watch the show to begin with. They got their perceived win for the cause, they'll move on to demanding something else somewhere else now. It's the fans and regular viewers that will be left, so for their/our sake I just hope she will turn out to be a Doctor who does surprise, and becomes one that we can all believe in.

Time will tell, it always does.
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

AND within hours of the announcement it's exactly as I feared...
The media is using it as a publicity gimmick to manufacture controversy and pit fans against one another. Disgusting. I don' f*ing appreciate fans being painted as mysoginists by the media and a bunch of Johnny-come-lately SJWs who don't even watch the show. This is just the BBC. I shudder to think of the trolling the US media will do. I am looking forward to see what Whittaker will bring to the role.... But inflammatory garbage like THIS is what will ruin it for me before I even get to watch her in the role. It's not a female Doctor herself but all this inevitable BS that surrounds it all.
https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-40626224

Rest assured, too, that the producers will come up with some 'terribly clever' way to mock those having trouble with this change from inside the show.

And no, ratings will not indicate if people will like the change. The controversy will inspire people to tune in... everybody loves a good trainwreck. That's what makes publicity stunts work.
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

I think I'll watch a few episodes and make up my mind based on what's presented.
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

Big Chief responded on Twitter that a Thirteenth Doctor figure will definitely get done.

Don't suppose they said anything about the Third Doctor figure or when the War Doctor figure might be getting released did they? (I'm not on facebook or twitter so can't ask!).
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

Don't suppose they said anything about the Third Doctor figure or when the War Doctor figure might be getting released did they? (I'm not on facebook or twitter so can't ask!).

BCS will have a presence at SDCC this year via Sideshow, so I am hoping to see some new unveilings - including Pertwee.
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

BCS will have a presence at SDCC this year via Sideshow, so I am hoping to see some new unveilings - including Pertwee.

Thanks for the info...hopefully they will have some awesome stuff to show us then :) I would love to see how the Pertwee figure is coming along, really hoping for a a Second Doctor figure announcement as well but I suspect that that is a long way off...I can but hope!! :lol
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

Okay... wait. Did I miss something? Has it been confirmed that Pertwee is in the works? I hope so... and I hope we'll get him in his red jacket and purple-lined cloak, a la "The Daemons" and "The Claws of Axos" era promo photos.
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

They posted 3D renders of the sculpt didn't they? I thought I remembered seeing them somewhere but I can't seem to locate them. :dunno
 
Re: Big Chief Studios - 1/6 Doctor Who - #04 Tom Baker

Here's the render that was shown, with compliments to whoever it was who took the photo and uploaded it originally (sorry, I can't remember):


ssl image
 
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