NECA Back to the Future

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Strickland = peg warmer

 

[a-dev]

Strickland = Slacker action figure

 

[The Green Goblin]

This forum really loves asking for line-killer figures. I'm just happy we're getting Marty figures, and likely Doc.

 

[dukefett]

This forum really loves asking for line-killer figures. I'm just happy we're getting Marty figures, and likely Doc.

Y'all got any of those BttF3 bartender figures?

 

[mikedanger]

Strickland and Goldie Wilson 2 pack

 

[a-dev]

You wouldn't know from the figure specs which have them both the same height. I'm sure that won't be the case though and Biff will be taller...the right amount of taller though? Who knows.

I love BTTF II even though the entire plot of that movie is a major plot hole - I'm not the first one to think of this by any means but if anyone wants to discuss

Spoiler

When Marty and Jennifer leave 1985 in the Delorean that should have meant they merely skipped 30 years when arriving in 2015. There shouldn't have been any other Marty and Jennifer in 2015. Rather, when they arrived in the future they would have found a story of their own mysterious disappearance back in 1985 and the ensuing heartbreak of their loved ones wondering what the hell happened to them.

BTTF II seems to posit that when they go into the future they also somehow remain in the timeline exactly as they otherwise would have but how the hell can that be the case? It can't. And look no further than BTTF I when Doc sends Einstein 1 minute into the future - was there some duplicate of Einstein and Delorean still there for that 1 minute period until a second Delorean turned up with another Einstein inside? Because that's basically what happens from the 2015 perspective of BTTF II. The movies contradict their own time travel logic.

The only way it can make sense is if they have traveled into an alternate timeline's version of 2015 - a timeline in which Marty and Jennifer did not time travel and thus have no awareness of their younger selves being there. Then there's 2 further problems with that -

1) it would defeat the entire purpose of the journey - which was for our Marty and Jennifer to stop their children's lives going to ***t - what would it matter if it wasn't their own timeline? Why should they care particularly?
2) In any case, according to the Doc you can only travel into the future of the timeline you are in. This was why, after they discover that they have arrived back in some hideously altered 1985 due to Biff's meddling, they cannot merely travel back to 2015 to stop Biff getting the Almanac and stealing the Delorean - that future had been erased and replaced with a new future of the timeline in which Biff killed George McFly, married Lorraine and Doc was committed to a mental assylum. Thus they could only solve their problem in the past when old Biff met young Biff to give him the Almanac.

So at the beginning of BTTF II what should travelling into the future of their own timeline mean? Go back to the first paragraph.


All this said, the ending of the original BTTF sets up this storyline so it's not exactly BTTF II's fault for proceeding with it.


edit - just a final thought - Doc initially travels to 2015 alone. This is when he first discovers all the stuff that's gone wrong in Marty's life and that's OK I guess. The problem is with the notion that you can pull yourself out of a timeline, jump into the future and meet your own future self there. Yeah, everyone else will be there but YOU won't be because only you can become the future you. So Doc should have known that the very act of taking Marty out of 1985 means Marty can't be there in 2015. Therefore the way to change Marty's future (since he didn't seem to have reservations about doing that anymore) was simply to tell Marty about everything that happens and let Marty change it over the natural course of time.

I happened to bring this up with my brother the other day and he raised the interesting point that when Doc sent Einstein 1 minute (or 2 minutes, can't remember) into the future for the initial test of the Time machine Einstein never actually returned to his original point in time - being a dog, he couldn't* - but even if Doc himself had travelled 2 minutes into the future, would it even have been necessary to make a 'return' journey? No matter the case, that's the key difference between the Einstein trip into the 'future' and Marty and Jennifer's trip to 2015. It was of course necessary for the latter to return to 1985.

So it could perhaps be argued that the fact that they do find their own counterparts in 2015 stipulates in advance that they will put themselves back into the natural timeline to then grow older and be present in 2015. There's still a problem though - this would mean that the middle-aged Marty and Jennifer should know about their younger selves being present in 2015 because that was them, they did that. And yet older Marty seems oblivious and older Jennifer is shocked into unconsciousness when she sees her younger self in front of her. So what gives? Did they forget what exact date their younger selves would appear? Was Jennifer likely to react that way no matter what?



Cameo appearance by Michael Gross as Burt Gummer in Tremors 2 - apt enough for 2 reasons - he played Michael J Fox's dad in Family Ties - and second he's dictating to himself in Tremors 2 as I am kinda doing here


*edit - RE: the part where I say Einstein couldn't travel 2 minutes back into the past because he's a dog and obviously couldn't operate the Delorean - true, but Doc could have sent him back if he deemed it necessary. He just didn't.

edit 2 - it's still all a head***k and I'm not sure anything I've said above holds water.

 

[Ironman69]

On that same note A-Dev, in BttF 3, when Marty travels to 1885 to rescue "Old" Doc, there should now be TWO DeLoreans. Doc's DeLorean that was struck by lightning at the end of BttF 2, and now Marty's ( which is actually the SAME DeLorean as Doc's! ). This is a great example in time travel science where one object (or person) from a different time period can actually exist together with it's own self. It is only when you travel to the past can you actually see yourself double. You can never do this while traveling into the future, for the exact reasons you mentioned earlier.

 

[EcklecticBadges]

In BTTF2 when old Biff leaves the Almanac with his younger self the moment he left that time period he altered the future so there should have been no scene where he exits the car and leaves his broken stick inside as that reality no longer existed. Marty and the Doc would have had no chance to try and stop it.

I still love the movie. The third one bored me to tears though.

 

[dukefett]

I happened to bring this up with my brother the other day and he raised the interesting point that when Doc sent Einstein 1 minute (or 2 minutes, can't remember) into the future for the initial test of the Time machine Einstein never actually returned to his original point in time - being a dog, he couldn't* - but even if Doc himself had travelled 2 minutes into the future, would it even have been necessary to make a 'return' journey? No matter the case, that's the key difference between the Einstein trip into the 'future' and Marty and Jennifer's trip to 2015. It was of course necessary for the latter to return to 1985.

So it could perhaps be argued that the fact that they do find their own counterparts in 2015 stipulates in advance that they will put themselves back into the natural timeline to then grow older and be present in 2015. There's still a problem though - this would mean that the middle-aged Marty and Jennifer should know about their younger selves being present in 2015 because that was them, they did that. And yet older Marty seems oblivious and older Jennifer is shocked into unconsciousness when she sees her younger self in front of her. So what gives? Did they forget what exact date their younger selves would appear? Was Jennifer likely to react that way no matter what?

View attachment 488931

Cameo appearance by Michael Gross as Burt Gummer in Tremors 2 - apt enough for 2 reasons - he played Michael J Fox's dad in Family Ties - and second he's dictating to himself in Tremors 2 as I am kinda doing here


*edit - RE: the part where I say Einstein couldn't travel 2 minutes back into the past because he's a dog and obviously couldn't operate the Delorean - true, but Doc could have sent him back if he deemed it necessary. He just didn't.

edit 2 - it's still all a head***k and I'm not sure anything I've said above holds water.

With regard to sending Einstein back in time, then there would've been 2 Deloreans at the same time. Basically Doc would've know his time machine worked before even actually trying it.

On that same note A-Dev, in BttF 3, when Marty travels to 1885 to rescue "Old" Doc, there should now be TWO DeLoreans. Doc's DeLorean that was struck by lightning at the end of BttF 2, and now Marty's ( which is actually the SAME DeLorean as Doc's! ). This is a great example in time travel science where one object (or person) from a different time period can actually exist together with it's own self. It is only when you travel to the past can you actually see yourself double. You can never do this while traveling into the future, for the exact reasons you mentioned earlier.

Oh yeah, I totally forgot that the Delorean Marty uses in BttF3 is Doc's and should still exist in 1885. I can't remember, do they ever acknowledge that there's 2 Deloreans in 1885? Doc wouldn't have needed to build the train time machine then? Or does he re-work that other delorean into the train?

In BTTF2 when old Biff leaves the Almanac with his younger self the moment he left that time period he altered the future so there should have been no scene where he exits the car and leaves his broken stick inside as that reality no longer existed. Marty and the Doc would have had no chance to try and stop it.

I still love the movie. The third one bored me to tears though.

If I remember right, changes in time occur in ripples, so there is time after a change to the past to redirect it again; it's not instant. That's why in BttF1 Marty is slowly disappearing instead of instantly disappearing when he's playing guitar towards the end. If changes happened instantly Marty would've basically disappeared as soon as he did anything with his parents.

 

[a-dev]

On that same note A-Dev, in BttF 3, when Marty travels to 1885 to rescue "Old" Doc, there should now be TWO DeLoreans. Doc's DeLorean that was struck by lightning at the end of BttF 2, and now Marty's ( which is actually the SAME DeLorean as Doc's! ). This is a great example in time travel science where one object (or person) from a different time period can actually exist together with it's own self. It is only when you travel to the past can you actually see yourself double. You can never do this while traveling into the future, for the exact reasons you mentioned earlier.

Yeah, although I tried with today's post, I find it very hard to get away from this. Surely with any time travel you do, whether it's to the future or to the past, you are extracting yourself from the world of the 'present'. You will no longer be there. As far as anyone you leave behind is concerned, if they didn't know what you were doing, you essentially went missing. How long you are 'missing' is up to you - because you could program your Delorean's computer to take you back at the exact time you left OR maybe you decide to travel a bit into the future of what was your 'present' to account for however many days, weeks or months you aged during your time travelling. But doing so may raise questions from those you left behind of where the hell you were.

As regards travelling 30 years into the future and finding yourself there though - just doesn't make sense. You removed yourself from the timeline to go there, you physically disappeared for 30 years only to reappear suddenly. I don't see why it would be any different than if you cryogenically froze yourself for that amount of time. You wouldn't wake up and find another you walking around because YOU are you and you were cryogenically frozen

In BTTF2 when old Biff leaves the Almanac with his younger self the moment he left that time period he altered the future so there should have been no scene where he exits the car and leaves his broken stick inside as that reality no longer existed. Marty and the Doc would have had no chance to try and stop it.

What dukefett said RE: the Ripple effect.

Terminator must also operate within this same premise of time travel because otherwise Skynet's plan to erase John Connor by sending a Terminator back to 1984 to kill his mother should have been an instant success. And yet John continued existing, discovered Skynet's plan and had time to counteract it.

I mean yeah, it's all total nonsense...we just have to buy it if we want to like the movies. Likewise, whatever rationale we can come up with for the BTTFII plothole of older Marty and Jennifer in 2015.

 

[EcklecticBadges]

Yeah the ripple effect was the only way it could work.

Another thing that always bothered me was that at the end of the first movie his whole family were basically all strangers to Marty. Sure they were all successful but Marty would have no experience of that growing up with them. His memories would be of the previous versions.

 

[dukefett]

Yeah the ripple effect was the only way it could work.

Another thing that always bothered me was that at the end of the first movie his whole family were basically all strangers to Marty. Sure they were all successful but Marty would have no experience of that growing up with them. His memories would be of the previous versions.

Yeah that'll definitely be a problem, but there really wasn't even enough time to explore that. Didn't BttF3 basically end the morning after the first time traveling attempt?

 

[ShadowX81]

Yeah the ripple effect was the only way it could work.

Another thing that always bothered me was that at the end of the first movie his whole family were basically all strangers to Marty. Sure they were all successful but Marty would have no experience of that growing up with them. His memories would be of the previous versions.

Thank god that the McFlys even had the same kids. Reminds me of the movie "About Time" where a guy goes back and changes something in his past, and when he returns in the present he has a son instead of a daughter. He realizes that even a small change of life course could result in a completely different sperm and egg being fertilized; making him realize that he can never travel back to before when his kids were born.

 

[a-dev]

I saw that one.

Yeah time travel really would just be too dangerous with unlimited possible negative consequences to even well-intended changes. It's a wonder Doc Brown even invented his time machine because it's not like he didn't know. And why did he make his train at the end of BTTFIII after being so adamant that the Delorean had to be destroyed?

 

[intercityfirm1895]

This forum really loves asking for line-killer figures. I'm just happy we're getting Marty figures, and likely Doc.

Lol definetely. I mean really? Strickland? Worst action figure idea ever.

 

[EcklecticBadges]

Yeah that'll definitely be a problem, but there really wasn't even enough time to explore that. Didn't BttF3 basically end the morning after the first time traveling attempt?

Yeah I think so. He has that race with Needles soon after I think.

I would take a Strickland figure as I could also use the head for his cop character in the Masters of the Universe movie!

"What the hell is that?!!"

 

[ShadowX81]

Yeah that'll definitely be a problem, but there really wasn't even enough time to explore that. Didn't BttF3 basically end the morning after the first time traveling attempt?

In present day the whole film takes place over a weekend.

The first film opens on Friday October 25th.
He leaves for 1955 at 2am on Saturday October 26th. Gets back at the same time.

The next morning he leaves with Jennifer and Doc to 2015 and returns that night into the Biff timeline.

He gets back from 1885 the next morning, Sunday October 27th.


One thing that always struck me as odd was that the whole 1985 aspects of the movie take place in late October yet there aren't any Halloween decorations anywhere.

 

[EcklecticBadges]

They wouldn't make a movie like this now.

A young kid hangs about at night with a weird old man and his Mother also has the hots for him.

 

[a-dev]

And the whole Biff sexually assaulting Lorraine but subsequently being given credit for George and Lorraine getting together - even being employed by them. I despise today's cancel culture with every fiber of my being and even I find that weird. Some cancellations can be pretty well justified and that'd be one of them.

 

[ShadowX81]

Yeah, when George and Loraine talk about Biff being ultimately responsible for them getting together it was more of a statement of affection for one another than for Biff. A crappy event brought them together. You can be thankful that it ended the way it did without having to have fond memories of every aspect of the circumstance. It is weird though that Loraine especially would be fine with Biff hanging around the house all the time.

Im curious if in the original timeline, at some point the original Biff took some drunken liberties with Loraine; and Loraine was too despondent to tell anyone about it/knew George was too weak to do anything.