The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug

[creature4000]

Is it because it's not what you expected or hoped for or because you don't like this type of movie (ie. Pirates of the Caribbean).

I guess hoped for... After watching LOTR trilogy Jan1 and seeing a dwarf who couldn't run very fast or jump over six feet kind of left me wanting some more continuity between them.

Heavy orcs running unoticed on thatched roofs!

 

[The Josh]

Sweet I just ordered one of the coins from weta, guessing they will release more over the year?

Should release four more.

That cliffhanger really killed me, another year jesus

I love peoples reaction. As soon as Bilbo said, "what have we done?" I got up and started down the steps while everyone else sat there.

 

[The Chev]

Should release four more.



I love peoples reaction. As soon as Bilbo said, "what have we done?" I got up and started down the steps while everyone else sat there.

It's funny because nobody even moves to get coats on until the credits start.

 

[The Josh]

It's funny because nobody even moves to get coats on until the credits start.

I know. I will say the entire theater saying what at my midnight showing was pretty funny.

 

[The Ween]

I guess hoped for... After watching LOTR trilogy Jan1 and seeing a dwarf who couldn't run very fast or jump over six feet kind of left me wanting some more continuity between them.

Heavy orcs running unoticed on thatched roofs!

Look at it this way, just like all humans aren't the same, neither are dwarves. Gimli was short and chubby and didn't move as well.

 

[Njits]

Look at it this way, just like all humans aren't the same, neither are dwarves. Gimli was short and chubby and didn't move as well.

And because CGI was a lot less cost-effective back then.

 

[Kibagami]

Man the nerds got a hold of this one quick. I'm already watching the dvd screener.

Thieves always work quick.

Not only that; it's Oscar season which means a lot of DVDs of movies that are currently in theaters are being passed around. You could get your hands on American Hustle and Lone Survivor too.

 

[The Josh]

And because CGI was a lot less cost-effective back then.

Yet the visual effects numbers are basically the same between the two trilogies.

 

[Njits]

Yet the visual effects numbers are basically the same between the two trilogies.

And they were way more subtle in LOTR, a CGI removed wire on a stunt double for instance is also categorized as a visual effects shot.

 

[The Josh]

And they were way more subtle in LOTR, a CGI removed wire on a stunt double for instance is also categorized as a visual effects shot.

I just watched all three EE this week and there is plenty of cgi in the films, and a lot of the things being said about The Hobbit films was said when the LOTR films came out. All five films have plenty of good or not so good cgi. I just find it funny people act like the LOTR films didn't use it at all.

 

[jye4ever]

Wait, the giant eagles, nazgul and fell beasts weren't real in LOTR.

 

[Irvy]

I hate that the wargs in TT look like crap now compared to the hobbit ones. Design wise and obviously the CG tech.

 

[Fritz]

I just watched all three EE this week and there is plenty of cgi in the films, and a lot of the things being said about The Hobbit films was said when the LOTR films came out. All give films have plenty of good or not so good cgi. I just find it funny people act like the LOTR films didn't use it at all.

Oh there was lots of CGI in Rings all right. Look at Moria, Helm's Deep, Pelennor, etc. I think what peoples biggest beef is that main guys like Azog and Bolg are mainly CGI not actors like Lurtz, Ugluk, Gothmog, etc. I think I'm one of the few people who prefers CGI Bolg to original Bolg.

PS. It's pretty funny but when you type "Hobbit Bolg" into google image search, most of pictures that come up are the original Bolg.

 

[The Josh]

I understand. I really like Azog's look especially with the improvements made in DOS. I don't mind Bolgs new/cgi look but I would have liked them to keep more of the original design in his cgi look.

 

[The Chev]

I just watched all three EE this week and there is plenty of cgi in the films, and a lot of the things being said about The Hobbit films was said when the LOTR films came out. All give films have plenty of good or not so good cgi. I just find it funny people act like the LOTR films didn't use it at all.

Yeah, that's what I've been saying all along.

 

[The Josh]

Yeah, that's what I've been saying all along.

 

[TheProcrastinator]

Nobody is saying that LOTR didn't use CGI, people are just pointing out that previous trilogy wasn't equally dependent on it. Back in 2001 Jackson used to shoot as much as he could on location. Location, location, location. Now it's mostly green screen to the point that even McKellen complained about it.

There was a palpable, grounded feeling to LOTR, feeling that it's a real place that You could visit. Now "The Hobbit" is gorgeous and I've said plenty of times before that the colorful look fits the story. But it doesn't look as real as LOTR tough. Most of locations in DOS have that CGI patina to them. Even places that could have been shot on location or easily faked in the studio with an elaborate sets are now clearly CGI. A decade ago they used biggatures. They didn't this time around. The opening vista shots of Lake Town in DOS are very pretty and atmospheric, but they are clearly CGI. Back in 2000's it would have been a no brainer for artisans at Weta to create model biggatures for this place to be shot from above (after all, what is Lake Town compared to Minas Tirith for example, which was also built as a biggature). How more realistic it would have looked? How more impressive would those opening shots be? You want to see the difference between the visuals in LOTR and Hobbit? Compare Lake Town opening shots, with the shots of Edoras when Eowyn is storming out of the Golden Hall, and Aragorn, Gimli, Legolas and Gandalf arrive in TTT. Thats the difference.

Some goes for most other places in DoS. Thranduil's halls were very pretty, but I could easily tell that besides the king's throne and the immediate floor area around it it, nothing else in that "set" was physical. In FOTR at least they digitaly composed Lothlorien out of variety of real elements.

And that whole color-enchanced, fairy tale look of the "Hobbit" could still be easily achieved on the physical sets by simply color grading the shots (like they did 12 years ago, but more). It would be just as beautiful, but it would look more real, more palpable.

Then there's the matter of CGI orcs (which I actually like).

All in all, I am not saying that Hobbit looks bad. Far from it. But it certainly suffers in some aspects becouse of PJ desire to bring it all in 3D and HFR (many of the CGI changes were made becouse of those formats). And I think it's silly and not fair to lump together all the arguments of those who complain about the overabundance of CGI and say that "LOTR used it too".

 

[DiFabio]

Great post, agree with everything.

Lord of the Rings felt like a real place I could visit with creatures I could interact with. CGI was used when it was absolutely necessary. The Hobbit? It feels fake and created digitally. I couldn't visit Smaug's lair or Goblin town without a few props and a huge green screen behind me.

 

[The Chev]

Nobody is saying that LOTR didn't use CGI, people are just pointing out that previous trilogy wasn't equally dependent on it. Back in 2001 Jackson used to shoot as much as he could on location. Location, location, location. Now it's mostly green screen to the point that even McKellen complained about it.

There was a palpable, grounded feeling to LOTR, feeling that it's a real place that You could visit. Now "The Hobbit" is gorgeous and I've said plenty of times before that the colorful look fits the story. But it doesn't look as real as LOTR tough. Most of locations in DOS have that CGI patina to them. Even places that could have been shot on location or easily faked in the studio with an elaborate sets are now clearly CGI. A decade ago they used biggatures. They didn't this time around. The opening vista shots of Lake Town in DOS are very pretty and atmospheric, but they are clearly CGI. Back in 2000's it would have been a no brainer for artisans at Weta to create model biggatures for this place to be shot from above (after all, what is Lake Town compared to Minas Tirith for example, which was also built as a biggature). How more realistic it would have looked? How more impressive would those opening shots be? You want to see the difference between the visuals in LOTR and Hobbit? Compare Lake Town opening shots, with the shots of Edoras when Eowyn is storming out of the Golden Hall, and Aragorn, Gimli, Legolas and Gandalf arrive in TTT. Thats the difference.

Some goes for most other places in DoS. Thranduil's halls were very pretty, but I could easily tell that besides the king's throne and the immediate floor area around it it, nothing else in that "set" was physical. In FOTR at least they digitaly composed Lothlorien out of variety of real elements.

And that whole color-enchanced, fairy tale look of the "Hobbit" could still be easily achieved on the physical sets by simply color grading the shots (like they did 12 years ago, but more). It would be just as beautiful, but it would look more real, more palpable.

Then there's the matter of CGI orcs (which I actually like).

All in all, I am not saying that Hobbit looks bad. Far from it. But it certainly suffers in some aspects becouse of PJ desire to bring it all in 3D and HFR (many of the CGI changes were made becouse of those formats). And I think it's silly and not fair to lump together all the arguments of those who complain about the overabundance of CGI and say that "LOTR used it too".

I agree that LOTR felt grounded. I just didn't notice a drastic difference between LOTR and Hobbit. Hobbit was a bit more silly, but I think PJ was trying to show that Middle-earth was changing into a darker world.

 

[DiFabio]

but I think PJ was trying to show that Middle-earth was changing into a darker world.

We see that in The Fellowship with the Shire, Bree and the other locations that are untouched by the war and it never looked fake? So that can't be it.