The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power | Amazon Prime Video - September 2, 2022

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Yet everyone loves Rogue One and Andor when Tony Gilroy isn't even a Star Wars fan.

It really doesn't matter if the writers, directors or even the actors are fans or not.

Non-fans can make masterpieces and fans can make absolute slop, and vice versa.
it depends if they do the homework after they get hired. actors will real all comics related to a character or watch the movies or stuff. they BECOME fans. daredevil, punisher, etc, those guys would look into the comics.

but with current marvel and star wars or other stuff like Halo I think? the creators even brag that they never read a single thing or never watched a single clip of the stuff they were adapting. zero. that's no Good
 
it depends if they do the homework after they get hired. actors will real all comics related to a character or watch the movies or stuff. they BECOME fans. daredevil, punisher, etc, those guys would look into the comics.
Sure, in some cases, but that's not entirely necessary.
but with current marvel and star wars or other stuff like Halo I think? the creators even brag that they never read a single thing or never watched a single clip of the stuff they were adapting. zero. that's no Good
Those are just bad creators.
 
Sure, in some cases, but that's not entirely necessary.

Those are just bad creators.
i don't remember who it was, I know it was someone from the marvels or eternals or halo,
someone on an interview was saying how they never touched the comic, how they went completely completely without knowing anything. how they just went with the script only. how they didn't know any background. and they were saying it as a positive,
( the director of Thor 4 said the same)
 
Anyway, just watched this weeks episode. I thought it was pretty good :dunno.

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.... just kidding, you are free to like whatever you like mate.
 
Holy crap episode 4 was freaking abysmal.

I fell asleep 3 times watching it!

When that lady came out from that village I thought I was watching an episode of Good Times it immediately took me out of Middle Earth and put me right back into my Medic days in NY lol
 
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Holy crap episode 4 was freaking abysmal.

I fell asleep 3 times watching it!

When that lady came out from that village. I thought I was watching an episode of Good Times it immediately took me out of Middle Earth and put me right back into my Medic days in NY lol
And yet every minute that you watch tells Amazon that you want more.
 
i really liked episode 4. I loved the scene in the dark forest with the ghosts and I loved the trees talking.
I loved the scene with the other wizard.
I loved everything with the elves and with the orcs.

I really loved it. I'm not making a joke. not trolling. I loved the way the orcs looked here. Iove galadriel
 
i really liked episode 4. I loved the scene in the dark forest with the ghosts and I loved the trees talking.
I loved the scene with the other wizard.
I loved everything with the elves and with the orcs.

I really loved it. I'm not making a joke. not trolling. I loved the way the orcs looked here. Iove galadriel
Keep Talking like that, and I'm gonna have to block you..... :wink1:

If not for anything other than just having bad taste in movies/tv shows. :rotfl
 
Keep Talking like that, and I'm gonna have to block you..... :wink1:

If not for anything other than just having bad taste in movies/tv shows. :rotfl

I liked what I saw, the story might be going nowhere or get boring. I'll admit that. I will admit that in 4 episodes there's not much going on. barely anything happening.

but I loved the visuals so far. and really I love the 2 hobbit girls they are funny. I love the scenes with the elves even if they arent doing much. I like the sets, I like the effects so far. I like the music

I guess since the expectations were so low and the bar was set so low, I'm just enjoying each scene visually. it's been boring but nothing too cringe.
 
So to set expectations properly: I’m keenly aware that the author is not Tolkien! Matching that level of quality would be like expecting for a stone monument to rival the great pyramid of Giza. Of course it won’t be that. No, rather RoP is essentially above average (which is not a high bar I’m pretty sure) fanfic, albeit with way higher production value than would ordinarily be possible.

I love the lore of Middle Earth so much that I can forgive a lot. So accepting this series for what it is, I’m actually finding myself entertained. It’s fun, for me anyway.

Spoiler below for episode 4:

[SPOILER="Spoiler"]
I’m disappointed that my forum handle namesake is apparently the Dark Lord of Rhun! It looks like the Stranger is Palando. And the writers made Alatar match what Tolkien first wrote about the blue wizards and Palando match the revision he made toward the end of his life. In my own mind I’ve imagined both of them matching the revised version of them both playing a heroic role. But then again maybe Palando will help Alatar come back to his senses and remember his true mission.
[/SPOILER]
 
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if I had to pick between hiring someone that never watch it and never cared at all, to a super fan. .....
Nicholas Meyer didn’t watch nor was a fan of Star Trek and he made Star Trek The Wrath of Khan.
 
Nicholas Meyer didn’t watch nor was a fan of Star Trek and he made Star Trek The Wrath of Khan.
but he respected I assume. did he brag about not caring?

and technically all directors are like that. technically a director is just for hire. he's just there to film.
my problem was when a show runner or the writers brag about not caring for the property or brag about never looking at a single page of a comic. the director of Thor 4 even mocked Thor and said Thor was absurd or something.

bragging and ridiculing the project you are working on is not good
 
but he respected I assume. did he brag about not caring?

and technically all directors are like that. technically a director is just for hire. he's just there to film.
my problem was when a show runner or the writers brag about not caring for the property or brag about never looking at a single page of a comic. the director of Thor 4 even mocked Thor and said Thor was absurd or something.

bragging and ridiculing the project you are working on is not good
At the time he had one movie under his belt. And it wasn’t a huge hit one either. The development of the movie was in a mess, multiple scripts none of them good from people familiar and that liked the franchise.

And yes he openly talks about how he didn’t know or was a fan. He’s still not really a fan. He views it as work he’s hired to do and he tries to make the best product he can.

And to be clear he wasn’t just the director he wrote the script opted to skip a credit for it cause it needed to be written quickly or the project would fail.

Bottom line. The point I’m trying to make, a super fan is sometimes the wrong choice. There are plenty of examples of people who aren’t fans of the IP making a good product.
 
At the time he had one movie under his belt. And it wasn’t a huge hit one either. The development of the movie was in a mess, multiple scripts none of them good from people familiar and that liked the franchise.

And yes he openly talks about how he didn’t know or was a fan. He’s still not really a fan. He views it as work he’s hired to do and he tries to make the best product he can.

And to be clear he wasn’t just the director he wrote the script opted to skip a credit for it cause it needed to be written quickly or the project would fail.

Bottom line. The point I’m trying to make, a super fan is sometimes the wrong choice. There are plenty of examples of people who aren’t fans of the IP making a good product.
but the point I was making is that hiring someone that mocks the property or the fanbase or brags about not caring for it or brags about not liking it is not a good idea either

one thing is to be a director for hire and another thing is to have negative feelings for the project.
 
but the point I was making is that hiring someone that mocks the property or the fanbase or brags about not caring for it or brags about not liking it is not a good idea either

one thing is to be a director for hire and another thing is to have negative feelings for the project.
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That wasn’t your point here which is what I was responding to.
 
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That wasn’t your point here which is what I was responding to.
oh I get it.
It looks like i was defending super fans. and I kind of was yes. I was kind of defending the hiring of superfans.
my point made it look like it's best to hire superfans, which could be bad . get bad results.

I can understand that superfans can ruin projects ( alien Romulus)
but then you get projects from super fans like hellboy. it depends
 
oh I get it.
It looks like i was defending super fans. and I kind of was yes. I was kind of defending the hiring of superfans.
my point made it look like it's best to hire superfans, which could be bad . get bad results.

I can understand that superfans can ruin projects ( alien Romulus)
but then you get projects from super fans like hellboy. it depends
Yeah. Outsider like Meyer “can” bring a good story from a IP if talented and they do the homework to understand it. He got it. He was like oh this is similar to Horstio Hornblower and turned in a really good Trek story.

But like you said super fans can do good work too. Peter Jackson come to mind. (And fitting for this forum).

End of the day either can work if they are talented.
 
My reaction to the insane "who is the stranger who is obviously Gandalf" story, the obvious Halbrand is Sauron reveal, the Harfoots, the Mithril storyline, the Southlands bullcarp, the Eminem cultists, the magic sword dam-key-volcano-rue-goldberg device insanity, the south-park style "elves are taking our jobs" storyline and the butchering of Numenor





I appreciate you clearing up a lot of the established lore for myself and others here. I have a pretty good memory, but maybe not that good for the complexity of the Tolkien universe.

(You can correct me if I am wrong or mistake in the following, from a lore standpoint.)

In the pilot episode, there's a flashback with young Galadriel and her brother (Finrod?) There's some bizarre out of touch dialogue then the guy goes off the war ( against Morgoth), then he gets killed and is returned on a slab. This is supposed to be a driving force for Galadriel to search for Sauron. Right here, from a screen writing perspective, is the first and major failure point in this series.

If you take the time to establish a real relationship/dynamic with Finrod and Galadriel, then you can put context on the loss. Then you can help the audience rationalize Galadriel's pathology and behavior ( which is all over the place, she's showing more Borderline Personality Disorder than being some storied she boss warrior general-ette. ) You can also establish Sauron as a real threat by actual storytelling instead of just raw exposition. The reason Game Of Thrones was able to weave in and out so many characters, kingdoms, and complex interests was because there was one clear central goal for everyone - To determine who should sit next on the Iron Throne.

I can galvanize a writers room around a long term war/siege against Morgoth. That makes sense to the audience. It's the kind of conflict that isn't so detached from their own perception of the world around them. However the political machinations and manipulation to make some powerful jewelry, that's a much tougher sell. If Galadriel is part of a reinforcement unit to resupply elves and she has to see her brother get killed, then Sauron shifts his nature and beds her and she falls in love with him, not knowing he killed her brother, that's something you can build around.

However part of this struggle is this is very established and beloved canon and lore. Creative license to make an effective TV show means consolidating characters ( Dune had this problem, there were just too many characters, and Villeneuve, in any other circumstance, would have trimmed the cast, but how could he do it when that story was so loved and held dearly by so many for decades?) Also fudging the timelines some.

A big struggle for the current ROP is there is no natural conflict. Except that which is self generated by bad decision making, poor ethics and constantly shifting plot armor. This is a sign of a very inexperienced writers room. When I see productions that miss the layups, that's very troubling. Screen writing, to be fair, is incredibly difficult, and it's not because it's at true blank slate. It's because the guard rails are already there, and sometimes it's easy to not see them, but you have stay contained within them or your narrative will fall apart.

Last thought, if you are going to spend this much money on a show, you need your first three episodes ( basically comprising a very long pilot) to have tremendous spectacle. You need to show the audience something they haven't seen before. How do you do that with more talking, endless talking, just chirping and jabbering over and over again from an endless stream of characters. You do it by pure fan service. Show people how brutal this world can be. I added a link to a video above that sort of encapsulates what I'm talking about.

IMHO, this show took a major wrong turn from the beginning. I don't care about what "No Go Zones" were contractually agreed upon, Bezos should have known better than to stay in the room if there wasn't enough practical material to tell a real story within the Tolkien lore.
 
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