Wonder Woman 1984 - June 5, 2020

[hellgrammite00]

I was watching some scenes on YT. Why does Maxwell Lord have an Asian son? I mean, like full Asian. Is he married to an Asian woman?

I assume he adopted.

What really is going to explode your mind is the fact that Wonder Woman, after realizing Trevor's soul returned to the living by violating the body of an innocent person, decides to have sex with that body in that person's house for like the week. And then at the end of the movie doesn't even at least explain or apologize for basically having non-consensual sex with the innocent person's body and hanging out in his apartment.

The movie literately ends on a moment of utterly horrifying deceit, where she decides telling the truth is just not worth it.

I mean what exactly is the message of the movie? If an innocent person is possessed by a spirit, whatever you do to them to fulfill your perverted desires is morally okay?

Shouldn't this have been the cost of wishing Trevor back? Not that she loses her powers, but that an innocent man is being destroyed so Wonder Woman can get her groove back. That should have been the focus, but its brushed away.

 

[Wor-Gar]

Is that what the Cat-Lady symbolizes in this? Like Cat People? Sexual desire?

What a pervy movie....

 

[ironwez20]

It seems DC/WB have a hard time making audiences and critics happy, even with all the extra time they had to make this film. Meanwhile the MCU can spit out Antman or Capt Marvel and get better reception.

It?s very frustrating but let?s be real. Marvel puts those characters out as characters you must see and have the upmost confidence in.

DC is just like. Let?s finally make a Wonder Woman movie after years and years of people begging cause marvel is making heroes cool. Gosh it?s annoying. But they have huge faith in Batman. They know he will sell.

They aren?t happy to have these characters and it shows in there marketing . Spider-Man is going to beat flash today the punch in flashpoint . It?s amazing they haven?t started shooting thst yet.

Games and tv shows for DC have marvel beat but not for long since Spider-Man ps4 is held so high. Idk they come across as people who just don?t care




Edit whoops . Looks like WW3 is a go. I guess WB has faith in a franchise that?s not batman!

 

[Spartan Rex]

I don?t think DC/ Warner has a counterpart to Marvels Kevin Feige who has the clout and over arching vision needed to oversee the franchises do they?
Even with out a Feige overseeing her efforts Jenkins has made some bad and dubious decisions with this movie.
It seems most of these could’ve been helped by test audiences and reshoots.
Not always a fan of test audiences and creativity by committee but in this case...
Id yank Jenkins off Rogue One but I bet Kennedy will protect her.

 

[hellgrammite00]

I don?t think DC/ Warner has a counterpart to Marvels Kevin Feige who has the clout and over arching vision needed to oversee the franchises do they?
Even with out a Feige overseeing her efforts Jenkins has made some bad and dubious decisions with this movie.
It seems most of these could?ve been helped by test audiences and reshoots.
Not always a fan of test audiences and creativity by committee but in this case...
Id yank Jenkins off Rogue One but I bet Kennedy will protect her.

DC had Bruce Timm for awhile, who was their guru for the animated stuff. He made some of the best comic book based content on the planet.

 

[abake]

Watched it last night, thought it was an entertaining movie, nothing special. I like the first one better.

The first act was a bit too girly-movie for my tastes... it's all about Barbara's feelings of inadequacy, then her crush on Diana, then her being taken advantage of by Max, then it's about Diana/WW getting Steve back... The rest of the movie is fun (not that the first third isn't), some good action, some good drama. It's a bit heavy handed on the "truth" message and the whole way of how the wishing works is a bit muddled, but it's a fun movie targeted more towards young women IMO.
I'm glad PJ and GG got it out of their systems, and made an entertaining movie out of it. I have a feeling that going forward WW will gravitate more towards the Snyder-esque tone.

As for some of the criticism I've heard/read, while I do agree that it's a bit uncouth how Diana and Steve gloss over him taking over another man's body, I think in the end that is the whole message of the story: this type of "wish fulfilment" without actually doing anything to make your wishes come true is wrong. It always comes at a price no only to yourself, but to others as well.
- Diana gets Steve back, but is sacrificing someone else for it, and that in turn is destroying her as she is losing her god-like powers.
- Max gets his wishes, but he's sacrificing others in order to get them, and in the end is losing the only person he really loves: his son.
- Barbara gets her wish of being sexy, powerful and cool, but by doing so is losing herself and going against the only person who actually gave her friendship.
- The Egyptian dude gets his ancestral Kingdom back, but in doing so threatens to destroy millions of innocent people instead of being adored and hailed as a saviour.

I also found Gadot's acting to be getting better, there were some very good dramatic moments IMHO (I still don't think she has the gravitas to tackle Cleopatra, but she's getting better). Another thing that caught my attention was how they actually let her look messed up. usually heroes don't looked messed up. They might have a trickle of blood here and a bit grime there, but they always look heroic (and good). Not so when WW is (not) saying good-by to Steve, she actually looks like a mess. Kudos for that.

And I had no problems with Cheetah's CGI, I thought it worked pretty well.

So... yeah, a bit too chick-flick in the first act, a bit too heavy handed on the "message", but a very entertaining movie. Bring on WW3.

 

[Sassafras]

Still in shock at how truly awful this was.

I found it pretty hilariously bad. Poor pacing, poor script, bad plot. Gal still fits the role perfectly. I hope they give her one more movie and do it justice. Really unfortunate as I REALLY was looking forward to this and wanted to like it so much. I may pass on gold armor collectibles after watching the movie...

I wanna see it more now.

Except no way in *&^% will I go a theater - assuming I can find any that didn't close.

And I ditched HBO and don't particularly want it back.

 

[hellgrammite00]

The sequel to this just got 'fast-tracked' and the villain has been revealed with Bradley Cooper starring.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

I assume he adopted.

What really is going to explode your mind is the fact that Wonder Woman, after realizing Trevor's soul returned to the living by violating the body of an innocent person, decides to have sex with that body in that person's house for like the week. And then at the end of the movie doesn't even at least explain or apologize for basically having non-consensual sex with the innocent person's body and hanging out in his apartment.

The movie literately ends on a moment of utterly horrifying deceit, where she decides telling the truth is just not worth it.

I mean what exactly is the message of the movie? If an innocent person is possessed by a spirit, whatever you do to them to fulfill your perverted desires is morally okay?

Shouldn't this have been the cost of wishing Trevor back? Not that she loses her powers, but that an innocent man is being destroyed so Wonder Woman can get her groove back. That should have been the focus, but its brushed away.

That doesn't seem to be a problem. However, imagine if WW were a man and Trevor a woman. The "feminist" and SJW would be going crazy.

 

[hellgrammite00]

That doesn't seem to be a problem. However, imagine if WW were a man and Trevor a woman. The "feminist" and SJW would be going crazy.

Wait, wait, wait

Doesn't seem like a problem? You mean doing something to somebody without their permission because they are effectively unconscious is okay? Are there not some recent people, who may or may not have made Jelly Pudding commericials, in jail now for similar acts?

This is why lifetime movies can be really bad. They make their characters act like monsters, but with the right sappy music, try and shift the perception. It is like watching Friends without the laugh-track (cringe.)

oh..maybe this is the story for WW3...

 

[abake]

I assume he adopted.

What really is going to explode your mind is the fact that Wonder Woman, after realizing Trevor's soul returned to the living by violating the body of an innocent person, decides to have sex with that body in that person's house for like the week. And then at the end of the movie doesn't even at least explain or apologize for basically having non-consensual sex with the innocent person's body and hanging out in his apartment.

The movie literately ends on a moment of utterly horrifying deceit, where she decides telling the truth is just not worth it.

I mean what exactly is the message of the movie? If an innocent person is possessed by a spirit, whatever you do to them to fulfill your perverted desires is morally okay?

Shouldn't this have been the cost of wishing Trevor back? Not that she loses her powers, but that an innocent man is being destroyed so Wonder Woman can get her groove back. That should have been the focus, but its brushed away.

Wait... if you're not in the body, I mean literally not inhabiting the body, not just passed out of anything, is it still you? How can it be non-consensual if the will inhabiting the body is consenting (actually actively pursuing it)?

And I didn't get the horrifying vibe you did with the ending... the way I saw it she was just wondering wether she should do as Steve said and go for this guy, but she's just not really into just "the body", even thought the guy turns out to be actually nice.

Also, what were the perverted desires? Did they do something kinky I didn't catch on to?

And as I posted earlier, I think a big part of the "cost" was exactly how you not only hurt yourself, but also others. However, I do agree that it wasn't shown explicitly in the movie. It would have benefited from a moment of anguish for both of them wondering just what the hell happened to the owner of the body.

 

[abake]

Wait, wait, wait

Doesn't seem like a problem? You mean doing something to somebody without their permission because they are effectively unconscious is okay? Are there not some recent people, who may or may not have made Jelly Pudding commericials, in jail now for similar acts?

This is why lifetime movies can be really bad. They make their characters act like monsters, but with the right sappy music, try and shift the narrative. It is like watching Friends without the laugh-track (cringe.)

oh..maybe this is the story for WW3...

Again, I think you're not understanding the idea... the dude wasn't there. That was Trevor in the body. His consciousness, his soul, his will, whatever you want to call it was inhabiting that body. So, for all effects and purposes, that was Steve Trevor, that's why Diana saw him as Steve Trevor, not as random guy with 80's sense of fashion.
So, there was no rape, if that is what you are inferring.

 

[hellgrammite00]

Wait... if you're not in the body, I mean literally not inhabiting the body, not just passed out of anything, is it still you? How can it be non-consensual if the will inhabiting the body is consenting (actually actively pursuing it)?

I mean we can make the argument that being unconscious is very similar. If you are not aware, and can't remember, does it really count? I think society would have a definitive statement on that one.

Not trying to make this a big thing, but when she confronted the man at the end, I was like okay, she has to tell him. And it plays a sappy music flirty thing, and it really through me off. Maybe the movie didn't tell me the way to feel at that moment like it wanted me too?

 

[hellgrammite00]

Again, I think you're not understanding the idea... the dude wasn't there. That was Trevor in the body. His consciousness, his soul, his will, whatever you want to call it was inhabiting that body. So, for all effects and purposes, that was Steve Trevor, that's why Diana saw him as Steve Trevor, not as random guy with 80's sense of fashion.
So, there was no rape, if that is what you are inferring.

yeah, his body got kidnapped, taken without permission. It still is his. They put it at risk, into battle, and did whatever they wanted. They didn't care if they killed his body.

My point is morally that shouldn't be cool. I mean the movie makes strong points about ensuring personal space and not treating bodies like objects. We can't be like oh, a dude attacked cheetah, that is wrong because he is treating her without respect, and then Trevor grabs a body and goes crazy.

Just like I was watching this like what the hell is going on here. You can't show me a serious scene of a rape attempt, and then minutes later treat an innocent persons body just as a piece of meat to use for your own purposes. Like you just set up the notion that a body is not to be used by somebody else, it is morally evil just minutes earlier.

Is this a movie trying to deal with serious themes or not? If not then why make scenes about them.

I had it on low volume, so the sappy music probably wasn't influencing my thinking.

 

[moose]

It like every movie it has good and bad, I applaud the fact that it changes it opted for a emotional story rather then full on action. I liked the later 2 thirds of the movie the first action scene was way to cheesy for me.

I know they are deliberately trying to movie away from the dark tone in the synder verse but it could be a period piece with out that.

It probably need more action in some areas or cut out some scenes to reduce the time.

I do like that fact that's not not generic like most marvel movies. Captain marvel is frankly a poor example of female action hero I dont sense any femininity in it and it feels like she is over compensating.

I am frankly more concerned about the future of the snyder verse than anyone individual movie. More then likely WB will continue to produce DC movies question is will they be connected or are we going in to this individual movie approach.

Each has it pros and cons, the individual movies have to adhere to a common thread so they link back up to the overall plot making them in some places predictable, but that could be offset to be able to show large team up movies and an opportunity to see something that previously was only ever show in cartoons and comics.

Right now if things stay as they are we may get one more movie featuring WW and 2 more maybe with aquaman 1 flash movie and no cyborg movie or superman batman movies. You cant make a just league with only have a team.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Wait, wait, wait

Doesn't seem like a problem? You mean doing something to somebody without their permission because they are effectively unconscious is okay? Are there not some recent people, who may or may not have made Jelly Pudding commericials, in jail now for similar acts?

This is why lifetime movies can be really bad. They make their characters act like monsters, but with the right sappy music, try and shift the perception. It is like watching Friends without the laugh-track (cringe.)

oh..maybe this is the story for WW3...

I haven't seen any reviews mention it. People must be fine with rape, as long as the victim is a man and the predator a hot woman.

 

[youbastards]

Who the **** makes a movie set in the 80?s with no 80?s music, just a Hans Zimmer score. Why was this even set in the 80?s???

 

[abake]

I mean we can make the argument that being unconscious is very similar. If you are not aware, and can't remember, does it really count? I think society would have a definitive statement on that one.

Not trying to make this a big thing, but when she confronted the man at the end, I was like okay, she has to tell him. And it plays a sappy music flirty thing, and it really through me off. Maybe the movie didn't tell me the way to feel at that moment like it wanted me too?

yeah, his body got kidnapped, taken without permission. It still is his. They put it at risk, into battle, and did whatever they wanted. They didn't care if they killed his body.

My point is morally that shouldn't be cool. I mean the movie makes strong points about ensuring personal space and not treating bodies like objects. We can't be like oh, a dude attacked cheetah, that is wrong because he is treating her without respect, and then Trevor grabs a body and goes crazy.

Just like I was watching this like what the hell is going on here. You can't show me a serious scene of a rape attempt, and then minutes later treat an innocent persons body just as a piece of meat to use for your own purposes. Like you just set up the notion that a body is not to be used by somebody else, it is morally evil just minutes earlier.

Is this a movie trying to deal with serious themes or not? If not then why make scenes about them.

I had it on low volume, so the sappy music probably wasn't influencing my thinking.

I haven't seen any reviews mention it. People must be fine with rape, as long as the victim is a man and the predator a hot woman.

Hmmm... I still think there's a very big difference here because the guy inside the body is Steve Trevor... but I do get where you're coming from hellgrammite. As I said, they should've made it obvious that displacing that dude so Steve could inhabit his body was what was causing WW's degradation. At least, that's how I read it.

 

[hellgrammite00]

Hmmm... I still think there's a very big difference here because the guy inside the body is Steve Trevor... but I do get where you're coming from hellgrammite. As I said, they should've made it obvious that displacing that dude so Steve could inhabit his body was what was causing WW's degradation. At least, that's how I read it.

I get it isn't exactly a clear cut case, and probably would need a jury to decide.

I think you could have had wonder woman not losing her powers, and instead having Trevor getting hurt and they dealing with the fact he is using a stolen body, it isn't his. The cost of Trevor back is that an innocent person is being used, and that should impact WW to the core morally.

The problem is she is only feeling regret because she is losing her powers, not because its the heroic thing to do.


Maybe the ending could have been WW could not get close to Maxwell, and Trevor is there to say he still hasn't gotten a wish. Maxwell asks Trevor what he wants, and he says I want you to hold the lasso. Maxwell laughs, saying that is all you want, but is suddenly struck with the truth of the lasso. As everybody undoes their wishes, Trevor could look at Gal Gadot, and indicated its her turn to let him go, this isn't his body.

At the end, Gal Gadot meets the man whos body was possesed, and he asks if they have met before, and she gives a sad smile, and said let me tell you a story about truth.

 

[abake]

I could go for that