Future of DC Films (DCEU)

[DParga21]

So replacing Superman with Supergirl isn’t woke? Or replacing Batman with batgirl?

Or how about the jj Abrams black Superman that’s supposedly going to be Clark Kent instead of Val zod? Do you genuinely believe that’s what fans want?

No one said that they don’t want to see great on screen representations of those characters, but not at the expense of the main ones.

I usually roll my eyes at "this is too woke" arguments, but this one had a point. Marvel's "woke" stuff is at least hand-offs to legacy characters. DC just wants to erase the originals from continuity. I really don't get the thinking here. I just don't. No one complained about the cast of the DC films so why get rid of all the characters they've ALREADY spent a decade establishing?
And I don't understand giving us a watered-down Black Adam instead of Superman.

 

[RavenAsh]

I think it also undermines Supergirl as her own character. They’re basically using her as a gender-swapped Clark, but that’s not Kara. She has her own characteristics, her own problems. So not only are Superman fans unhappy, any Supergirl fans will be too. The Kara/Clark relationship is massively important to both characters as well, but WB has just shrugged their shoulders, saw an opportunity to win some points with a particular crowd, and ignored all the reasons why it’s a bad decision. Fans of Supergirl don’t want female Superman is my overall point

 

[ironwez20]

Supergirl debuted in 1959. Batgirl Babs popped up in 1961. They’ve been around longer than most fans have been alive. They’re have been many stories in the comics where they’ve taken over in the absence of their male counterparts.

I’m fine with a black Superman. Why not? He’s an alien from another planet. We have Clark Kents that have been gorillas, dogs, dinosaurs, but a black guy is a bridge too far? Really?

We’ve also had Batman lead over 9 movies, Superman over 6… I think we can let some of their legendary counterparts get a spotlight from time to time. It’s not like they’re going to NOT make a sequel to The Batman.

The thing I agree with snoopy on is that. Superman doesn’t really have a definitive movie franchise tbh. Like sure the old films are good for there time but each film after never reached his true potential and they always seem to hold him back. Superman (Clark Kent) is the most iconic superhero alive. He’s the father of all superheroes. He should be respected.

Dc doesn’t need a black Superman because they already have icon and plenty of iconic black characters. Static shock is as iconic as they come but shocker they won’t make a film about him. They won’t make a black green lantern film. They won’t make a bumblebee film. They won’t make a black lightning film. They treat cyborg like absolute dog ****.

So maybe before dc moves to black Superman to try and gain points on Twitter they should focus on its huge cast of black characters first. I’m fine with batgirl and supergirl . But many black people don’t care nor want a black Superman.

If they made Clark Kent black I wouldn’t really care but my point still stands. Dc is way to dumb to just make movies of its iconic poc cast. And they have amazing poc characters they can choose from.

 

[snoop101]

Supergirl debuted in 1959. Batgirl Babs popped up in 1961. They’ve been around longer than most fans have been alive. They’re have been many stories in the comics where they’ve taken over in the absence of their male counterparts.

I’m fine with a black Superman. Why not? He’s an alien from another planet. We have Clark Kents that have been gorillas, dogs, dinosaurs, but a black guy is a bridge too far? Really?

We’ve also had Batman lead over 9 movies, Superman over 6… I think we can let some of their legendary counterparts get a spotlight from time to time. It’s not like they’re going to NOT make a sequel to The Batman.

One of if not THE most recognizable and iconic superhero of all time should be black after being Caucasian for over 80 years because “why not?” That’s so weak.

If that’s your logic then why stop there? Let’s make him a trans gorilla dinosaur dog hybrid. You’re right, thats what we’ve been missing all these years.

Warner is bringing in these secondary characters to replace the main ones, not to take over in their absence. Any way you try to put it, that’s stupid.

 

[jye4ever]

You know what’s really pissing me off about them going forward without Snyder is the fact that they are still making everything look like Snyder is making it especially Black Adam and The Rock should be ashamed of that.

Fine dump Snyder but then also dumb his aesthetics stop ripping it off!

 

[Garlador]

The thing I agree with snoopy on is that. Superman doesn’t really have a definitive movie franchise tbh. Like sure the old films are good for there time but each film after never reached his true potential and they always seem to hold him back. Superman (Clark Kent) is the most iconic superhero alive. He’s the father of all superheroes. He should be respected.

Dc doesn’t need a black Superman because they already have icon and plenty of iconic black characters. Static shock is as iconic as they come but shocker they won’t make a film about him. They won’t make a black green lantern film. They won’t make a bumblebee film. They won’t make a black lightning film. They treat cyborg like absolute dog ****.

So maybe before dc moves to black Superman to try and gain points on Twitter they should focus on its huge cast of black characters first. I’m fine with batgirl and supergirl . But many black people don’t care nor want a black Superman.

If they made Clark Kent black I wouldn’t really care but my point still stands. Dc is way to dumb to just make movies of its iconic poc cast. And they have amazing poc characters they can choose from.

I agree on all counts, btw. Superman hasn’t had a truly definitive movie in decades. Even if you like Man of Steel, it’s still highly divisive. It didn’t bring all the fans together like a good Superman movie should, even if Cavill was perfectly cast for the part.

I also agree we have DOZENS of amazing minority characters deserving of leading a movie without race-bending. I would not be upset with a black Superman, but I’ve long argued that elevating your current black heroes is a better solution, or you’ll always have your black Clark living in the looming shadow of “default” white Clark. It’s why Miles is not just black Peter Parker; he’s a completely different hero. John Stewart is far different from Hal Jordan. Sam is totally different from Steve as Captain America.

The only major race-swap that I think every really worked was Nick Fury, and that’s largely because Sam Jackson is cooler than 99% of all other actors alive and nobody cared enough about Nick Fury when they changed it for the Ultimates universe.

 

[MyenShi]

Yea why does WB suddenly hate Superman? I’m starting to think that all this evil Superman stuff led them to believe that they really think the guy is evil. That new suicide squad game he’s evil.

They don’t. WB just hates not shooting themselves in the foot at every opportunity. There’s three main issues.

1. They don’t want to give Cavill what he’s asking for. No one can say what that is but it’s likely either higher compensation or creative control.

2. WB/DC has decided the best way to move forward with the new DCEU is to cherry-pick the best ideas other people had, keep what they’ve already spent money on, and discard the rest. They don’t have concrete plans for Superman because no projects were far enough along.

3. There’s the belief by the powers that be that a Superman that is benevolent is too boring for general audiences even if that’s what dans want to see. Superman is not a favorite personally but what he represents is important and he’s still a comic icon.

Snyder set him up poorly in the DCEU by turning him into an angsty neck snapping Martha screaming Bat puncher since he has some very odd ideas of what being a superhero means. But it’s not like WB/DC had any better ideas.

DCAU Superman is my gold standard and showed that you can tell interesting stories even with a character that’s still good and mostly omnipotent. But I’m sure the execs find the DCAU boring.

 

[ironwez20]

You know what’s really pissing me off about them going forward without Snyder is the fact that they are still making everything look like Snyder is making it especially Black Adam and The Rock should be ashamed of that.

Fine dump Snyder but then also dumb his aesthetics stop ripping it off!

Lol what’s really weird is that in the Shazam trailer they use footage of the Snyder movies and characters. What do they want? They are so weird . If you don’t want to make this universe a thing anymore why are you still using things from that universe? Idiots!

 

[ironwez20]

I agree on all counts, btw. Superman hasn’t had a truly definitive movie in decades. Even if you like Man of Steel, it’s still highly divisive. It didn’t bring all the fans together like a good Superman movie should, even if Cavill was perfectly cast for the part.

I also agree we have DOZENS of amazing minority characters deserving of leading a movie without race-bending. I would not be upset with a black Superman, but I’ve long argued that elevating your current black heroes is a better solution, or you’ll always have your black Clark living in the looming shadow of “default” white Clark. It’s why Miles is not just black Peter Parker; he’s a completely different hero. John Stewart is far different from Hal Jordan. Sam is totally different from Steve as Captain America.

The only major race-swap that I think every really worked was Nick Fury, and that’s largely because Sam Jackson is cooler than 99% of all other actors alive and nobody cared enough about Nick Fury when they changed it for the Ultimates universe.

If DC wanted to compete with marvel and get fans talking they’d do static shock. The character is iconic. I honestly don’t know who is in charge of DC and these decisions. But because they never wanted to expand there hero universe and because they never wanted to grow they have now been buried by marvel and it’s b and c list characters. These were once American icons and the face of superheroes for decades and now they are second rate to what I’d argue is characters that were inspired by them.

Lol sell the rights

 

[Garlador]

If DC wanted to compete with marvel and get fans talking they’d do static shock. The character is iconic. I honestly don’t know who is in charge of DC and these decisions. But because they never wanted to expand there hero universe and because they never wanted to grow they have now been buried by marvel and it’s b and c list characters. These were once American icons and the face of superheroes for decades and now they are second rate to what I’d argue is characters that were inspired by them.

Lol sell the rights

My favorite superhero growing up was The Flash. While we had a few TV shows and he showed up in cartoons, I thought for SURE we'd get a solo Flash movie by now. Even Flashpoint isn't really a solo Flash movie, and it's beyond cursed at this point.

 

[MyenShi]

Lol what’s really weird is that in the Shazam trailer they use footage of the Snyder movies and characters. What do they want? They are so weird . If you don’t want to make this universe a thing anymore why are you still using things from that universe? Idiots!

 

[Bravomite]

Superman has similar values as Captain America. The MCU has shown WB that American audiences and worldwide audiences don’t have an issue with a hopeful boring “good guy” character like Clark or Steve.

Superman has a power set similar to Thor and is also from a highly advanced alien culture. The MCU has shown WB’s tons of different ways of making that work on film.

They could even look at the comics or the first two Reeves superman stories. There are so many blue prints in place.

Fans like Cavill as superman. He is the MCU generations superman. To change him before he has had a trilogy of movies is throwing money away and unnecessarily confusing to audiences. If one of the actors of your top two characters wants the money to play a character of that hierarchical positioning in your movie universe then just pay him already.

Instead they want to replace him with two inferior copies of that character who are not even the comic book established derivative copy (super girl).

 

[Dave_W]

I think it's a case of WB throwing another idea at the wall to see what sticks.

Returns, a Reeve universe sequel, didn't go great.

MoS, make him angsty, didn't do as well as expected (I love it though, flaws and all)

BvS, make him even more conflicted and losing hope, did even worse.

Josstice League, lighter hearted and a bit more what we expected, movie was a disaster!

ZSJL, similar to JL, went down better than JL but the damage was done.

So this time around they're toying with throwing the race/gender card around to see if that works, instead of using S:TM as a template (just like Feige does), and having faith that's the way to go every time.

 

[Garlador]

DC treats Superman like Sega treats Sonic the Hedgehog or Disney on Star Wars. They’re always overreacting and throwing the baby out with the bath water instead of seeing what worked and cultivating that. When you’re constantly redoing the character from the ground up, he has no consistency.

Superman isn’t some insurmountable nut to crack. He’s got almost a century of stories, dozens of well-liked adaptations, global recognition, and countless blueprints they could follow.

Stop being ashamed of Superman. Embrace the fact he’s a colorful, optimistic, do-gooder, old-fashioned piece of purehearted and magical Americana. Marvel did it with Steve.

Superman should be the hero all other heroes hope to be like one day.

 

[Dave_W]

I hate hearing all the "He's not relatable" excuses, as if most people can relate to a billionaire Playboy or a guy from the 40's frozen in ice for 70+ years

 

[Garlador]

I hate hearing all the "He's not relatable" excuses, as if most people can relate to a billionaire Playboy or a guy from the 40's frozen in ice for 70+ years

Who can’t relate to being an African king of a futuristic nation with a connection to the spirit gods? It’s just so grounded!

Seriously, though, I have a three year old. We had a Smallville local con last month. She throws on a cape, pretends to fly, and yells “I’m Superman!” Clearly, nobody wants THAT inspiration on film.

 

[KitbashOfficer]

WB - wasting your time, my time, Cavill's time all because they have no thought, rhyme or reason on how to proceed logically. And putting Jim Lee and Geoff Johns in charge of some things has done nothing either.

It's like conservatives complaining about the Affordable Health Care Act. They know it's needed, had no plan but when it was presented and put out there, they all complained about it - yet have come up with no better alternative.

 

[Sweet Rabbit]

DC should have picked a lane and stayed in it. Stopping and starting over & over did nothing for them

 

[Mondragon]

DC should have picked a lane and stayed in it. Stopping and starting over & over did nothing for them

 

[devilof76]

WB - wasting your time, my time, Cavill's time all because they have no thought, rhyme or reason on how to proceed logically. And putting Jim Lee and Geoff Johns in charge of some things has done nothing either.

It's like conservatives complaining about the Affordable Health Care Act. They know it's needed, had no plan but when it was presented and put out there, they all complained about it - yet have come up with no better alternative.

It’s because the solution is to return to market based medicine, and no one has that kind of spine. Or brain.

Like WB.