Future of DC Films (DCEU)

[Hoody999]

I don’t want to bash away on Black Adam because its just not constructive. I wasn’t able to find much that I could get into.

Just a quick comment though about the end credits scene. And unfortunately yeah, it’s negative, lol. For me it was underwhelming after all the hype about it. I mean of course it was great to see Cavill suited up again (well, even that was compromised, I’ll mention why next sentence), but it was literally 5 seconds. I didn‘t care for the mustard yellow color in the insignia, the suit looked looked ugly overall. The score I didn’t even notice during the film. But from what I understand it’s just a few notes from the main theme that isn’t the rousing iconic part, and its played slowly and softly; then it quickly changes to something else. Most viewers will make zero connection to 1978 Reeves Superman.

Agreed with the Reeves score. I only recall it being a blended mix of Williams and maybe Zimmer ? Either way it wasn't what we thought with pure Williams-

The film not being a 10/10 could be a bit of a good thing for us Snyder fans. It hopefully means they won't confide in the Rock for absolutely everything, but more importantly hopefully get Zack and his team for writing, CGI etc back for at least a couple of more films.

I'm sure Cavill had input for the suit. Maybe the contrast was just edited too high ?? But I agree it was a bit too much. Non realistic almost.

Anyway I'm interested to see the weekend box office.

 

[Hoody999]

I’m actually one of those converts I was a phase 1-2-3 MCU snob but honestly what pushed me there was Snyder himself I still think it’s his one missteps when he went on the media circuit and bashed the MCU specifically Ant-man as fluff and it did eventually bite him in the *** so yeah sure I was vinegar towards Superman breaking necks and destroying cities.

I was just OK with BVS theatrical and honestly the extended cut while definitely better there are still some glaring issues with it including that silly Lois Lane fruit epiphany and Batman refusing to listen too Superman before the fight started.

The Infinity Saga is a masterpiece and and a memorable legendary time at the cinema but I eventually came around on the Snyderverse and now actually LOVE it ALL including BvS extended!

I like Luthor jr and his urine trolling was freaking epic and honestly hasn’t been equalled by Marvel yet!

The least said about Marvel phase 4 the better although NWH was a great time worthy of Phase 1-2-3.

Yep if DC can finally get their ***t together this could very well be opportune timing to win a few converts (although I always maintain it doesn't need to be one "team" or the other. That seems to be an American thing somehow).

In any case, if DC plays their cards right they could take some decent box-office market share away from Feige and Co.

Alan Horn and Zaslav should be very aware of this. Strangely enough all their fumblngs could mean they are finally doing some good stuff right at the best time.

 

[Hoody999]

So movie here or there. Anyone getting a Hot Toys Black Adam now ?

I'm still very much on the fence.

 

[Alatar]

So movie here or there. Anyone getting a Hot Toys Black Adam now ?

I'm still very much on the fence.

Not me, lol!

 

[T8OO]

Man of steel was and I remember. People were mad about a lot of things about that movie

The pa Kent stuff
Superman’s attitude
The hope stuff.
The fighting in the city.
The movie was extremely panned by fans back then.
But again bvs could have a good directors cut. I’ve never seen it but I doubt it could fix the horrible issues I had with the film.

The rushed death of Superman
The silly flash scene
The camera scene showing the JL which was forced.
Batman being older than superman and being this old worn guy who is tired. Hate that trope and I hate how tdkr influenced that movie.
Lex Luther. Horrible casting .
Doomsday. Horrible design.
A Batman vs Superman film but they barely fought. Very lackluster fight.

Couldn’t see past all that and can’t see how a directors cut can fix that. But that’s me.

Sure some fans had issues with all of that are were very vocal about it. The other half of fans loved it and I thought the GA liked it.

BvS UE doesn't change any of that. Quite a few of those are your own expectations not being met, which is fine but I don't think that makes the movie bad. Do you find Gandalf dying in the first LOTR rushed?
I thought the fight was great! They did market it the movie poorly in that regard and it is a bad name. Dawn of Justice was good enough.

 

[Alatar]

Agreed with the Reeves score. I only recall it being a blended mix of Williams and maybe Zimmer ? Either way it wasn't what we thought with pure Williams-

The film not being a 10/10 could be a bit of a good thing for us Snyder fans. It hopefully means they won't confide in the Rock for absolutely everything, but more importantly hopefully get Zack and his team for writing, CGI etc back for at least a couple of more films.

I'm sure Cavill had input for the suit. Maybe the contrast was just edited too high ?? But I agree it was a bit too much. Non realistic almost.

Anyway I'm interested to see the weekend box office.

Totally agree. Thankfully we’re probably safe from the Rock “taking over” the DCEU. Or even to have massive input, I guess. I’m sure he was never really in the running to be head of DC Films but rather will be a consultant like Alan Horn and Todd Phillips. Anyway, had this film been truly excellent and made $1B something like that would have been a real prospect, I think. But I have little doubt that box office will be mid tier.

 

[ironwez20]

Sure some fans had issues with all of that are were very vocal about it. The other half of fans loved it and I thought the GA liked it.

BvS UE doesn't change any of that. Quite a few of those are your own expectations not being met, which is fine but I don't think that makes the movie bad. Do you find Gandalf dying in the first LOTR rushed?
I thought the fight was great! They did market it the movie poorly in that regard and it is a bad name. Dawn of Justice was good enough.

Hmmm? Gandalf dying in lotr was supposed to happen and in the first book of fellowship. It was unexpected and left an impact on the viewer who didn’t read the books. It felt like great story progression
Superman died in his second film. Made no sense. We just got introduced to this character and he’s already on probably his biggest arc. We barely get to see some of his most iconic moments

It had nothing to do with my expectations. I just think it was executed poorly. It didn’t flow and it wasn’t done Justice.

And again I remember clearly fans and the ga not taking a liking to mos. It was split. It wasn’t just a few vocal fans.

 

[T8OO]

I’m actually one of those converts I was a phase 1-2-3 MCU snob but honestly what pushed me there was Snyder himself I still think it’s his one missteps when he went on the media circuit and bashed the MCU specifically Ant-man as fluff and it did eventually bite him in the *** so yeah sure I was vinegar towards Superman breaking necks and destroying cities.

I was just OK with BVS theatrical and honestly the extended cut while definitely better there are still some glaring issues with it including that silly Lois Lane fruit epiphany and Batman refusing to listen too Superman before the fight started.

The Infinity Saga is a masterpiece and and a memorable legendary time at the cinema but I eventually came around on the Snyderverse and now actually LOVE it ALL including BvS extended!

I’ve really grown to appreciate what Snyder was going for.

I like Luthor jr and his urine trolling was freaking epic and honestly hasn’t been equalled by Marvel yet!

The least said about Marvel phase 4 the better although NWH was a great time worthy of Phase 1-2-3 the lessons Peter was subjected too was powerful enough to move me.

After everything we had seen you still think he would have listened?

 

[T8OO]

Hmmm? Gandalf dying in lotr was supposed to happen and in the first book of fellowship. It was unexpected and left an impact on the viewer who didn’t read the books. It felt like great story progression
Superman died in his second film. Made no sense. We just got introduced to this character and he’s already on probably his biggest arc. We barely get to see some of his most iconic moments

It had nothing to do with my expectations. I just think it was executed poorly. It didn’t flow and it wasn’t done Justice.

And again I remember clearly fans and the ga not taking a liking to mos. It was split. It wasn’t just a few vocal fans.

I feel what you say about Gandalf applies just as much to Superman. You say it was supposed to happen. In Snyder's movies, Superman is supposed to die in the 2nd movie, which is one movie later than Gandalf dying. This is a your expectation thing I was talking about. You think he shouldn't die in the second movie. Why can't his iconic moments come later after he is resurrected?

If anything I thought Superman dying brought great story progression with Bruce being partly responsible for that not only drove him to create the league but there was a literal need for it simply because Superman wasn't around anymore.

MoS has a 7.1 on IMDb and 75% on RT for audience scores, that is good!

 

[Alatar]

I’m actually one of those converts I was a phase 1-2-3 MCU snob but honestly what pushed me there was Snyder himself I still think it’s his one missteps when he went on the media circuit and bashed the MCU specifically Ant-man as fluff and it did eventually bite him in the *** so yeah sure I was vinegar towards Superman breaking necks and destroying cities.

I was just OK with BVS theatrical and honestly the extended cut while definitely better there are still some glaring issues with it including that silly Lois Lane fruit epiphany and Batman refusing to listen too Superman before the fight started.

The Infinity Saga is a masterpiece and and a memorable legendary time at the cinema but I eventually came around on the Snyderverse and now actually LOVE it ALL including BvS extended!

I’ve really grown to appreciate what Snyder was going for.

I like Luthor jr and his urine trolling was freaking epic and honestly hasn’t been equalled by Marvel yet!

The least said about Marvel phase 4 the better although NWH was a great time worthy of Phase 1-2-3 the lessons Peter was subjected too was powerful enough to move me.

MCU phase 1-3: brilliant.

Phase 4… so uneven. I‘m probably an outlier with this but I had a good time with Shang Chi and Black Widow. I enjoyed MoM for the most part. For the series I liked Wandavision, FaWS, and Ms Marvel. Unlike most I didn’t get into the most popular of offerings: NWH and Loki. I’m not into nostalgia about Spider-Man and Loki gave me whiplash with the non-stop portaling between timelines.

After about 20 minutes I couldn’t even watch TL&T, it was that bad for me. One of the worst CBMs I have ever seen. Which is saying a lot.

I’m a broken record on it but BvS is about taking Batman and Superman, putting them in the real world we inhabit, and imagining the problems that would result from that. (That’s what BvS’s inspiration Watchmen, i.e., the 1986 comic run, does with superhero mythology.) BvS is meant to shake people up, to disturb, not to give people soothing escapism into ideal fantasies about what we want the characters to be like in imagination. In real life they would not be able to be that. Etc. If one can allow that conceptually, it changes the experience of the film. Anyway, ZSJL swings the pendulum back toward embracing the fantastical roots and conventions of comic book superheroes. But MoS, BvS, and ZSJL is an epic journey and I’m glad that it doesn’t try to mimic the MCU.

 

[jye4ever]

MCU phase 1-3: brilliant.

Phase 4… so uneven. I‘m probably an outlier with this but I had a good time with Shang Chi and Black Widow. I enjoyed MoM for the most part. For the series I liked Wandavision, FaWS, and Ms Marvel. Unlike most I didn’t get into the most popular of offerings: NWH and Loki. I’m not into nostalgia about Spider-Man and Loki gave me whiplash with the non-stop portaling between timelines.

After about 20 minutes I couldn’t even watch TL&T, it was that bad for me. One of the worst CBMs I have ever seen. Which is saying a lot.

I’m a broken record on it but BvS is about taking Batman and Superman, putting them in the real world we inhabit, and imaging the problems that would result from that. (That’s what BvS’s inspiration Watchmen, i.e., the 1986 comic run, does with superhero mythology.) BvS is meant to shake people up, to disturb, not to give people soothing escapism into ideal fantasies about what we want the characters to be like in imagination. In real life they would not be able to be that. Etc. If one can allow that conceptually, it changes the experience of the film. Anyway, ZSJL swings the pendulum back toward embracing the fantastical roots and conventions of comic book superheroes. But MoS, BvS, and ZSJL is an epic journey and I’m glad that it doesn’t try to mimic the MCU.

Great post!

I’m very pro Snyderverse now his JL was great shame we that are deprived of his complete vision.

Yeah I recently rewatched Shang and it wasn’t bad for what it was the dragon stuff was quite cool in a kaiju kind of way but BW I hated the only good scene for me was the family reunion at the house that was well done.

I’m about to leave to go watch BA I’m curious where it will fall when compared to Marvel Phase 4.

 

[ironwez20]

I feel what you say about Gandalf applies just as much to Superman. You say it was supposed to happen. In Snyder's movies, Superman is supposed to die in the 2nd movie, which is one movie later than Gandalf dying. This is a your expectation thing I was talking about. You think he shouldn't die in the second movie. Why can't his iconic moments come later after he is resurrected?

If anything I thought Superman dying brought great story progression with Bruce being partly responsible for that not only drove him to create the league but there was a literal need for it simply because Superman wasn't around anymore.

MoS has a 7.1 on IMDb and 75% on RT for audience scores, that is good!

Nah. It made sense cause the lore for Gandalf was set. We know who he is. We don’t know about this Superman. We don’t know about what he goes through or that much about him. We were just introduced to him. Lotr is a set story. This wasn’t. This was trying to build a universe of characters. It rushed an iconic story for nothing. It didn’t feel earned. It felt like they just wanted to adapt to much at a time and it fell flat.

Why should we care about someone we were just introduced to death? Imagine if they killed captain America in his second film. It wouldn’t have made sense. We just got introduced to the character.

 

[Prime Clone]

Controversial!

B&R > SR
WW84 > Joker
SM III > MOS
Shazam > Entire Snyderverse

https://screencrush.com/every-dc-comics-movie-ranked/

 

[T8OO]

Nah. It made sense cause the lore for Gandalf was set. We know who he is. We don’t know about this Superman. We don’t know about what he goes through or that much about him. We were just introduced to him. Lotr is a set story. This wasn’t. This was trying to build a universe of characters. It rushed an iconic story for nothing. It didn’t feel earned. It felt like they just wanted to adapt to much at a time and it fell flat.

Why should we care about someone we were just introduced to death? Imagine if they killed captain America in his second film. It wouldn’t have made sense. We just got introduced to the character.

LOTR only became a set story afterwards, just like Snyders movies have. I knew NOTHING about Gandalf when I sat down in the cinema in December 2001 and watched this great character die towards the end. He came back in the next movie and it was brilliant. I mourned him then I was elated at his return. Just like I did and my kids did with BvS/ZSJL.

You didn't care when Obi-Wan died?

I can understand how it not meeting your needs lets you down but I don't understand how you can't see that you are taking two very similar things, applying your expectations to them and saying one is good and one is bad is beyond me

 

[T8OO]

Controversial!

B&R > SR
WW84 > Joker
Superman III > MOS
Shazam > Entire Snyderverse

https://screencrush.com/every-dc-comics-movie-ranked/

I used to click on these lists out of interest, but I don't anymore. I think they are written purely to bait people in a get a rise.

 

[T8OO]

MCU phase 1-3: brilliant.

Phase 4… so uneven. I‘m probably an outlier with this but I had a good time with Shang Chi and Black Widow. I enjoyed MoM for the most part. For the series I liked Wandavision, FaWS, and Ms Marvel. Unlike most I didn’t get into the most popular of offerings: NWH and Loki. I’m not into nostalgia about Spider-Man and Loki gave me whiplash with the non-stop portaling between timelines.

After about 20 minutes I couldn’t even watch TL&T, it was that bad for me. One of the worst CBMs I have ever seen. Which is saying a lot.

I’m a broken record on it but BvS is about taking Batman and Superman, putting them in the real world we inhabit, and imagining the problems that would result from that. (That’s what BvS’s inspiration Watchmen, i.e., the 1986 comic run, does with superhero mythology.) BvS is meant to shake people up, to disturb, not to give people soothing escapism into ideal fantasies about what we want the characters to be like in imagination. In real life they would not be able to be that. Etc. If one can allow that conceptually, it changes the experience of the film. Anyway, ZSJL swings the pendulum back toward embracing the fantastical roots and conventions of comic book superheroes. But MoS, BvS, and ZSJL is an epic journey and I’m glad that it doesn’t try to mimic the MCU.

Funnily enough I quite enjoyed Shang Chi and Black Widow too. Not great but a good time.
I thought Phase 3 was also uneven, one great movie, one good movie, a couple of decent ones but at least half of them were very poor.
I watched FaWS and thought it was subpar. Haven't bothered watching the rest.
I liked NWH on the first watch, I do think nostalgia aside it's probably very average. MoM was underwhelming.

 

[ironwez20]

LOTR only became a set story afterwards, just like Snyders movies have. I knew NOTHING about Gandalf when I sat down in the cinema in December 2001 and watched this great character die towards the end. He came back in the next movie and it was brilliant. I mourned him then I was elated at his return. Just like I did and my kids did with BvS/ZSJL.

You didn't care when Obi-Wan died?

I can understand how it not meeting your needs lets you down but I don't understand how you can't see that you are taking two very similar things, applying your expectations to them and saying one is good and one is bad is beyond me

Nooo. Lotr when the movie came out was a set story there is no comparison. Even before that there was the hobbit and plenty of other lore. You are comparing a set story to something that was trying to build a universe. It’s not a fair comparison whatsoever. I don’t even know where you got it from. Obiwan wasn’t a main character he was a side character in the first movie. If he died he would further the heroes journey

 

[csutkakoma]

I have to side with ironwez on this one. Superman's death is a huge thing in the comics and it was earned with decades of build up. Here it was sadly very emotionless and rushed after one movie. It wasn't earned and I did not feel anything. And yes Superman is different than Gandalf. Especially considering his comic history.

It was a very bad move with a terribly rushed last act with a horribly wasted Doomsday and story arc. Seriously why waste and iconic character and moment like this? Superman's death should be a whole movie and it should have a huge impact. Watch the Death of Superman animated (2018) movie. That is how you do things IMO.

 

[T8OO]

Nooo. Lotr when the movie came out was a set story there is no comparison. Even before that there was the hobbit and plenty of other lore. You are comparing a set story to something that was trying to build a universe. It’s not a fair comparison whatsoever. I don’t even know where you got it from. Obiwan wasn’t a main character he was a side character in the first movie. If he died he would further the heroes journey

I feel like you're missing my point.
The writer of the interpretation decides what lore goes into their story and how. When they decide what should happen IT IS SET.
Your expectations of how his interpretation should go are the problem here. There's nothing wrong with not liking the direction but saying it is wrong is incorrect. Many others watched it and loved it, even fans of the interpretations that came before.

 

[T8OO]

I have to side with ironwez on this one. Superman's death is a huge thing in the comics and it was earned with decades of build up. Here it was sadly very emotionless and rushed after one movie. It wasn't earned and I did not feel anything. And yes Superman is different than Gandalf. Especially considering his comic history.

It was a very bad move with a terribly rushed last act with a horribly wasted Doomsday and story arc. Seriously why waste and iconic character and moment like this? Superman's death should be a whole movie and it should have a huge impact. Watch the Death of Superman animated (2018) movie. That is how you do things IMO.

It was huge in the comics because they left it decades before doing it and they only did it due to poor comic sales and to emphasize his importance.

Snyder also used it to show the world how important Superman is, he just did it earlier to progress the story and the need for the league.

You are doing what ironwez is doing and basing what is right on how you think it should play out because of other interpretations.

In a 5 part movie arc, that brings at least 6 main superhero characters together plus a Steppenwolf invasion and then a Darkseid invasion when is the best time to kill off Superman?