Marvel Studios - She Hulk

[ironwez20]

Grace was mine!

Back off!

 

[Dark_Knight_89]

I actually don't understand the concern or uproar about the Captain America joke/topic. Its not a big deal and certainly doesn't "ruin" anything?

And Cap is my favourite character in the MCU, so you'd think I'd be "sensitive" to any discussion about him.

But no, I really don't understand what the problem is. It's all very minor and trivial.

But hey, when has minor and trivial ever stopped the Internet from prolapsing before?

 

[ironwez20]

I honestly don’t understand what’s the big deal either. This is t the first time a marvel character ******.

 

[RavenAsh]

I honestly don’t understand what’s the big deal either. This is t the first time a marvel character ******.

Iron Man 1 opened with it in the first ten minutes

 

[Chakor]

Grace was mine!

 

[jye4ever]

Chakor

 

[JAWS]

He kissed Sharon.

Also name a single Scout that made it out of youth as a virgin.

Kissing and *******….. not the same.

Personally I don’t care if he did or not. Just don’t think it adds to the character in any positive way.

 

[JAWS]

People just can’t fathom thinking about there childhood heroes getting laid

I think with Cap we are talking about a character with the highest of Values and Morals.

Not saying that sex before marriage makes anyone amoral but for a man like Cap he might think it’s an amoral act especially since he loved Peggy.

This is the guy who said “Language” after all.

IDK. It does not really matter. But the end scene was unneeded.

 

[JAWS]

Oh - I don't know about that . . . Raquel Welch was one of my childhood heroes


.

I ruined Tanya Roberts

 

[Darth Snoopy]

Grace was mine!

Gross.

You're legally blind, aren't you?

 

[Dark_Knight_89]

I must say, I agree wholeheartedly with what is said here at 16:31;



The idiots who dislike this solely for the reason that it shows a strong woman and a woman's frustrations and anger (done in an effective and succinct way that compliments the story and character, I might add) are the exact people that she's referring to when she explains how she's had years of experiencing in controlling her anger;

"Well, here's the thing, Bruce, I'm great at controlling my anger, I do it all the time. When I'm catcalled in the street, when incompetent men explain my own area of expertise to me. I do it pretty much every day, because if I don't, I'll get called 'emotional' or 'difficult', or might just literally get murdered. So I'm an expert at controlling my anger because I do it infinitely more than you!"

The episode doesn't make this the whole point of the story or the character. It came at a time when Bruce was repeatedly telling Jen the importance of controlling her emotions now that she is a Hulk. It makes sense that this would be discussed here, and it doesn't really come up again or dominate the episode thematically.

The episode succeeds where some other projects with strong females leads have failed - and that is by effectively showing the strengths of the character via their own merit and not simply by tearing down other characters in the process. She-Hulk is clearly powerful, but Bruce's Hulk is still shown to be powerful too (he's probably the most "Hulk" he's been in years - although things could only improve after Infinity War and Endgame).

Now as a straight white male, I appreciate that (for some people) I have no right to even talk about this... but I try to in an understanding way.

 

[JAWS]

I must say, I agree wholeheartedly with what is said here at 16:31;



The idiots who dislike this solely for the reason that it shows a strong woman and a woman's frustrations and anger (done in an effective and succinct way that compliments the story and character, I might add) are the exact people that she's referring to when she explains how she's had years of experiencing in controlling her anger;

"Well, here's the thing, Bruce, I'm great at controlling my anger, I do it all the time. When I'm catcalled in the street, when incompetent men explain my own area of expertise to me. I do it pretty much every day, because if I don't, I'll get called 'emotional' or 'difficult', or might just literally get murdered. So I'm an expert at controlling my anger because I do it infinitely more than you!"

The episode doesn't make this the whole point of the story or the character. It came at a time when Bruce was repeatedly telling Jen the importance of controlling her emotions now that she is a Hulk. It makes sense that this would be discussed her, and it doesn't really come up again or dominate the episode thematically.

Her speech did not really bother me one way or the other.

The only thing I thought was dumb is she is telling Bruce Banner that she has to deal with controlling her anger more than he does.

Now Comic book history tells us that Bruce was raised by an awful father who mentally and physically abused Bruce. Bruce was bullied by General Ross before he ever became the Hulk. Bruce was always controlling his anger.. Probably too well and thus we get the hulk personality.

Movie wise. Well the reasons for Bruce to loose his cool are way worse then having someone mansplain something to you. Jennifer's speech was a typical "I am the victim" speech. A well educated, white, upper-class, attractive woman in charge of a major criminal case thinks she might be murdered if she tells a male coworker that she knows she is more qualified then he is. Yawn.

I don't know. Maybe its because at my Job, all the mangers are woman and I never here anyone complain about or call them something derogatory because of their sex. Never once have they been threatened by any of the male workers they supervise. Maybe my small conservative town is just way more progressive than the big cities

 

[vailus]

I actually don't understand the concern or uproar about the Captain America joke/topic. Its not a big deal and certainly doesn't "ruin" anything?

And Cap is my favourite character in the MCU, so you'd think I'd be "sensitive" to any discussion about him.

But no, I really don't understand what the problem is. It's all very minor and trivial.

But hey, when has minor and trivial ever stopped the Internet from prolapsing before?

The “concern” is two fold, 1. Why does it matter? Because Captain America is a symbol of hope and honor and she is making fun of whether he was a virgin, (and yes, the whole point of even speculating is as a joke) which would have been fine in the 1940s but almost comes off as her suggesting he was an incel in the 2020s. Unfortunately this goes along with the strong women are only strong when they tear down stronger men narrative people complain about in modern writing. You can say that’s looking for something that isn’t there, but it is there. It may not have been the intention, but it’s definitely surface level in this show. This doesn’t make sense to the audience either who know he married Peggy Carter when he went back in time, so it makes the writers seem ignorant from the audience’s point of view as well.

Also, 2. What happens if you flip the script and have a male discussing the sexual nature of a female. Black Widow was named that in the comics because she had sex with men then assassinated them. Jeremy Renny actually alluded to this in an interview and received hate for it. Imagine if a male character dared to discuss all the men she slept with. Would it be taken as a joke or “**** shaming”?

I honestly don’t care personally, but I do tire of obvious double standards. Same with Thor being naked and chained while the women talk about his butt. How would that have gone over if that was Jane? We all know the reality.

 

[vailus]

I must say, I agree wholeheartedly with what is said here at 16:31;



The idiots who dislike this solely for the reason that it shows a strong woman and a woman's frustrations and anger (done in an effective and succinct way that compliments the story and character, I might add) are the exact people that she's referring to when she explains how she's had years of experiencing in controlling her anger;

"Well, here's the thing, Bruce, I'm great at controlling my anger, I do it all the time. When I'm catcalled in the street, when incompetent men explain my own area of expertise to me. I do it pretty much every day, because if I don't, I'll get called 'emotional' or 'difficult', or might just literally get murdered. So I'm an expert at controlling my anger because I do it infinitely more than you!"

The episode doesn't make this the whole point of the story or the character. It came at a time when Bruce was repeatedly telling Jen the importance of controlling her emotions now that she is a Hulk. It makes sense that this would be discussed here, and it doesn't really come up again or dominate the episode thematically.

The episode succeeds where some other projects with strong females leads have failed - and that is by effectively showing the strengths of the character via their own merit and not simply by tearing down other characters in the process. She-Hulk is clearly powerful, but Bruce's Hulk is still shown to be powerful too (he's probably the most "Hulk" he's been in years - although things could only improve after Infinity War and Endgame).

Now as a straight white male, I appreciate that (for some people) I have no right to even talk about this... but I try to in an understanding way.

No, it doesn’t show her as a strong female character. It doesn’t have any backstory into who Jennifer is one minute prior to the opening of the show. One man tells her to smile while she is giving her closing argument (and he is right, juries trust attorneys who smile and show confidence, this is a fact) and that’s the only time we really see a man “explain her area of expertise” to her. Which again would have worked better if he wasn’t actually correct.

Prior to her talking about how well she controls her rage we see her lose her cool and threaten and inferred to be about to physically attack some jerks at the bar before Bruce stops her, so we know she’s lying, but Bruce doesn’t call her out for this. It is never addressed. Hopefully it will be later, but since we have no background on her as a person, it needed to be addressed here. Also, the guys were jerky, but not implied to be dangerous. This scene would have worked better if they were who she encountered first before the women in the bathroom made her look like a prostitute standing out in front of a bar. Also, I’m not suggesting it’s ok to rape a women for her clothes, but if you actually look like a prostitute in front a bar, it seems like getting some male attention is likely. They didn’t threaten her or attack her, so the scene was just very badly written, but it’s all we have to ***** her character so that’s what I’m doing.

Further, again, we know nothing about Jennifer’s backstory in this show, but we know Bruce was physically and emotionally abused by his father as a child, and all he has suffered through as the Hulk, so her speech about knowing better than him what it’s like to be angry is very much off putting to the audience who knows nothing about her, but who has shared Bruce’s suffering. Maybe she does have reason to be better at emotional control, but show, don’t tell. By the end of the episode we don’t know anymore about her than before the show and for a character who is defined by emotions like a Hulk, He or She, that’s bad setup going forward.

Again, hopefully this does get addressed, but as a writer you want people to emotionally invest in your character from the start, and this show failed spectacularly at that. From the reviews of the people who were allowed to watch the first 4 episodes it doesn’t sound like that will be fixed too soon, but I haven’t seen them so I can’t say beyond that.

 

[pophoody]

I must say, I agree wholeheartedly with what is said here at 16:31;



The idiots who dislike this solely for the reason that it shows a strong woman and a woman's frustrations and anger (done in an effective and succinct way that compliments the story and character, I might add) are the exact people that she's referring to when she explains how she's had years of experiencing in controlling her anger;

"Well, here's the thing, Bruce, I'm great at controlling my anger, I do it all the time. When I'm catcalled in the street, when incompetent men explain my own area of expertise to me. I do it pretty much every day, because if I don't, I'll get called 'emotional' or 'difficult', or might just literally get murdered. So I'm an expert at controlling my anger because I do it infinitely more than you!"

The episode doesn't make this the whole point of the story or the character. It came at a time when Bruce was repeatedly telling Jen the importance of controlling her emotions now that she is a Hulk. It makes sense that this would be discussed here, and it doesn't really come up again or dominate the episode thematically.

The episode succeeds where some other projects with strong females leads have failed - and that is by effectively showing the strengths of the character via their own merit and not simply by tearing down other characters in the process. She-Hulk is clearly powerful, but Bruce's Hulk is still shown to be powerful too (he's probably the most "Hulk" he's been in years - although things could only improve after Infinity War and Endgame).

Now as a straight white male, I appreciate that (for some people) I have no right to even talk about this... but I try to in an understanding way.

Oh Jesus. ‘As a gay white male’ I say for goodness sake man, you’re allowed your opinion.

It’s so sad to see blokes reduced to feeling like they might ‘have no right’ to talk about anything not immediately about them or their gender/race. Don’t fall into that trap. You have free speech. You have every right to an opinion about ANYTHING. You’d be quite within your rights to tell me you don‘t believe in gay marriage (I imagine you do but just as an example) and we’d agree to disagree,

Without wishing to sound old, I am on the way to 40, but reading posts like this really worries me about what public education in the west has been doing to kids for decades now.

Anyway, I won’t go any further here but I thought at least this much should be said.

 

[loki2371]

I just read yesterday that in an interview with the showrunner episode 1 was re edited. Originally most of her origin wasn't to be shown until episode 8. But someone in Disney felt they needed to get her origin story out of the way so the viewers weren't "confused"..

Maybe Jen (after already being She Hulk) gets abused by all these men over the next 7 episodes and they'll show where all her anger and frustration comes from....

I'm waiting till this is over anyway before I decide if I want to even bother.

 

[karamazov80]

Lots of commentary here that I can't totally wade through, but I'll just say that I thought this was a really good, fun first episode. Big step up from what I saw as a bit of a let down with Moon Knight and Ms. Marvel. Yeah, the reaction of Jennifer from being infected, and corresponding response from Bruce didn't seem overly realistic, but it seemed in the vein, tone-wise, of something like the Ant-Man movies. I'm hopeful for what we'll see in the rest of the series.

 

[Darth Snoopy]

Keep the sociopolitical commentary out of this thread or earn an all-expenses paid vacation, if not permanently, from the board.

Posts deleted.

 

[Darth Snoopy]

Yeah, yeah, I know...

​

but those are the rules. And before you say it, y'all knew that...

 

[pophoody]

It’s cause I’m gay isn’t it? Homophobia!