Star Wars: Episode IX - THE RISE OF SKYWALKER

[Skywalker(OG)Kush]

Forgive me... I am pushing 50... What poll??

As for Khev.. He know the OT are great. I don't recall him saying anything that bad. Guess I will have to go back and read if any of his OT comments are all that criminal



Never mind.. I found the poll... I don't have any issue with that poll.

I think its obvious that the end result of the ST showed that if there was a plan.. They did not follow it.

Just read the last quote someone posted of his or his response to me a few pages back. He is constantly bringing up his perceived issues with the ot or gl to justify the st mess. My point is a real ot fan would never do this because new hope and empire are far better movies then anything the st gave us. Thats what i was trying to get you to say and you have already just not in the context in which it makes khev look crazy lol. If he says crazy things you can still like the st but dont have to always agree with the crazy **** he says. I know it feels like there are only a few of you that like the st and you want to stick together but i also know based on all your posts you dont think the st is anywhere near the quality of the ot and you would never blast those movies to defend the st. So why defend the indefensible comments he makes when you do not agree????

 

[JAWS]

Just read the last quote someone posted of his or his response to me a few pages back. He is constantly bringing up his perceived issues with the ot or gl to justify the st mess. My point is a real ot fan would never do this because new hope and empire are far better movies then anything the st gave us. Thats what i was trying to get you to say and you have already just not in the context in which it makes khev look crazy lol. If he says crazy things you can still like the st but dont have to always agree with the crazy **** he says. I know it feels like there are only a few of you that like the st and you want to stick together but i also know based on all your posts you dont think the st is anywhere near the quality of the ot and you would never blast those movies to defend the st. So why defend the indefensible comments he makes when you do not agree????

I guess it comes down to being happy with the end result. I dont think Khev is bashing on the OT.. Just showing that decisions that GL made have caused issues in the OT but we love them anyways..

Anyways Khev is a big boy he can defend himself. If he wants to prop up the ST by showing that the OT had some similar issues then I don't have an issue with that. It makes for good discussion. I don't read it and see it as tearing down of the OT.

GL was changing his mind all the time.. In fact the guy never stops as the SE of the OT shows.

My fav is how he see's Yoda as a character in roundtable discussions during ROTJ and then goes against all of that in the PT.

 

[Skywalker(OG)Kush]

I guess it comes down to being happy with the end result. I dont think Khev is bashing on the OT.. Just showing that decisions that GL made have caused issues in the OT but we love them anyways..

Anyways Khev is a big boy he can defend himself. If he wants to prop up the ST by showing that the OT had some similar issues then I don't have an issue with that. It makes for good discussion. I don't read it and see it as tearing down of the OT.

GL was changing his mind all the time.. In fact the guy never stops as the SE of the OT shows.

My fav is how he see's Yoda as a character in roundtable discussions during ROTJ and then goes against all of that in the PT.

Its ok to change your mind and make minor changes to the plan that dont cause issues with the overarching story that you mapped out. The st did not make minor changes to their plan they made huge wholesale changes that were jarring and made the whole st feel like a disconnected unplanned mess. Changing lukes or vaders lineage from new hope to esb did not have the same effect because the audience wasnt led in one direction just to have all story arcs dropped in the next installement. An ot equivalent would be if obi said luke was anakins son in new hope but in empire we find out he was really the emperors son or some unrelated party that was not even hinted at in a new hope and empire acts like that conversation in a new hope didnt exist within the same story thread/trilogy

Obiwan didnt lie to luke, vader killed anakin from within metaphorically speaking. So when he said anakin was killed by vader atleast they adressed it and explained it in the ot, in st they just figured we were all stupid and didnt even bother explaining anything they set up they just dropped the story threads completely without any explanation

 

[The Buffinator]

Since you insist on the whole long-winded post here it is. People quote parts of posts all the time to narrow down to the point.

It doesn't change Khev's insistence that the ST had a plan. It never did. Except for Kennedy's plan to infuse her agenda into Star Wars. All three movies were for all intents and purposes almost independent from one another with very rough transitions and fluidity. Kennedy is on record claiming "it's hard because no source material ". Now we have Rey Skywalker admitting that nobody knew what was going on. It was a rudderless ship which was painfully obvious to anyone looking at the sum of all parts objectively, yet some stubbornly continued to deny.


Originally Posted by Khev
Yep, Lucas has taken obvious glee in doubling down on the stupidest elements of his Saga. Who the hell in his right mind looks at the revised Han/Greedo scene and says "yeah, but how can I make it *worse*?"



It's such a misnomer to claim that the ST "had no plan." I'm surprised to see even you perpetuating that JAWS. They had a plan. They had the entire trilogy outlined with the endgame in sight before even RO hit theaters. Colin Trevorrow's script dated November or December 2016 literally proves this. And Trevorrow himself confirmed on Twitter that the Duel of the Fates script (and all accompanying concept art also completed over a full year before even TLJ hit theaters) was indeed his.

The ST had a more unified plan than *both the OT and PT.* Do you think Lucas had a script for ROTS and concept art a year before AOTC hit theaters? Hell no. Do you think that ROTJ was written in 1979? HELL NO, lol. Disney/LFL did their due diligence and planned out the entire trilogy well in advance.

And that plan was to have TFA seem familiar with Snoke in the Emperor's role and Kylo in Darth Vader's role. Everything appeared the same but they were "going backward to go forward." And the "going forward" part was the huge twist that Snoke would not be the Emperor for very long and that the Darth Vader character (Kylo) was going to reign supreme this time around. However Disney saw how divisive TLJ was with the new ideas it was leaning into and called an audible with TROS. "Ditch the original plan. Go back to the familiar that audiences loved so much in TFA." And so they did. And the trilogy feels a bit disjointed due to the "course correction" but it isn't because they were making it all up as they were going. Far from it.

But ROTJ ditched the entire plan that George had with ESB so it's in good company. And TROS did a hell of a lot better of changing things at the last second than ROTJ did as well.

Damn . Got em !

Got em??? How exactly did you come to that conclusion? Read the highlighted parts. Khev said they had a plan mapped out prior to Rogue One's release (so After TFA but before TLJ), but then Disney got cold feet and ditched that plan prior to TROS. Which is what I (and Jaws) politely pointed out was omitted when his post was referenced previously by you, The Ducky and TFH. Now I honestly don't know if Khev's claim about Trevorrow's script proving the original plan is in fact true, but since no one seems to have disputed it I assume either you guys don't know or are in agreement. So for me your "got em" claim is either premature (pending verification of said claim) or simply wrong. But regardless, as Wor-Gar's poll has demonstrated, we're all in agreement that there was NO plan that was mapped out pre-ST and followed to its conclusion. It appeared to me that you guys were saying Khev had made those claims, but the post that was dug up as evidence doesn't support that.

 

[Skywalker(OG)Kush]

If they started this so called plan after the first movie in the installment it was already a fail, plus they quickly abandoned that so called plan after one movie. So was this “plan” only for last jedi to “ruin” all the story arcs setup in tfa? Cause they quickly abandoned this plan going into tros. So what you are saying is only tlj was planned out?? Seems to me the “plan” was to let each director do whatever the hell they wanted cause they didnt have an overarching story mapped out to begin with. They relied on the director and the writers they brought in to wing it, then in tros they tried desperately to make all this nonsense connect or just retcon it completely out of existence in one way or another. Most all off tlj was all a lie Or a mirage retconned by tros, there is no reason to watch that movie at all. So they retconned their own plan that did t start with the first movie but the 2nd in a 3 movie trilogy- people call that a plan. I call that plan for just one movie like they would plan for any one off movie A studio would make with no foresight into the future

 

[ironwez20]

Got em??? How exactly did you come to that conclusion? Read the highlighted parts. Khev said they had a plan mapped out prior to Rogue One's release (so After TFA but before TLJ), but then Disney got cold feet and ditched that plan prior to TROS. Which is what I (and Jaws) politely pointed out was omitted when his post was referenced previously by you, The Ducky and TFH. Now I honestly don't know if Khev's claim about Trevorrow's script proving the original plan is in fact true, but since no one seems to have disputed it I assume either you guys don't know or are in agreement. So for me your "got em" claim is either premature (pending verification of said claim) or simply wrong. But regardless, as Wor-Gar's poll has demonstrated, we're all in agreement that there was NO plan that was mapped out pre-ST and followed to its conclusion. It appeared to me that you guys were saying Khev had made those claims, but the post that was dug up as evidence doesn't support that.

Dude. Do you wanna go back and look at what he wrote and how he use to say everything fit perfectly and it all lined up so well. Cause I distinctly remember him saying how well the ST was mapped out. The guy got called out multiple times for saying the ST flowed well and connected well. It wasn?t . I don?t know why u can?t see that. He kept back peddling on his statements cause he kept getting proven wrong . That?s why it must be very confusing for you to understand

 

[ironwez20]

Lol this whole thread is talking bout khev and his wild claims meanwhile he?s petting his doomcock mask laughing at us. He?s mad

 

[Skywalker(OG)Kush]

Lol this whole thread is talking bout khev and his wild claims meanwhile he?s petting his doomcock mask laughing at us. He?s mad

No way khev is doomcock, doomcock is the monitor, khev is the anti-monitor !!!!!! The real doomcock would never talk that much trash about the ot!! Only his disney super villain arch rival would

 

[The Buffinator]

Dude. Do you wanna go back and look at what he wrote and how he use to say everything fit perfectly and it all lined up so well. Cause I distinctly remember him saying how well the ST was mapped out. The guy got called out multiple times for saying the ST flowed well and connected well. It wasn?t . I don?t know why u can?t see that. He kept back peddling on his statements cause he kept getting proven wrong . That?s why it must be very confusing for you to understand

No dude, I don't want to go back and look at what Khev wrote in the past and it's readily apparent that you don't either. And the ONLY thing I don't see is any evidence supporting your distinct recollections. You remember his saying it was mapped out and flowed/connected well. I recall his saying that TROS' making Rey Palp's granddaughter & revealing the Force Dyad worked for him and retroactively fixed stuff that was previously problematic in the first two films. Fixed stuff for HIM, not you, me or anyone else. And the only thing confusing to me is why it's so important to you guys that the everyone else here agree to hate the ST as much as you do. Get over it - not happening.

 

[TheDucky]

I. Am. Doomcock.

 

[ironwez20]

No dude, I don't want to go back and look at what Khev wrote in the past and it's readily apparent that you don't either. And the ONLY thing I don't see is any evidence supporting your distinct recollections. You remember his saying it was mapped out and flowed/connected well. I recall his saying that TROS' making Rey Palp's granddaughter & revealing the Force Dyad worked for him and retroactively fixed stuff that was previously problematic in the first two films. Fixed stuff for HIM, not you, me or anyone else. And the only thing confusing to me is why it's so important to you guys that the everyone else here agree to hate the ST as much as you do. Get over it - not happening.

lmao. My man. I don't care nor does anyone else if Khev likes the ST or not. it's the stuff he says. YOU can choose not to see it and by all means do so. I don't care. Ain't nobody trying to force anyone to dislike anything in this thread. I have absolutly no idea where you got that from. People are back and forth cause of the silly comments made by Khev and Jye about the PT. This thread would have died a long time ago if they didn't keep trying to say how bad the PT sucked and everything. So if you want to tell someone to get over over it why don't you point the finger at them lol.

Nobody here who is against the ST is telling Khev you shouldn't like it they are arguing with him becuase he makes silly comments and statements. So it sparks a huge debate on St vs PT. I think your confused and think Khev just said he liked the ST and everyone jumped on him. thats not the case. So stop with that lol

 

[ironwez20]

Also I don't like talking bad about Khev anyway. He's a swell guy. We just disagree on this tiny little thing.

 

[Prime Clone]

I just got done watching this.. I watched it back when it was first made.. I wonder if subconsciously this is where I came up with Pick your Poison as he says it in the video..

I agree with so much.

I think the ST would have benefited with having JJ on the whole time for sure.. Its the one thing that the PT has over the ST IMO...

Its a fun watch if you have not seen it before.

Thanks, good watch! I liked TLJ, but yes the ST would have been more cohesive if JJ oversaw the whole shebang.

Why did Disney have such an aggressive release schedule? If they'd given him more time it could have turned out so much better. Did they think SW was going to fall out of favour if they waited too long?

 

[jye4ever]

Thanks, good watch! I liked TLJ, but yes the ST would have been more cohesive if JJ oversaw the whole shebang.

Why did Disney have such an aggressive release schedule? If they'd given him more time it could have turned out so much better. Did they think SW was going to fall out of favour if they waited too long?

Now that is a great question.

2 words!

Mo Ney

Make that 3 words!

De Mo Ney

 

[The Buffinator]

lmao. My man. I don't care nor does anyone else if Khev likes the ST or not. it's the stuff he says. YOU can choose not to see it and by all means do so. I don't care. Ain't nobody trying to force anyone to dislike anything in this thread. I have absolutly no idea where you got that from. People are back and forth cause of the silly comments made by Khev and Jye about the PT. This thread would have died a long time ago if they didn't keep trying to say how bad the PT sucked and everything. So if you want to tell someone to get over over it why don't you point the finger at them lol.

Nobody here who is against the ST is telling Khev you shouldn't like it they are arguing with him becuase he makes silly comments and statements. So it sparks a huge debate on St vs PT. I think your confused and think Khev just said he liked the ST and everyone jumped on him. thats not the case. So stop with that lol

Usually it's pretty obvious that the ST/PT back-and-forth is all good natured fun, but for some reason this time it struck a chord with me. IDK, maybe it's due to my lack of sleep? Regardless, I've seen you guys go at it long enough now that I should have realized that no one in this conversation is actually that belligerent. Sorry if I got a little testy. All good.

Also I don't like talking bad about Khev anyway. He's a swell guy. We just disagree on this tiny little thing.

Typed with tongue planted firmly in cheek, no doubt!

 

[adambadadam]

Good gawd lol!!!

The irony in these forums is too rich for my blood. However, the "just deserts", not so much

 

[Prime Clone]

Now that is a great question.

2 words!

Mo Ney

Make that 3 words!

De Mo Ney

Assuming Disney mainly bought LF for the merchandising rights, they could have comfortably milked those for a few years while they got their moviemaking s--- together!

 

[Khev]

Got em??? How exactly did you come to that conclusion? Read the highlighted parts. Khev said they had a plan mapped out prior to Rogue One's release (so After TFA but before TLJ), but then Disney got cold feet and ditched that plan prior to TROS.

Exactly. I never once said that they had everything mapped out prior to TFA, lol. Only that they had completed scripts for Parts II and III prior to the release of RO which actually makes the ST the *most* planned out trilogy of the entire Skywalker Saga regardless of what idiots on YouTube are saying. Did they stick to their plan? Obviously not after Carrie's passing and the fan backlash to TLJ. But that's never been in dispute.

 

[Khev]

I love how this TFA look ends up being a foreshadow of her flight to Exegol.

 

[TheDucky]

Exactly. I never once said that they had everything mapped out prior to TFA, lol. Only that they had completed scripts for Parts II and III prior to the release of RO which actually makes the ST the *most* planned out trilogy of the entire Skywalker Saga regardless of what idiots on YouTube are saying. Did they stick to their plan? Obviously not after Carrie's passing and the fan backlash to TLJ. But that's never been in dispute.

They never had a plan after TFA. They never had a plan for the whole trilogy.

Rian Johnson himself confirmed the first one.