1/6 The Dark Knight - 1/6th scale Two Face Collectible Figure (Toy Fairs 2019) Exclusive

[Zurdo95D]

It's awesome the film has a large impact, for companies to be producing new figures/statues up to today.

 

[Cap'n Cook]

Any more photos of this from SDCC?

 

[ShadowX81]

And release all of the criminals Dent had put away (including the hundreds swept up in the racketeering bust early on in the movie).

Kind of an important plot point.

Except they kind of walk all of that back in The Dark Knight Rises when they suddenly claim that hiding Harvey Dent's actions before he died (which is completely irrelevant to the morality of the Dent Act itself) means all of the criminals punished under that act were somehow unjustly convicted. Even though all of the people prosecuted more than deserved to be in jail and the Act was wildly effective.

The point is, Dent didn't snap - he was always a nasty, scummy guy.

He hides it well, but it's demonstrated before his accident multiple times throughout the movie.

The tragedy is, most of Gotham doesn't realize it - and so he must be lionized, for the sake of the greater good, even though he never deserved it.

He was? When? When he intimidated a homicidal thug that threatened his girlfriend? All things considered, it wasn't that unreasonable of a thing to do. Let alone nasty or scummy.

 

[mynameschris]

I don’t think it showed him like that at all, it just showed there was a side to him which was always there that could become two face like the 50/50 chance with the coin.

Just because the man had a dark side and when pushed a temper doesn’t make him a bad person. It was going through a traumatic experience resulting in that dark side becoming a split personality which made him a villain.


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[sj2106]

Ledger was just so good it really overshadowed everything else about the film, Batman included. No doubt his Joker was the single highlight of the franchise but I still feel Batman Begins was the more complete film. It is also one of the few Batman movies so far that focuses on Batman himself. 89 was more a Joker movie, Returns Catwoman stole the show, TDK Joker and Rises Bane.

Not that this is really relevant to this figure sorry lol.

 

[Wor-Gar]

And release all of the criminals Dent had put away (including the hundreds swept up in the racketeering bust early on in the movie).

Kind of an important plot point.



The point is, Dent didn't snap - he was always a nasty, scummy guy.

He hides it well, but it's demonstrated before his accident multiple times throughout the movie.

The tragedy is, most of Gotham doesn't realize it - and so he must be lionized, for the sake of the greater good, even though he never deserved it.

I have to agree with what the others have said earlier in regards to these two points.

I'll add that I don't see how the Joker releasing criminals on Gotham has anything to do with Two-Face being an unbelievable realized villain -- which was what I was talking about.

Also, I too do not see Dent as a "scummy evil guy" in hiding. You must be conflating some comic stories into the movie.

 

[Zurdo95D]

Ledger was just so good it really overshadowed everything else about the film, Batman included. No doubt his Joker was the single highlight of the franchise but I still feel Batman Begins was the more complete film. It is also one of the few Batman movies so far that focuses on Batman himself. 89 was more a Joker movie, Returns Catwoman stole the show, TDK Joker and Rises Bane.

Not that this is really relevant to this figure sorry lol.

I agree, Begins is a fantastic Batman origin film.

 

[Chuck72586]

Begins is my favorite of the trilogy. I think it had the best combination of the grounded, serious approach Nolan was going, but also still feeling like a comic book movie. TDK/TDKR felt more like crime/war dramas respectively and went too far with the grounded approach.

 

[creasy]

Ledger was just so good it really overshadowed everything else about the film, Batman included. No doubt his Joker was the single highlight of the franchise but I still feel Batman Begins was the more complete film. It is also one of the few Batman movies so far that focuses on Batman himself. 89 was more a Joker movie, Returns Catwoman stole the show, TDK Joker and Rises Bane.

Not that this is really relevant to this figure sorry lol.

My sentiments exactly [emoji106]


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[RaBu]

View attachment 461417

looks so cool !!!!

 

[haytil]

Except they kind of walk all of that back in The Dark Knight Rises when they suddenly claim that hiding Harvey Dent's actions before he died (which is completely irrelevant to the morality of the Dent Act itself) means all of the criminals punished under that act were somehow unjustly convicted.

It's not about morality, it's about how the justice system works. If Dent's crimes are revealed, it throws every prosecution he's been involved in under doubt. Every criminal prosecuted by Dent now can appeal to have their conviction overturned and thrown out, on the premise that a miscarriage of justice may have been perpetrated.

This is most true of the 549 criminals that were being processed (after Lau's testimony) - essentially, the entirety of the organized crime in Gotham - who would have the strongest case due to both the recency of Dent's crimes and the connection of these crimes to organized crime figures.

Dent's crimes taint everything.

Even though all of the people prosecuted more than deserved to be in jail and the Act was wildly effective.

Do they "deserve" to be in jail? Sure, they're criminals. But the legal system of this country guarantees due process, and if that's violated, then any resulting legal decisions or actions thereafter are tainted.

Just like when you aren't read your Miranda rights when you're arrested - if you later confess to a killing, you can have that testimony thrown out (and potentially any conviction achieved as a result of that confession overturned), even if you did, in fact, commit the killing.

And this isn't about the Dent act - that's from TDKR. We're discussing the coverup for Harvey Dent at the climax of TDK. The Dent Act is a piece of legislation, that is created after the events of TDK and are not relevant to this discussion.

He was? When?

From the beginning, Dent is shown to be a guy who doesn't think the rules apply to him. He cheats and breaks the rules, but he gets away with it because he does it in a charming way (and people don't object to his results). There are multiple examples, ranging from the mundane...

-Cheating with a double-sided coin is apparently a habit (even using it on his girlfriend)

...to the understandable, yet still sketchy...

-Punching a guy on the witness stand in a courtroom (after he has been disarmed and is no longer a threat)

...to the absolutely unacceptable:

-Abducting and torturing a suspect for information

The last of which, you were already aware of:

When he intimidated a homicidal thug that threatened his girlfriend? All things considered, it wasn't that unreasonable of a thing to do. Let alone nasty or scummy.

Abducting and torturing a suspect, threatening to kill them in an interrogation by holding a loaded gun to their head, holding them in a secret location....these are absolutely unacceptable, criminal actions. It's terrifying to think that a cop can do this, and it's terrifying to hear that you think it's reasonable behavior. (Do you think Dent read Schiff his rights and provided him with a lawyer before playing Russian Roulette?)

By the way, these things happen in real life Gotham City - and it never ends well, either for the victims who are convicted after giving false confessions, for the suspects that end up mysteriously dead after interrogations, for the cops that are prosecuted for their misconduct, or for the city that has to pay out millions in restitution.

(https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/feb/24/chicago-police-detain-americans-black-site, https://www.theatlantic.com/politic...ago-police-torture-decades-now-online/504233/)

But if a cop's girlfriend has been threatened - well, then that's OK?

I'll add that I don't see how the Joker releasing criminals on Gotham has anything to do with Two-Face being an unbelievable realized villain -- which was what I was talking about.

I have no idea what this is a reference to. First, Joker didn't release a bunch of criminals in Gotham City, so I think you're confused about what happened in the movie.

Second, my response to you was to your initial statement that you didn't think Dent was believable because he just "snapped." And I was saying no, he didn't just "snap," going from a good guy to a bad guy - he was always a bad guy, from the start. All the Joker did was encourage Dent to act out on his impulses, which were already there and visible to the audience.

Also, I too do not see Dent as a "scummy evil guy" in hiding. You must be conflating some comic stories into the movie.

See above. I'm talking about "The Dark Knight," the comic stories have no bearing on this particular characterization of Harvey Dent.

 

[Chainedstream]

Pre-ordered! Will be my first DC figure, got to get Batsy later down the line. Hopes for a joker 3.0 increase immensely

 

[sj2106]

Pre-ordered! Will be my first DC figure, got to get Batsy later down the line. Hopes for a joker 3.0 increase immensely

A Joker 3.0 would be well worth doing as long as they change the sculptor. No offence to Yuli but she's failed to nail Ledger's likeness across multiple figures in two scales.

 

[Wor-Gar]

[Dent] he was always a bad guy, from the start.

I think this is where most disagree.

You seem to take the Joker's view on life and people; that we're all evil at heart and just 'need a little push'. Pretty sure that wasn't Nolan's message.

 

[MxBxM]

It's not about morality, it's about how the justice system works. If Dent's crimes are revealed, it throws every prosecution he's been involved in under doubt. Every criminal prosecuted by Dent now can appeal to have their conviction overturned and thrown out, on the premise that a miscarriage of justice may have been perpetrated.

This is most true of the 549 criminals that were being processed (after Lau's testimony) - essentially, the entirety of the organized crime in Gotham - who would have the strongest case due to both the recency of Dent's crimes and the connection of these crimes to organized crime figures.

Dent's crimes taint everything.



Do they "deserve" to be in jail? Sure, they're criminals. But the legal system of this country guarantees due process, and if that's violated, then any resulting legal decisions or actions thereafter are tainted.

Just like when you aren't read your Miranda rights when you're arrested - if you later confess to a killing, you can have that testimony thrown out (and potentially any conviction achieved as a result of that confession overturned), even if you did, in fact, commit the killing.

And this isn't about the Dent act - that's from TDKR. We're discussing the coverup for Harvey Dent at the climax of TDK. The Dent Act is a piece of legislation, that is created after the events of TDK and are not relevant to this discussion.



From the beginning, Dent is shown to be a guy who doesn't think the rules apply to him. He cheats and breaks the rules, but he gets away with it because he does it in a charming way (and people don't object to his results). There are multiple examples, ranging from the mundane...

-Cheating with a double-sided coin is apparently a habit (even using it on his girlfriend)

...to the understandable, yet still sketchy...

-Punching a guy on the witness stand in a courtroom (after he has been disarmed and is no longer a threat)

...to the absolutely unacceptable:

-Abducting and torturing a suspect for information

The last of which, you were already aware of:



Abducting and torturing a suspect, threatening to kill them in an interrogation by holding a loaded gun to their head, holding them in a secret location....these are absolutely unacceptable, criminal actions. It's terrifying to think that a cop can do this, and it's terrifying to hear that you think it's reasonable behavior. (Do you think Dent read Schiff his rights and provided him with a lawyer before playing Russian Roulette?)

By the way, these things happen in real life Gotham City - and it never ends well, either for the victims who are convicted after giving false confessions, for the suspects that end up mysteriously dead after interrogations, for the cops that are prosecuted for their misconduct, or for the city that has to pay out millions in restitution.

(https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/feb/24/chicago-police-detain-americans-black-site, https://www.theatlantic.com/politic...ago-police-torture-decades-now-online/504233/)

But if a cop's girlfriend has been threatened - well, then that's OK?



I have no idea what this is a reference to. First, Joker didn't release a bunch of criminals in Gotham City, so I think you're confused about what happened in the movie.

Second, my response to you was to your initial statement that you didn't think Dent was believable because he just "snapped." And I was saying no, he didn't just "snap," going from a good guy to a bad guy - he was always a bad guy, from the start. All the Joker did was encourage Dent to act out on his impulses, which were already there and visible to the audience.



See above. I'm talking about "The Dark Knight," the comic stories have no bearing on this particular characterization of Harvey Dent.

This is so wrong. None of the examples you make hint at Dent having a hidden evil side.

-The coin flips with Rachel are innocent trick and he later states he creates his own luck

-The guy in court who pulled a gun on him was punched right after his gun malfunctioned and then later disarmed

-The criminal he kidnapped, he never had the intention to kill him. He just wanted information without knowing the guy had metal problems

 

[sj2106]

Well Dent must have been kinda unhinged to start. No matter the tragedy you don't just go from good guy to crazy psychopath that fast.

His short temper and willingness to flout the rules was already in evidence before he became two face.

It's hard to show a complete character arc when he's the secondary villain in a movie. I guess they did the best they could but it's obviously not the same as the animated series where they could more gradually reveal his schizophrenic personality.

 

[Zurdo95D]

Is anyone gonna pose it up with Gordon and Batman to create the ending scene?

 

[MxBxM]

Well Dent must have been kinda unhinged to start. No matter the tragedy you don't just go from good guy to crazy psychopath that fast.

His short temper and willingness to flout the rules was already in evidence before he became two face.

It's hard to show a complete character arc when he's the secondary villain in a movie. I guess they did the best they could but it's obviously not the same as the animated series where they could more gradually reveal his schizophrenic personality.

He was not a crazy psycopath in the movie. He just decided to punish those involved in the death of Rachel. He was not killing innocent people left and right for no reason.

Even when he threatened Gordon's son, he just wanted him to feel what he felt in the last moments he had with Rachel but I never sensed he would harm the boy. If he killed Gordon, then I still wouldn't have thought of him as a psycopath.

Remember that also Joker influenced his mind and was the first Harvey could have killed and let a coin that he felt a connection with Rachel since the scarred side occured when she died.

 

[Cocoboloboy]

Is anyone gonna pose it up with Gordon and Batman to create the ending scene?

I don’t have Gordon so for me it’ll be Bats in the middle with Joker on one side and Dent on the other.

 

[sj2106]

He was not a crazy psycopath in the movie. He just decided to punish those involved in the death of Rachel. He was not killing innocent people left and right for no reason.

Even when he threatened Gordon's son, he just wanted him to feel what he felt in the last moments he had with Rachel but I never sensed he would harm the boy. If he killed Gordon, then I still wouldn't have thought of him as a psycopath.

Remember that also Joker influenced his mind and was the first Harvey could have killed and let a coin that he felt a connection with Rachel since the scarred side occured when she died.

Flipping a coin to see if people live or die seems pretty psychotic to me! A more sane person would have surely turned all their rage on the Joker.

Similar to real life killers, there may be a trigger event but they have to already have serious issues to ever go down that path. Dent was flawed from the start in my eyes.