URGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGENT!!

[tbay]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

i think a new rule should be in place if you want to do business on here. if your a customizer you do not and should not need the full amount of said custom up front to start a project. if you ever watch guy's like robbie jones, he only gets a deposit, and when done ask's for the balance wich is more than 50% in most cases. for example; i paid a guy to make me some 1/6 th leaves, like from a tree. lol...i paid $45, he canceled the run, would you know i could not get a mere $45 back from this guy!!!! i had to accept a custom made stand instead. he said he didnt have the money, he is still on here taking hundreds of dollars in orders. i for one would never hire this guy or buy, regardless. if he could not give me back $45, what would happen on a run with mayBe hundereds or thousands involved.

also there are some good guys on here that have never screwed people over, NEVER!!! yet with some of them i have paid for commissions and so far its been 2 1/2 years and still have not seen them completed. THIS IS DOWNRIGHT RIDICULIOUS!!!!, they guy has never ever taken a dime from anyone, yet all this time later who suffers, ME ME ME, and if i would say something i would be run out of town with fire, swords, and ax's.....

some of these customizers think they could do no worng on here because the high praise that is shoved into them by us groupie's,,,,,,OMG thats the best paint app i ever seen!! please take all my money,,,,,,,,,,,,,or sweet jesus,,, thats the best custom figure i have eever seen, please take my first born now,,,,,or how about,,,seriously that is the best 1/6th suit i ever seen, please take all of my money........they feel this way because we make them feel this way...how could they not have an EGO, and feel like they could do whatever and they would get a pass!!! ,,,,,,we thank the living crap out of these guys making things for us, wich is well deserved and nice. but it boarders on naseau,, and its all our fault...we are ALL guilty of doing this in the customs game.....the high praise and king annointing.

automatticly because they have this god givin skill, we also give them the title of the best ever guy, would never go bad, etc etc etc.... to be honest there are a few that are not nice....and we have know idea if they would ever go bad....yet,, her we all come, sedning them friend requests because well, we want to be friends with him, because maybe he now will take my commisions the more i praise him and such. c'mon you see it all the time, and most are guity of it, including ME. what scares me is how everyone said all of these things to MOE, he has 100% feedback, the post count, had it all... yet he turned bad and as bad as you can get. is there right now another moe on here??? scary to think so....i will say 98% of the customizers on here are good people and just want to enjoy the hobby like us and make some money to pay for their habit's also. nothing wrong with that. yet there are that 2 % that are probably headed down that bad break up road that is all too familiar.

its time for me to change the way i give up my money. time to call out who is not doing right by me regardless of who doesnt like it. its also time for the board to change, for the mod's to hear the complaint and if in the favor of the customer chime in and get the hounds off their back if it is happening in a thread. thats the main resaon most do not speak up, hear it all the time. I WILL BECOME MY OWN VICTIM TO THE SAID CUSTOMIZERS FAN BOYS. this cannot happen. because being silent is why this happnes to get as big as it gets, read this thread, same thing, its been so and so months and broken promises, nothing from moe, yet nobody made a thread or went to a mod over this. we still seen a few defend moe on here because he didnt do this to them,,, WHAT? no but can you read what he has done to your fellow freaks.

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,THINGS NEED TO CHANGE ON HERE,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,we need to peak up more often and get help when needed,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,


my disclaimer; i am gulity of all that i have wrote on here period.

So a guy takes your money for an item, cancels the run and the money disappeared. Then he forces you to take an item you didn't want. Yet, he's still selling crap on here unscathed? That's just shameful, but very typical. For every "highly publicized" incident like this one, there's five people doing the same exact thing at a lower scale.

It's definitely a soup nazi culture here, but at least the soup nazi always delivered the soup.

 

[SwedishHeat]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

I would like to see people not pay up front for rainman and iminime releases. Show "the big guns" how it should work. Like it or not, those two are the pillars of this community and people base their perception of how it should work on how those two outfits operate.

I'm sure it will never happen, as I don't see any of those guys in this thread, so I can only assume those folks don't care. I tend to think that the people that can spend $800 on a custom figure, have no qualms about losing $150 on a chem suit.

 

[Rdeezy]

I would like to see people not pay up front for rainman and iminime releases. Show "the big guns" how it should work. Like it or not, those two are the pillars of this community and people base their perception of how it should work on how those two outfits operate.

I'm sure it will never happen, as I don't see any of those guys in this thread, so I can only assume those folks don't care. I tend to think that the people that can spend $800 on a custom figure, have no qualms about losing $150 on a chem suit.

People also pre-order Hot Toys too...I mean on most full custom figures like RM or Iminime buyers are show a prototype then order, so they're not ordering blindly. With RM, the figures are delivered within 3-4 months, pretty quick turnaround. And both RM and Iminime have their own websites so if any problems arise you go through their sites. SSF is more to showcase their figures before and after you order.

 

[mightyq]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

People also pre-order Hot Toys too...I mean on most full custom figures like RM or Iminime buyers are show a prototype then order, so they're not ordering blindly. With RM, the figures are delivered within 3-4 months, pretty quick turnaround.

GOOD PONIT.... and i think you can put certain customizers in categories.

 

[mightyq]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

I would like to see people not pay up front for rainman and iminime releases. Show "the big guns" how it should work. Like it or not, those two are the pillars of this community and people base their perception of how it should work on how those two outfits operate.

I'm sure it will never happen, as I don't see any of those guys in this thread, so I can only assume those folks don't care. I tend to think that the people that can spend $800 on a custom figure, have no qualms about losing $150 on a chem suit.

valid points,, thats why there are so much to work through

 

[karamazov80]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

In the past I was one of the most vocal advocates for changing the way customs sales work. But my comments were largely dismissed because they were made at a time when we didn't have a major scam going on. Folks have short memories. But the reality is that lots of these guys probably wouldn't operate without upfront payment, because they're not traditional businesses and couldn't handle the upfront investment in some cases (Denny Kim said this is why he has to charge upfront), and because this expectation has been established here, and who wouldn't be happy to remove the risk from themselves if they were allowed to? Dave doesn't want to hamper custom sales too much, or to offend too many artists who haven't yet done wrong, so buyer beware. I only deal with folks I trust, and where I usually know their track record. Considering that we apparently aren't going to have major restrictions on how custom sales work here, that's all you can do for now. I felt Moe to be disingenuous awhile back, which was reinforced by some of his behaviors and comments. Based on that, and what I felt to be some overly high prices, I stayed away. Same goes for some others here.

 

[galactiboy]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

People also pre-order Hot Toys too...I mean on most full custom figures like RM or Iminime buyers are show a prototype then order, so they're not ordering blindly. With RM, the figures are delivered within 3-4 months, pretty quick turnaround. And both RM and Iminime have their own websites so if any problems arise you go through their sites. SSF is more to showcase their figures before and after you order.

Yes, but you don't have to pay until the items ships... or at most on Sideshow (and most retail sites) it might be a 10% deposit.

Sure it takes a year to get a figure from HT or Sideshow, but they assume the risk, not the customer. Rainman is definitely one of the best models of how the pay ahead system can work, but I still don't know how much protection there is for customers should something go wrong (he's injured, project goes completely wrong, natural disaster, etc.).

Probably one of the most frustrating things about Shrunken Head Studios, they're a license holder and "real" company, but did the pay ahead thing and now more than two years later no figures delivered.

 

[vareika]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

Meanwhile, Moe kicks back, enjoying the discussion.

 

[Spook]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

I paid for a pair of Myers coveralls on the 30th of March, 2012 and never received them. It was $85. He first said that they must have been lost in the mail and would make me a new pair... several times. I gave up on him. Sorry to hear he's scammed many others.

Mark

 

[Leon 911]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

People also pre-order Hot Toys too...I mean on most full custom figures like RM or Iminime buyers are show a prototype then order, so they're not ordering blindly. With RM, the figures are delivered within 3-4 months, pretty quick turnaround. And both RM and Iminime have their own websites so if any problems arise you go through their sites. SSF is more to showcase their figures before and after you order.

 

[Doom Saber]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

i think a new rule should be in place if you want to do business on here. if your a customizer you do not and should not need the full amount of said custom up front to start a project. if you ever watch guy's like robbie jones, he only gets a deposit, and when done ask's for the balance wich is more than 50% in most cases. for example; i paid a guy to make me some 1/6 th leaves, like from a tree. lol...i paid $45, he canceled the run, would you know i could not get a mere $45 back from this guy!!!! i had to accept a custom made stand instead. he said he didnt have the money, he is still on here taking hundreds of dollars in orders. i for one would never hire this guy or buy, regardless. if he could not give me back $45, what would happen on a run with mayBe hundereds or thousands involved.

also there are some good guys on here that have never screwed people over, NEVER!!! yet with some of them i have paid for commissions and so far its been 2 1/2 years and still have not seen them completed. THIS IS DOWNRIGHT RIDICULIOUS!!!!, they guy has never ever taken a dime from anyone, yet all this time later who suffers, ME ME ME, and if i would say something i would be run out of town with fire, swords, and ax's.....

some of these customizers think they could do no worng on here because the high praise that is shoved into them by us groupie's,,,,,,OMG thats the best paint app i ever seen!! please take all my money,,,,,,,,,,,,,or sweet jesus,,, thats the best custom figure i have eever seen, please take my first born now,,,,,or how about,,,seriously that is the best 1/6th suit i ever seen, please take all of my money........they feel this way because we make them feel this way...how could they not have an EGO, and feel like they could do whatever and they would get a pass!!! ,,,,,,we thank the living crap out of these guys making things for us, wich is well deserved and nice. but it boarders on naseau,, and its all our fault...we are ALL guilty of doing this in the customs game.....the high praise and king annointing.

automatticly because they have this god givin skill, we also give them the title of the best ever guy, would never go bad, etc etc etc.... to be honest there are a few that are not nice....and we have know idea if they would ever go bad....yet,, her we all come, sedning them friend requests because well, we want to be friends with him, because maybe he now will take my commisions the more i praise him and such. c'mon you see it all the time, and most are guity of it, including ME. what scares me is how everyone said all of these things to MOE, he has 100% feedback, the post count, had it all... yet he turned bad and as bad as you can get. is there right now another moe on here??? scary to think so....i will say 98% of the customizers on here are good people and just want to enjoy the hobby like us and make some money to pay for their habit's also. nothing wrong with that. yet there are that 2 % that are probably headed down that bad break up road that is all too familiar.

its time for me to change the way i give up my money. time to call out who is not doing right by me regardless of who doesnt like it. its also time for the board to change, for the mod's to hear the complaint and if in the favor of the customer chime in and get the hounds off their back if it is happening in a thread. thats the main resaon most do not speak up, hear it all the time. I WILL BECOME MY OWN VICTIM TO THE SAID CUSTOMIZERS FAN BOYS. this cannot happen. because being silent is why this happnes to get as big as it gets, read this thread, same thing, its been so and so months and broken promises, nothing from moe, yet nobody made a thread or went to a mod over this. we still seen a few defend moe on here because he didnt do this to them,,, WHAT? no but can you read what he has done to your fellow freaks.

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,THINGS NEED TO CHANGE ON HERE,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,we need to peak up more often and get help when needed,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,


my disclaimer; i am gulity of all that i have wrote on here period.

I completely agree. You can call me bias, but I never liked how some people here treats customizers as gods simply because these fans become super bias. Not that they shouldn't be praised, but a lot of the Freaks members do is not only to praise them, but to kiss their assess as if they can't do anything wrong. They praise them and give the customizers a lot of business, unaware that they might be booked. The customizers in turn, might not say anything, since money is money. They eventually get so overwhelmed that they can't recover and start screwing people over. Once one person gets screwed over and mentions it here, he gets attacked by the customizer's groupies. I have been saying time and time again, it is a bad thing to have customizers and companies trying to be fans with the community since the community will take it the wrong way and actually see the person from the company as their best friend.

It has happened to SOTA (at least Jerry has gotten better with PCS) and Triad Toys, the latter started by a member at the now defunct Men with Dolls forum. Before PCS, Jerry used to talk to the Action-figure.com community on the daily basis. Eventually he would tell his ideas and his opinions on the forums, making the groupies follow his every word and started to attack other toy companies that made similar products. The same thing has had happened to Aaron Archer from the Transformers brand. It is said that the Hasbro higher ups told Aaron Archer that he couldn't post on the TFW2005 anymore since his presences in the forum was causing an unhealthy competition from other Transformers forums.

I have to mention Big Chief Studios since Greggo and them didn't really went this route as the other companies in the past - Big Chief Studios is doing a better job at PR than they were a year ago. Greggo doesn't really participate here, which is a good thing, and his participation on the FB BCS page is more about the product his company is selling - he is trying to buddy buddy with the people on facebook, but at the same time, is only answering questions regarding current figures in production.

I think for any new customizer wanting to start a business here, ask yourself why you really want to do it. If it is for sharing your talent to the freaks here and giving them figures you and them want, then that is awesome. However, if it is to make a huge amount of dough, you have to rethink this route. A lot of the people who are long time customizers selling their wares here, they aren't in it for the fame here. Those who were either left for screwing people over (Chris Howes, etc..) or because they made it big in the 1/6 community (Kato).

While people like Rainman accepts money up front, a lot of people who sell their wares here don't. A good example is Warriors Gate Productions. They have been here for a long time and are still around because Rick has faith that people who want his heads will pay once they are ready. He also only have heads made if he has interest in them. I am sure he is also someone who has to eat up the cost when the prototypes go bad.

 

[Doom Saber]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

People also pre-order Hot Toys too...I mean on most full custom figures like RM or Iminime buyers are show a prototype then order, so they're not ordering blindly. With RM, the figures are delivered within 3-4 months, pretty quick turnaround. And both RM and Iminime have their own websites so if any problems arise you go through their sites. SSF is more to showcase their figures before and after you order.

You have to keep in mind that both RM and Iminime are small studios that do this full time. Iminime makes official heads while Rainman is an artist who probably knows how to handle a business. Rainman also has a production limit of his figures since he knows how many he can tackle on any given time. I imagine RM has experience selling his customs, so he knows how to not screw people over. New people like Moe likely do not have this experience, so they end up ripping people off.

 

[Leon 911]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

most of what you say makes sense but may not have a solution as without upfront money custom creators wont cater to our needs.
however one point i completely agree is - this whole "godlike worship" thing ----- butt load of crap. i think its a business, i respect the art and the artist, but we pay for what they create. "someone cant do no wrong" is how big scams happen... I think whoever sells here (you , me, one single customiser individual or otherwise) should be treated as an enterprise / business and may be some accountability on output and $. The question still remains is "how"

i think a new rule should be in place if you want to do business on here. if your a customizer you do not and should not need the full amount of said custom up front to start a project. if you ever watch guy's like robbie jones, he only gets a deposit, and when done ask's for the balance wich is more than 50% in most cases. for example; i paid a guy to make me some 1/6 th leaves, like from a tree. lol...i paid $45, he canceled the run, would you know i could not get a mere $45 back from this guy!!!! i had to accept a custom made stand instead. he said he didnt have the money, he is still on here taking hundreds of dollars in orders. i for one would never hire this guy or buy, regardless. if he could not give me back $45, what would happen on a run with mayBe hundereds or thousands involved.

also there are some good guys on here that have never screwed people over, NEVER!!! yet with some of them i have paid for commissions and so far its been 2 1/2 years and still have not seen them completed. THIS IS DOWNRIGHT RIDICULIOUS!!!!, they guy has never ever taken a dime from anyone, yet all this time later who suffers, ME ME ME, and if i would say something i would be run out of town with fire, swords, and ax's.....

some of these customizers think they could do no worng on here because the high praise that is shoved into them by us groupie's,,,,,,OMG thats the best paint app i ever seen!! please take all my money,,,,,,,,,,,,,or sweet jesus,,, thats the best custom figure i have eever seen, please take my first born now,,,,,or how about,,,seriously that is the best 1/6th suit i ever seen, please take all of my money........they feel this way because we make them feel this way...how could they not have an EGO, and feel like they could do whatever and they would get a pass!!! ,,,,,,we thank the living crap out of these guys making things for us, wich is well deserved and nice. but it boarders on naseau,, and its all our fault...we are ALL guilty of doing this in the customs game.....the high praise and king annointing.

automatticly because they have this god givin skill, we also give them the title of the best ever guy, would never go bad, etc etc etc.... to be honest there are a few that are not nice....and we have know idea if they would ever go bad....yet,, her we all come, sedning them friend requests because well, we want to be friends with him, because maybe he now will take my commisions the more i praise him and such. c'mon you see it all the time, and most are guity of it, including ME. what scares me is how everyone said all of these things to MOE, he has 100% feedback, the post count, had it all... yet he turned bad and as bad as you can get. is there right now another moe on here??? scary to think so....i will say 98% of the customizers on here are good people and just want to enjoy the hobby like us and make some money to pay for their habit's also. nothing wrong with that. yet there are that 2 % that are probably headed down that bad break up road that is all too familiar.

its time for me to change the way i give up my money. time to call out who is not doing right by me regardless of who doesnt like it. its also time for the board to change, for the mod's to hear the complaint and if in the favor of the customer chime in and get the hounds off their back if it is happening in a thread. thats the main resaon most do not speak up, hear it all the time. I WILL BECOME MY OWN VICTIM TO THE SAID CUSTOMIZERS FAN BOYS. this cannot happen. because being silent is why this happnes to get as big as it gets, read this thread, same thing, its been so and so months and broken promises, nothing from moe, yet nobody made a thread or went to a mod over this. we still seen a few defend moe on here because he didnt do this to them,,, WHAT? no but can you read what he has done to your fellow freaks.

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,THINGS NEED TO CHANGE ON HERE,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,we need to peak up more often and get help when needed,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,


my disclaimer; i am gulity of all that i have wrote on here period.

 

[Rdeezy]

You have to keep in mind that both RM and Iminime are small studios that do this full time. Iminime makes official heads while Rainman is an artist who probably knows how to handle a business. Rainman also has a production limit of his figures since he knows how many he can tackle on any given time. I imagine RM has experience selling his customs, so he knows how to not screw people over. New people like Moe likely do not have this experience, so they end up ripping people off.

My brother and I just completed a run of 45 headsculpts and 30 outfits Trevor did the sculpts for us and RM tailor did the clothing and many other contributed to the accessories...it was our first project ever and we didnt screw anyone over so I wouldn't say it takes a ton of business sense, but mostly just honesty.

 

[Leon 911]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

My brother and I just completed a run of 45 headsculpts and 30 outfits Trevor did the sculpts for us and RM tailor did the clothing and many other contributed to the accessories...it was our first project ever and we didnt screw anyone over so I wouldn't say it takes a ton of business sense, but mostly just honesty.

 

[Doom Saber]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

most of what you say makes sense but may not have a solution as without upfront money custom creators wont cater to our needs.
however one point i completely agree is - this whole "godlike worship" thing ----- butt load of crap. i think its a business, i respect the art and the artist, but we pay for what they create. "someone cant do no wrong" is how big scams happen... I think whoever sells here (you , me, one single customiser individual or otherwise) should be treated as an enterprise / business and may be some accountability on output and $. The question still remains is "how"

I think a lot of us buy custom wares on impulse. Not to say that something like Gangs of New York is a bad movie, but do that many ppl really want toys from that franchise or do they buy it because someone is making customs of them. It seems like the latter. Anyway, I think educating both the seller and buyer about selling/buying stuff at the freaks might help.

I agree that the sellers here should take accountability. I am thinking that contracts might be helpful. Have a contract signed by both buyers and seller(s) so that if a seller(s) rips ppl off, it would be easier to get the money. It also prevent the naysayers who would say pull the copyright infringement card, resulting in the seller to leave without worrying about legal issues. Why do ppl do that? Do they care more about this hobby than those getting screwed thousands?

It happens every year since a lot of us ignore those who are careful. Before Moe, it was Darko, a kid who screwed a lot of members cash because he too on way too many requests despite warnings from one member.

 

[Doom Saber]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

My brother and I just completed a run of 45 headsculpts and 30 outfits Trevor did the sculpts for us and RM tailor did the clothing and many other contributed to the accessories...it was our first project ever and we didnt screw anyone over so I wouldn't say it takes a ton of business sense, but mostly just honesty.

That's different. Your project is one with different ppl contributing in the project. The guys who screwed ppl over were one-two ppl doing lots of projects at the same time. For instance, Chris Howes was one person taking on 500 head sculpts whereas Darko was one kid taking on 100 paint requests. Everyone except Moe took on too many requests with a team of two ppl tops. It is easier to manage a large project if more hands are in it doing different things.

Also, those who screwed others all didn't start bad. They did a few successful runs, including Darko. It's when they started taking more projects in the same timeframe.

 

[annihilate22]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

Two scenarios from me. The level of professionalism and the business ethic involved is self explanatory.

Scenario1

Customizer A
Had two projects finalized with him. The parts for each were sent to him and he was to take it from there. Money was collected upfront for each project and work began. While initially the WIPs were quickly shared they started to slack in a while and he started getting cranky. Then, the quality began to deteriorate from whatever it was worth to make out through the WIPs shared and he started getting uneasy on asking for changes. I finally get a response saying

I've spent over 10 hours on this figure and ive got to call it a day I'm afraid.

When I commission a custom job to be executed, I expect the customizer to complete the job - I'm not hiring him on an hourly basis. Anyway, I got my stuff back in 10 days after that email and I shared my feedback with him and was as courteous as one could be.

I just reached home last night and opened the package. The stuff has arrived absolutely fine and I saw both Bill and McClane.

However, I'm really sorry to say this but I was a disappointed when I did see the figures. The paint on Bill's coat has cracked in many places and the blood on him comes off as shocking red paint. The blood app on him and McClane are miles apart. Also the leather tarp for Bill's right leg is torn at the bottom. To be honest it upset me to see this.

As for McClane the weathering on his body was good, but the only thing that put me off was his clothes. They seemed rather dirtied than weathered.

Again, I don't want you take this in the wrong way I am not pulling you down, but it's just honest feedback from my side.

A follow up email after two months ,

I never heard back from you. Don't you have any feedback for the project you completed?

And his response to that was

To be honest I didn't know how to respond without getting very angry at the time. I have done things for a lot of people and always had positive feedback.

I worked hard on your stuff and it was not a pleasant experience for me truth be told.

Sorry but that's how I felt. Don't know what to say other than that. It's history for me.

After the incident described above, I made up my mind on treading a careful path for future deals.

Customizer B - Hidden Jitsu
I approached HJ for some work, at least 4 months after I had got to know him and found him to be a great guy (at that time). The discussion ensued and it was made clear to him before starting off that the payments would be split 60:40, 60 at the onset and 40 on completion. WIPs were to be shared and I had albums created with reference pictures for each project - I made it as systematic as possible so as to avoid confusion of any sort later in the game. I had 5 projects finalized with him and sent over everything. (Of course, it was foolish on my part to keep all my eggs in one basket).

I sent over the advance after all the stuff reached him and work was to commence immediately as promised, however I was suddenly hit with a PM days later that I had to wait cause there were other projects taken up while we were finalizing my lot. That was the first warning bell, however I took it as an honest gesture and allowed him to do his thing. I kept posting in his thread in the weeks after that and a month later finally PMd him asking about the status of my lot. (Warning 2, I was seeing heads painted in his thread which were all delivered much later than I sent over my stuff but I ignored it thinking the guys must have booked him when the heads were on pre-order).

Finally after 30 days I got a PM saying work was to begin on 3 projects simultaneously. Once again, I shared the ref pics that I had sent right in the beginning and waited to hear back from him. A PM to check on the status two weeks later, and I was met with an apology of him being saddled with other work but he was getting to my stuff soon. Another PM two weeks later still the same excuse. I was disappointed but still had faith. Four days after, he tells me a project or two (Yeah!) has been completed. When I ask him for pics he says, "Sorry the stuff is already packed up, I don't have time to unpack it and send over pics as I'm due to shift to a new place." That was Warning 3, but I let it slip yet again taking his word for it. He constantly updated his thread with other work, so in a way I was at peace knowing that if other work is being executed I'm good too.

A week later to my surprise I get a PM from him, that work was to begin on my stuff. Again, he tells me 3 projects are to begin simultaneously (These are different from the first 3 he spoke about earlier for which he had no pics or proof to share). Within a week, I finally see the first thing ever painted and boy was I thrilled. And once more, the line was blank soon after.

In the interim I get PMs of him throwing away my HT Indiana Jones body cause he 'thought' it was a cheap knock-off, but of course he replaces it with a KO TTM-19.

I had, had enough by this time but with all my stuff in his possession and a 60% advance, I contacted a mod about what was going on. I began to Bcc him every PM exchange, keeping him abreast of the situation. (His tone had now changed from Mr. Nice guy to STFU I'm doing you a favor by working on your stuff.)

Another 30 days of PMs getting exchanged asking for updates and I finally get a response that he can't work on my stuff anymore and he will send everything back. He also conveniently usurped the entire advance (60% of the money for 5 projects I paid) and all this for A SINGLE PAINTED HEAD. He now wanted me to pay for return postage or he would throw my stuff off in the Garbage bin. With Dave and Snoopy finally convincing him to be rational over another 20 days, his response was now blackmail - Either I pay him an Obnoxious amount for international shipping that too as a GIFT or forget about getting my stuff back. I spoke to a friend on the board who was kind enough to act as a proxy and HJ agreed to ship the stuff to him since he was domestic. The cost was barely nothing compared to what I had already lost and I was coerced into what seemed like the final bid to get my stuff back. Luckily, he came through and I finally had my stuff with me (not all of it since he decided to keep some for Good Luck) and I was out of a good amount of cash. Nevertheless, I made sure to have him banned and Dave and Snoopy were very supportive throughout the ****storm. I'm extremely grateful to the guy who helped me out.


On the flipside, here's an example of 2 customizers/Painters: JOhnny Cheung and Rahmier84. I wanted to get some work done and approached from each one.

• Both had a backlog and made it clear at the onset that it would be a while before they get started. (Which is the way it should be done)
• After discussing the controllables involved, I shipped my stuff to them. (On offering an 'advance' both flat out refused. Cheung says money will be collected only once everything is ready to ship. Jake says that he doesn't take money upfront as the closer the project is to completion, the more he is driven to complete the project as there a lump-sum waiting for him).

No stories here no drama, nothing. I've been made aware of what I'm getting into at the onset. They've shared WIPs or completed projects on their own, without having to touch base even once. They have constant updates in their threads and they're outright honest.

From where I look at it, it's clear there's the equal amount of risk at stake for both entities (Artist and customer)

• If the person who commissioned flakes - of course the artist is at a loss (especially if it's a one off) but then he could recoup the amount by selling it off.
• And if the artists flakes yes it's a loss to the customer but it's restricted to the cost of a blank head.

Personally, I couldn't feel more at peace after having such professional dealings in comparison with what went down earlier. These guys are A-grade and I feel this is definitely a model to follow not because it's worked for me because the merits in working like this are plentiful.

 

[Fangs of Death]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

Sage stuff, Annihilate. It's probably been said before (umpteen times, don't have time to go thru all these posts) but the way custom commerce works on here it seems there is a lot of money to be had by someone who can churn out one custom run after another to the required quality. And it would seem that it would become difficult (over time) to refuse an opportunity/request. So the flake gets in too deep, through greed, or inability to turn it down. A character flaw, for some people--they start off legit and standup, and end up corrupted and turn into a bull*****er and a liar because they just can't stop, but neither can they ultimately deliver.
I say again, I intend to be offering customs at some point. I however do not need a cash cow, I have other priorities. But some can't turn one down, simple as that. I'm not trying to defend any rippers off, just point out (remind) that there does seem to actually be a lot of cash to be had in 1/6 customs, and some people can't resist it. All this is obvious enough I suppose...some kind of intermediary banker would seem to be long overdue.

 

[Kay-ess-cee]

Re: UEGENT!!-anybody who is owed clothing from moe's production's must read this-URGE

Put me down for 2 chem suits ($260) since Oct 2013.

He's attempted to pacify me a few times with "no worries, brother" comments and PMs promising $25 off my next order...Gee, thanks! Haven't heard from him proper since January.

This was my second, and last custom purchase on these boards. I know there are lots of upstanding artists here, and that I shouldn't let one bad apple spoil it, but honestly, there just isn't enough security on ANY transaction performed in this way. I'm just not willing to take the chance again.