would you rather be an employee or an employer ?

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And I know which one. I envy you because I work in nearly the same profession but under a different union and it SUCKS! And I pay more union dues a month than the factory workers in Detroit! :monkey4

Well, as far as union dues go, ours went up quite a bit after the union spent several tens of millions to bury Arnold's ******* education "reforms" several years ago. Do I agree with everything my union does or stands for? Absolutely not! But, honestly, any major profession that is directly connected to political whim needs a union.
 
Personally, I'd rather be unemployed (even in Greenland ;)), than work in another union job, ever again in my life.

Yep, nowadays Unions are pretty much useless, except for the Union leading getting rich, while completely ignoring what the union member need and being complete morons
 
I live in California and the cost of living here is so fraking high even when you are making six figures, you feel the pinch !

I think there is no good answer. I have been woring for a large agency now for 15yrs and when the money is decent, it becomes harder to walk away. IT ALSO BECOMES HARDER WHEN YOU HAVE A love for our figure hobby :)

Peace
 
Yep, nowadays Unions are pretty much useless, except for the Union leading getting rich, while completely ignoring what the union member need and being complete morons

No. No. No. I LOVE unions. I would not be caught DEAD joining one. But unions are largely responsible for my wage being as high as it is. And I don't have to pay dues.


LONG LIVE UNIONS! ROCK ON!
 
The point is moot... Read a paper, watch the news. Either way we're all screwed.

The future is no longer in plastics, it is in becoming a governmental bureaucrat. That way you are both the problem and the problem solver, working toward the solution to the problem which will ultimately become the problem again.

God save us all.

Government please stay out of our lives!
 
The point is moot... Read a paper, watch the news. Either way we're all screwed.

The future is no longer in plastics, it is in becoming a governmental bureaucrat. That way you are both the problem and the problem solver, working toward the solution to the problem which will ultimately become the problem again.

God save us all.

Government please stay out of our lives!

Amen brother. wish more people thought this way.
 
Neither the employee nor the employer. I'm my own boss without any employees whatsoever.
 
No. No. No. I LOVE unions. I would not be caught DEAD joining one. But unions are largely responsible for my wage being as high as it is. And I don't have to pay dues.


LONG LIVE UNIONS! ROCK ON!

Alot of non-union places around here are cutting back on wages or benefits so be careful.

Without unions most people would be making minimum wage.
 
Re: would you rather be an employee or an employer ?

Yep, nowadays Unions are pretty much useless...

This is true in some factory settings where unions have become greedy and destroyed any sense of profit in the world market, but without unions, more often than not, business would screw their workers; especially corporations that report to stockholders and government based jobs.

Let me explain from a teacher's perspective:

Roughly every six years or so, the political spectrum changes and all of the sudden there is a frenzy where everything in education changes. When NCLB kicked in back in 2001, all types of 'reforms' were hitting and suddenly teachers needed to get 80 hours of training each year, new credentials, new teacher "professional development" tests, and...now standardized testing becomes everything. Now, other than standardized testing, I don't have a problem with these things because they do help build better teachers, BUT the district/state immediately tried to screw us.

Teachers were suddenly expected to start paying for online classes to get the 80 hours, we were expected to pay to take these tests at $270 a pop, getting my credential cost $17k (although the union fought that and now they have a BITSA new teacher induction program that cut down the cost of credentials). We were also expected to start doing Saturday workdays and two hours a week of afterschool tutoring. I already paid for my four year degree and the initial teacher prep. examp, shouldn't the state/district/fed help pay for all these new requirements?

And standardized testing, it sounds great, "students/schools will be held accountable." But what happens is that principals jobs are on the line if math/reading scores do not hit AYP/API; all of the sudden, art, P.E., social studies, and music was gone from the classroom despite education codes that mandate instructional minutes going to them. Six hours a day of math, math review, math intervention, basal reading, corrective reading, reading workshop, and English Language Development for Spanish students.

And if teacher pay is based on "performance" and "accountiblity on test scores making AYP," which is Obama's new rhetoric, then the good teachers in bad districts are inherently screwed because the principals are going to load the good teachers with the students who need the most help to increase the schools overall test score. Trust me, last year I had 9 resouce students-two of which had behavior modification plans- and four level one English speakers. Do you have ANY clue what that did to my test scores compared to the other teachers who had little to no RSP students or EL level ones and can't control major discipline problems? If you only looked at whether or not the students in my class were considered "proficient," I would appear to be a horrible teacher. However, my principal loaded me because she knew that I would increase the students from far below grade standards to basic; closer to proficient which improves the school's overall AYP and makes the school as a whole look better.

Now that California is 40 BILLION dollars in the red, politicians are looking for ways to cut; I understand that. But without the union, we would have 40+ students in a classroom, our pension would disappear even though we have worked towards it for years, the pay we receive for the extra 80 hours required by us would be cut, and so on.

Sorry, rant off...
 
With all due respect, Kibishii, I think we're going to have to agree to disagree. You seem to believe that the teachers unions (I don't know whether you are in CTA or CFT, but it doesn't really matter) are noble, altruistic organizations. My personal experience with them has shown them to be wholly corrupt.

I respect what you do, but I do not respect any unions, and I never will.
 
And your customers.

The notion of "being your own boss" has always been something of a pipe dream, a "grass is always greener" fallacy. Everyone works for someone, or you don't work at all.

Those who succeed in small business do so by offering a desirable product/service, and by satisfying and growing their customer base. Those who succeed in large companies do so by offering a good work ethic and a desirable skill set.

Disagree with what you are saying. Why is it a pipe dream to be your own boss? If you have your own business or service, no one tells you what to do or when to do it. The success of yourself and your business lies solely on you. I'd take this any day of the week and having my future in my own control rather than being stuck in the middle of the heap, and one day waking up to "sorry but we're going to have to let you go due to payroll cut-backs".
 
Disagree with what you are saying. Why is it a pipe dream to be your own boss?

no one tells you what to do or when to do it.

The success of yourself and your business lies solely on you.

Because those two highlighted comments do not mean the same thing. Yes, if you own your own business, your success or failure is entirely up to you. But the idea that no one tells you what to do is the fallacy I referred to. Your customers tell you what to do, and if you don't do it, you fail. You work for them. They are, in the purest sense of the word, your boss.
 
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