Captain America 4 Brave New World - February 14, 2025

[crows]

I think the MCU began to lose me around the time we began to see ubiquitous 'nanotech' -- i.e. magic -- from Iron Man's suits to all of Wakanda and onwards.

The stories are fantasy and demand total suspension of disbelief, but there is a line they crossed for me. It made everything too easy and allowed the writers to become lazy, the characters less relatable.

I guess it's a quantity thing. I can accept Cap's shield ("...that thing does not obey the laws of physics!") and allow Dr. Strange's powers, but Nano-Everything and Consequence-Free Suits cross over fully into Saturday morning cartoon territory for me. Arbitrary as it seems.

and it becomes a problem when you start asking, how come doesn't everyone have a wakanda super suit ? like all secret service or all avengers or just everyone.
not only was it a problem when you have to ask " where's the rest of the avengers" in any movie , but now you have to ask, why doesn't everyone working for the president get one?

 

[DParga21]

I think the MCU began to lose me around the time we began to see ubiquitous 'nanotech' -- i.e. magic -- from Iron Man's suits to all of Wakanda and onwards.

The stories are fantasy and demand total suspension of disbelief, but there is a line they crossed for me. It made everything too easy and allowed the writers to become lazy, the characters less relatable.

I guess it's a quantity thing. I can accept Cap's shield ("...that thing does not obey the laws of physics!") and allow Dr. Strange's powers, but Nano-Everything and Consequence-Free Suits cross over fully into Saturday morning cartoon territory for me. Arbitrary as it seems.

I feel the same way. Hand-wavy "nanotech" just makes everything ridiculous. One of the biggest problems is that it's become a crutch to whip a mask on and off a hero instantaneously.
It all looks really silly.

 

[ironwez20]

So wtf did Gus Fring do in the movie? Nobody is talking about him.

Also there is a whole thread on Twitter about what the movie was supposed to be and diamond back was supposed to be in it and it focused on the serpent society.

 

[jye4ever]

I cringe every time I see Falcons helmet instantly go on over his head.

It looks so fake and unobtainable.

It completely takes me out of the experience.

 

[The Buffinator]

So wtf did Gus Fring do in the movie? Nobody is talking about him.

Also there is a whole thread on Twitter about what the movie was supposed to be and diamond back was supposed to be in it and it focused on the serpent society.

Giancarlo Esposito plays a more grounded version of Sidewinder, the ruthless leader of a group of mercenaries. In Act 1 we learn that they

Spoiler

stole the first batch of refined Adamantium from a Japanese research facility on Celestial Island for a mysterious buyer (Samuel Sterns) who never shows up to collect & pay him. SamCap and Falcon arrive at the non-meet to (a) save some hostages and (b) recover the Adamantium, which is actually part of Sterns' nefarious plan. Sidewinder escapes and later tries to kill Sam (who is without his suit at the time) but is ultimately taken down and captured. He later provides some intel to SamCap in an effort to get a cushier prison sentence.

 

[The Buffinator]

I cringe every time I see Falcons helmet instantly go on over his head.

It looks so fake and unobtainable.

It completely takes me out of the experience.

You're thinking of either The Core or Avatar. This one has Vibranium and Adamantium, not Unobtanium.

 

[ZE_501]

and it becomes a problem when you start asking, how come doesn't everyone have a wakanda super suit ? like all secret service or all avengers or just everyone.
not only was it a problem when you have to ask " where's the rest of the avengers" in any movie , but now you have to ask, why doesn't everyone working for the president get one?

Hell, why doesn't the president have one?

 

[YoNoSe]

I first started to zone out when F&WS was treating Bucky a little too comic relief-y. Then it didn't get better. Then I liked Wandavision until it seemed like the show didn't understand what it's hero was doing. It took me about 4 tries to finish Eternals, which is very appropriately named. I skipped Ms Marvel, She Hulk, Secret Invasion. Maybe some other things? I watched Love & Thunder and it nearly broke my heart how terrible things had become.

So I guess it was a low bar Brave New World had to meet to impress but I do feel like it's at least a step off the wrong direction.

Oh and yeah nanotech sucks. The regular human heroes should always be at more risk than the magic space people. Plus stuff like the IM2 racetrack suit-up had the audience going nuts. By Infinity War you feel like you're watching the effects guys do a coloring book.

 

[darth dennis]

Ah. If ESB posters and trailers revealed the "I am your father" business.

Thanks alot! I was going to watch Empire for the first time today... just great...

 

[jye4ever]

I first started to zone out when F&WS was treating Bucky a little too comic relief-y. Then it didn't get better. Then I liked Wandavision until it seemed like the show didn't understand what it's hero was doing. It took me about 4 tries to finish Eternals, which is very appropriately named. I skipped Ms Marvel, She Hulk, Secret Invasion. Maybe some other things? I watched Love & Thunder and it nearly broke my heart how terrible things had become.

So I guess it was a low bar Brave New World had to meet to impress but I do feel like it's at least a step off the wrong direction.

Oh and yeah nanotech sucks. The regular human heroes should always be at more risk than the magic space people. Plus stuff like the IM2 racetrack suit-up had the audience going nuts. By Infinity War you feel like you're watching the effects guys do a coloring book.

 

[Khev]

(2. Is super powered by the serum
This new Cap should’ve been dead after just ONE punch from Red Hulk or better yet have his hand instantly crushed when he catches his shield.)

the movie cheats because his suit is from wakanda so he's basically got a "super serum" suit like if it was Black panther where if he gets hit it absorbed the power of the hit.

so he does things like if he has the serum anyway

Oh wow. I was just joking the other day about how Sam is now just a hodge-podge of half a dozen other heroes with his Falcon wings, Ant-Man mask, Cap shield, and now BP suit??? Sheesh.

 

[Khev]

So now i’m screwed because this lame version of Cap is their Cap going forward.

Yeah this whole smug "he's your Captain now" just makes me wonder if I even care about all the upcoming Secret Wars/Doom stuff. Iron Man to Endgame was an amazing run, if that's all the MCU ends up being to me then so be it.

 

[YoNoSe]

Wakanda tech loses half it's value as soon as you step off the rhino farm.

 

[Khev]

I think the MCU began to lose me around the time we began to see ubiquitous 'nanotech' -- i.e. magic -- from Iron Man's suits to all of Wakanda and onwards.

The stories are fantasy and demand total suspension of disbelief, but there is a line they crossed for me. It made everything too easy and allowed the writers to become lazy, the characters less relatable.

I guess it's a quantity thing. I can accept Cap's shield ("...that thing does not obey the laws of physics!") and allow Dr. Strange's powers, but Nano-Everything and Consequence-Free Suits cross over fully into Saturday morning cartoon territory for me. Arbitrary as it seems.

No it isn't arbitrary, I don't like the nano-everything either. As I believe Wor-Gar pointed out it was James Gunn who started it with Star-Lord's mask and now it's everywhere.

 

[Khev]

So, if you don't like the movie, fine. There are plenty of critiques to be made of the thing. I'm sure I'll have a few once i see it. But maybe we can stop raking the Black man over the coals for saying the same thing the white man did. It's not a good look.

Oh get over yourself with that nonsense, Evans is a much bigger jerk in real life than Mackie is. And people were indeed annoyed by his comments (though they were said at a time when the country was less divisive and came across as more naive than outright anti-American.) Also people complained, myself included, that Cap:TFA was the first origin movie that had to have a subtitle. We get Iron Man, The Incredible Hulk, Thor, and then "Captain America: The First Avenger" because Disney wanted to give America-hating countries the option to just call it "The First Avenger" on their marquees. Then to their surprise almost every other country ended up keeping the full title. But I digress.

 

[jye4ever]

Oh get over yourself with that nonsense, Evans is a much bigger jerk in real life than Mackie is. And people were indeed annoyed by his comments (though they were said at a time when the country was less divisive and came across as more naive than outright anti-American.) Also people complained, myself included, that Cap:TFA was the first origin movie that had to have a subtitle. We get Iron Man, The Incredible Hulk, Thor, and then "Captain America: The First Avenger" because Disney wanted to give America-hating countries the option to just call it "The First Avenger" on their marquees. Then to their surprise almost every other country ended up keeping the full title. But I digress.

Epic post is epic!

 

[YoNoSe]

Actors are stupid & should be ignored IRL.

That said, Hawaiian Punch should have made a deal with Ezra Miller.

 

[DParga21]

Oh get over yourself with that nonsense, Evans is a much bigger jerk in real life than Mackie is. And people were indeed annoyed by his comments (though they were said at a time when the country was less divisive and came across as more naive than outright anti-American.) Also people complained, myself included, that Cap:TFA was the first origin movie that had to have a subtitle. We get Iron Man, The Incredible Hulk, Thor, and then "Captain America: The First Avenger" because Disney wanted to give America-hating countries the option to just call it "The First Avenger" on their marquees. Then to their surprise almost every other country ended up keeping the full title. But I digress.

My question still remains, though: What is inherently anti-American about those comments?
We may be dipping into Dark Room territory a bit here, but Captain America the character has not been a jingoistic "America Can Do No Wrong" guy since the 50's. In the decades since, he's been a mirror held up to say "This is what we as a country should strive for", and I don't see how anything Mackie OR Evans says contradicts that.

 

[Khev]

My question still remains, though: What is inherently anti-American about those comments?
We may be dipping into Dark Room territory a bit here, but Captain America the character has not been a jingoistic "America Can Do No Wrong" guy since the 50's. In the decades since, he's been a mirror held up to say "This is what we as a country should strive for", and I don't see how anything Mackie OR Evans says contradicts that.

Fair enough, we can leave it at that. And you're right, there have been plenty of times in the comics where Cap has felt forced to stand against the US government in defense of what he sees as "American ideals", and even beyond that, simply doing what was "right." We even saw saw that in the MCU with The Winter Soldier.

 

[jye4ever]

My question still remains, though: What is inherently anti-American about those comments?
We may be dipping into Dark Room territory a bit here, but Captain America the character has not been a jingoistic "America Can Do No Wrong" guy since the 50's. In the decades since, he's been a mirror held up to say "This is what we as a country should strive for", and I don't see how anything Mackie OR Evans says contradicts that.

Captain America will do everything in his power to defend any nation that holds its politicians to super high moral standards and when they criminally go astray or rogue with the wishes of their hard working citizens he will relentlessly go after those politicians to root out corruption with as much force as he would use against external invading forces.

If Cap thought Thanos was tough wait until he sees the grossly irresponsible spending abuse being subjected to his fellow countryman, he’s going to need another dose of serum to tackle that one lol