Child Refuses to Speak the Pledge Due to Unequal Rights For Gays

[galactiboy]

True, and I actually removed part of my post after I realized I was probably misconstruing prog's intent.

The biggest concern I have is that there still seems to be a very strong "separate but equal" vibe around marriage/domestic partnerships/etc. But if you are looking at it from a secular perspective the definition of marriage does not have to be limited to religious/spiritual ideals... and really the important aspects related more to the rights that come with marriage.

 

[The Ween]

Here's the thing.......so some other kid decides he's not going to say the pledge for whatever reason, then another, then another. Then you have another kid demanding to say a prayer, spread a carpet pointing towards Mecca, or stick a pin in a voodoo doll of his teacher because he's standing up for his rights to do so. It can go on and on if allowed.

Sorry.......but I work in a school. If you don't like what they do there........home school or something else. You have that choice.

 

[BuffyGirl]

Gay rights should be nationwide and shouldn't be left up to the states to decide. On the flip side, churches and such shouldn't be forced to perform gay marriages if it is against their beliefs. However, it should be legal everywhere, no ifs, ands, or buts.

Kudos to the kid, even if it wasn't his idea.

Agreed! If we are all truly equal, then we should all have the same rights.

 

[agen_kolar]

Here's the thing.......so some other kid decides he's not going to say the pledge for whatever reason, then another, then another. Then you have another kid demanding to say a prayer, spread a carpet pointing towards Mecca, or stick a pin in a voodoo doll of his teacher because he's standing up for his rights to do so. It can go on and on if allowed.

Sorry.......but I work in a school. If you don't like what they do there........home school or something else. You have that choice.

Yeah, there are pros and cons to this issue. I remember when I was in 8th grade, and my history teacher was going over the constitution and such. She asked the class how many people think prayer should be in school, and I was the only person to believe it should not. Several of my friends exclaimed things like, "Kyle, you don't want us to be able to pray?" My argument was "Once you allow that, you have to allow everyone else to do whatever the heck they want. A moment of silence is enough for people to do what they need to do."

 

[ProgMatinee]

I agree...and I assume you are fine with a Muslim or Hindu kid doing so as well.

Of course.

I do want to clarify that whatever religious or secular ritual a child wants to do needs to be within a confines of not being overtly distracting to the whole context or point of school, which is to learn.

Be it Christianity, Islam, Hindu, etc, if the religion required the kid to take a break every 1/2 hour and/or set up a shrine in the middle of class, or light 1000 candles, or switch on Sponge Bob Square Pants, etc then obviously a limit is necessary.

And I think thats the crux of this kid's protest. Was it distracting? I believe it was not. Therefore the teacher should have ignored it. If the kid proceeded to yell or talk over the other kids' right to do the ceremony, then we have a seperate situation.

Re: gay marriage, I guess I'm not sure aside from filing taxes, what gay couples are missing from governments...and can those differences be reconcilled without possibly bastardizing the social aspects of "marriage" that people hold dear? Shouldn't therefore those same things be made available to any couple that wishes, whether gay or hetero, married or simply "together"?

 

[pixletwin]

Gay rights should be nationwide and shouldn't be left up to the states to decide. On the flip side, churches and such shouldn't be forced to perform gay marriages if it is against their beliefs. However, it should be legal everywhere, no ifs, ands, or buts.

This.

 

[jinxx]

Secularism for some, miniature american flags for others!

 

[Bannister]

At first, mom Laura Phillips told the Times, the principal talked about Will telling a substitute to jump off a bridge. When pressed, the principal admitted the whole incident was sparked by the boy exercising his constitutional right not to recite the Pledge of Allegiance.

This has to be my favorite part of the article. The principal can't even be honest enough with the parent with regards to why their child told the teacher off.

 

[creecher]

?????????? ?? ?? ????? ????? ?? ???? ?????? ????!!

You have the right to remain silent. Especially if you're pointing that thing at me, I'd prefer it.

 

[BuffyGirl]

.

Re: gay marriage, I guess I'm not sure aside from filing taxes, what gay couples are missing from governments...

A lot of American's marry Canadians and people from other countries, and then can bring those spouses to the United States to be with them and share in life and family, etc.

Gay couples from America who meet and fall in love with people from other countries cannot do the same thing. They must stay separate, or be lucky enough to have one of them live in a country gay marriage is legal and WANT to move there.

Also, adoption for Gays isn't legal in all states due to the gay marriage ban.

 

[Cloud]

I agree and I say if some other kid feels its his right to pray outloud before eating his lunch he should be allowed as well.

Public schools are government institutions that should not punish someone for using their 1st Amendment right.

But our constitution also guarantees separation of church and state, meaning no religion in government-funded schools.

That is why I was outraged to hear that they are teaching "Intelligent Design" in public classrooms in Georgia!

 

[EVILFACE]

Awesome. Maybe he won't speak, period!

 

[ProgMatinee]

But our constitution also guarantees separation of church and state, meaning no religion in government-funded schools.

That is why I was outraged to hear that they are teaching "Intelligent Design" in public classrooms in Georgia!

I don't want to discuss curriculum in this conversation.

On the individual level, however, the seperation of church and state was designed to protect people with religion from state persecution, not the other way around. Your interpretation is a bastardization of the law. I would argue that using the school system (the state) to prevent the exhibition of religious freedom is actually more against the law than some kid praying out loud or multiple kids grouping together.

 

[The Ween]

But our constitution also guarantees separation of church and state, meaning no religion in government-funded schools.

That is why I was outraged to hear that they are teaching "Intelligent Design" in public classrooms in Georgia!

There's no true seperation of church and state. Both are in each other's business.

You can't win no matter what. You can't make everyone happy.

 

[Mesa]

If our own commander-in-chief doesn't have to show any respect to the flag during the memorial service at Fort Hood this past week, why should this kid have to pledge allegiance to it?

It's no longer politically correct to show respect to the symbol that grants you these sort of freedoms that so many enjoy. It's much more acceptable to show disrespect for it. Ironic, don't you think? You think this kid would be allowed to pull this crap in China? In Iran? yeah, the middle-east is REAL tolerant of homosexuals.


Funny, I didn't see a thread defending Carrie Prejean when she exercised her rights to say she wasn't in support of gay marriage. Instead, the media and a good portion of the public tried character assassination and ultimately took away her crown simply for exercising her right to free speech when asked her opinion.

I guess freedom of speech only applies if you think a certain way.


Edit: and I'm almost certain my post will be either deleted, or be reason to shut this thread entirely.

 

[ProgMatinee]

mesa come on...now the lock will come. wish we could have kept politics (the first paragraph) out of this and just kept it a social commentary

 

[Mesa]

it's relevant, I think. Our leader has about as much respect for the flag as this kid. Plus, how is "gay rights" any less political than what I posted? It's a touchy subject to begin with. I didn't start the thread.


And for the record, I really have no problem with gay marriage.

 

[Bannister]

That is why I was outraged to hear that they are teaching "Intelligent Design" in public classrooms in Georgia!

I have no problem with this as long as it is taught as a theory.

 

[LChinoz]

If our own commander-in-chief doesn't have to show any respect to the flag during the memorial service at Fort Hood this past week, why should this kid have to pledge allegiance to it?

It's no longer politically correct to show respect to the symbol that grants you these sort of freedoms that so many enjoy. It's much more acceptable to show disrespect for it. Ironic, don't you think? You think this kid would be allowed to pull this crap in China? In Iran? yeah, the middle-east is REAL tolerant of homosexuals.


Funny, I didn't see a thread defending Carrie Prejean when she exercised her rights to say she wasn't in support of gay marriage. Instead, the media and a good portion of the public tried character assassination and ultimately took away her crown simply for exercising her right to free speech when asked her opinion.

I guess freedom of speech only applies if you think a certain way.


Edit: and I'm almost certain my post will be either deleted, or be reason to shut this thread entirely.

Come on Mesa...this is unnecessary in this thread. You're not happy Obama won, we get it. Let's try and keep this on topic and not get the thread locked.

 

[ProgMatinee]

it's relevant, I think. Our leader has about as much respect for the flag as this kid. Plus, how is "gay rights" any less political than what I posted? It's a touchy subject to begin with. I didn't start the thread.


And for the record, I really have no problem with gay marriage.

theres a difference between social and political. bringing obama into it makes it political automatically.