Do You Want to Live Forever?

[The Josh]

Living forever without getting sick or old and having limitless money to take care of myself, yes.

If I still get old, sick, and have to work, no thanks.

No sense of humor!

When I am old with aching joints and whatever else is in the cards for me...I will welcome a new adventure after I leave this world.

To quote Gandalf and Pippen:

Pippin: I didn't think it would end this way.
Gandalf: End? No, the journey doesn't end here. Death is just another path... One that we all must take. The grey rain-curtain of this world rolls back, and all turns to silver glass... And then you see it.
Pippin: What? Gandalf?... See what?
Gandalf: White shores... and beyond, a far green country under a swift sunrise.
Pippin: [smiling] Well, that isn't so bad.
Gandalf: [softly] No... No it isn't.

Love that scene.

If its like Dave said then sure that would be cool. If its just living longer as an old person being old. Nah, I'd rather go in my sleep.

 

[Avenger]

As others have mentioned, the problem with this all is resources. Overfishing, over hunting, over polluting. I don't know about global warming, but humanity often strip mines an environment, and moves on to the next. That's with current population levels, which will continue to explode exponentially with future generations. Add this science, assuming this guy isn't a gas bag, and there's a real problem. Chances are, 90% of the world would live in poverty, real 3rd world poverty as the cost of every day needs rockets. A corporate government will take hold, as traditional governments cannot stand in a world of dwindling resources, wrought with war and famine. It would be sort of like they treated air on Mars in Total Recall.

Humanity isn't ready for that kind of longevity. It would require far more responsibility than we currently employ. In fact, this would require a true, and working socialist state on the level of Star Trek. And, the one invention that lets it work in Star Trek is the replicator. As it stands, current generations must perish for future ones to thrive. For everything there is a season.

 

[Devil_666]

I thought the discussion was being realistic.

Nah.. discussions like this about living forever always turn into a personal laundry list of stuff people want to do now but don't have the time for.

Realistically, if you could live forever you better damn well start making plans to live somewhere else because eventually you would outlive both our Sun and even our Galaxy (as we know it). And you'd also eventually outlive every other Galaxy and star system in the universe until it was just you and space.

 

[devilof76]

People will have to figure that out anyway, assuming the species can make it that far.

As long as the person we are after doesn't hide in caves or Pakistan...then it may take years and years.

Like I said, all it takes is the moral conviction---i.e., balls---to do the deed. It's not like no one knew who he was or what he was capable long before he was hiding in Pakistan.

 

[Jen]

Like I said, all it takes is the moral conviction---i.e., balls---to do the deed. It's not like no one knew who he was or what he was capable long before he was hiding in Pakistan.

We can't swoop in and save the day everywhere. We can't even fix the problems we have in our own country.

 

[devilof76]

Nope. But we could stop financing the problem states, and honestly, if all we wanted to do was eliminate those problem tyrants, all we would have to do is eliminate them. Playing Mother Theresa to every country we removed a dictator in is why it's expensive to do so. If we limited ourselves to assassinations, it would be amazingly cheap.

Besides, with someone like Bin Laden, we would be saving our own day. And that's an obligation our leader have to us. They have no excuse for being gutless when it comes to that.

In fact, this would require a true, and working socialist state

That would guarantee failure. There is no limit to how many people this planet can support because the limits on production aren't material. Resources are theoretically limitless. Similarly to emergencies when prices skyrocket, the population will only grow according to what can be afforded. In socialist systems where everyone is guaranteed food, shelter, education, healthcare regardless of their ability to pay for it, yeah, shortages will be the norm. That doesn't happen when people are expected to feed their own.

So no, a true, working capitalist system would make it possible for people to live as long as they wanted with this medical technology at their disposal. SUpposing they needed more materials, look around you: there's an entire solar system worth of it, and honestly, the earth is a hell of a lot bigger than you're giving it credit for. Just because people haven't figured out how to use all of the material here available to us doesn't mean it's useless.

 

[Jen]

We are going to have to agree to disagree because I see no positive outcomes with your ideas.

 

[Mr. EcKo]

 

[devilof76]

We are going to have to agree to disagree because I see no positive outcomes with your ideas.

Why am I not surprised.

All I see are dead tyrants and populations forced to figure out how to survive without dictators telling them how.

 

[Jen]

Because power, greed and money have corrupted many who started out with the best intentions. It has been that way for centuries and isn't going to change. You remove one tyrant and another will take it's place...maybe not immediately...but it will happen. If we become a country of professional assassins - where would we draw the line? Why not take out a president or prime minister because we don't agree with his politics....it's a slippery slope and one I would not want to go down. Those with the power and money - care mostly for their own best interests...and I know they could really care less about what happens to folks like you and me. Let's not fool ourselves. Those with the power who can rise up and fight (or make the decisions to have someone assassinated) know they are going to gain something from it...it's not necessarily for the good of the people...that's just the b.s. they feed us. Case in point - Iraq. Those who made the decisions for us to go to war sure did get awfully rich....and what do we have...more debt, soldiers who are wounded without proper medical care, soldiers who gave their lives and a country that doesn't seem much more stable than it was before we went in. If we went in and just assassinated Saddam and left...we would most likely just be creating more civil war among different factions wanting power. More violence, more crime and those with the most guns and money usually wins and another tyrant in power. It's a never ending cycle that sadly will not change in our lifetimes if ever at all.

And cutting off federal aid to states that are not meeting a quota is not fair either. What if there is a natural emergency..it is the regular tax paying, working people that are most affected...do we just say sorry..your state's government can't balance their budget any better than the federal government can so we have decided not to help you out. I may live in Washington..but I am a citizen of the United States. I pay my federal taxes and if my federal govt. decided to hang me to dry because of my local govt...well I would be mighty pissed off to say the least.

 

[The Chaver]

This is coming.

I suggest you all read "The Singularity is Near"

 

[devilof76]

I thought we agreed to disagree.

Because power, greed and money have corrupted many who started out with the best intentions. It has been that way for centuries and isn't going to change. You remove one tyrant and another will take it's place...maybe not immediately...but it will happen. If we become a country of professional assassins - where would we draw the line? Why not take out a president or prime minister because we don't agree with his politics....it's a slippery slope and one I would not want to go down. Those with the power and money - care mostly for their own best interests...and I know they could really care less about what happens to folks like you and me. Let's not fool ourselves. Those with the power who can rise up and fight (or make the decisions to have someone assassinated) know they are going to gain something from it...it's not necessarily for the good of the people...that's just the b.s. they feed us. Case in point - Iraq. Those who made the decisions for us to go to war sure did get awfully rich....and what do we have...more debt, soldiers who are wounded without proper medical care, soldiers who gave their lives and a country that doesn't seem much more stable than it was before we went in. If we went in and just assassinated Saddam and left...we would most likely just be creating more civil war among different factions wanting power. More violence, more crime and those with the most guns and money usually wins and another tyrant in power. It's a never ending cycle that sadly will not change in our lifetimes if ever at all.

And cutting off federal aid to states that are not meeting a quota is not fair either. What if there is a natural emergency..it is the regular tax paying, working people that are most affected...do we just say sorry..your state's government can't balance their budget any better than the federal government can so we have decided not to help you out. I may live in Washington..but I am a citizen of the United States. I pay my federal taxes and if my federal govt. decided to hang me to dry because of my local govt...well I would be mighty pissed off to say the least.

 

[Jen]

I thought we agreed to disagree.

We did...or I did...but then you responded how you saw countries trying to fend for themselves after we assassinated their dictator, like it was guaranteed to have a positive outcome for them...and I had to respond to your comment on our federal govt...and then it snowballed and I rambled on....

I'm off to bed now.

 

[devilof76]

I don't care what outcome it has for them. I'm sick of dealing with their crap and wasting our money and our lives on holding their hands while we wait for them to get a clue how to act like human beings.

As for taxes, if you give away your fortune based on a promise to help you when you need it, don't be surprised when the other people in line ahead of you have spent it before it was your turn. Taxes are the dumbest thing human beings have ever invented, and that's saying a lot. No government that writes it's own paycheck is accountable to the people who are expected to pay up. None. If the last two Presidents aren't enough for people to get it, then I don't think any of us will have to worry about living past 100.

 

[Jen]

I thought we agreed to disagree?

You don't care about their outcome but you want to become a country of assassins who go around killing their leaders? Now that's just cruel...if you don't care - let them get rid of their own leaders. If you care enough to kill a dictator - then you can't just leave the innocents to fend for themselves among the packs of wolves you are going to unleash. If we are going to have the "balls" to go out and do what needs to be done..then we should have the moral obligation to help clean up the mess we are contributing to.

Whether or not taxes is a good idea is a moot point. As President, our elected leader should look after our interests - that is their moral obligation - as you put it and the federal government should come to the aid of her citizens when the need is there regardless if someone lives in a problem state.

Now I am really off to bed.

 

[Yodee]

no...want to be 6ft in the ground at age 60

 

[devilof76]

If a country is creating problems for us and our allies, then removing their leaders is not contributing to the problem. It is solving the problem. Our problem. Their problems are their own and they are welcome to fix them. We are morally obliged to no one but us.

It's not like we just pick leaders to assassinate and then laugh at the chaos that ensues. A people is responsible for their own government. If they can't keep it in line, then they are responsible for the consequences that come from outside their borders. There are no innocents in that regard.

But back at home, people should be able to save enough so that they can help themselves in times of trouble. As independent, rational and capable adults, we should be able to look after ourselves, and I believe that is our only moral obligation. Taxes make that impossible, so no, it isn't moot.

G'night.

 

[Jen]

You edited your post after I responded.

But it doesn't change my opinion.

 

[devilof76]

I did not.

I think.

Did I?

I don't remember. Weren't you going to bed?

 

[Jen]

Short-sightedness will be the downfall of many. And that is all I will say on that matter.

And to clarify - when I am talking about federal aid - I'm mainly talking about man made or natural disasters. If an earthquake hits Seattle and destroys my city....there is no way I'm going to have enough saved to rebuild and get back on my feet and I doubt many others will either. We need federal aid for times of crisis. And I can go on about other things we need federal aid for...like education...but I'm tired.

And to get this thread back on track...I still don't want to live forever.