Ok. Me and my boys just finished watching this and we agree that this is probably the best episode of NuWho we have ever seen.
It sure sets the bar high for the final two.
It sure sets the bar high for the final two.
Doctor Who - Spoilers!
- Thread starter Memnoch
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Memnoch
Lt. Vulture
Read the outline on Wiki, downloading it now. Looking forward to what seems to be the best Who yet! Now, should I watch sober or after taking a pain killer? 
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Extraordinary episode. I give it a 10/10. Tenant does it again (but when hasn't he?). Superb performances all around and brilliant, brilliant writing. That profound darkness which began in Children of Earth, seeps into Waters of Mars and never lets up. And this is perhaps the only time I have ever found myself disgusted with what the Doctor has done and said. His actions and demeanor remind me of the Plutonian in Mark Waid's Irredeemable. "Time Lord victorious" indeed. Is it just me, or has the good Doctor started down the path the Valeyard revealed to him way back in Trial of a Time Lord as in he will become the Valeyard, the most evil of all Time Lords. And now, Christmas cannot get here soon enough!
d_jedi1
Super Freak
I just read this on IMDB, have no clue if it's accurate, just re-posting whats been claimed there.
"This is not a drill, spoilers ahead.
Since syphoning off his regeneration, the next Doctor that was being 'born' remains inside much like the Master's identity within Yana in Utopia. The new Doctor begins to manifest after the Doctor is wounded, resulting in a somewhat schizophrenic change over that lasts almost all the second part of The End Of Time and a final regeneration "like a steam pipe with enough pressure to rewrite the DNA of everything for fifty yards". This causes a mad dash for a 'death' alone in The Tardis. The outfit is wrecked, so is the interior of the Tardis, resulting in a redesign. David and Matt share screentime with some spooky sfx throughout the episode. Four times. The knocking is not literal and is not The Master, that was a deliberate metaphor which combined with the presence of the Master is known to serve a big red herring. The new Doctor knocks four times.
The something coming back through the dark is also the same reason why Dalek's are in the next season despite the genocide in Journey's End; the planet Gallifrey is coming back into existance as time rewrites itself now that the time lock has been broken on The Time War by Dalek Caan, and further interferance has taken place. This saves the Dalek's and The Time Lords, and creates a 'cold war' of time that will see other races brought in on both sides. The new Doctor is considered a fugitive, as the killer of his own kind. In many ways the next season resembles Firefly, in the space wide rebellion/politics way of things."
and further in the thread...
"I've also been told some stuff about Dalek's trying to turn humans against Time Lords by giving the humans technology long ahead of time, in a bid to make them advance technologically far out of synch with any humility of their place in the universe. Which sounds interesting to me, and I have heard a recording where a scientist is explaining to the Doctor that he is recieving these inventions in his head randomly, without working on such designs.
The details I have to me are far too meticulate, and fit far too well, for me to dismiss outright as a hoax, ergo I post the details for debate (more so than to debate the validity of the claim - let's face it, I'm never going to name my drinking buddy)."
"Apparently The Tardis is totalled because it is a living organism. It has often been referred/inferred to as alive (reference; Boom Town, Turn Left), ergo it is prone to damage by such a blast, where as inanimate clothing is not. The outfit is damaged by the destruction of The Tardis more so than by the energy itself. Given the energy is Time Lord stuff, and so is The Tardis, it makes sense it could overload and go to pieces.
I think with the time line being rewritten, everytime it happens things afterward change, but the 'time' that happened before the change remains constant for the change to have taken place, even if it only remains constant for the people in 'the eye of the storm' (reference; The Last Of The Time Lords) or perhaps encased in a Tardis, or in its viscinity, as The Tardis does generate a kind of energy/cloak that can be residual (reference; pilot of Torchwood).
I've also been told there will be one episode specifically about growing a Tardis, which in addition to being pretty cool (and no doubt called something like The Garden Of The Tardis) would be a perfect opportunity to explain any Deus Ex Machina about time lines. After all, it is Time And Relative Dimension In Space.
To be honest, I liked the idea of the Doctor being the last of his kind, but with The Master coming back again its obvious this is no longer a priority core design for the show, and frankly on the subject of Deus Ex Machina...if he's going to beat the maximum regeneration total allowed (and ratings will no doubt dictate he will) it makes sense that Gallifrey will have to be around, just like Davros had to come back last time to explain a new era of Dalek. I doubt the Doctor will find The Orb Of Extra Regeneration on some far flung planet and get away with it against the audience."
"This is not a drill, spoilers ahead.
Since syphoning off his regeneration, the next Doctor that was being 'born' remains inside much like the Master's identity within Yana in Utopia. The new Doctor begins to manifest after the Doctor is wounded, resulting in a somewhat schizophrenic change over that lasts almost all the second part of The End Of Time and a final regeneration "like a steam pipe with enough pressure to rewrite the DNA of everything for fifty yards". This causes a mad dash for a 'death' alone in The Tardis. The outfit is wrecked, so is the interior of the Tardis, resulting in a redesign. David and Matt share screentime with some spooky sfx throughout the episode. Four times. The knocking is not literal and is not The Master, that was a deliberate metaphor which combined with the presence of the Master is known to serve a big red herring. The new Doctor knocks four times.
The something coming back through the dark is also the same reason why Dalek's are in the next season despite the genocide in Journey's End; the planet Gallifrey is coming back into existance as time rewrites itself now that the time lock has been broken on The Time War by Dalek Caan, and further interferance has taken place. This saves the Dalek's and The Time Lords, and creates a 'cold war' of time that will see other races brought in on both sides. The new Doctor is considered a fugitive, as the killer of his own kind. In many ways the next season resembles Firefly, in the space wide rebellion/politics way of things."
and further in the thread...
"I've also been told some stuff about Dalek's trying to turn humans against Time Lords by giving the humans technology long ahead of time, in a bid to make them advance technologically far out of synch with any humility of their place in the universe. Which sounds interesting to me, and I have heard a recording where a scientist is explaining to the Doctor that he is recieving these inventions in his head randomly, without working on such designs.
The details I have to me are far too meticulate, and fit far too well, for me to dismiss outright as a hoax, ergo I post the details for debate (more so than to debate the validity of the claim - let's face it, I'm never going to name my drinking buddy)."
"Apparently The Tardis is totalled because it is a living organism. It has often been referred/inferred to as alive (reference; Boom Town, Turn Left), ergo it is prone to damage by such a blast, where as inanimate clothing is not. The outfit is damaged by the destruction of The Tardis more so than by the energy itself. Given the energy is Time Lord stuff, and so is The Tardis, it makes sense it could overload and go to pieces.
I think with the time line being rewritten, everytime it happens things afterward change, but the 'time' that happened before the change remains constant for the change to have taken place, even if it only remains constant for the people in 'the eye of the storm' (reference; The Last Of The Time Lords) or perhaps encased in a Tardis, or in its viscinity, as The Tardis does generate a kind of energy/cloak that can be residual (reference; pilot of Torchwood).
I've also been told there will be one episode specifically about growing a Tardis, which in addition to being pretty cool (and no doubt called something like The Garden Of The Tardis) would be a perfect opportunity to explain any Deus Ex Machina about time lines. After all, it is Time And Relative Dimension In Space.
To be honest, I liked the idea of the Doctor being the last of his kind, but with The Master coming back again its obvious this is no longer a priority core design for the show, and frankly on the subject of Deus Ex Machina...if he's going to beat the maximum regeneration total allowed (and ratings will no doubt dictate he will) it makes sense that Gallifrey will have to be around, just like Davros had to come back last time to explain a new era of Dalek. I doubt the Doctor will find The Orb Of Extra Regeneration on some far flung planet and get away with it against the audience."
Ok. Me and my boys just finished watching this and we agree that this is probably the best episode of NuWho we have ever seen.
It sure sets the bar high for the final two.
Given how the previous 2 finales have failed to live up to the first act they'll probably stink though having said that I fully expect the ratings record set by part 4 of "City of Death" in 1979 to be smashed as the hype for the departure of the most useless Doctor ever will no doubt be turned up to 11.
Memnoch
Lt. Vulture
Well, that was quite good. Seemed a bit too dark for the under 12 crowd though. Overall I think it's one of my favorite episodes so far, but not one I could watch repeatedly.
Weird.. my kids (8 and 6) both LOVED it. They were playing with their Doctor Who toys until well past bedtime they loved it so much. hehe
Memnoch
Lt. Vulture
I dunno, I wouldn't think it so dark if not for the suicide at the end. That really is what stuck with me. The design of the creatures were suitable creepy as well. I suppose I can see how kids would focus on the cool adventure parts and the adults would see more of hte dark undertones.
Kabukiman
Greatest Person Ever
Wait, bcm liked it?
/me scrambles to find a download
/me scrambles to find a download
wookster
Very foolish words man!
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My 8 year old would be OK, but my 5 year old would most likely have nightmares. Spiderwick scared them both, yet they were OK with Monster House. I think if I can watch it befoer them to make sure I'll be happier.
Both my kids are pretty innocent though... on the whole!
Both my kids are pretty innocent though... on the whole!
Wait, bcm liked it?
/me scrambles to find a download
I watched the alternative edit which for some mysterious reason resembled "The Daemons"
People have told me WoM was more like the sort of thing I'd enjoy as it wasn't so fast paced and Tennant didn't do his usual "manic" BS but one decent story this late in the proceedings isn't really gonna change my views on either him or RTD so I'm not going to bother, especially now I'm able to catch up with all the other Classic episodes I've not seen free of charge.
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William Shatners Toupee
Super Freak
I gotta say I didn't really love WOM. It was "alright", but that's about it. Maybe a 6 out of 10.
It was a good premise, but really dragged 3/4th through and was about 10-15 minutes too long. I'm tired of Tennant being the Emo gloomy Doctor. It was dragged out too far in Buffy. It's been done to death here. The last fifteen minutes picked up substantially as it set up the final two eps, which I am looking forward to. In the big picture, RTD's reign for me is mixed with extreme triumphs and but littered with lots of silly failures (the Dalek Empire being raised and destroyed every season, the Doctor shooting excess radiation out of his foot), which for me at this point overcasts his successes. He made the show a success. I thank him for that, but am VERY very excited for Moffat to start his reign.
It was a good premise, but really dragged 3/4th through and was about 10-15 minutes too long. I'm tired of Tennant being the Emo gloomy Doctor. It was dragged out too far in Buffy. It's been done to death here. The last fifteen minutes picked up substantially as it set up the final two eps, which I am looking forward to. In the big picture, RTD's reign for me is mixed with extreme triumphs and but littered with lots of silly failures (the Dalek Empire being raised and destroyed every season, the Doctor shooting excess radiation out of his foot), which for me at this point overcasts his successes. He made the show a success. I thank him for that, but am VERY very excited for Moffat to start his reign.
I find it annoying the Reapers didn't show up at the end of WOM after Tennant changed time. Seems rather sloppy to purposely gloss over them when their invention was from RTD's reign.
I do like this story MAY have been a set up for some sort of Ice Warrior story later on. It would be odd that the Flood happens to look so much like the Ice Warriors around the mouth, on the IW home planet, where the IW were mentioned alot, if it's not meant to have significance in a story later on down the line. Maybe the Ice Warriors became a symbiotic race with them at one point, or the IW are infected by the flood? After all, the Ice Warriors sure do like Earth. Maybe now we know the reason- their Flood hosts?
I do like this story MAY have been a set up for some sort of Ice Warrior story later on. It would be odd that the Flood happens to look so much like the Ice Warriors around the mouth, on the IW home planet, where the IW were mentioned alot, if it's not meant to have significance in a story later on down the line. Maybe the Ice Warriors became a symbiotic race with them at one point, or the IW are infected by the flood? After all, the Ice Warriors sure do like Earth. Maybe now we know the reason- their Flood hosts?
Reapers only show up when a paradox has been created (like Rose2 running in front of Rose1 and the Doctor).
I think a gloomy Doctor can work, Tom did it well enough during season 18 and Eccleston's darker moments were excellent but like everything he does that's not in some way "manic" Tennant never sounds remotely natural and from what I gather about the storyline Adelaide killed herself so she didn't have to listen to him being emo anymore
Not long now though until he leaves and the show regains a viewer as I've decided to put any prior dislike of Moffat and my scepticism of Matt Smith's suitability for the role to one side and be more open minded about the new era as I can't imagine anything being worse than the present one.
ProgMatinee
circlesendwheretheybegin
anyone know if this is on comcast ondemand? I always miss the original airings somehow.
Its not going to air in the US until Mid-December.
ProgMatinee
circlesendwheretheybegin
ok cool! i can wait a little longer so not to have to watch it on a 20 inch computer monitor.
I watched it on my 52 inch here in Utah.
(granted I had to disconnect my computer in my bedroom, carry out to the living room and hook it up to my TV.. but it was worth it).
(granted I had to disconnect my computer in my bedroom, carry out to the living room and hook it up to my TV.. but it was worth it).
ProgMatinee
circlesendwheretheybegin
how does it look when you do that? does the computer need a real good graphics card to make it look nice? i don't have a good card on my computer, but I was looking at new tvs and saw that they accept computer inputs.
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