The NBA needs to talk to the NCAA and end the one and done
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The NBA needs to talk to the NCAA and end the one and done
The Clown Prince of Crime
Super Freak
Neal136
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Let me assist a bit with this one ... Mike wasn't a great three-point shooter. He was one of the greatest mid-range shooters of all-time. And once he added that fadaway jump shot ... forget about it. No one could stop it.
I never said Steph or LeBron aren't great players. They are. That said, I believe this era is much easier to play in than it was in the Magic/Bird/Jordan eras. I don't think any old school players would have a hard time adjusting to not being touched when trying to score. The reverse is a whole different story. Let guys like Rodman, Parish, Oakley, Mason, McDaniel, or Laimbeer tag LeBron under/around the basket like they did MJ and others. Hard fouls they routinely dispensed back then would be flagrant fouls today. Today's players would be ejected if they hit players like they did back in the 70's and 80's. Back then, all that was the price you paid to get to basket. Can LeBron deal with that kind of physical D on a nightly basis and be better than he is today? That's highly debatable. MJ's scoring average going up with no arm bars, hand checking, or physical D in the lane...that's not.
As far as Steph is concerned. I see him more as a Reggie Miller type player. Both are great pure shooters and had wonderful NBA careers. The only difference is Steph has won championships and played with higher caliber teammates. I don't see him having the same impact that MJ did overall. MJ's offensive game was killer and his D was just as good. This is why he is considered the GOAT by even the legends of the game. As for MJ not being a GREAT shooter, I don't see where you are getting your facts from. In MJ's 13 years with the Bulls, he shot 50.5% from the field (please don't bring up his Washington years, we all know he was old and a shadow of himself then). In any era, that makes him a great shooter. Hell, Steph is a career 47.7% shooter and no one can touch him while he's trying to score in today's game.
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That fade away he developed was lethal. It opened up the whole floor for him because he was able to hit his outside shots. It made him an even better scorer later in his career because he could get to the front of the rim easier. Guys guarding him had to come out further to D him up. That allowed him more space in the lanes and then...things would get ugly for the opposition.
I would totally disagree with you that MJ was one of the best mid range shooters of all time. Not even close to an all time great. MJ is an incredible player and scorer, but he wasn’t a pure shooter.
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I never said Steph or LeBron aren't great players. They are. That said, I believe this era is much easier to play in than it was in the Magic/Bird/Jordan eras. I don't think any old school players would have a hard time adjusting to not being touched when trying to score. The reverse is a whole different story. Let guys like Rodman, Parish, Oakley, Mason, McDaniel, or Laimbeer tag LeBron under/around the basket like they did MJ and others. Hard fouls they routinely dispensed back then would be flagrant fouls today. Today's players would be ejected if they hit players like they did back in the 70's and 80's. Back then, all that was the price you paid to get to basket. Can LeBron deal with that kind of physical D on a nightly basis and be better than he is today? That's highly debatable. MJ's scoring average going up with no arm bars, hand checking, or physical D in the lane...that's not.
As far as Steph is concerned. I see him more as a Reggie Miller type player. Both are great pure shooters and had wonderful NBA careers. The only difference is Steph has won championships and played with higher caliber teammates. I don't see him having the same impact that MJ did overall. MJ's offensive game was killer and his D was just as good. This is why he is considered the GOAT by even the legends of the game. As for MJ not being a GREAT shooter, I don't see where you are getting your facts from. In MJ's 13 years with the Bulls, he shot 50.5% from the field (please don't bring up his Washington years, we all know he was old and a shadow of himself then). In any era, that makes him a great shooter. Hell, Steph is a career 47.7% shooter and no one can touch him while he's trying to score in today's game.
You can say Klay would be like Reggie Miller if he played in the 1980s or 90s, but not Steph. Steph has a handle, Reggie didn’t. Reggie made a living making jump shots off screens, Steph can do that AND create his own shot off the dribble.
Klay is pretty comparable to Reggie, but I think Klay is superior due to his D. It’s unclear if Klay would ever have the clutch moments Reggie had over the years if he was the star of the team, so I could see arguments for either being better than the other.
Steph, on the other hand, is a different type of animal. Who knows if he’d be durable enough in the good old days, but he’s a much bigger offensive threat than Reggie ever was and they are both similar defenders. I’m not really sure who I’d compare Steph to offensively, but maybe Kareem (sky hook) or Wilt (the dunk). Those two players changed the NBA offensively, much like Steph...albeit in very different ways.
Steph most definitely isn’t in the class of MJ. When Steph is on, he’d have a higher impact on offense than MJ, but MJ could dominate the game in many other ways (defense, mentally, etc.)
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As I said, Steph is a great player. Miller did get most of his action on screens. However, they both can shoot the basketball. Miller shot 47.1% from the field for his career and Steph is at 47.7%. Pretty similar numbers. However, Steph can create his own shot and is a far deadlier 3pt shooter. Both are on the slim side physically (Reggie is 4 inches taller) so that's another reason I compared them. I firmly do believe Steph can play in any era. He can fill up the bucket from just about anywhere on the floor. That's going to open lanes and help a team in any era. Reggie was able to stay healthy even when playing back then. I have no reason to believe it would be any different with Steph. He has serious skills and is fun player to watch.
I can go on
Well I read the first article, and even they are qualifying their selection on MJ. And they have Kareem listed?
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You don’t think KD is better than MJ at mid-range? What about Rip Hamilton? Steph? Reggie Miller? Glen Rice? Drazen Petrovic? John Stockton? Etc.
Michael Jordan was a scorer, not a pure shooter. I can’t see why anyone would put him on a top shooting list other than just because he is the GOAT. Granted, if we are talking about a game winning shot, MJ is a great choice. He was a killer.
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I can go on
I think that time makes people forget just how deadly a shooter MJ really was. Either that, or some people are just too young to have seen him play live. You can't appreciate or understand how lethal MJ was on the floor watching YouTube or ESPN classics. It's a curse we all share. I never saw players like Russell, the Big O, Wilt, or Jerry West play live. I started watching basketball in the late 70's so those guys were pretty much done when I got into the NBA. That said, MJ's numbers speak volumes about his game. 30.1 career average during the regular season and it only increased when it mattered the most (33.4 ppg in the playoffs). 6-0 in the Finals and 6 time Finals MVP. Those are some staggering stats. Watching him play was even more unreal.
I’m old, I remember MJ (and hating him) throughout my early basketball years. I do not remember him at all as a shooter, but I remember him as a DOMINATING scorer (and defender). Those are two very different things. Jordan, Paul Pierce, Kobe, etc. all dominating scorers, but not pure shooters. Reggie, Stockton, Price, Petrovic, etc. were pure shooters. Guys like Mullin and Bird were a bit of both.
When I was playing, I was often compared to Mullin, but that might also be due to the color of my skin.
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I understand. Being from Chicago, I watched much more Bulls basketball than most people who aren't Bulls fans. That's only normal. MJ made the game fun to watch for those of us who lived around Chicago when he played for the Bulls. Watching at least about 50 games a season and all of his playoff games left a lasting impression on me and I'm sure his fans. He definitely was more of a one dimensional player early in his career. Dunking and penetrating to the front of the rim is basically all MJ was known for offensively. That definitely changed in his later years. Later in his career, he developed a deadly fade away that just couldn't be stopped. As a scorer and a shooter, the MJ we saw during the Bulls final championship runs was different than the one we saw early on. His jumper was nowhere near as good early in his career. The fade away he had after he came out of his first retirement allowed him to hit shots from all over the floor. Like other here mentioned, he became an excellent shooter. I will agree that the others you mentioned were pure shooters from the jump. MJ did evolve and added that killer fade away later on.
To me, saying MJ was a great jump shooter, is like saying Jason Kidd was a great jump shooter. They both adapted.
I grew up in the Bay Area, but went to Purdue so I saw a bunch of MJ when I was out there. I even went to his restaurant at one point (mid-90’s?)
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Again, I can see where you are coming from. The guys you mentioned were pure shooter from the get go. They were known for it throughout their careers. MJ drove to the basket for lay ups and dunked early in his career. That did change drastically later. He relied heavily on his fade away later in his career and it was awesome to behold. His game at that time became complete. He could do it all and it showed. He hit mid range shots and jumpers consistently and with deadly accuracy during those last 3 championships, particularly against the Jazz. He also did it during the regular seasons at that time of his career as well.
It's cool that you went to school at Purdue. It's a long way from the Bay area. It's also the alma mater of one of my all time favorite QBs. I love me some Drew Brees.
BurningRage
Super Freak
Kawhi wants out of San Antonio.
Darth Madden
You Are A Tooooooy!!!
Guess he realized he can't win by himself either.
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