Guillermo Del Toro departs “The Hobbit”

[theguru1]

We're only talking about a difference of 3 years not 30 years.

In the space of under 2 years, they went from the couple of Gollum shots in FOTR, to a total re-creation and full on character in TTT.
They also had a lot more to do in LOTR, half involving creating the technology in the first place.... Massive anyone.

 

[The Josh]

Wow.

Seriously?


How could....never mind

Methinks some people are too protective of their favorite film series

Don't know what to say guys (there was some sarcasm in my comparison though). IMO LOTR had better acting, visuals, and story. The story IMO just captures you and hits you emotionally. Never felt pulled in to Pan's. For me there just isn't anything that makes me feel Pan's is better than any of the three LOTR movies.

Essentially, if we can't make it, nobody can. They need money and could have a fortune for the rights. Terribly short-sighted. Studio execs acting like three year olds.

I know. Thats the killer part of it all. Just boggles the mind that there's a need to act that way.

Double A?

Oh alright. Triple A

Oh no he didnt

You deserve this one Josh...

Guess that depends on how you look at it.

 

[devilof76]

Pan's Labyrinth didn't hit you emotionally? I don't understand.

Made me cry. LOTR did not.

Yeah, Tinkerbell is pretty hot.

 

[Master Wayne]

Pan's Labyrinth didn't hit you emotionally? I don't understand.

Made me cry. LOTR did not.

LOTR put me to sleep. Does that count?

 

[devilof76]

To each their own. I loved LOTR, but Pan's Labyrinth was one of the most brilliant war films I've ever seen. The esthetic credentials of that movie were off the charts. It was pretty much perfect.

I wouldn't give LOTR that kind of credit, but the scope was much larger, and keeping something like that together would take a lot. The job PJ did was amazing, but if I didn't already love the story, I might not be as enthusiastic about it as I am.

 

[The Josh]

Pan's Labyrinth didn't hit you emotionally? I don't understand.

Made me cry. LOTR did not.

No, not really, I didn't walk away going this was awful but I didn't walk away feeling impacted either.

LOTR does that to me every time I've seen it and I admit there are parts that have made me cry like a little girl.

To each his own. I'm not trashing anyones opinion on Pan's. Just from my POV at least Pan's could only hope to match LOTR and be the set of films they came out as.

 

[devilof76]

The end of the world is nothing compared to the murder of a little girl.

 

[The Josh]

The end of the world is nothing compared to the murder of a little girl.

Those would both be very sad.

Its the story as a whole though that I base it off of. The characters and what they go through, the little stories it tells along the way, the points it makes again along the journey, etc. All of that is among the many things that to me are what makes LOTR so great.

 

[Jen]

Those would both be very sad.

Its the story as a whole though that I base it off of. The characters and what they go through, the little stories it tells along the way, the points it makes again along the journey, etc. All of that is among the many things that to me are what makes LOTR so great.

I fully agree with you there, Josh. I could watch LOTR over and over and never tire of it. Each times it moves me as much as the first.

Pan's, I greatly enjoyed....but it just didn't have the same impact on me emotionally as LOTR. Could be because I was already familiar with the LOTR material and it was great seeing how my vision after reading the books, was so similar to what PJ gave us. It was a project of such enormous scale and PJ delivered.

 

[Fritz]

Pan's Labyrinth was a great movie. Lord of the Rings was EPIC. That is all!

 

[pixletwin]

In the space of under 2 years, they went from the couple of Gollum shots in FOTR, to a total re-creation and full on character in TTT.
They also had a lot more to do in LOTR, half involving creating the technology in the first place.... Massive anyone.

Right... that had nothing to with the fact that Gollum isn't even in FotR and yet is a main player in the remaining two books. If you are going to comment at least please think about what you are saying.

 

[devilof76]

Those would both be very sad.

Its the story as a whole though that I base it off of. The characters and what they go through, the little stories it tells along the way, the points it makes again along the journey, etc. All of that is among the many things that to me are what makes LOTR so great.

Tolkien's story is amazing, no argument there. And I can watch LOTR over and over. I have sat through the extended versions, consecutively, and without a break, several times. All 11 hours. I can't do that with Pan's Labyrinth. It is too much. Too intense, too poignant, and too real.

It isn't a matter of personal preference. It's a matter of recognizing potency in cinematic expression. PJ could have tightened up all three of those films, the last two in particular. After the Fellowship, things seemed to lose focus a bit, and I believe even he said that the Crack of Doom sequence was something he couldn't get right. And that's the climax! Pan's Labyrinth was fully cohesive from stem to stern. Never excessive or deficient.

And when I point out the imperfections, I am not knocking Lord of the Rings whatsoever. It is what brought my love of movies and toys back to the level it was at when I was a child, which is something that Star Wars, or X-Men, or anything else up to that time couldn't do. A truly monumental achievement.

I would never buy collectibles from Pan's Labyrinth. It is somethng beyond that. I don't know how else to say it. It was a transcendent experience. It wasn't fun or inspiring. It was sublime. And whereas you don't see a Lord of the Rings every day, you never see a Pan's Labyrinth. That's what put it above for me. It's probably the best movie I've seen in the last ten years. Or more.

 

[The Ween]

Why is everyone comparing Pan's Labyrinth to LOTR?...
Oranges to Apples IMO...

I'm deeply saddened that Del Toro isn't doing the Hobbit though...

I agree. I don't get it.

 

[wofford29]

I've seen plenty of films as good and better as Pan's since it's release, so saying you never see one is a hugely personal thing. I love Pan's, but then again I also think it's loss to The Lives Of Others in 2007 was justified as well, so I clearly don't love it as much as most.

 

[devilof76]

The use of fantasy to tell a war story stands out for me, and how that enabled him to emphasize and exaggerate the most sensitive aspects of the story. I'm no film critic. Never had a class, never worked in the industry, and never inundated myself with movies to the extent that I could say I fully fathom the artform. But I understand literature, and I have seen very few films that could present a narrative with the kind of power a great novel can. This one made me feel like I was reading Victor Hugo at his best. Maybe it is personal. I find that hard to reconcile with my personal preference for watching LOTR, but I would be the last one to know if my evaluation was clueless per true film criticism. I do know that I have no interest in seeing The Lives of Others, so maybe you're right.

 

[CAhobbit]

The end of the world is nothing compared to the murder of a little girl.

Both involve murder/death/etc. though. LOTR had numerous tragedies...death, loss of innocence, traumatic situations, etc.

PL has many of the same tragedies.

We're all effected differently by stories. PL is a film that I quite enjoyed. It was beautiful, tragic, well told, etc. Unfortunately I wasn't as invested into the film as much as I was LOTR. LOTR touched me far more than PL did. But that's just how it is, right? We all have different tastes and connect to the movies/books/etc. that we come to love.

 

[LOTRFan]

Tolkien's story is amazing, no argument there. And I can watch LOTR over and over. I have sat through the extended versions, consecutively, and without a break, several times. All 11 hours. I can't do that with Pan's Labyrinth. It is too much. Too intense, too poignant, and too real.

That's the truth and the folly of comparison, while both are "fantasy-driven" they unfold on different levels.

Pan's is intended to be visceral, haunting and evocative; those aren't words I would use for LOTR. The latter is essentially an epic popcorn film (swords and sandles ablaze), with timeless themes - and of course my moniker here should speak to which I prefer, though I wouldn't argue which is better filmmaking.

 

[Moriaman]

Both Pans and LOTR are executed brilliantly,you cant really compare them except to say they are both fantasy based (even though both films portray the real world so well,which is one of the many reasons they work imo).

I love them both,couldnt say i love one over the other,depends on my mood tbh,they affect me in different ways.

Even though GDT isnt directing,his stamp will be all over the Hobbit in the design and look of the movie,i just hope they find a director worthy and who has the balls to pull it off (no pun intended)

 

[devilof76]

Both involve murder/death/etc. though. LOTR had numerous tragedies...death, loss of innocence, traumatic situations, etc.

PL has many of the same tragedies.

We're all effected differently by stories. PL is a film that I quite enjoyed. It was beautiful, tragic, well told, etc. Unfortunately I wasn't as invested into the film as much as I was LOTR. LOTR touched me far more than PL did. But that's just how it is, right? We all have different tastes and connect to the movies/books/etc. that we come to love.

You're probably right.

I respond very strongly to tragedies based in the history of the early 20th century. I hold the late 19th century as one of the highest points in all of human culture; even higher than Golden Age Greece in many regards. There was a hope and optimism blooming that had never before been possible, or believed possible. It was like all of the most beautiful fairy tales were coming to life in the industrialized world (regardless of the way it is depicted today). Then it all changed, and it changed so hard and fast that no one understood (don't understand to this day) why or how it could all go to hell so completely and so brutally. It was Mahler's 9th in real time. One moment Einstein was expounding relativity, the next moment, swastikas were covering Europe. It's the emotional palette that Tolkien worked from, but he separated his story from the history so that it could stand on its own. Pan's Labyrinth is set fully in that history, so it hits me much harder. The emotional impact is more acute because it's that much more real to me, being as heavily invested in that time period as I am.

 

[The Josh]

Pan's Labyrinth was a great movie. Lord of the Rings was EPIC. That is all!

Totally agree with ya Fritz.

Tolkien's story is amazing, no argument there. And I can watch LOTR over and over. I have sat through the extended versions, consecutively, and without a break, several times. All 11 hours. I can't do that with Pan's Labyrinth. It is too much. Too intense, too poignant, and too real.

Believe me I agree the story is amazing and I've done the EE marathon more times than I can count. Pan's is a solid flick but I have no desire to see

It isn't a matter of personal preference. It's a matter of recognizing potency in cinematic expression. PJ could have tightened up all three of those films, the last two in particular. After the Fellowship, things seemed to lose focus a bit, and I believe even he said that the Crack of Doom sequence was something he couldn't get right. And that's the climax! Pan's Labyrinth was fully cohesive from stem to stern. Never excessive or deficient.

Well, it is and isn't. For me based on all things considered I think PJ did a better job of expressing the story and the items within that story much better than GDT did in Pan's. Are there things within LOTR that I'd change or tweak ever so slightly? Sure but overall I think its a true showcase in how to make such an epic tale come to life and resonate with people for a very long time.

I would never buy collectibles from Pan's Labyrinth. It is somethng beyond that. I don't know how else to say it. It was a transcendent experience. It wasn't fun or inspiring. It was sublime. And whereas you don't see a Lord of the Rings every day, you never see a Pan's Labyrinth. That's what put it above for me. It's probably the best movie I've seen in the last ten years. Or more.

Well, I disagree with you somewhat. You rarely if ever see something like LOTR that captures so many and like I said takes all the things of the story and make them resonate with so many. Like you I can't totally explain why LOTR has hit me so hard but for me personally and how I view the film its nothing short of amazing.