1/6 Hot Toys - TMS 021 - The Clone Wars: Ahsoka Tano Collectible Figure

[user 67922]

A female character that succeeds in everything with no justification and has no flaws.

But some people like to call every female character a Mary Sue because they lowkey hate women.

That isn’t targeted at anyone here before anyone fires up their keyboards, but if it offends you, it likely applies to you

Right, thank you. So yeah Ahsoka definitely isn’t a Mary Sue and is a character that pre-dates the current woke movement by several years. Rey probably is tbh. In searching for the term I found people also calling Luke a Mary Sue. Again that makes absolutely no sense, as he’s a character that started flawed and had to train to achieve his abilities. I guess calling Luke out for being a Mary Sue is just a defensive response from ST fans to the justifiable criticism Rey receives.

 

[Uncle Bingo]

The current state of this thread is the result of Hot Toys not releasing Ahsoka and instead releasing Captain Marvtard.

 

[sithlord13]

When she first appeared she was a bit of Mary Sue but Dave actually stated that he intended for people to not like her and it was part of her arc and you know ? It worked for me. She started to make errors - which stopped her being a mary Sue - and she developed into a gold character. Unlike, sadly, Rey

 

[TurdFurgusonsHat]

Rey is Kathleen Kennedy's self image on screen in live action.

 

[RandomHero]

Rey absolutely could have been a fine character after TFA. Outside of magically holding her own against a relatively untested Kylo Ren, she really didn’t do anything egregious in that film. However, like just about every other character that appeared in the ST, the last two movies killed any chance of her being a decent character.

BB-8 was the best character in the ST and that’s probably because he doesn’t actually talk.

 

[Ramatuelle]

I’m having too much fun watching you fall on your own sword.

"I know you are but what am I" is not a convincing argument. In fact, it isnt even an argument.

Lay out your position or dont, just know that "dont" is seen as what it is: an admission that you really dont HAVE an argument to offer. Fair enough, we're done here I think.

 

[chrisstbh]

Reys only personality trait was having no parents. Girl, nobody gives a ****.

 

[Ramatuelle]

Can someone please explain the meaning of Mary Sue? It’s an Americanism I’m not particularly familiar with. The definition I found was a flawless boring female. Ahsoka is neither flawless (she has/had attachment issues, was impulsive, was headstrong) and clearly could never be classed as boring. As far as I can see she’s just a female Anakin (pre-fall to the DS) and the whole point of her character initially was Anakin getting a taste of his own medicine. She definitely can’t be put in the same category as Rey.

EDIT: Also, what’s the male equivalent of a Mary Sue? A Joe Bob?

"Mary Sue" also contains the nuanced meaning of this character being the author's self-insertion into the story. This is a big fanfic thing. Most fanfic original characters are Mary Sues; that character is living the experience the author themselves would like to have with the story's protagonists.

Mary Sues have impenetrable plot armor and are usually so overpowered as to strain one's sense of suspension of disbelief. They also tend, at least in fanfiction, to be sexual dynamos on a pornstar level. Don't shoot the messenger, I'm just sayin'.

 

[Ramatuelle]

Reys only personality trait was having no parents. Girl, nobody gives a ****.

Hell, half the SW universe are orphans. Its almost a requirement.

 

[noheddardstark]

"Mary Sue" also contains the nuanced meaning of this character being the author's self-insertion into the story. This is a big fanfic thing. Most fanfic original characters are Mary Sues; that character is living the experience the author themselves would like to have with the story's protagonists.

Mary Sues have impenetrable plot armor and are usually so overpowered as to strain one's sense of suspension of disbelief. They also tend, at least in fanfiction, to be sexual dynamos on a pornstar level. Don't shoot the messenger, I'm just sayin'.

Fans tend to use the term "Gary Stu", with Wesley Crusher being a prime example.

 

[user 67922]

"Mary Sue" also contains the nuanced meaning of this character being the author's self-insertion into the story. This is a big fanfic thing. Most fanfic original characters are Mary Sues; that character is living the experience the author themselves would like to have with the story's protagonists.

So, what you’re saying is Filoni is living out his hero fantasies through a teenage Togruta girl haha. At least we now know who Dave dresses up as on Halloween. Okay, from that point of view I can see how she could be considered a Mary Sue. From the point of view of overpowered I still think that’s a cartoon thing, where characters tend to have over-exaggerated abilities to start with. Kids really dig that ****. It remains to be seen how infallible she is in live-action, I’d imagine Filoni will tone it down some. After all Din Djarin blocked her attacks with just a bit of Beskar.

 

[matticus]

A female character that succeeds in everything with no justification and has no flaws.

But some people like to call every female character a Mary Sue because they lowkey hate women.

That isn’t targeted at anyone here before anyone fires up their keyboards, but if it offends you, it likely applies to you

Or if you just look at the military, women are not on the front lines and can't pass the high standards of the U.S. Marine Corp. So instantly accepting women as these Amazonian warriors is really laughable in the real world. Yet we are all here talking about fictional what ifs and that is laughable in the real world.

I just hope Hot Toys keeps churning out the releases so they can get to my Snowspeeder Luke.

 

[chrisstbh]

Or if you just look at the military, women are not on the front lines and can't pass the high standards of the U.S. Marine Corp. So instantly accepting women as these Amazonian warriors is really laughable in the real world. Yet we are all here talking about fictional what ifs and that is laughable in the real world.

I just hope Hot Toys keeps churning out the releases so they can get to my Snowspeeder Luke.

Can't apply the same logic to alien space wizards

 

[user 67922]

Rey is Kathleen Kennedy's self image on screen in live action.

And Kathleen herself is the ST generation’s Mary Sue. Can’t do any wrong, responsible only for the good things that happen with Star Wars, and stands up bravely against all of us toxic naysayers. The way Reddit SW Leaks has been celebrating her new 3 year contract this week you’d think she was Joan of Arc.

 

[Jedi_Col]

When she first appeared she was a bit of Mary Sue but Dave actually stated that he intended for people to not like her and it was part of her arc and you know ? It worked for me. She started to make errors - which stopped her being a mary Sue - and she developed into a gold character. Unlike, sadly, Rey

Curious why you say she was a Mary Sue? I don’t think it applies to her at all. She is a Jedi Padawan who had training. She certainly wasn’t a super powered Jedi who was so great without any explanation. When you compare Ahsoka to Rey, there’s no comparison that I can see. Rey was a scavenger on a planet by herself who suddenly was able to go toe-to-toe with a trained dark side user in mind battling, then mind trick a stormtrooper, then beat him in a lightsaber duel. I don’t see how Ahsoka is at all a Mary Sue. I’m not saying you’re wrong or anything, I’m just curious what aspects you see that made her one.

 

[Ramatuelle]

So, what you’re saying is Filoni is living out his hero fantasies through a teenage Togruta girl haha. At least we now know who Dave dresses up as on Halloween. Okay, from that point of view I can see how she could be considered a Mary Sue. From the point of view of overpowered I still think that’s a cartoon thing, where characters tend to have over-exaggerated abilities to start with. Kids really dig that ****. It remains to be seen how infallible she is in live-action, I’d imagine Filoni will tone it down some. After all Din Djarin blocked her attacks with just a bit of Beskar.

Honestly, I dont know and would not care to make a prediction. But I'll note that *wherever* Filoni goes, Ahsoka goes - and so there's that bit of evidence. But when asking about the general concept of Mary Sue, the reality of author self-insertion is a given, especially in written fan fiction.

If Ahsoka fights Vader in live action and wins, that'll be a *really* Mary Sue moment imo in the sense of overpoweredness. NO! This guy is maybe the most powerful Force user ever! Some teenage girl is not fighting him and winning, the idea is ridiculous. Kenobi himself could not beat him! Qi'ra fighting him with electric sai is ridiculous! Dont even go there. Kylo being bested by Rey: RIDICULOUS

 

[Lordscum]

And Kathleen herself is the ST generation’s Mary Sue. Can’t do any wrong, responsible only for the good things that happen with Star Wars, and stands up bravely against all of us toxic naysayers. The way Reddit SW Leaks has been celebrating her new 3 year contract this week you’d think she was Joan of Arc.

They haven't officially come out and said it's for three years , as of yesterday her publicist hasn't said anything nor any of the major Hollywood trades so who knows for sure? Also this goes against what Bob Chapeak is trying to do as far as keeping studio execs contracts to 1 to 2 years so there is accountability .

 

[pixletwin]

If you use the word "woke" in a discussion, a kitten in Alabama drowns and you lose a few brain cells.

 

[RandomHero]

I hate cats so

 

[Chainedstream]

The current state of this thread is the result of Hot Toys not releasing Ahsoka and instead releasing Captain Marvtard.

Bunch of addicts, in need of their next type of meth.