I just watched the original theatrical SW and ROTJ

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Khev

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And much to my surprise I learned that I prefer the SE's of each. Go figure.

After being reminded of how utterly perfect the theatrical ESB was recently I needed to see SW and ROTJ to see if the same held true. Almost for ROTJ, definitely not for SW.

Star Wars was certainly charming and I much preferred the original Greedo scene and lack of any Jabba (or Boba Fett) appearance whatsoever but it was just so darn rough it almost was like I *was* watching a work print.

My favorite scenes all survived the SE intact (opening on the Blockade Runner, Luke staring at the suns, pretty much everything from the Death Star escape and later). It loses a little ground in Mos Eisley (I think I like having a badly rendered Jabba with a badly done voice even less than the new Greedo scene) but oh does it soar during the Death Star attack.

The theatrical DS attack is certainly entertaining to "observe" as an exercise of 1977 technical brilliance but doesn't draw me into the actual battle nearly as well as the updated attack in the SE. What can I say, I like real looking spaceships.

ROTJ was more bittersweet. I like *everything* better in the theatrical version...until that freaking ewok song. I much prefer the animatronic Sy Snootles to the silly CGI characters in the SE. The song in the original seems more otherworldly and unsettling--and appropriate for a performance in the alien underworld of Tatooine.

I like the original Sarlacc pit much more than Audrey II in the SE and even little changes made to to the sounds of the engines on Wedge's X-Wing when he cruises toward the DS's main reactor are a bit of an annoyance in the SE. And though I didn't notice it as much with SW, once again those *colors* are just so much more natural and atmospheric in the original ROTJ, particularly in Jabba's palace.

But oh goodness that ewok celebration song. To go out on such a note gives such an air of silliness to the entire trilogy (or saga.) The ewok "singers", party favor whistles and noises, blech. The music in the SE finale is *so* much better and really validates the saga as worthy of a more epic and sentimental finale. And as a PT lover I have to admit that Hayden Christensen's ghost also gives the end an extra emotional punch, a definite plus.

So I'm glad to have the original OT finally on DVD and I do hope that George one day will allow them to be fully restored.

As for my average viewing of the saga it'll go: PT, ANH SE, original ESB, ROTJ SE.

I really wish I could get an ANH SE without the new Greedo and Jabba scenes, and an ROTJ SE with *only* the new celebration sequence added, but oh well. I can still enjoy and appreciate the entire saga.
 
Khev said:
And much to my surprise I learned that I prefer the SE's of each. Go figure.

:clap Welcome to the club.

Khev said:
So I'm glad to have the original OT finally on DVD and I do hope that George one day will allow them to be fully restored.

Unfortunatelt that won't happen since the originals were reportedly burned. These DVDs are just strait transfers of the old Laser Disc editions. Im afraid thats as good as we'll ever get. :( :monkey2
 
I really hope that this "original, original" release will pave the way for an eventual cleaned-up release of the original OT.

I don't see any reason why this couldn't happen and its not like it wouldn't be printing money for Lucasfilm. It would be especially nice to make it anamorphic for those with fancier tvs :D
 
pixletwin said:
Unfortunatelt that won't happen since the originals were reportedly burned. These DVDs are just strait transfers of the old Laser Disc editions. Im afraid thats as good as we'll ever get. :( :monkey2

I really have a hard time believing that... but anyway, they could at least re-release the THX versions from the 90's.
 
I don't like the Sarlacc chages either - gives less hope of Boba surviving. :D

I ABSOLUTLY HATE having Hayden Christensen at the end though. He is being rewarded for "dying" 30 or so years ago and living a life of evil since then. Ben and Yoda got screwed and had to be old ghosts because they were good their whole life! It should be ALL old or ALL young (a young Yoda would be very cool to see). I don't like the mix and matching. So until George figures that out, originial ghosts for me.
 
Buttmunch said:
I don't like the Sarlacc chages either - gives less hope of Boba surviving. :D

I ABSOLUTLY HATE having Hayden Christensen at the end though. He is being rewarded for "dying" 30 or so years ago and living a life of evil since then. Ben and Yoda got screwed and had to be old ghosts because they were good their whole life! It should be ALL old or ALL young (a young Yoda would be very cool to see). I don't like the mix and matching. So until George figures that out, originial ghosts for me.

Here we go.

Here is one of my all time favorite posts at Millenniumfalcon.com and it sums up exactly how I feel on the subject:
The Kenobi said:
I detect the presence of some lying mother ****ers around these parts.

Regarding the welcome addition of Hayden as Anakin in ROTJ,

After watching TPM,AOTC, knowing the gist of ROTS, then the magnificent new version of the original trilogy ; I can only say this. After the 6 film build up to the climax when Anakin appears in glory, I cried. It was so ****ing beautiful and perfect. And you lying mother ****ers know you got teary eyed as well. Don't be bitter and cynical. You know you "got it", and understood what Mr. Lucas was saying. And if you are too jaded , cynical, and self absorbed in body count films, and you didn't see and appreciate the ****ing beauty of that moment, then **** your child hood.

And as far as the ****s talking about Anakin NOT looking at Ben, think outside the ****ing box! He IS looking at Ben, he simply isn't visible yet to the naked eye. You can tell as he phases in , then abruptly turns his head away in embarassment at finally being redeemed in Ben and Yoda, AND Lukes eyes! Its ****ing beautiful. God dammit.


Star Wars owns you. :rock

:peace
 
I certainly got where George was coming from, but to me it still seems wrong. If he wants Hayden in there, go back and film Ewan as Obi-Wan all the way through Empire and Jedi. Then Yoda should also be young. If they are supposed to look the age when they died, then Anakin needs to be old since he obviously came back to kill the Emperor.

Besides, how does Luke know that that young guy is his father when he only saw him old?

BTW, when I saw it, it wasn't beautiful. I felt bad for Shaw getting cut. Just like how David Prowse (sp?) should have played suited Vader at the end of RotS for old times sake.
 
Buttmunch said:
I certainly got where George was coming from, but to me it still seems wrong. If he wants Hayden in there, go back and film Ewan as Obi-Wan all the way through Empire and Jedi. Then Yoda should also be young. If they are supposed to look the age when they died, then Anakin needs to be old since he obviously came back to kill the Emperor.

Besides, how does Luke know that that young guy is his father when he only saw him old?

Why should he? When Obi-Wan died I think the mental picture he had of himself was how he was at that moment (ie a fully realised Jedi). Same with Yoda. As far as Anakin was concerned, man... He was a mechanized franken-monster when he died and certainly not how he thought of "Anakin Skywalker" as. If you notice the Anakin at the end of ROTJ has no scars. It isn't the ROTS Anakin we are seeing.

While we're at it. Why would it have to be ep 3 Obi-Wan at the end? Why not ep 2? There is no logical reason why Obi-Wan and Yoda should appear young. Besides if you read the screenplay of ROTS and Yoda's dialogue with Qui-Gon you learn that after ROTS Obi and Yoda became padawan learners to Qui-Gon. So seeing them as the fully realised Jedi we knew from the OT makes perfect sense.
 
Buttmunch said:
I certainly got where George was coming from, but to me it still seems wrong. If he wants Hayden in there, go back and film Ewan as Obi-Wan all the way through Empire and Jedi. Then Yoda should also be young. If they are supposed to look the age when they died, then Anakin needs to be old since he obviously came back to kill the Emperor.

This is the smartest thing I've read on these boards in ages. :bow :bow :duff

Putting Hayden in ROTJ is the most arsebackward thing Lucas did to the so called "special" editions, eventhough I find nothing "special" about them.

Replacing Lapti Nek was dumb also.
 
pixletwin said:
Why should he? When Obi-Wan died I think the mental picture he had of himself was how he was at that moment (ie a fully realised Jedi). Same with Yoda. As far as Anakin was concerned, man... He was a mechanized franken-monster when he died and certainly not how he thought of "Anakin Skywalker" as. If you notice the Anakin at the end of ROTJ has no scars. It isn't the ROTS Anakin we are seeing.

While we're at it. Why would it have to be ep 3 Obi-Wan at the end? Why not ep 2? There is no logical reason why Obi-Wan and Yoda should appear young. Besides if you read the screenplay of ROTS and Yoda's dialogue with Qui-Gon you learn that after ROTS Obi and Yoda became padawan learners to Qui-Gon. So seeing them as the fully realised Jedi we knew from the OT makes perfect sense.

I see what you are getting at. I understand what you mean, but if Anakin had the choice to appear young and unscared,etc. Then Ben and Yoda should have too. Hayden at least shouldn't be wearing the long Jedi robes he never wore.

I sorely wish they thrown the Qui-Gon cameo in the Special/Extended/Ruined editons of the PT. It would have made the connection the Jedi ghosts better.

I know it sounds kinda against my opinion of Young Anakin spirit, but I would have liked to see Qui-Gon thrown in at the end of RotJ like that fan-made video. Anakin only became a Jedi because of him and I think he would have liked to see Qui-Gon again.

Perhaps Qui-Gon was secretly training Anakin to become a ghost? Thats what Yoda and Ben were learning to do right? So had did Anakin become a ghost? Surely the Emperor didn't teach him or the emperor would have become a ghost,etc. (not counting the EU clone crap).
 
Buttmunch said:
....I sorely wish they thrown the Qui-Gon cameo in the Special/Extended/Ruined editons of the PT. It would have made the connection the Jedi ghosts better.

I know it sounds kinda against my opinion of Young Anakin spirit, but I would have liked to see Qui-Gon thrown in at the end of RotJ like that fan-made video. Anakin only became a Jedi because of him and I think he would have liked to see Qui-Gon again.....

I use to think including Qui-Gon was a dumb idea but I agree. The way they edited it so that Qui-Gon appeared after Luke turns away so you know it is for the audience to see, not Luke, would do nothing but enhance ep 1-6. But I guess BM my good eBuddy, we will never see eye to eye on hayden. :lol
 
Bonehead15 said:
This is the smartest thing I've read on these boards in ages. :bow :bow :duff

Thanks!! :rock

I just want things consitant. To me when you die, you should be in your "perfect" state as ghost, which for most people would be what, your 20's? So Anakin's would make sense, but then Ben and Yoda don't. If they all looked the way they died, the original way works.
 
pixletwin said:
I use to think including Qui-Gon was a dumb idea but I agree. The way they edited it so that Qui-Gon appeared after Luke turns away so you know it is for the audience to see, not Luke, would do nothing but enhance ep 1-6. But I guess BM my good eBuddy, we will never see eye to eye on hayden. :lol

It seems that way. Agree to disagree right? At least we both win in the end because there are TWO versions! :lol
 
Buttmunch said:
Thanks!! :rock

I just want things consitant. To me when you die, you should be in your "perfect" state as ghost, which for most people would be what, your 20's? So Anakin's would make sense, but then Ben and Yoda don't. If they all looked the way they died, the original way works.

I am absolutely dumbfounded by that statement...

Ben and Yoda were at their MOST POWERFUL when they died. :monkey4 ;)
 
pixletwin said:
I am absolutely dumbfounded by that statement...

Ben and Yoda were at their MOST POWERFUL when they died. :monkey4 ;)

I guess I didn't say that right. Sure they were most powerful then, but I was refering to their physical bodies. They abviously weren't in their physical prime when they died.

I woud have loved to see a young Yoda in action! :rock
 
Buttmunch said:
I guess I didn't say that right. Sure they were most powerful then, but I was refering to their physical bodies. They abviously weren't in their physical prime when they died.

I woud have loved to see a young Yoda in action! :rock

True. But what defines a Jedi? Physical strength or their strength in the force?

Wow I haven't geeked out this bad in ages. :eek:
 
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