James Cameron's AVATAR discussion thread

[Khev]

Just had to quote this image again.

Yes Disney really needs to stop ripping off Jim's story ideas.

James Cameron's AVATAR Script Treatment (featuring all the elements outlined above): 1994

Disney's Pocahontas: 1995

 

[King Darkness]

Thats classic.

 

[IrishJedi]

Re: I saw AVATAR in 3D!

Cameron mentions Avatar being most inspired by stories like Edgar Rice Burroughs' John Carter of Mars .

I'm glad he admitted that, because many of the Pandora creatures are lifted almost right out of John Carter of Mars. The design of AVATAR isn't original, either (HALO is in there as well). The movie rests entirely on its conceit (FX, 3-D, IMAX, etc) and works only because Cameron is such a capable and masterful filmmaker and it has strong performances from the cast and James Horner's best score in over a decade.

 

[Khev]

Re: I saw AVATAR in 3D!

Two things:

1) Disney's Pocahontas was released in 1995, but as a traditionally animated film it was in production for 3 years prior. Which means it predates this AVATAR description which supposedly everyone knew about before 2 weeks ago.

Right. But the notion that Jim got himself a copy of Disney's take on Pocahontas before it went into production is a tad silly, no? Note that I said "Disney's take." There's no question that Avatar is derivitave (except that almost all stories like this, Dances With Wolves, Last Samurai, etc., end with the primitives "losing" at the end, so Avatar departs pretty significantly in that regard,) he just didn't rip off the animated version as is being implied.

3) I still think a sequel to AVATAR should deal with a "lost colony" of somekind. It's already the same story (with the exact same message) so it'd be near to see some creepy mystery thrown into the mix. I'm serious. I think that'd be kinda cool.

Possible spoiler for the end of the alleged "Avatar trilogy":

Spoiler

Originally Avatar was going to end with Jake sending a video recording back with the expelled humans warning that if anyone from Earth ever came back to Pandora the planet would unleash an incurable and highly contagious plague upon them. Since that was omitted from the movie I wonder if he's saving it for the end of the third film.

 

[King Darkness]

Re: I saw AVATAR in 3D!

I dont want sequels. This is a great stand alone movie, and doesnt really need to be expanded.

 

[daikkenaurora]

Re: I saw AVATAR in 3D!

I saw AVATAR in 3D

 

[Kibagami]

Re: I saw AVATAR in 3D!

Heh. So did I.

 

[CAhobbit]

I had no problem with the story being simple or it being something that has been done before. If you take the deep down roots of any story, nothing is original. Movie was still great!

I keep hearing this point being brought as a rebuttle to those that had issues with the story of 'Avatar'. I'm not saying it isn't valid (it sure is), but I think there's a point from the side that didn't care for the story that is being missed (or at least not presented clearly). It's not that we don't know that the stories and formulas are rehashed over and over again, but rather that said storytelling is only as successful as it's presentation. If told well we can forget that we've seen that tale or tales before. IMO 'Avatar' was not presented successfully in its storytelling because for myself, I couldn't 'escape' within the films tale. I think this is just one of the reasons people complain about the story.

 

[Khev]

Re: I saw AVATAR in 3D!

I dont want sequels. This is a great stand alone movie, and doesnt really need to be expanded.

I absolutely agree. Every element of the narrative was exploited to full satisfaction without being overdone. We know what its like to live on Pandora, we know how all the creatures and its people behave both at peace and at war, the adversaries were either killed or sent packing, and the dramatic tension over Jake's enormous crutch of having to manipulate events as an avatar while preserving his frail human form is no more.

Call it good Jim and let Hot Toys take over from here!

 

[IrishJedi]

Re: I saw AVATAR in 3D!

Right. But the notion that Jim got himself a copy of Disney's take on Pocahontas before it went into production is a tad silly, no?

Of course it's silly. I don't think anyone really believes he deliberately culled story and design elements from all of these other things and purposely "stole" them as his own. First off, there is no way he is that dumb. What I do think, though, is that he's such a big fan of sci-fi, video games and movies himself that he took all of his favorite aspects from different things and just made a big hodgepodge of it all for a big 3D IMAX FX spectacle. And that's pretty cool. But there are people out there who think that AVATAR is wholly original (story, designs and all) and that's quite clearly far from the truth. If ever a movie's whole was more important than the sum of its parts it's this one.

I dont want sequels. This is a great stand alone movie, and doesnt really need to be expanded.

I agree completely, and I think any direct sequel would cheapen this one. It's a complete tale. But, unfortunately, I bet we'll get at least one sequel. I've heard it may take place on one of the different moons of Pandora with completely different characters and creatures. That could be interesting, I guess.

 

[King Darkness]

Re: I saw AVATAR in 3D!

If anyone is capable of making a good sequel its Cameron, but if he does do one I would like it to be at least 5 years from now, or even more. Let this film build its own legacy before doing another, maybe even 10 years.

 

[IrishJedi]

Re: I saw AVATAR in 3D!

If anyone is capable of making a good sequel its Cameron, but if he does do one I would like it to be at least 5 years from now, or even more. Let this film build its own legacy before doing another, maybe even 10 years.

Yes.

And he'd better damn make another classic Cameron, hard R-Rated sci-fi/action flick first. I doubt BATTLE ANGEL will be the cure, either. But I suppose it could be. THE ABYSS wasn't R, but it sure feels more mature than the stuff he's been doing lately.

It's been, what, 16 years since TRUE LIES? 19 years since T2. Unacceptable. Jim, your pseudo Disney flicks are kinda cool and cute, but get back to doing what you do best, sir.

 

[King Darkness]

Re: I saw AVATAR in 3D!

And he'd better damn make another classic Cameron, hard R-Rated sci-fi/action flick first.

HELL YES!!!!!

 

[Kibagami]

Re: I saw AVATAR in 3D!

Battle Angel is pretty mature; it's one of those adult Manga and at the same time it's in tune with Terminator. If the internet is correct; which I doubt; the film will cover her birth; her relationship with Hugo; and her racing days following his death. And those volumes are crazy good enough to make a good film. Now I'm just worried if it will be true to the Manga thematically and aesthetically while Cameron hardcore.

 

[galactiboy]

Whereas I felt engrossed in the movie... for both the visual aspect and story. Sure it wasn't hard to predict what would happen, but I still enjoyed seeing things play out.

 

[ironwez20]

Re: I saw AVATAR in 3D!

Sounds interesting. I never heard of that manga, i wish cameron could tackle naruto lol.

Do you guys think that avatar 2 will take the place of jakes kid or somthing,trying to see other worlds outside of pandora and jake tries to stop his daughter\ son from achieving that dream or somthing along those lines.

 

[Bamboota]

This is hilarious! A forum thread dedicated to help people deal with the depression they're experiencing because Pandora isn't real.


https://avatar-forums.com/showthread.php?t=43

Original Poster:

I recently read on the Avatar TypePad Blog, that people are becoming depressed because of the movie. People are realizing that the dream can't actually come true. I was trying to start a thread where people gave ideas on how to cope with it, as in reading Avatar stuff, Writing ( about avatar of course), painting, or whatever.

Person Coping:
After I watched Avatar at the first time, I trully felt depressed as I "wake" up in this world again.
So after few days, I went to cinema and watched it again for the second time to relieve the depression and hopeless feeling.
Now I listen to the soundtrack and share my views in this forum. It really helps.

Person Offering Advice:
Start living like Neytiri: in touch with nature, the environment, and not being greedy and wasteful. Pass on the burger, for something more healthy for you and less cruel to animals. Spend your time on this forum, or volunteering in your free time, instead of getting high or drinking, twiddling your thumbs, being apathetic and complaining about how bad the world is. Don't get swept away by the wave of negativity, live your dream. Your life has only two switches, to shine or not to shine. There is no "apathy" setting. If you're on apathy setting you might as well sign your world away to destruction. When you get discouraged by everyone around you, be courageous like Jake, and jump on the leonopteryx. Be the change you want to see in your world. There are only so many people on this earth, the more of them that are doing positive things, the less of them that are out there doing negative things. It's unfortunate that we live in a world where, just by pulling a trigger or making a corporate decision, one single greedy human being can wipe out the hard works of love of many people. But this is why we need to stop focusing on money and start focusing on our environment. Because we have the intelligence to kill ourselves, but not the wisdom to stop it. What will our money buy, when everything that is worth having is destroyed? The only way you can fill the emptiness you feel after this movie, is to jump on the leonopteryx.

Now depression, no matter what brings it on, isn't funny. So I'm not making fun of these people. But what I am saying is if you can't go around beating yourself up every time a fictional universe isn't real. If that was the case I would have offed myself years ago when I didn't find anything but suit jackets in my grandmother's wardrobe.

Also thought i post up a video with Olivia Munn As A Na'vi in a Thelma And Louise II parody...it's meh...but whatever:

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="https://www.youtube.com/v/ogUmnW2DMr8&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&hl=en_US&feature=player_embedded&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"></param><embed src="https://www.youtube.com/v/ogUmnW2DMr8&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&hl=en_US&feature=player_embedded&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

 

[cr`]

It's funny, but can you blame the guy? He took a basic story structure we've seen 1000 times before and retold it in his own, style and visual bravado.

Like someone said before, you can make most stories and movies from like 6 main plot structures. Ya got good guys, you got the main hero You got the villians. Some good guys are gonna die, but in the end the good guys wins. Premise of every Star Wars movie too.

i'm not talking about basic good guy vs bad guy formula. i'm talking about plotpoints that run from a to b to c to d in such a predictable manner.

look, i was one of those poster who actually said every movie borrows from every other movies. i dont mind familiar concept told in a new way. if anyone read my posts before the film's release, actually that was exactly what i was expecting from avatar. but just because the concept/formula is borrowed doesnt mean the story beats have to run exactly the same.

 

[galactiboy]

This is hilarious! A forum thread dedicated to help people deal with the depression they're experiencing because Pandora isn't real.


https://avatar-forums.com/showthread.php?t=43

Wow, glad there are losers out there that make me feel even better about myself

 

[ironwez20]

I know its kinda sad when you take a movie that seriously. Were collectors of movie merch and other stuff and so on but wow. thats just really wierd.