JND / Kojun Works: The Dark Knight Rises - 1/6 Selina Kyle / Catwoman

[Nick D]

Nolan waited three months after the success of Batman Begins, then wanted to begin discussion about the sequel after seeing how it played out, on his own.

Originally he didn’t put the Joker card in the finale to tell people Joker was definitely coming, just thought that was a good way to close as he had no idea how it’d perform.

After the success, WB asked him if he had anything left to tell and he said yes.

Heath and Nolan saw eye to eye completely regarding direction before a script was ever produced.

He was probably quite fatigued with the material and production at large by the time he was knee deep in production on Rises but he wanted to make it.

The entire trilogy was his intention but more so as each installment played out, not from day one.

 

[Scout Trooper]

I think he was always in for a trilogy to tell Bruce’s arc, except he had it planned out with Heath coming back for the third. Once that was out of the picture, it was a case of making something workable that still told the story he wanted to tell but you can tell there is an element of just wanting to be over with it in the final execution

I doubt he was thinking about a Trilogy early on. He took on the first film without any intention or commitment to return for another (although he hadn't ruled out the possibility). He's on record saying it. He then took a similar approach with The Dark Knight. I'm not sure when the conversations for a third film started. But it may not have been until after TDK released, and Ledger's tragic passing.

 

[intothevoid]

I doubt he was thinking about a Trilogy early on. He took on the first film without any intention or commitment to return for another (although he hadn't ruled out the possibility). He's on record saying it. He then took a similar approach with The Dark Knight. I'm not sure when the conversations for a third film started. But it may not have been until after TDK released, and Ledger's tragic passing.

I don’t think he’s necessarily being completely honest though in those interviews - when he planted the Joker seed at the end of Begins he had to have been thinking of how the story would continue.

With TDK there was a sense of him quickly wrapping the two face arc so as not to leave any unfinished ideas on the table for the third, but from what I’ve heard Joker was absolutely planned to continue his arc in the third as one of the escaped prisoners after the fall of Gotham - I can’t remember where I heard this but apparently he was supposed to be in Scarecrow’s place running the Kangaroo court amongst other things

 

[Scout Trooper]

I don’t think he’s necessarily being completely honest though in those interviews - when he planted the Joker seed at the end of Begins he had to have been thinking of how the story would continue.

With TDK there was a sense of him quickly wrapping the two face arc so as not to leave any unfinished ideas on the table for the third, but from what I’ve heard Joker was absolutely planned to continue his arc in the third as one of the escaped prisoners after the fall of Gotham - I can’t remember where I heard this but apparently he was supposed to be in Scarecrow’s place running the Kangaroo court amongst other things

Maybe he knew Joker would be the character he'd take on if he were to make another. But I don't see the card as any kind of promise. Just a cool easter egg to give the world some open ended expansion.

I don't know how Joker could have played into Rises, but I can't see Ledger being brought back only to be handed a secondary role like Scarecrow.

He'd also trump the main villain, which would undermine the narrative.

 

[Nick D]

Nolan wrapping up quickly regarding Two Face was because of his commitment to realism and the character no longer had a will to live, narratively,
he took care of everyone responsible for her death,
then wanted to join her in it.

Two Face doesn’t make it two days in Nolan’s world which is the reason for the degree of burn damage applied instead of going for a more subtle survivable approach.

Rises wasn’t a real thought for a while after TDK.
They needed a break after the emotional highs and lows experienced from the beginning of TDK’s production to the film’s release. He still felt like he had a closing final chapter to tell, but he wasn’t in a rush.

 

[HyperDrive]

Oh, I was referring to JazzInc’s Pfeiffer Catwoman.

I’m sitting out the JND figures / hyperrealistic customs. I have a fairly established collection of live action Batman figures across Hot Toys, Inart, and third party, and I don’t want to introduce a new, vastly more detailed line into the mix, and then feel like all my other figures suck and need to replace them.

D’oh! I misread. I tend to forget about that JazzInc ‘92 Catwoman.

And yeah, I feel that. I made that realization long ago lol.. My INART figs have made my Hot Toys look like little toys. Almost like they’re 1/12 but scaled up, if that makes sense.

Good thing I plan to display them apart from each other so the disparity isn’t too apparent on the shelf!

 

[HyperDrive]

I also find it funny how you choose to ignore me @Nick D, but whenever I mess up, and someone either corrects me or “puts me in my place” lol, you’re the first to give that a like, just like my other “haters”. Nick, just know that while I may not agree with you 100% of the time, it’s not like I’ve got anything against you lmao, or anyone for that matter. I get most of y’all despise me, but idk, perhaps I don’t take this hobby so seriously as some of y’all.

 

[Chopper Face]

People be complaining about the price of a figure, and then buy 15 £300 figures in a year...

 

[sabin23]

JND is going for a Rolex type business model - charge a premium to a dedicated customer base and create artificial demand by restraining supply.

Lower sales volume but higher margins - the opposite of Hot Toys. There are different ways to skin a cat.

As long JND is making a profit and their balance sheet is healthy, I don’t see them changing their niche in the collectible industry.

As a collector with no specific brand loyalty, it’s nice having so many options compared to what we had just a decade ago when it was basically Hot Toys, Sideshow, some lesser licensed companies (Enterbay, Blitzway, Asmus, etc) and some very poor 3rd party figures.

 

[Nick D]

JND is going for a Rolex type business model - charge a premium to a dedicated customer base and create artificial demand by restraining supply.

Lower sales volume but higher margins - the opposite of Hot Toys. There are different ways to skin a cat.

I think this is a common misconception about them and their business model which makes people unjustly view them negatively.

To a degree, yes putting a cap on edition size helps drive demand, for any product that has some form of attention on it.

But it isn’t the sole reason they’ve done this since their establishment.

Everything is produced in-house with materials that aren’t common place in the business or to outsource, how often do they implement plastic?

The company isn’t based in China like their competitors, paying factory workers lousy salaries and overworking them, therefore a far more expensive process.

Their extremely limited numbers are mostly due to that being all they’re comfortable with producing on a given release to maintain their standard of quality and not to overwork their artists.

If they thought they could effectively produce and move 10K units of this Catwoman at the prototype’s level, in a timely manner, for their asking price, they would. Imagine you yourself in their shoes trying to produce that many with a fully realized skull underneath, you’d never finish.

We have no clue how big of an operation Hot Toys is to where they’re seemingly able to just pump out release after release, constant varying degrees of edition sizes, almost effortlessly it would seem.

One thing is for sure, if Hot Toys began using the same tech as JND, the prices and edition size would reflect that.

That is exactly what happened when they came up with the Artisan line to compete with InArt.

 

[Lokki]

Maybe we need to be careful with the use of the term "technology" in regards to these JND figures.

If we're being brutally honest, they "fixed" a problem that never existed. No one really needs an endo skeleton, and no one was really asking for a seamless neck - while these things are "nice" - they also have massive drawbacks - and I'm talking about kitbashing, and upgrades.

In terms of JND's business model - unless someone is directly involved with the JND operations, I would assume any information from a third party, is speculation at worst, and at best, strategic information passed over from an "inside" source. From what I can see, as an outsider is the following:

1) Reduction of ES for 1/3 scale pieces going forward - one might ask why? could it be linked to a lower demand?

2) A number of "Sold Out" pieces have returned to stock, for a second "release" - and in some specific cases, are still on sale now - meaning the restock was a significant size!

3) The reception of their Kojun line has been lukewarm - at best - with most collectors favouring Hot Toys of InArt

4) JND continues to copy / follow the same tired I.P's as the other companies - but charging significantly more for the same characters

 

[shadows]

Sounds like speculation from Nick D on JND's operations indeed. I don't know much about JND, I just browsed their offerings briefly in the past and I have no brand loyalty - I buy from whoever brings out banger releases at a price I like.

I don't like any of JND's pricing period, their Birds of Prey Harley Quinn was outrageous money and the likeness wasn't even good, seriously. Their TDK Armory pricing is also outrageous, can't remember how much but way more than HT's 2.0, and the HT's Bruce Wayne looks better.

(Edit: Although Harley is 1/3, my opinion remains unchanged)