Kaustic Plastik / Infinite Statue / SD Toys - 1/6 Universal Monsters

[mattjack]

Lust for a Vampire was part two of the Karnstein trilogy, that included The Vampire Lovers and Twins of Evil.
They maybe a little racy for some, but an enjoyable watch.

I saw Twins of Evil. I remember the twins.
But I think I didn't see the second one.

 

[batsheva]

It's probably too "dated" for kids. Or maybe they can appreciate the designs but without taking these monsters seriously. Theses designs have been used in cartoons and parodies way too often. Also in Hallowenn masks form. It's more "fun horror" I think for them.

Ah, this makes sense!
When I first saw them in the 90s, I didn't see the parodies and cartoons of the classic monsters as it hasn't been made yet, or there's only just a few of em.
But nowadays, just like you said, the 2000 kids see the design in many parodies and fun cartoons so they don't feel the "horror" anymore.

Although for me personally, even though I have seen the parodies and cartoons.. something about the monsters from the old movies still gives me the creeps. The silent-ness and the look of them. It still scares me a bit, when I see the movie.

Thank you !

I'm a little less motivated right now because of those damn AI that can probably do drawings better than me...
Thankfully it's not my job to do art. I would be depressed

The one i'm currently working on is a Charlie's Angels movie poster with modern actresses.
Yeah I know pretty mych all the movies are bad. But it's about imagining a casting and making a cool poster.

Hey man, you did great, don't be less motivated!
I work as an artist, and I still feel that AI won't be able to fully replace us, human artist.
Keep working on your art, looking forward to see more!

 

[Kebron]

No, you don’t get it.

What I said was, the first time I see and hooked by the classic monsters, it was not because of nostalgia. It was because of the design. As a kid, I love the design. The look of the classic monster. I instantly love them without the nostalgia factor.

Nostalgia: longing for or thinking fondly of a past time or condition.

When I first see them as a kid, I have no nostalgia of any past with the classic monsters. Because I have never seen them before.

Thats what I want to know with nowadays kids: do they feel the same attraction to the classic monsters as I do back then, when they first see the classic monster design?

Has nothing to do with nostalgia.

Then, I said “of couse now I feel nostalgia with the classic monsters” because at my age now, I have the memory of my childhood when the first time I saw the monsters. But it has nothing to do with my question.

Do you get it?

Lol. What you aren’t getting is that I was talking about today, in my original statement that you responded to saying that it wasn’t nostalgia. It’s pure nostalgia because we are adults all who saw these characters for the first time as kids.

Seriously go re read the original statement that you responded to and read what I was responding to in that statement. I was saying why we as adults feel the pull to these older incarnations and reject the newer ones. I wasn’t talking about what drew us as kids to enjoy these creatures as you thought I was.

 

[batsheva]

Lol. What you aren’t getting is that I was talking about today, in my original statement that you responded to saying that it wasn’t nostalgia. It’s pure nostalgia because we are adults all who saw these characters for the first time as kids.

Seriously go re read the original statement that you responded to and read what I was responding to in that statement. I was saying why we as adults feel the pull to these older incarnations and reject the newer ones. I wasn’t talking about what drew us as kids to enjoy these creatures as you thought I was.

You are the one who first responded to my statement with "nostalgia", and I am just telling you that it's not what I feel personally. For me as a kid back then, it is not nostalgia as I love it when I first see it, with no past experience at all.
And at my age now, I still prefer the classic design, but not because of the nostalgic feeling.

You can say nostalgia for yourself, yes, but for me, it wasn't nostalgia. And I know myself better than anyone else.
Do I feel nostalgic when I see the classic designs? yes, of course! But that's not why I prefer the classic.
The nostalgia feeling doesn't mean that I will always prefer the old one over the new one.
It's like feeling nostalgic for my old home, but even with that feeling, I still prefer my new home.
So the preference for the classic monsters for me, has nothing to do with nostalgia. It has more to do with the designs and look of the classic Monsters itself, which I think is still miles better than the updated one.

here is my statement that you respond with "nostalgia", and mind you, I was not responding to any of your statements when I wrote this:

From our standpoint, I think we can all say (at least generally here in this thread) that we don't like the update on the monsters. But maybe for the younger generations.. do they actually think the original monster design is boring? or unappealing?

The monsters were from the 30s, and I'm born 50+ years after, and I think the designs are brilliant. But of course, I can't speak for the 2000's kids.. born almost 70 years after..

You responded with nostalgia, and I'm not against it. You be you.
I responded, "For me personally, it is not nostalgia". Because again, for me, it is not the factor of why I prefer the classic design.
Everyone here seems to understand, with Mattjack giving me an insight into what might happen with monsters n younger kids nowadays, which truly makes sense.

So again, to clarify.. in my original statement, my question is not talking about now, at my age, why I like the classic monsters instead of the updated one. But I am talking about me as a kid, loving it at first sight when it was originally created 50 years ago. And why does Universal feel the need to update the design of the monsters? do they think the younger kids nowadays won't feel the same love at first sight as I did when I first saw them back then?

The members here helped me with insights: It's because of parodies, fun cartoons and Halloween decos, and maybe less action or shiny designs that are appealing to kids nowadays.. who knows for sure?

 

[Dr. Anton Phibes]

.. who knows for sure?

 

[Mondragon]

Hey Guys, I just saw this post, sorry, I haven't been on the boards much, been very busy. Im so glad you guys like the new Monsters! I did sculpt the Frankenstein, Bride, and Mummy for the KP line. Sd Toys is a European distributor partner that secured the license with KP. Your wallets don't have to quake, as there will be several price levels for Standard, Delux, and Exclusive, so no one has to miss this awesome collection. They will come with multiple hands and very cool features/accessories. The Bride has sculpted hair, not rooted. the poster are my renders that I colored based off the original Pantone colors we could find from the films, but pending licensor approvals.....so not final color. Fabio the art Director did a great job putting the collage together for the promo. I did sculpt the London after Midnight Lon Chaney, he does have rooted hair and will be shown at SDCC. I am working on more pieces for them. These are 1/6th figures and there will also be statues coming too in the future. I'll keep you guys posted as Im allowed to drop info..... By the way, you guys are going to love the Mummy Accessory!

Fantastic! Thanks for the info, and any ongoing updates, or production pics.
I you can lean Kaustic into producing a (Edna Tichenor) Luna The Batgirl to go with your excellent Man in The Beaver Hat sculpt, that would be sensational! (or if she is to niche of a character maybe on a crowdfunded basis?)

They really should be a set:
For all the revisits Chaney as the Man in the Beaver Hat figure gets, I do wish some would also offer Luna the Bat Girl (Edna Tichenor). Though not as iconic, she really is quite striking, and belongs with him.

 

[batsheva]

I you can lean Kaustic into producing a Luna The Batgirl to go with your excellent Man in The Beaver Hat sculpt, that would be sensational!

I would definitely buy LUNA!!

 

[Kebron]

You are the one who first responded to my statement with "nostalgia", and I am just telling you that it's not what I feel personally. For me it is not nostalgia as I love it when I first see it, with no past experience at all.
And now, I still prefer the classic design, but not because of the nostalgic feeling.

You can say nostalgia for yourself, yes, but for me, it wasn't nostalgia. And I know myself better than anyone else.
Do I feel nostalgic when I see the classic designs? yes, of course! But that's not why I prefer the classic.
The nostalgia feeling doesn't mean that I will always prefer the old one over the new one.
It's like feeling nostalgic for my old home, but even with that feeling, I still prefer my new home.
So the preference for the classic monsters for me, has nothing to do with nostalgia. It has more to do with the designs and look of the classic Monsters itself, which I think is still miles better than the updated one.

here is my statement that you respond with "nostalgia", and mind you, I was not responding to any of your statements when I wrote this:


You responded with nostalgia, and I'm not against it. You be you.
I responded, "For me personally, it is not nostalgia". Because again, for me, it is not the factor of why I prefer the classic design.
Everyone here seems to understand, with Mattjack giving me an insight into what might happen with monsters n younger kids nowadays, which truly makes sense.

So again, to clarify.. in my original statement, my question is not talking about now, at my age, why I like the classic monsters instead of the updated one. But I am talking about me as a kid, loving it at first sight when it was originally created 50 years ago. And why does Universal feel the need to update the design of the monsters? do they think the younger kids nowadays won't feel the same love at first sight as I did when I first saw them back then?

The members here helped me with insights: It's because of parodies, fun cartoons and Halloween decos, and maybe less action or shiny designs that are appealing to kids nowadays.. who knows for sure?

Yes I responded to this part in particular.

“From our standpoint, I think we can all say (at least generally here in this thread) that we don't like the update on the monsters.”

My “its’s nostalgia” comment was to that part.

You seem to think I was addressing you in that statement. I wasn’t. I was talking in general like you were.

Nostalgia is what makes accepting new designs and looks hard for older audiences to accept. Which is what I was answering. It’s why people love their first Doctor who, despite later ones being superior show and acting wise. It’s why people love the first Enterprise despite it looking a little dated compared to the refit.


You then I guess took it personal and recounted your child hood and falling in love with the outfits. That’s reminiscing, which is something that happens when you feel nostalgic.

Here’s the thing with nostalgia. You may feel it’s not nostalgia you can write paragraphs explaining how you feel it’s not. But those first impressions during childhood make a hard imprint on us. That imprint influences us.

So go ahead and say it’s not nostalgia. But from everything you have said so far. From my view it plays a part in your attachment to the original designs. And that’s ok.

Let’s return the thread to its regular viewing. Reply to me in PMs please if you feel you must.

 

[batsheva]

Yes I responded to this part in particular.

“From our standpoint, I think we can all say (at least generally here in this thread) that we don't like the update on the monsters.”

My “its’s nostalgia” comment was to that part.
You seem to think I was addressing you in that statement. I wasn’t. I was talking in general like you were.

Sure, but that was not the question I was asking in my statement, hence me being confused at first, but then I understood and responded "For me personally it's not nostalgia", meaning it's just for me, my reasoning is personal. Not because I feel that you are addressing me, but just wanted to state my opinion on the nostalgic factor.

Nostalgia is what makes accepting new designs and looks hard for older audiences to accept. Which is what I was answering. It’s why people love their first Doctor who, despite later ones being superior show and acting wise. It’s why people love the first Enterprise despite it looking a little dated compared to the refit.

That is true, but doesn't always apply to all, or everyone. Hence me adding "for me personally".
Batman, for instance, I grew up with Neal Adams Batman, but I prefer the modern (pre-rebirth) Batman design. I grew up watching Adam West Batman but I prefer the Keaton Batman design. Nostalgia is a factor but not strong enough to make me pick one after another.

You then I guess took it personal and recounted your child hood and falling in love with the outfits. That’s reminiscing, which is something that happens when you feel nostalgic.

Yes, I'm not denying I feel the nostalgia, but I'm just explaining that nostalgia is not the factor here, for me when I was a kid, or now as an adult

Here’s the thing with nostalgia. You may feel it’s not nostalgia you can write paragraphs explaining how you feel it’s not. But those first impressions during childhood make a hard imprint on us. That imprint influences us.

I understand that, but I also know how I feel personally. I know for sure if the new updated design is better in terms of look and design, I might like it better than the classic one. I am an artist so visual takes a good part on my preference.. and personally I still love the classic design over the updated one.

So go ahead and say it’s not nostalgia. But from everything you have said so far. From my view it plays a part in your attachment to the original designs. And that’s ok.

That is from your view, so go ahead if you want to think that way. But in case you want to know the truth (and this is coming from me, myself, and the one who feels it.. so I know what I have in mind), nostalgia does exist, but I do not pick the classic one over the updated version because of it.

Let’s return the thread to its regular viewing. Reply to me in PMs please if you feel you must.

Let's do, and likewise, you can PM me if you need further explanation.


Back to the topic, I just found the ref picture for my Frankenstein bust by J. Hammond:

I hope this expression is chosen as one of the extra Monster heads!

 

[pixletwin]

Warning: Please stay on topic. (ie insisting on what other people's emotions are or are not, is not on topic)

 

[vaanrose]

It's probably too "dated" for kids. Or maybe they can appreciate the designs but without taking these monsters seriously. Theses designs have been used in cartoons and parodies way too often. Also in Hallowenn masks form. It's more "fun horror" I think for them.

The cartoons and parodies are big part of the reason the designs feel so timeless, perhaps ironically, given how much Universal fights anybody that gets too close to them. The designs have been reinforced for decades, and it's why attempting to redesign them is a fool's errand. The designs could be objectively better, it doesn't matter, the cultural zeitgeist knows what these characters look like, and when you remove Dracula's collared cape and replace it with a leftover prop from a My Chemical Romance video, he ceases to be Dracula.

 

[pixletwin]

I just read Dracula for the first time and yep, written descriptions be damned, it was Bela in my mind. No choice.

 

[batsheva]

The cartoons and parodies are big part of the reason the designs feel so timeless, perhaps ironically, given how much Universal fights anybody that gets too close to them. The designs have been reinforced for decades, and it's why attempting to redesign them is a fool's errand. The designs could be objectively better, it doesn't matter, the cultural zeitgeist knows what these characters look like, and when you remove Dracula's collared cape and replace it with a leftover prop from a My Chemical Romance video, he ceases to be Dracula.

Design and look wise, I agree with this.
But I think mattjack's trying to say that because of the "familiarity", the feelings of "mysteriousness" is now gone, and the horror feeling is slowly replaced with "scary but fun", hence the redesign..
Remember that we fear the unknown.

But looking at the updated versions of the monsters.. they are not scary at all (to me), they are.. superhero-ish.

 

[mattjack]

I just read Dracula for the first time and yep, written descriptions be damned, it was Bela in my mind. No choice.

The funny thing is, in the book, he has grey hair and a mustache. And to me now, with the Hammer movies in my head, Dracula looks like this :

It's one of the reasons why I made a Dracula custom based on the Dooku figure :

 

[GhostBeard]

Have you been to Universal? Their theming is top notch. No reason to think the Dark Universe area will look like something from Spirit Halloween.

If you are looking at current photos, well the land is still under construction it's not done yet. In promo material they have talked about the significance of the burning windmill. Victor Frankenstein is in the backstory of the land. He's the great great grandfather of Victoria.

As for the windmill...it's a theme park, it's a neat effect, something to look at. You are WWWAAAYYY over thinking it.

As for Galaxy's Edge...I don't know what to tell you, they do have stormtroopers and the Falcon. I've been there several times.


Character designs aside, everything Universal has shown for Dark Universe looks fun and immersive and I look forward to being there when they open next year.

Galaxy's Edge has an altered Falcon ship because Lucas retained some toy & merchandizing rights. Look closely at details like the satellite on top for example and you'll see they changed details to avoid paying Lucas anything for its use. Because of KK's mandates WDW only uses those plastic looking uniforms from the ST First Order nonsense and not the classic Stormtroopers we all grew up with. I have also been there several times, we're passholders but I am pretty sure we're letting that lapse this year.

As for the windmill ... they are the ones who are supposed to be WWWAAAYYY overthinking it, it's a theme park and not an amusement park. There's a significant difference. We were at US Orlando a couple years ago for a week, and opted not to use the last day as they were giving passes away at the time but we didn't want to wade through those US crowds, which are distinctly different from Disney crowds in ways I won't go into here.

Their theming is ok, if dated throughout most of the park save HP and Simpsons. Marvel was ok about 30 years ago but I don't think they can touch 90s land for fear of losing something in the rights they have for Marvel east of the Mississippi. From the mock ups I've seen, which are always better than the actual finished product (just look at the most recent Disney mock ups and the less than stellar results they ended up with) the Monsters land imagines a brightly lit village/land with Halloween evoking colors on the peripheral that look nothing (to my eyes) like the classic Universal Monster movies. That along with the "updated" Monsters designs, which will look dated in less than decade IMO, give a theme park look but do not transport someone onto the movie sets of these classic films, which was the initial idea Walt had that US is attempting to ape (which they did fairly well with Harry Potter).

As for the windmill, yes I am trying to figure out the reasoning for including it in the story of the park, other than it looks cool and it's from the end of Frankenstein. EVERY element in these parks must make thematic sense and tell a cohesive story. Again, that's the point. It's why some recent additions to EPCOT do not make sense and hurt the park overall.

But if people just want cool rollercoasters and local college students walking around in rubber masks and make-up, then that's fine, and that's an amusement park. That's Six Flags. That's not why people fork over the bigger bucks for parks like WDW and US.

I was really looking forward to this, and to be honest we have kids in the family who LOVE Mario so I'm assuming we'll go back for that and then experience their Monsters area, and maybe it will be enjoyable. But it will never feel like living in those classic movies. It's fine. But it could have been great. And all this doesn't take a lot of effort to sort out. When you are passionate about something, it comes easy.

 

[GhostBeard]

I just read Dracula for the first time and yep, written descriptions be damned, it was Bela in my mind. No choice.

When I read it (as I do every year) I imagine Lee with a huge, white mustache. I would also recommend listening to the audio book read by Lee, it's phenomenal.

 

[GhostBeard]

Do I feel nostalgic when I see the classic designs? yes, of course! But that's not why I prefer the classic.

The classic designs do not endure because of nostalgia, they endure for the specific, physical aspects of the make-ups and actors' likenesses in those roles. Updates on those will always feel watered down and derivative because at their core that is exactly the essence of those "updates."

 

[xipotec]

That, and also the more frightening thing is : kids watch tiktok, they don't even have the attention span to watch a movie...let alone an old movie that takes its time and doesn't use quick cuts every 3 seconds.
It's sad and really concerning for their ability to focus on something (to learn, to be good at a job.) I hope I'm just pessimistic and tiktok isn't really rotting their brain...

Same reason no one reads anymore, anything longer than a meme doesn't give enough dopamine quick enough.

 

[batsheva]

The classic designs do not endure because of nostalgia, they endure for the specific, physical aspects of the make-ups and actors' likenesses in those roles. Updates on those will always feel watered down and derivative because at their core that is exactly the essence of those "updates."

Yes!!
Well said, sir.

 

[Kebron]

Galaxy's Edge has an altered Falcon ship because Lucas retained some toy & merchandizing rights. Look closely at details like the satellite on top for example and you'll see they changed details to avoid paying Lucas anything for its use. Because of KK's mandates WDW only uses those plastic looking uniforms from the ST First Order nonsense and not the classic Stormtroopers we all grew up with. I have also been there several times, we're passholders but I am pretty sure we're letting that lapse this year.

As for the windmill ... they are the ones who are supposed to be WWWAAAYYY overthinking it, it's a theme park and not an amusement park. There's a significant difference. We were at US Orlando a couple years ago for a week, and opted not to use the last day as they were giving passes away at the time but we didn't want to wade through those US crowds, which are distinctly different from Disney crowds in ways I won't go into here.

Their theming is ok, if dated throughout most of the park save HP and Simpsons. Marvel was ok about 30 years ago but I don't think they can touch 90s land for fear of losing something in the rights they have for Marvel east of the Mississippi. From the mock ups I've seen, which are always better than the actual finished product (just look at the most recent Disney mock ups and the less than stellar results they ended up with) the Monsters land imagines a brightly lit village/land with Halloween evoking colors on the peripheral that look nothing (to my eyes) like the classic Universal Monster movies. That along with the "updated" Monsters designs, which will look dated in less than decade IMO, give a theme park look but do not transport someone onto the movie sets of these classic films, which was the initial idea Walt had that US is attempting to ape (which they did fairly well with Harry Potter).

As for the windmill, yes I am trying to figure out the reasoning for including it in the story of the park, other than it looks cool and it's from the end of Frankenstein. EVERY element in these parks must make thematic sense and tell a cohesive story. Again, that's the point. It's why some recent additions to EPCOT do not make sense and hurt the park overall.

But if people just want cool rollercoasters and local college students walking around in rubber masks and make-up, then that's fine, and that's an amusement park. That's Six Flags. That's not why people fork over the bigger bucks for parks like WDW and US.

I was really looking forward to this, and to be honest we have kids in the family who LOVE Mario so I'm assuming we'll go back for that and then experience their Monsters area, and maybe it will be enjoyable. But it will never feel like living in those classic movies. It's fine. But it could have been great. And all this doesn't take a lot of effort to sort out. When you are passionate about something, it comes easy.

FYI I live in Orlando and I’m at all these parks monthly.

I’m not saying it’s the Falcon is the same as the OT Falcon. I’m saying it’s the actual Falcon. Just like the Stormtroopers that are there are actual Stormtroopers. Something you said they aren’t. KK doesn’t mandate anything at WDW. Parks is a totally different division from Lucasfilms.

Concerning the burning windmill did you watch the video Universal put out last month? It gives a bit of the story. It’s a tavern now run by a group that hunts the monsters and you’ll get to interact with them.

Universal has overtaken Disney when it comes to themeing. Started with HP and every area since has had the same standard. Disney has stagnated. They coast by in fan loyalty now. I could go into detailed specifics but this isn’t the place for it.

It flat out won’t be the same as the classic movies. For one it will be in color but it’s going to have some of the feel from all the material I’ve read/watched. I have faith they will be able to pull it off, and who knows maybe we will see a resurgence in Universal Monsters.