LOST discussion - thar be spoilers ahead!

[beeshaw]

I'm going with this:

The bomb was not the reason that island sank. Something else happened. The bomb was in fact supposed to go off thus creating the 'current timeline' with all the Losties currently in 2007. I think this 2004 Flight 815 redux timeline is a result of something that has yet to happen. They've thrown us for a loop so many times with flash backs/forwards that this is just one more out-of-context to throw us off element.

 

[Entropy]

By the end of the series, I see the island and it's magic 'lost'/destroyed/inaccessible to anyone post 2007, Fall of the House of Usher/The Tempest style, so the island sunk fits with that. Surely the bomb's detonation affected the island more than simply sending them back to 2007, but I can definitely see the 'reset' events being caused from something other than the bomb and that the 'reset' events are the end story for most of the characters - but no way Jack, Kate or Locke are living out the rest of their days on the mainland. Their 'LA X' versions will find the island somehow, even if they have to go to the past, with Ellie's and/or Widmore's help 'natch, to get there. But they've already played out that "we have to go back" storyline.

Obviously, Jack's neck cut, Desmond's appearance on the plane and Juliet's "we should have coffee sometime" line to Sawyer were set ups for payoffs & reveals later in the season.

I'm still interested in what/who is Jacob? MiB appears to be a supernatural creature/demon/devil trapped on the island somehow but is Jacob also? We know he can leave the island unlike MiB. He doesn't age, but neither does Richard and Richard is just a man who possibly used the Lazarus Pit water while uninjured (would explain why he's "immortal" and Sayid and Ben, maybe Illana as well, are not). Perhaps Jacob is just a man too, one of the first, if not the very first, to crash on the island (who first used this fountain of youth?), and he entered some sort of contest/bet with this demon. If so, perhaps his "power" is simply foreknowledge of the events that will come to pass on the island he received from some future someone (Jack)?

Someone healed Locke and Rose, but maybe it was MiB/the island and not Jacob's doing. For whatever reasons, the ability of the MiB to leave the island and "go home" seems tied to his killing Jacob, winning the wager and controlling or destroying whoever/whatever Jacob was protecting (the temple & water?). And how could he "go home"? physically via Frozen Donkey Wheel or philosophically through some spiritual release/death? And if he does leave the island and go home, and his power is tied to that of the island itself, could his departure/defeat be the cause of the island sinking? Whatever it is, a free demon/devil/supernatural evil dude is never a good thing for the rest of the world.

 

[Agent0028]

This was what I was thinking too - they all became better people because of the adversity on the island and I think the new reality will show that they are less fulfilled because they never crashed.



Lots of changes have to take place, such as Desmond being on the plane (what book was he reading?). But if Hurley is no longer cursed and the hatch never existed, thus the numbers never existed, then how did Hurley win the lottery?

Desmond being on the plane makes sense to me because he can't be on the island sense its under water. Exactly why he is ont he plane obviously we can't know yet, but I assume its the same reason why all these people have crossed paths before. But Shannon and Boone don't seem to be as intertwined with others as far as I can rember.

 

[UTtoyfan]

I just saw this on Youtube and thought it was really well done!
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Can't wait for Tuesday!

 

[beeshaw]

Surely the bomb's detonation affected the island more than simply sending them back to 2007

I'm not sold in this (yet). I'm sticking with Faraday's 'What ever happened, happened'' (even though the Jughead time-reset was his idea). I keep going back to the 'I watched your friends die' moment, which a lot of us thought at that point was them flashing 'back to the future' (heh). I think that's exactly what happened, and what was supposed to have happened, because it already did. (?)

 

[beeshaw]

Desmond being on the plane makes sense to me because he can't be on the island sense its under water. Exactly why he is ont he plane obviously we can't know yet, but I assume its the same reason why all these people have crossed paths before. But Shannon and Boone don't seem to be as intertwined with others as far as I can rember.

Shannon and Boone really weren't were they?

And if Desmond stuck around on the plane, I'd agree with you. But they made a point of him leaving, and really, having no one else acknowledge him. To the point of Jack asking where he went and Rose just saying she was sleeping.

 

[Entropy]

I'm not sold in this (yet). I'm sticking with Faraday's 'What ever happened, happened'' (even though the Jughead time-reset was his idea).

I don't think they're mutually exclusive.

Exploding a nuclear bomb next to the 'special stuff' only sends those in the vicinity ahead in time? seems like there'd be more dramatic fallout.

 

[Lookin4Precious]

I'm calling the last shots of the series to be a montage showing all our characters in their lives off island (however they play out in the "alt" world) intercut with the rising waters of the ocean, as the island sinks out of sight and off of our television sets forever....

 

[pixletwin]

That was really cool!

I just saw this on Youtube and thought it was really well done!
<object width="560" height="340"><param name="movie" value="https://www.youtube.com/v/MKcKtjrL5bc&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="https://www.youtube.com/v/MKcKtjrL5bc&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="560" height="340"></embed></object>

Can't wait for Tuesday!

 

[Moonloop]

Desmond being on the plane makes sense to me because he can't be on the island sense its under water. Exactly why he is ont he plane obviously we can't know yet, but I assume its the same reason why all these people have crossed paths before. But Shannon and Boone don't seem to be as intertwined with others as far as I can rember.

They've always said Desmond is 'special', and I now think that is going to come into play. Desmond knows what is going on in both the time line from season 1-5 and the Alt. time line, and he is playing his part to make sure the Losties all end up where they are suppose to be (he is also time traveling between the two).

I ultimately think he is trying to have both time lines come back together into one main/real time line. But Desmond is going to play a big part I believe.

 

[Agent0028]

That's a good thoery. The only way I can see a timeline merge is if at some point they do something that causes the plane not to crash. If its by their actions that the plane doesn't crash then everything that happened on the island did indeed happen, although they will have no ability to remember it. I don't know if that even makes sense. But its the horse I'm currently betting on.

 

[Memnoch]

That video was freaking AWESOME. Interesting the plane breaks apart when the book club brings up free will.

 

[Agent0028]

Didn't have time to watch the video before so I just went back and watched and it is awesome. I noticed another difference. In the first crash Jack drinks the little bottle, but if I recall correctly during the second crash he pockets it. It was also neat to see the exact same scene of Charlie passing Jack from the two different view points.

Also seeing the crash from the pilot really reminds me of the first time I watched Lost thinking it was going to be a ridiculous attempt at a drama version of Gilligan's Island that would be canceled very quickly. In fact I even remember commenting to someone that I was watching a stupid show because I had nothing better to do. I've never been so happy to be wrong.

 

[beeshaw]

I don't think they're mutually exclusive.

Exploding a nuclear bomb next to the 'special stuff' only sends those in the vicinity ahead in time? seems like there'd be more dramatic fallout.

Hmm... once they detonated the bomb, their job was done. They flashed back. I don't think the actual 'explosion' is what caused them to flash, just the act of fulfilling their 'destiny'. As far if the bomb ACTUALLY exploded... we haven't seen that. They've implied tons of things in this show, just to flip that expectation on it's head. Who's to say that Faraday was wrong and the 'pocket' messed with the bomb itself. Maybe it wasn't a full explosion. Maybe it got sucked into the pocket....

 

[Moonloop]

Didn't have time to watch the video before so I just went back and watched and it is awesome. I noticed another difference. In the first crash Jack drinks the little bottle, but if I recall correctly during the second crash he pockets it.

Actually in the first crash, Jack is given two bottles. He drinks one and pockets the other.

The 2nd "crash" (though not really) he is given one bottle....he opens it and begins to pour it but the turbulence causes him to spill it and then he pockets it.

 

[Agent0028]

Ah, thanks, I didn't catch her handing him two bottles and somehow I missed him starting to pour the bottle in the second crash. I guess flight would be more appropriate than crash, eh?

 

[Moonloop]

I guess flight would be more appropriate than crash, eh?

Haha, yeah. I am in the habit of calling it 'the 2nd crash' myself, but then I have to remind myself that it never crashed.

 

[Entropy]

I don't think the actual 'explosion' is what caused them to flash, just the act of fulfilling their 'destiny'.

Wasn't that show called 'Quantum Leap'?

Maybe it wasn't a full explosion. Maybe it got sucked into the pocket....

Like the Mars Attack scene when the Martian inhales the nuclear explosion and laughs?

Doesn't wash with me. Again, seems like odd story telling to introduce a nuclear bomb, explode it and it then have zero affect on its surroundings.

 

[YoNoSe]

There are monsters and ghosties and polar beasties. Time travel, instant transmission to far off lands, and full speed collisions into brick walls that result in zero injuries. I'm prepared to accept a limited explosion.
I'm sure it has an effect (the D & C interview even acknowledged that) but it's impossible to determine yet what the effect could be on that island, in that ditch, with that...rock.
Maybe the completely neutral, unreadable all-purpose expression of Elizabeth Mitchel's face confused the bomb into inertia.

 

[Moonloop]

I was thinking about the opening scene in S6 where the Island is underwater......remember in Season 4 after Ben turns the wheel, from the point of view of the helicopter we see a small splash where the island was, as if it went under water.

Maybe part of the island moving involves it going underwater? It might be hard to understand because at the time people were still on the island, but they did experience a flash and the freighter/copter was gone. Maybe during the flash the island goes in some slow mo mode and travels underwater to a new location. And since the people left on the island flash, they do not physically experience that moment which happens in an instant for them.

That is one idea of why the Island is sunk, and since it might have been in the process of moving or hiding at the time the 2nd flight went over, it didn't crash. I think the main point i'm trying to make or contemplate is can the island can be sunk and re-surfaced based on that one scene we see in Season 4.