Man of Steel (SPOILERS)

[Darth Zangetsu]

To be fair, this is a message board where grown men come to complain about superhero dolls.

I also complain about video game and LOTR dolls. I'm a complex individual.

 

[GasparZizou]

To be fair, this is a message board where grown men come to complain about superhero dolls.

I know, I thought we were all man children here

 

[CelticPredator]

How Superman is flying isn't important to the story. It's the story stuff that doesn't quite add up.

 

[Skywalker(OG)Kush]

Actually, no, that's not it.


The original Zod had a superiority complex, he clearly thought everyone was beneath him and had a desire to rule. He offered Jor-El a place at his side before his imprisonment, and Jor-El banished him to hell.

What did Zod say? That he'd make Jor-El knee before him, and one day, his heirs. That's part of his complex, he's a Fascist who wants to command.

Superman is that heir. Now when they land on Earth, he doesn't know that Kal-El lives on it. So what does he do? Upon finding out that the "Planet Huston" is below him and he's now a superior being, he works his way up the ranks and desires to rule the inferior humans. You say he doesn't take care of the world, yet he clearly does. Or did you forget about Superman's absence due to his own hubris and desire to live a mortal life without his powers?

Zod then learns of Superman's existence and learns that it's Jor-El's son. Now his promise to Jor-El can be kept and Zod desires to vanquish Superman and have him kneel and swear loyalty before him.



They show all this. From Zod terrorizing humans, talking in the third person, making belittling comments, threatening to kill Luthor, even after Luthor helps him by disclosing information about Superman.

If what your saying is true then he wouldn't have chased after superman and would have continued to take over the world, destroying everything in his wake until he was ready to deal with Kal el. If he thought he was such a chicken and unworthy why would zod chase after him?? Wouldn't he have felt like he already won and with nothing in his way continue taking over the world. Why even try to have supes kneel before him until after. Supes just left so the world was free for the taking

 

[GasparZizou]

Yep. Zod wanted to be Zod.

MoS, Zod was forced to be Zod.

That's not quite accurate, he wasn't "forced" to be Zod, "forced" kind of implies that it was against his will, when in fact, he was designed to be that.

More like:

S2: Zod wanted to be Zod.

MoS: Zod IS Zod.

 

[Darth Zangetsu]

DiFabio,

Yes, MoS Zod didn't care about anything else but his duty, he was a near unstoppable force, when he had no purpose anymore you could feel his wrath and confusion towards Superman, it was so good, I hate to say this, but every time I heard "Kneel before Zod", not even once I was able to take it seriously, not even as a child.

I guess you can't talk about Superman as a movie without taking into consideration it's comic book attachments.

It you think the story is not "simple" anymore, although it's not one bit complicated, it's because the comics themselves are just as complex, the Krypton you see in MoS is something very similar to what you see in the Birthright comics, and the new 52 action comics are also kinda complex if not more than MoS.

I don't know about you but when I see a movie, if I don't get certain details to a specific situation, my mind fills the holes by itself like, how is Supes flying? Mhm maybe anti-gravity properties in his body, or silly **** like that and MoS gave me exactly what I wanted in that regard

I just feel like everybody praising the Donner movies do it more with a "nostalgia armor" than for what the movie actually is, in my opinion.

I loved when he is on his knees before they fight, and he's realizing he has nothing left except for revenge. "My soul Kal, that's what you have taken from me."

 

[GasparZizou]

How Superman is flying isn't important to the story. It's the story stuff that doesn't quite add up.

Actually, many people have argued over if it is a deed of strength or a skill or a physiological property.

The story stuff adds plenty in terms of sci-fi storytelling, which the comics have had plenty for years now.

 

[jye4ever]

Actually, no, that's not it.


The original Zod had a superiority complex, he clearly thought everyone was beneath him and had a desire to rule. He offered Jor-El a place at his side before his imprisonment, and Jor-El banished him to hell.

What did Zod say? That he'd make Jor-El knee before him, and one day, his heirs.

Superman is that heir. Now when they land on Earth, he doesn't know that Kal-El lives on it. So what does he do? Upon finding out that the "Planet Huston" is below him and that he's a superior being, he works his way up the ranks and desires to rule the inferior humans. You say he doesn't take care of the world, yet he clearly does. Or did you forget about Superman's absence due to his own hubris and desire to live a mortal life without his powers?

Zod then learns of Superman's existence and learns that it's Jor-El's son. Now his promise to Jor-El can be kept and Zod desires to vanquish Superman and have him kneel and swear loyalty before him.



They show all this. From Zod terrorizing humans, talking in the third person, making belittling comments, threatening to kill Luthor, even after Luthor helps him by disclosing information about Superman.

Stakes pretty high if you ask me:


General Zod: The vote must be unanimous, Jor-El. It has therefore now become your decision. You alone will condemn us if you wish, and you alone will be held responsible by me.

 

[Dr.Mirakle32]

I just feel like everybody praising the Donner movies do it more with a "nostalgia armor" than for what the movie actually is, in my opinion.

I'm 22 years old. I watch the 1978 film today, and I see a classic that's just as entertaining as STAR WARS, or RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK. I see MOS, and I see a decent modern-day blockbuster that isn't as well done or as fun as BATMAN BEGINS, THE DARK KNIGHT or THE AVENGERS.

 

[GasparZizou]

I loved when he is on his knees before they fight, and he's realizing he has nothing left except for revenge. "My soul Kal, that's what you have taken from me."

Shannon just nailed it in every single line.

And I love the way he say's Kal!

 

[chewblacca]

Stakes pretty high if you ask me:


General Zod: The vote must be unanimous, Jor-El. It has therefore now become your decision. You alone will condemn us if you wish, and you alone will be held responsible by me.

I agree. The Zod in Superman two had a personal grudge against Superman. The world was his all he wanted, all he needed was to subjugate the son of the man who imprisoned him.

 

[morphosis]

DiFabio,

Yes, MoS Zod didn't care about anything else but his duty, he was a near unstoppable force, when he had no purpose anymore you could feel his wrath and confusion towards Superman, it was so good, I hate to say this, but every time I heard "Kneel before Zod", not even once I was able to take it seriously, not even as a child.

I guess you can't talk about Superman as a movie without taking into consideration it's comic book attachments.

It you think the story is not "simple" anymore, although it's not one bit complicated, it's because the comics themselves are just as complex, the Krypton you see in MoS is something very similar to what you see in the Birthright comics, and the new 52 action comics are also kinda complex if not more than MoS.

I don't know about you but when I see a movie, if I don't get certain details to a specific situation, my mind fills the holes by itself like, how is Supes flying? Mhm maybe anti-gravity properties in his body, or silly **** like that and MoS gave me exactly what I wanted in that regard

I just feel like everybody praising the Donner movies do it more with a "nostalgia armor" than for what the movie actually is, in my opinion.

i agree with this. Filling in the holes within your own mind is one of the key things to movies that people dont even realize is happening. You cannot show every second of every little thing especially a movie like this that has so much going on.

MoS touched on a lot of comics. Last Stand on New Krypton, Godfall, The World of Krypton, Birthright, For All Seasons and new DC52 stuff just to name a few. They definitely did their homework. The scene when Superman is flying over the earth gives me goosebumps every time because i feel (and i have no idea if this was intended or not) but it reminded me of late Michael Turner's amazing and beautiful art of Superman. Its my favorite art of Superman and i have a signed print of it

 

[jye4ever]

I agree. The Zod in Superman two had a personal grudge against Superman. The world was his all he wanted, all he needed was to subjugate the son of the man who imprisoned him.

Sure, not as complicated as an intersteller DNA splicing across an ocean of stars salvation plot line but still fun to watch play out with a great pay off.

 

[CelticPredator]

A movie should never rely on filling stories with your mind. The story should work on a surface level.

 

[chewblacca]

I wonder what the Zod from MOS would have done if Kal did not have the codex and it was destroyed with Krypton? What would there be to rebuild? Would he have gone to another world, or just try and conquer earth because he could?

 

[GasparZizou]

I'm 22 years old. I watch the 1978 film today, and I see a classic that's just as entertaining as STAR WARS, or RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK. I see MOS, and I see a decent modern-day blockbuster that isn't as well done or as fun as BATMAN BEGINS, THE DARK KNIGHT or THE AVENGERS.

Why is age important? I'm 23, I've seen the old Supes movies since I was a kid and watch them again a couple days ago, still don't think of Superman 2 as a classic, Star Wars I agree, and I'm never been a fan of Indiana Jones.

And regarding TDK trilogy, Begins was perfect for me, I have many issues with the next 2 movies but I wouldn't even consider them as just "fun blockbusters", The avengers I would, I think that the Avengers is mindless as ****, but IMO MoS is the best Superman movie, and TDK trilogy is still better than the Burton movies, but not by much.

 

[jye4ever]

I wonder what the Zod from MOS would have done if Kal did not have the codex and it was destroyed with Krypton? What would there be to rebuild? Would he have gone to another world, or just try and conquer earth because he could?

He would be a bored Zod.

 

[chewblacca]

A movie should never rely on filling stories with your mind. The story should work on a surface level.

Exactly, any writer worth his salt puts all his cards on the table and let's us watch how the hand is played.

 

[jye4ever]

Exactly, any writer worth his salt puts all his cards on the table and let's us watch how the hand is played.

I usually only use those for DiFabio or Celtic.

 

[GasparZizou]

A movie should never rely on filling stories with your mind. The story should work on a surface level.

That's what I mean, I have to suspend belief in movies like S2.