MARVEL' S Falcon and the Winter Soldier

[Sassafras]

Sam did not whine, he literally did make a stand and told them to do better in their face in public.

Well, you can look at it that way. I'm trying to recall the greatest speeches I've ever heard, and don't remember ANY of them having "I know a bunch of y'all hate me because I'm black/weird/use a Dell instead of a Mac..." Meanwhile Bucky is reading fan fic about soap and all the innovative speculation from the fangirls/boys about what can be done with a metal arm...

Gawd, I miss President Whitmore. Or Nick Fury. Nick Fury yelling at Tony Stark.

It's like the script was written with a pack of crayons and a couple pounds of weed. The lame fight choreography and poor casting really didn't help, but the biggest problem was the script.

 

[user 64404]

Well, you can look at it that way. I'm trying to recall the greatest speeches I've ever heard, and don't remember ANY of them having "I know a bunch of y'all hate me because I'm black/weird/use a Dell instead of a Mac..." Meanwhile Bucky is reading fan fic about soap and all the innovative speculation from the fangirls/boys about what can be done with a metal arm...

Gawd, I miss President Whitmore. Or Nick Fury. Nick Fury yelling at Tony Stark.

Dude did you even read what you write Oo
He said that because its true, him being Captain America will be way more hated than when he was falcon because of what the mantle represent he is now a political figure, and yes the hated cames from the fact that he is black.

"I know a bunch of y'all hate me because I'm black/weird/use a Dell instead of a Mac..."
Are you really comparing the way society have different treatment to a black and a white person with different brands of computer? are you really this blind?
Sam is leading the discussion by example lecturing the people in charge to be better.

 

[Sassafras]

Dude did you even read what you write Oo
He said that because its true, him being Captain America will be way more hated than when he was falcon because of what the mantle represent he is now a political figure, and yes the hated cames from the fact that he is black.

"I know a bunch of y'all hate me because I'm black/weird/use a Dell instead of a Mac..."
Are you really comparing the way society have different treatment to a black and a white person with different brands of computer? are you really this blind?
Sam is leading the discussion by example lecturing the people in charge to be better.

Oh, I GET what the writers were trying to do. It'd be hard not to, with the sledgehammer, the audience-is-so-stupid writing style that was apparently geared to elementary school kids or the Twitter mob. The showrunner should have had the new Cap use hand puppets and forgot the Spanish translator. Maybe this sounds better in another language.

 

[Khev]

The showrunner should have had the new Cap use hand puppets and forgot the Spanish translator.

 

[Khev]

 

[jye4ever]

And lol @ hand puppets

 

[Wor-Gar]

Doesn't he look a bit like Urkel?

Brilliant analogy up there BTW.

 

[ZE_501]

Doesn't he look a bit like Urkel?

That's JYEbait.

 

[matticus]

This just goes to show that Mackie isn't a good lead in any show or movie. He is a pretty good supporting actor, but can't deliver on a lead. Clearly the writing and direction helped prove that even more. Everything I've liked him in is supporting, but leading like in Altered Carbon S2, series canceled!

 

[jye4ever]

Yesterday was EG 2nd year anniversary.

And here we are lol

 

[Wor-Gar]

This just goes to show that Mackie isn't a good lead in any show or movie.

The suit doesn't help. It's very Avengers 1 Cap.

 

[The Buffinator]

This just goes to show that Mackie isn't a good lead in any show or movie. He is a pretty good supporting actor, but can't deliver on a lead. Clearly the writing and direction helped prove that even more. Everything I've liked him in is supporting, but leading like in Altered Carbon S2, series canceled!

?????????

Are you saying he's not a good lead actor because he wasn't able to elevate the show despite poor writing & directing, or did you think his bad acting dragged down good writing & directing? Based on past comments I'm pretty sure you don't mean the latter, but of all the critics here you're the first I've seen that is actually questioning Mackie's acting chops.

 

[The Buffinator]

Can't believe I'm so down on a show about my fav MCU character, and another fav, but unlike SW, to me these aren't the characters, or the treatment, I was expecting. I mean, I own the 1/4 scale Iron Studios statues of these guys $$$$$.

Look on the bright side - you could be Jaws.

 

[matticus]

?????????

Are you saying he's not a good lead actor because he wasn't able to elevate the show despite poor writing & directing, or did you think his bad acting dragged down good writing & directing? Based on past comments I'm pretty sure you don't mean the latter, but of all the critics here you're the first I've seen that is actually questioning Mackie's acting chops.

He couldn't elevate the show. Maybe just taking someone else's role is difficult enough, but I didn't feel him driving the show. I think he is best at comedy and critiquing others, which has great value in a supporting character. But I don't feel the Evans/Boseman gravitas that I think Sebastian Stan would be better at. I don't have that flaw feeling like I do with the others. I think the writing really didn't bring anything special out of him to make you really feel for him, at least IMO. Giving up the shield instead of having it taken away might have actually made him more of a antagonist for a short period of time to be honest.

 

[Wor-Gar]

Nothing wrong with Mackie, he just doesn't have a strong presence. That's a problem for a lot of good actors.

 

[matticus]

Nothing wrong with Mackie, he just doesn't have a strong presence. That's a problem for a lot of good actors.

Good writing with a focus of direction on Sam could have elevated his talent. I just don't think these D+ shows pass the thorough logic tests like the movies do. Guess these are just filler for the big movies.

 

[Wor-Gar]

I don't know. When Mackie's on screen with Zemo, your eyes go to Zemo... or Walker... or Bucky. They each have more presence.

Mackie was perfectly cast for what he was originally intended for -- a supporting player and buddy for Cap.

 

[e30ernest]

I had the highest expectations for FWS. Not just wishful thinking since my fav MCU character and another fav were involved; IMO it was a no brainer to do a frenemy buddy cop style movie with lots of interesting action. Like Expendables or something.

U didn't even need to explain your characters or skill set. Huge amount of comic material to draw on. A former good guy counsellor dealing with another guy out of time who has some questionable ways of handling an issue, plus having the shield. Lethal Weapon type stuff. Do some jaw dropping action. Throw some poignant moments in.

All the parts were there to do something amazing and they botched it, except for Walker and Zemo. If the previous movies had never happened, or comics, I wouldn't give *&^% about either character. Not that Sam and Bucky resemble the characters I knew anyway. Yeah, there was Covid messing things up; but that doesn't explain a *&^% script.

Now I don't have much hope another fav of mine - Loki - isn't gonna get the cartoon cheese corn treatment.

I guess I didn't have high expectations for FWS because of all the slated releases, this was the most normal Marvel series.

It didn't have the initial intrigue WV, Loki or What If has. WV had the mystery of the sitcom world and the return of Vision, Loki has the multiple timelines and What If has what if scenarios to explore. FWS was always just going to be a buddy-cop type series set in the MCU. The whole super soldier thing has been done before too.

After that, we have a bunch of newer characters coming in. Ms Marvel is interesting to me and so is She Hulk. Hawkeye is less interesting for the same reason that FWS was not that interesting.

I think it's also why I am not as interested in the upcoming BW film. Usually Hollywood doesn't make the best kung-fu/martial arts films (I also still have a bad taste in my mouth from the atrocity that was Iron Fist) so I have very low expectations for Shang-Chi.

 

[Sassafras]

He couldn't elevate the show. Maybe just taking someone else's role is difficult enough, but I didn't feel him driving the show. I think he is best at comedy and critiquing others, which has great value in a supporting character. But I don't feel the Evans/Boseman gravitas that I think Sebastian Stan would be better at. I don't have that flaw feeling like I do with the others. I think the writing really didn't bring anything special out of him to make you really feel for him, at least IMO. Giving up the shield instead of having it taken away might have actually made him more of a antagonist for a short period of time to be honest.

Agree - but if they'd kept the show, I think, to what I thought it was gonna be - more of an @ss whooping Cap dealing with Bucky who still drifts to the edge about how he goes about things (breaking Zemo out was good) and a lot of snark, I'd be binge re-watching.

It's like the writers kinda got that, but then the boat foundered, took on too much ballast, and sank. Sam ends up trying to be the steely-jawed hero and it's miserable; meanwhile Bucky is actually giving old man advice over the phone to some terrorist.

I get what they were trying to do; because the original reason the two men even met is gone; even if you wanted to add dealing with racism there were ways to do that that are less heavy handed, but have clout. I still remember Quill seeing Rocket's back for the first time, and that was a few frames of film.

Meanwhile actor talents get wasted, Mackie doesn't seem like a natural fit for someone being grim all the time; and the only one who seems like they are having fun is Zemo.

 

[jye4ever]

Holy crap it just hit me after reading Sass post.

If Russos Cap was a better Superman than Snyder Superman then Mackie Cap is MCU version of Snyder Superman.

Mopey burdened with heavy wokeness Cap.