No Time To Die (2020 Bond film)

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a-dev said:
Sorry if I'm misunderstanding you here but those nods to the past shouldn't be taken as indicative that Craig's Bond is the same Bond as Pierce Brosnan and certainly not to suggest that Craig's Bond is the same Bond as Roger Moore who was in his 50s in the 1980s and therefore how can Bond still only be in his 50s in the 2020s. That quite simply cannot be the intention because it makes no sense at all continuity-wise. The past Ms in those wall portraits can be seen as just that, past Ms who James Bond never knew, they were all before his time. And this interpretation doesn't require that you subscribe to the idea of James Bond being a codename either - you simply ignore the past movies. They didn't happen as far as Craig's continuity is concerned. In this way the past Ms or the past Q gadgets are just incidental background details included for the benefit of the viewer only as tributes to Bond as a movie franchise.
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Continuity means nothing in the Bond franchise. Every woman Bond ends with at the end of the films disappears by the start of the next film and they're never seen again. Only the supporting cast returns, like M, Q, and Penny. Not even Felix is consistent. Specter often returns with a different Blofeld usually. The reference to old gadgets have also become a staple of the franchise. Like you said, it's for the fans.

I think the first Bond film to have some references to previous movies was OHMSS. That was the first film without Connery, so maybe they were trying to have some kind of continuity? They probably gave up on the idea after the film bombed. Interestingly, it wasn't until For Your Eyes Only starring RogerMoore in the 80s that they referenced Bond's dead wife from the 60s. It was so random. The same heppened in License to Kill with Dalton. By that point, Bonds dead wife had nothing to do with continuity. It was just a background detail like him being an orphan or having a license to kill.

The Craig film series might be the only one that has some kind of self contained plot continuity, but they still reference the old films as a tribute. The filmmakers trust the audience to be a ble to defferentiate which is which. Regardless, the lack of continuity or occasional cherry picked continuity is one of the reasons the Bond franchise has lasted for so long,imo. The franchise is flexible enough to start over fresh, so new fans can get into it but it's also consistent enough to stisfiy the old fans using certain tropes and supporting characters. I don't think any other franchise can get way with such a "f**** it" attitude, enjoy the ride and forget about continuity or "canon."
 
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The Clown Prince of Crime said:
Continuity means nothing in the Bond franchise. Every woman Bond ends with at the end of the films disappears by the start of the next film and they're never seen again. Only the supporting cast returns, like M, Q, and Penny. Not even Felix is consistent. Specter often returns with a different Blofeld usually. The reference to old gadgets have also become a staple of the franchise. Like you said, it's for the fans.

I think the first Bond film to have some references to previous movies was OHMSS. That was the first film without Connery, so maybe they were trying to have some kind of continuity? They probably gave up on the idea after the film bombed. Interestingly, it wasn't until For Your Eyes Only starring RogerMoore in the 80s that they referenced Bond's dead wife from the 60s. It was so random. The same heppened in License to Kill with Dalton. By that point, Bonds dead wife had nothing to do with continuity. It was just a background detail like him being an orphan or having a license to kill.

The Craig film series might be the only one that has some kind of self contained plot continuity, but they still reference the old films as a tribute. The filmmakers trust the audience to be a ble to defferentiate which is which. Regardless, the lack of continuity or occasional cherry picked continuity is one of the reasons the Bond franchise has lasted for so long,imo. The franchise is flexible enough to start over fresh,so new fans to get into it but it's also consistent enough to stisfiy the old fans using certain tropes and supporting characters. I don't think any other franchise can get way with such a "f**** it" attitude, enjoy the ride and forget about continuity or "canon."
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Super epic post.
 
Wor-Gar said:
Which is why it is so pointless.

Compartmentalizing must be different now. People seem to need closure -- even if pointless. Bring Bond to an end, even though we know the recasting process is already moving ahead. It's shallow, a bit like so many "Origin" stories that audiences seem to need. After a certain point, do you really need another Batman origin story?

So what are the Craig Bonds supposed to be? A separate volume? It's own complete era? Now we're ready for a redo -- new Bond, new M, new Moneypenny, new Blofeld...? Or do you just recast Bond and keep the others, but then how does that work from the other characters frame of reference? Do they all just have amnesia like Judy Dench after Brosnan?

Early Bond and Indy were great 'hero tales' because they just started in the middle -- no set-up, no end, just constant adventures.
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I think they are supposed to be the “what if” series of bond films.

What If…
Bond didn’t like being a spy
Bond just wanted to find true love
Bond was a quitter
Bond was had a blah personality
Bond died

IDK.. At some point I will have to give this film a 2nd viewing… Buts it’s 2.5 pointless hours of meh… just to get to the Bond does at the end ending.

If the film were better I would respect the death of Bond much more.

I mean the villain that ultimately took him out (basically) was that guy ??? Gah… just such a bad villain.

Really the way that this Bond was written I think he could not wait to let himself die…. Just let the pain of being a spy go away.

I’ll have to give Spector another watch. I enjoyed that one much more than this one but I could not tell you why. Seems like it was the one film that he enjoyed being A spy up until he quit :lol
 
Khev said:
:lol :lol

"Medically he's fine, and there's a million ways he can live a happy life and still find ways to interact with his family. But for some reason he's just standing there like an idiot. He's lost the will to live."
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Well to be fair…. He had the virus and could pass it to anyone… eventually it would probably make it back to his family…

I am sure he was happy there was no other choice.
 
The Clown Prince of Crime said:
Sure he did. Ford has been asking for death since the 80s, so they gave it to him, and Solo walked straight to his death and his little rubber body never to be seen again. 😞


Haven't seen it. 🤭
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The ocean waves battle ending with Rey’s defeat and Han/Leia involvement easily joins my other favorite moments from SW it is irresistibly a joy to revisit.
 
Wor-Gar said:
Wait -- how did Thunderball reimagine the Bond series?
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I didn’t meant that it reimagined, I meant that it was re done also, we currently know it as Never Say Never the unofficial bond film lolol, all in all Never say Never is just another Thunderball because of the writer and stuff.
The Clown Prince of Crime said:
I think Blofeld is the only Bond villain that's been played by different actors in multiple films, but that's understandable because he's Bond's Moriarty, so I get it. I'm not so sure I want to see a new Goldfinger or Dr. No. I definitely don't want a remake of the old films. Maybe Dr No, because the original is kind of boring and old enough that you can almost make a completely different film.
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They pulled it off cleverly using the facial surgery storyline, I was blown away. Frederic Gray is my favorite Blofeld to be honest, i freaking love his accent hahaha
 
Ropen said:
They pulled it off cleverly using the facial surgery storyline, I was blown away. Frederic Gray is my favorite Blofeld to be honest, i freaking love his accent hahaha
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He's the only main villain that's been in multiple fims. Interestingly, several henchmen or antagonists have been in multiple films, played by the same actors 🙂
 
Ropen said:
I didn’t meant that it reimagined, I meant that it was re done also, we currently know it as Never Say Never the unofficial bond film lolol, all in all Never say Never is just another Thunderball because of the writer and stuff.
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OH, OK. Yeah, I never really liked NSNA. Same reasons in 1983 as I have with Indy 5 today... but Connery back then was shamefully only in his 50's. :lol



"Padme's Disease" is classic. I see this term becoming canon around here for years to come.


I also agree with JAWS that if the movie was better I might have found the ending more tragic. But Bond is not something that I go to for 'tragedy'; so emotionally I'm just not ready to share that with him. Next thing you know, they'll add 'romantic comedy' to John Wick.
 

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