PT Changing How You View The OT

[Coorectghosting]

This is opinion.

the acting but mostly the character development and not too good dialog. they were all pretty flat. didn't care about them. overuse of special effects to the point that it's more about being visually pretty instead of having substance. the plots were a bit unclear with the political aspects. The PT doesn't carry much emotional weight for me

and in some ways how it seemed like fanboy mentality had influenced Lucas. Like Anakin building C-3PO or Yoda hanging out with Chewbacca. totally goofy stuff. R2-D2 and C-3PO even being around wasn't needed. Obi-Wan doesn't remember R2 in ANH.

 

[MaulFan]

I disagree, the "Hello there!" out of Obi-Wan suggests familiarity thanks to the PT, and his puzzlement isn't over not recognizing him but wondering what's going on that has lead Luke to believe R2 is Obi-Wan's property since R2 was always Padme's droid.

 

[Coorectghosting]

You're reading too much into it. So he says hello to the droid. That means he noticed the droid and is friendly to droids.

And Leia gave orders to R2 to do his best so I guess R2-D2 figured he'd have a better chance if he said he's the property of Obi-Wan. Leia needs Old Ben. she wants him bad. Anyway, Obi-Wan doesn't remember R2.

 

[MaulFan]

You're reading too much into it. So he says hello to the droid. That means he noticed the droid and is friendly to droids.

And Leia gave orders to R2 to do his best so I guess R2-D2 figured he'd have a better chance if he said he's the property of Obi-Wan. Leia needs Old Ben. she wants him bad. Anyway, Obi-Wan doesn't remember R2.

That's the whole point of this thread, discussing how the PT allows us to see elements of the OT in a new light. And I don't get your point on the Leia comment, it has no bearing on what I said, no matter what the reason R2 claimed to be Obi-Wan's property, that's the story, Luke told it to Ben and Ben being wise would be suspicious of this, even without the PT, that's how I understand, especially following his comment with "very interesting", you can tell he's trying to process what's going on. Afterall, he's Luke's care taker and Luke out and about and on a mission to find him is certainly going to perplex the Old Wizard.

 

[Prime Clone]

and in some ways how it seemed like fanboy mentality had influenced Lucas. Like Anakin building C-3PO or Yoda hanging out with Chewbacca. totally goofy stuff. R2-D2 and C-3PO even being around wasn't needed. Obi-Wan doesn't remember R2 in ANH.

It was always Lucas's intention for the droids to be in all the films, as if we were seeing the events through their eyes. And I think it's plausible how Luke and Leia "inherited" them from Anakin and Padmé.

As for Obi-Wan not remembering Artoo, he seems to show a bit of disdain for droids in the prequels, so he probably just didn't pay much attention to them.

 

[PosterBoyKelly]

OK, commenting on the subject of this thread as a whole:

The PT totally changed my viewing of the OT. Not really just the story, but the characters and their feelings on things. Facial expressions, tones of voice, all that. Actually makes the OT better to me. Or maybe I'm just relieved to see better acting

Anyway, I actually agree w/Maul Fan on a lot of points so I'll leave it there.

 

[Coorectghosting]

I can't go to such lengths to rationalize things that don't make sense.

They're a sort of sequels I dismiss just like I do with the Halloween sequels, Nightmare on Elm Street sequels, Hellraiser, etc....

 

[MaulFan]

It is a much more enjoyable viewing experience to have all 6 films to influence pereception of each film. ANH has always been my least favorite OT film, and still is, but I enjoy it much more post PT than I used to, especially because I now enjoy Obi-Wan Kenobi as a character much more.

 

[Agent0028]

Alot of what you (Maulfan) are saying about Leia's memory of Padme and Obi-Wan recognizing the droids makes sense (to me at least) but technically speaking they are inconsistencies (to me at least). Take Leia's memory, her exact words don't contradict what could be her memories, but her words are misleading and I don't know any reason why she would phrase it that way to Luke. It makes more sense that she would say, "well I only saw pictures, but she always seemed sad" or something like that. But like I said I'm perfectly okay with the inconsistencies (although they did annoy me alot at first) and I find it fun to explain them and that's a really good explanation for that one.

 

[MaulFan]

Well I won't deny inconsitencies, GL's infamous for it it's par for the course with him, but I do feel the overall films of the PT added some nice new meaning to events of the OT, such as the Vader-Obi duel and the entire persona of Darth Vader.

 

[The Josh]

It is a much more enjoyable viewing experience to have all 6 films to influence perception of each film. ANH has always been my least favorite OT film, and still is, but I enjoy it much more post PT than I used to, especially because I now enjoy Obi-Wan Kenobi as a character much more.

I agree. The way things flow and influence each other or my views on them is really something special as a fan now with all 6 films complete. ANH flips with ROTJ as my least fave of the OT but my love for ANH has grown because of the PT that's for sure.

In the end for me as much as I liked the OT before the PT I like it WAY more now because of the PT. Much the same way I am with LOTR. I liked LOTR before the movies but once I saw the movies the light went on with what I was missing.

 

[TheObsoleteMan]

The whole saga is littered with inconsistencies. It's plainly obvious in ANH that Vader and Anakin are not intended to be the same person, Luke and Leia are not siblings and the Anakin Obi-Wan is reminiscing about is not the Anakin presented in the PT. You just have to turn your brain off and go along for the ride.

 

[Agent0028]

I do feel the overall films of the PT added some nice new meaning to events of the OT, such as the Vader-Obi duel and the entire persona of Darth Vader.

I agree. I think I mentioned it once before, probably in this thread, but maybe another, but after the PT I really love the part when Obi-Wan looks up at the screen and says, "Well hellow there." Because to me it is like being welcomed back by an old friend that's not been seen for 18 years.

 

[The Josh]

The whole saga is littered with inconsistencies. It's plainly obvious in ANH that Vader and Anakin are not intended to be the same person, Luke and Leia are not siblings and the Anakin Obi-Wan is reminiscing about is not the Anakin presented in the PT. You just have to turn your brain off and go along for the ride.

 

[MaulFan]

the Anakin Obi-Wan is reminiscing about is not the Anakin presented in the PT.

How do you figure that. Obi-Wan tells Luke that Anakin was the best starpilot in the galaxy, a cunning warrior and a good friend, that sums up how GL portrayed PT Anakin to me.

 

[Darklord Dave]

We know that when Lucas wrote Star Wars (the first movie) that Luke and Leia weren't related and Vader and Anakin were different people. But I think Lucas did a good job from Empire on and through the PT of making it pretty consistant with the first film "from a certain point of view."

 

[MaulFan]

It works well for Luke and Leia not to know their relation until Jedi, it would have put them in further jeopardy with Palpatine and the Empire if there was an awareness that they were the offspring of Vader/Skywalker.

 

[artistrex]

I think that the best way to see how Vader from ROTS is Really the same in The OT is how he begs Luke to join him, and how he seems almost regretful that he destroyed Kenobi. It helps you realize how much Vader in ANH, has truly screwed himself and how he has grown to hate everything. In ESB once he realizes the Luke is alive he thinks that maybe his choices weren't in vain. But By ROTJ he knows that his choices were wrong, but he thinks he can't change it.


On a different note I was watching Ep.3 a few months ago with my 3 year old son. He got a kick out of the fight scenes but I know he really didn't get what was going on. My question is... In a few years when I introduce him to SW, (B4 my wife can show him star trek) Do I show him The OT 1st or let him watch the Pt 1st and then the OT?:maul

 

[D. Martin]

See I thought overall the PT did a pretty good job of blending what happened in the OT. So I don't think there are any real severe issues. But that's just me.

The moment we saw Bail in the Blockade Runner, the two trilogies merge into one Saga...

 

[Atom Hues]

How do you figure that. Obi-Wan tells Luke that Anakin was the best starpilot in the galaxy, a cunning warrior and a good friend, that sums up how GL portrayed PT Anakin to me.

I think what he's getting at is, the "Luke's father" that Ben is talking about is the one that existed at that stage in the writing. Meaning, Luke father, a Jedi Knight & ally of Kenobi who was ACTUALLY betrayed and murdered by a pupil of Ben's who turned to the Dark Side and helped hunt & kill Jedi Knights for the Empire. And NOT the version of Anakin that we ended up knowing and loving, after later versions of scripts were changed, modified, what have you.

At some point during the various screenplay drafts of EMPIRE STRIKES BACK, Lucas & crew came up with the notion that Vader & Luke's father could be the same guy, which would be a great "GASP!!!" moment in the film, and add tension by making the audience wonder, as Luke did, why Ben didn't say this. We, the audience, could wonder, as James Earl Jones says he did, if Vader was actually lying, playing with Luke to get him to turn.

STAR WARS, especially the early films, was/were definitely a work-in-progress. It's documented in last year's MAKING OF STAR WARS. It details all the differences in all the different drafts of the film. All the characters changed from draft-to-draft; Luke was even a girl for about a month during one draft. Changes were made DURING filming. For example, Luke's last name was Starkiller when Mark Hamill first started playing the character in Tunisia, and was changed to Skywalker just before they shot the Detention Block scenes in England.

And Lucas has shown that he likes to make tweaks and changes during editing, and even years after the films are finished. There's no reason to think he wouldn't be doing it DURING the making of the trilogy.

This is why Vader wasn't Luke's father (as far as anyone involved knew) when STAR WARS was made, and why Luke and Leia didn't become brother & sister until REVENGE OF THE JEDI was in pre-production.

Changes from the "original" idea were being made constantly.