Shang Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings (September 3rd, 2021)

[a-dev]

I'll never forgive Endgame for taking the climatic battle for the fate of the universe and setting it in a BLOWN UP PARKING LOT IN NEW YORK!

If you put it like that it sounds lame, sure, but technically it took place at the ruins of Avengers HQ.....

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Despite all of my problems with it, I still think IM2 is better than the vast majority of MCU flicks. It feels like a genuine film. It's shot differently, the jokes are there but are more natural, the tone is vibrant and energetic but has its quiet moments and darker hues; it's just different from the tv-esque look that followed. There was a time when this was the hypest thing

You felt the impact of the punches, the weight of the suits, the gravity of the fight. Now it's all slapstick in bright green-screen rooms. I'll never forgive Endgame for taking the climatic battle for the fate of the universe and setting it in a BLOWN UP PARKING LOT IN NEW YORK!

I don't think it's nostalgia because it's generally waning off from me, yet I still find it a messy, but still good, proper superhero movie. It could've been better, much, much better, but compared to all the capeshit out there, I think it walks the line between big blockbuster action and its story very well.

I haven't seen IM2 in years, but I remember being disappointed by it. At the time sequels were as good as the first or better, TDK, Spiderman 2, X2 ..etc. I remember it lacking action and being kind of boring with Stark trying to find a new source of power. The first big action set piece was the race track fight, then the second action sequence was the IM fight against War Machine, which wasn't great, and finally that final battle and Black Widow beating up some guys. As for the look of the film, don't remember, but this was phase one, so they were not a factory style studio yet. The first film I remember that had a tv quality to it was the first Avengers film in 2012. Something about the sets, camera angles, and lack of interesting locations made it look like a tv show, until the final battle, imo.

I just watched the final fight scene from Shang Chi, and man does that look awful. I don't mean the cgi or wire work, it's the fact they're doing so much and yet it means nothing. They can hit each other endlessly, and none of it feels real. They can take endless amount of punishment without a mark to show for it. I'm just old and grumpy. 5 year old me would love this stuff.

I could be wrong, but I also saw one of the opening fight scenes from Shang Chi, and

Spoiler

the new Mandarin loses to some chick while he was using the ten rings. I mean, WTF? It's Zod all over again from MOS. How do you have the main antagonist lose so early in the film? Maybe I didn't see the whole fight?

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

If you put it like that it sounds lame, sure, but technically it took place at the ruins of Avengers HQ parking lot, near the Quick Stop.

Fixed.

 

[Otomofan]

If you put it like that it sounds lame, sure, but technically it took place at the ruins of Avengers HQ.....

It was? I always thought it was just some vague rocky astral dimension that would be easy to animate.

That whole sequence was the equivalent of the Image Comics style of drawing in the 90s....all splash pages and speed lines and zero backgrounds.

 

[a-dev]

Fixed.

That needs a Jye-photoshop. Quickstop with Jay and Silent Bob loitering outside. Or maybe Jay and Silent Bob appearing out of their own portal to join the fray.

 

[Victοr]

If you put it like that it sounds lame, sure, but technically it took place at the ruins of Avengers HQ.....

Yeah, you're right. It was a blown up industrial complex, not parking lot, in New York...

I haven't seen IM2 in years, but I remember being disappointed by it. At the time sequels were as good as the first or better, TDK, Spiderman 2, X2 ..etc. I remember it lacking action and being kind of boring with Stark trying to find a new source of power. The first big action set piece was the race track fight, then the second action sequence was the IM fight against War Machine, which wasn't great, and finally that final battle and Black Widow beating up some guys. As for the look of the film, don't remember, but this was phase one, so they were not a factory style studio yet. The first film I remember that had a tv quality to it was the first Avengers film in 2012. Something about the sets, camera angles, and lack of interesting locations made it look like a tv show, until the final battle, imo.

Oh, I was dissapointed as well, especially since it was compared to TDK. But I still felt as if I was watching an actual film. And looking back, missed chances and wasted potential and all, it still feels like a properly structured movie. I remember how everyone complained that it was full of set-ups for the Avengers and didn't have a coherent plot, but after what the MCU became, IM2 feels as "empty" as IM1. The armours, while still CGI, felt real. The fights carried more weight. The shots were more cinematic. After Avengers the quality changed to cheap, factory-made tv flicks.

I just watched the final fight scene from Shang Chi, and man does that look awful. I don't mean the cgi or wire work, it's the fact they're doing so much and yet it means nothing. They can hit each other endlessly, and none of it feels real. They can take endless amount of punishment without a mark to show for it. I'm just old and grumpy. 5 year old me would love this stuff.

I could be wrong, but I also saw one of the opening fight scenes from Shang Chi, and

Spoiler

the new Mandarin loses to some chick while he was using the ten rings. I mean, WTF? It's Zod all over again from MOS. How do you have the main antagonist lose so early in the film? Maybe I didn't see the whole fight?

I haven't gone to see it, I'll wait to speedwatch it at home, mostly to see how they handle the Mandarin, but I'm expecting nada. Fights being weightless has been becoming more and more frequent, especially in the MCU. One could argue that when you up the power-levels so much, it's bound to happen. Myself, I'm not so sure. I think it has to do more with how it's all framed, how the impact is portrayed, many factors. I don't even think the "old & grumpy" argument works. All capeshit is silly and utterly nonsensical. Same goes for most action flicks. A hit on the head can downright kill you, when a serious drama like Whiplash has a teacher hurling chairs at musicians, and we just accept and roll with it. But there's a way to make all the powers have weight and not fall into the pitfalls of it all being just CGI-fests with nothing meaty in there.

A commentary on that was the latest Eva. In previous series the fights between the Evas and the Angels were 1-on-1 and while crazy things were happening all over, you could feel the impact of the hits on each other, on the city, on everything. But in 3.0+1.0 it goes full-on CGI destructo-fest and it all stops being engrossing, immersive and they lack a punch. Lore and exposition flies at lightning speed and you're left waiting for the "spectacle" to end. The point is that it's all silly ******** and getting invested so much in fictional lore that gets retconned and played fast and loose with at any given moment is a tremendous waste of time. It's why the setting changes from the "real world" to a bunch of sets and gamepads, to show that it's all soulless, easily churned out CGI with no work or passion put into it.

For my money, I think it's about setting internal rules within your universe, sticking to them, and then putting a lot of work in how your product is made to ensure that it comes off as "real" as possible. We accept that these things are wholly fantastical from the get-go. How they're handled is up to the creator. Ghost Rider is a Spirit of Vengeance with a flaming skull, but he just wears a leather biker get-up and uses a flaming chain to punish devils. It's not that hard to pull off. Meanwhile Magneto is more "down to Earth" by being "just a mutant", yet he controls ElectroMagnetism and thus his powers can go from basic things to full on anime. Watching an unhinged Magneto unleash his powers could be either magnificent or downright silly and boring. It's all about how you handle it.

 

[ZE_501]

Despite all of my problems with it, I still think IM2 is better than the vast majority of MCU flicks.

I've always liked Iron Man 2. It was fun, it had good action, it's re-watchable.

I'll never forgive Endgame for taking the climatic battle for the fate of the universe and setting it in a BLOWN UP PARKING LOT IN NEW YORK!

It was Avengers HQ, as @a-dev pointed out. I can think of a few reasons for the setting.

• Made sense in terms of narrative flow
• A blasted field gives them a blank canvas for the epic final fight
• They already had battles in cities, on an alien planet
• Having the fight on Earth is close to home and shows stakes

I never even thought about where the fight was happening when I saw that film. If I had to do it differently, sure, do it in a major city -- but on Earth. Which would change the character of the final clash -- collateral damage, many of the heroes being diverted to save civilians etc. ... but it's problematic because Thanos' forces would have leveled said city and killed hundreds of thousands of civilians even with the heroes present. Maybe not the tone they were after.

 

[Victοr]

I've always liked Iron Man 2. It was fun, it had good action, it's re-watchable.

It was Avengers HQ, as @a-dev pointed out. I can think of a few reasons for the setting.

• Made sense in terms of narrative flow
• A blasted field gives them a blank canvas for the epic final fight
• They already had battles in cities, on an alien planet
• Having the fight on Earth is close to home and shows stakes

I never even thought about where the fight was happening when I saw that film. If I had to do it differently, sure, do it in a major city -- but on Earth. Which would change the character of the final clash -- collateral damage, many of the heroes being diverted to save civilians etc. ... but it's problematic because Thanos' forces would have leveled said city and killed hundreds of thousands of civilians even with the heroes present. Maybe not the tone they were after.

All I know is that when the fate of the universe is at stake, and it's a fight between a bunch of super-men and alien gods, versus a galactic warlord and his massive armada, fighting just outside of New York is underwhelming. Then again Thanos and the entire Infinity Saga was butchered from comics to film, so who cares. Just give me good some good enough/passable-for-the-comic-versions dollies and that's all I'm looking for from the MCU.

 

[Johnny Utah]

All this phase 4 talk makes me really miss the golden years when we had Tony and Steve. A new film every year, the hype, the figures…

The run up to Winter Soldier was amazing.

 

[jye4ever]

Saw it in Imax lastnight (was supposed to be thursday night but storm changed my plans) and it was my first Imax viewing since Spiderman FFH and the first packed screening since Spiderman FFH, BW was nowhere as filled as this.

I will say this as a “representation” movie it utterly blows away BP absolutely destroys it way better with everything. Seriously BP is trash next to this.

Will there be some jealousy lol

BW is also garbage compared to this movie then again so is TSS.

It’s true some of the best “fantasy” martial arts choreography put on film super dynamic and thrilling to watch especially with the rings which were well utilized.

Ok with that now out of the way Marvel phase 4 is in absolute shambles they are just throwing everything cosmic at the wall to see what sticks.

They don’t even know which multiverse creating device/plot they want to go with they are jumping from Wanda to Loki to DS to Kang to Spiderman to Ten Rings it is a convoluted mess.

The humor was also super cringing ughhh.

Initially I wasn’t buying into the Mandarin plot it just wasn’t working for me I was calling BS on all of if his existence and motivations but I ultimately just accepted that he was

Spoiler

bored of existing and decided to hang up the rings meh whatever.

.

Look I didn’t hate it and the cgi was spectacular (over head forest shots) and maybe as a stand-alone fantasy Kung Fu movie I can enjoy it but Marvel phase 4 is truly lost in translation.

I will say this I can’t believe Marvel just gave us a

Spoiler

Gamera 3 Iris and King Ghidorah hybrid kaiju in this the beast was really well visualized and actually pretty damn frightening to behold well done Marvel once again they out do WB it made Starro look even more silly lol

Godzilla franchise is looking really bad now

The masked villain was cool looking that Hot Toys will look sweet.

I certainly don’t regret seeing it on Imax but i’m left indifferent I guess is the word.

Regarding the post credits:

Imagine if the rings belong to

Spoiler

Galactus and that’s who they were calling in the post credits scene, maybe lol I mean who else is left as a big cosmic threat at this point are they going to finally wake up Adam Warlock lol

Spoiler

I didn’t buy his sister taking over the Ten Rings organization at the final end credits scene after what they went thru together.

Look if you are one of those already fully dead inside with one foot in the grave at 40 to 55 years old and are just here to remind everyone that humanity can’t end fast enough for your liking then please go watch this so that we can enjoy your same review as the previous 100 superhero fantasy sci-fi movies you watched I do enjoy engaging in those discussions. I’m serious I might need to cross that bridge one day lol

If you are one of those adults who Kathleen Kennedy keeps you up at night even worse than if you think the government has your porn viewing records then no need to watch it just stick to Gina Carano’s future blockbuster projects.

Everyone else who is an MCU diehard and are vaccinated definitely go watch it on Imax or a Dolby Cinema and if you are not vaccinated go watch it anyways don’t worry about covid new variant it only made Joe Rogen sick for 1 day you are good to go.

But i’m guessing most MCU diehards are ready to hang up their MCU hats I know I am….

Eternals lol

 

[matticus]

Saw it in Imax lastnight (was supposed to be thursday night but storm changed my plans) and it was my first Imax viewing since Spiderman FFH and the first packed screening since Spiderman FFH, BW was nowhere as filled as this.

I will say this as a “representation” movie it utterly blows away BP absolutely destroys it way better with everything. Seriously BP is trash next to this.

Will there be some jealousy lol

BW is also garbage compared to this movie then again so is TSS.

It’s true some of the best “fantasy” martial arts choreography put on film super dynamic and thrilling to watch especially with the rings which were well utilized.

Ok with that now out of the way Marvel phase 4 is in absolute shambles they are just throwing everything cosmic at the wall to see what sticks.

They don’t even know which multiverse creating device/plot they want to go with they are jumping from Wanda to Loki to DS to Kang to Spiderman to Ten Rings it is a convoluted mess.

The humor was also super cringing ughhh.

Initially I wasn’t buying into the Mandarin plot it just wasn’t working for me I was calling BS on all of if his existence and motivations but I ultimately just accepted that he was

Spoiler

bored of existing and decided to hang up the rings meh whatever.

.

Look I didn’t hate it and the cgi was spectacular (over head forest shots) and maybe as a stand-alone fantasy Kung Fu movie I can enjoy it but Marvel phase 4 is truly lost in translation.

I will say this I can’t believe Marvel just gave us a

Spoiler

Gamera 3 Iris and King Ghidorah hybrid kaiju in this the beast was really well visualized and actually pretty damn frightening to behold well done Marvel once again they out do WB it made Starro look even more silly lol

Godzilla franchise is looking really bad now

The masked villain was cool looking that Hot Toys will look sweet.

I certainly don’t regret seeing it on Imax but i’m left indifferent I guess is the word.

Regarding the post credits:

Imagine if the rings belong to

Spoiler

Galactus and that’s who they were calling in the post credits scene, maybe lol I mean who else is left as a big cosmic threat at this point are they going to finally wake up Adam Warlock lol

Spoiler

I didn’t buy his sister taking over the Ten Rings organization at the final end credits scene after what they went thru together.

Look if you are one of those already fully dead inside with one foot in the grave at 40 to 55 years old and are just here to remind everyone that humanity can’t end fast enough for your liking then please go watch this so that we can enjoy your same review as the previous 100 superhero fantasy sci-fi movies you watched I do enjoy engaging in those discussions. I’m serious I might need to cross that bridge one day lol

If you are one of those adults who Kathleen Kennedy keeps you up at night even worse than if you think the government has your porn viewing records then no need to watch it just stick to Gina Carano’s future blockbuster projects.

Everyone else who is an MCU diehard and are vaccinated definitely go watch it on Imax or a Dolby Cinema and if you are not vaccinated go watch it anyways don’t worry about covid new variant it only made Joe Rogen sick for 1 day you are good to go.

But i’m guessing most MCU diehards are ready to hang up their MCU hats I know I am….

Eternals lol

Drunk jye loving the movie, trashing the MCU, then trashing Shang, then feeling sorry for Shang, then coming after you politically and personally. Love it!

 

[jye4ever]

Drunk jye loving the movie, trashing the MCU, then trashing Shang, then feeling sorry for Shang, then coming after you politically and personally. Love it!

Indifferent is not loving.

It was more entertaining than BP and BW though.

I pooped on Phase 4 not the Infinity Saga although BP is in the IS as is BW.

Phase 4 is schizophrenic.

Mandalorian > Shang > MCU TV

 

[loki2371]

Without a doubt do I believe this IS better than BP. And I'm sure better than BW (even though I haven't seen it).

BP sucked. For me, it is in the bottom 3 for worst MCU movies. Right there with Cap Mavel and the Incredible Hulk.

 

[chrisstbh]

Pleasantly surprised by this movie, was a fun ride and Wenwu was great.

Why is Bruce Banner a small white guy again though.

 

[TurdFurgusonsHat]

Why is Bruce Banner a small white guy again though.

They definitely should have race swapped him.

 

[chrisstbh]

They definitely should have race swapped him.

Par for the course these days though.

But he’s supposed to be a big green guy permanently now, no?

 

[GhostBeard]

Right now this is the most interesting forum going. I had no idea about some of this stuff. Shang-Chi possibly gay because there's no overt female love interest? Tha' hell? Not having the obligatory girlfriend and making this a family drama is novel for the MCU, I never thought Black Panther's girlfriend storyline worked. And people want/need that to mean he's gay? Odd. I'm also noticing MCU fans (which I am one) give movies "passes" to the extent that a new MCU flick helps push the next Phase along. What about a movie standing on its own two feet?

I remember reading a quote from some director who hated the stinger use in comic book movies, calling them cheats and saying it means the director wasn't skilled enough a storyteller to get that info into the movie's fabric without clumsily tacking it onto the end, I've never forgotten that. The unfortunate reality of Black Widow (for me) was that the stinger was the only interesting element of the movie.

I really want to like this movie, like I've really wanted to like the past three Disney projects I've watched; e.g. Loki, Jungle Cruise and Black Widow. For my mileage, Disney is 0 for 3 on those. I don't care about phase 4/cosmic bru-ha-hah or what-have-you, representation or any other beside the point elements . I just want Shang-chi to be a good movie on it's own. It's sounding rather paint-by-numbers D list comic book character origin story wrapped around family-friendly martial arts action. Interesting.

 

[TurdFurgusonsHat]

Par for the course these days though.

But he’s supposed to be a big green guy permanently now, no?

The MCU can do whatever they want and don't ****ing question it. Star Lord can be black, Captain America can be a British Girl....anything. Except Black Panther, make him white and go to prison on Twitter.

 

[GhostBeard]

The MCU can do whatever they want and don't ****ing question it. Star Lord can be black, Captain America can be a British Girl....anything. Except Black Panther, make him white and go to prison on Twitter.

Wouldn't that make him The Phantom?

 

[TurdFurgusonsHat]

Wouldn't that make him The Phantom?

This made the rounds on the internets after What If Star Lord and the feedback was interesting.