Star Wars: The Last Jedi (Dec 15th, 2017)

[klwn]

That’s sort of my point....maybe it was not suppose to be disguised?

I mean it is a new SW lead by a female producer who is vocal about women’s rights?

Disney has been trying for many years to be inclusive of as many cultures and religions as possible. Which is in their financial interest to do so. As a stock holder , I agree with that call.

What people are pushing against is they want SW to remand the same, and not be a female lead with amazing powers. Has Rey been Ryan I doubt the complaining would have been as loud. Especially the agenda word, which makes me ill every time someone says it...

Had Anakin been Annakin, I am quite sure the same arguments would have been waged.

Fact is many people spit out the word Agenda to make it seem like a vast conspiracy is afoot to change their beliefs or corrupt their children or something....it’s real tin foil hat stuff....persecution complex....

Female producer makes female strong film? Well yeah?!??

I think it would be better for people to drop the code words as flat out say they do not like female leads or many changes to the OT they grew up with.

The whole argument of Rey not being trained, too powerful , etc etc is the real code words for some folks who just do not want to see a female character out perform the male hero’s of their youth without justifiable cause.....

But why not?


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Again, back to the idea that if people have issues with female character portrayals, they are automatically sexist even if they don't want to admit it.
Even if they have perfectly valid points to make, still sexist. I'll let my girlfriend (who's kinda SJW actually) know.

I am vegan. I had issues with the animal rights messages in this movie. Does that make me not vegan? Do I need to pay more attention to what I eat because I'm actually eating meat every day without noticing? ****ing ridiculous.

 

[aa909]

RO did the female lead hero perfectly.. Gave us a great line also.... She was the Best soldier in Saw Gerrera's story.

Having strong female characters is fine.. This film felt a little like it may have had an agenda beyond that.

Yes female hero's are kinda new... But there have been many Kick Ass woman in movies recently.. Atomic Blond, The Matrix, Black Widow, Fury Road, Aliens, ALIEN 3, Terminator 2, The Fast and Furious films, Hunger Games, Kick Ass, Kill Bill, Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon, Resident Evil, Salt, Laura Croft, Underworld, Buffy, The Fifth Element, Several Different Bond Woman, Wonder Woman....

Its been going on for a while.. Like I said RO is a great example of having no issue in our SW films.. Rey has the Mary Sue issue right now... And Dern McPurple not only seemed to have an agenda behind her story.. She was one of the less intelligent characters in the series also. Hmmmmm Maybe the message was pro male

Your post is thoughtful and well articulated... but notice how you're now in a defensive position having to demonstrate that you're not a sexist by listing all the movies you like with strong female leads? this is the new PC culture...

 

[Khev]

A quick heads up to all that despite being partially filmed with IMAX cameras TLJ actually didn't feature any alternating aspect ratios. So there wasn't a "Falcon escapes Jakku" sequence where the screen temporarily goes sky high like there was in TFA. I'm actually glad for the uniform aspect ratio since now I don't have to be annoyed when the expanded screen isn't included on the bu-ray, lol.

 

[Asta]

Teletubbies

 

[klwn]

Your post is thoughtful and well articulated... but notice how you're now in a defensive position having to demonstrate that you're not a sexist by listing all the movies you like with strong female leads? this is the new PC culture...

Exactly, I ****ing hate this. They make you have to justify yourself by proving that you are not what they accuse you of being, instead of just arguing the quality of the art itself.

How about I start accusing people who love the movie of actually hating Star Wars and being pro-child slavery?

 

[jye4ever]

Is there enough evidence to support that Rey is Vader?


Unknown parents being a key component.


Kylo tells her to let go of her past, be who you were meant to be, literally leading her right into the hole in the ground where she saw her own reflection like Luke saw his own in ESB inside the cave wth his head in Vader’s helmet.


Does let go of your past mean Vader letting go of the lightside and become Vader again.


Is that where this is all going the resurrection of Vader?

 

[JAWS]

Good points, although most of the films you list HAVE male leads with female 2ndary leads.




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Yeah but those secondary female leads are usually kicking plenty of male ass

Point being we accept it all and enjoy strong female leads... Rey just magically became great at everything... She did not earn it.

 

[Asta]

Is there enough evidence to support that Rey is Vader?


Unknown parents being a key component.


Kylo tells her to let go of her past, be who you were meant to be, literally leading her right into the hole in the ground where she saw her own reflection like Luke saw his own in ESB inside the cave wth his head in Vader’s helmet.


Does let go of your past mean Vader letting go of the lightside and become Vader again.


Is that where this is all going the resurrection of Vader?

Kennedy would love to resurrect Vader as a female. Implying this time around he won't make a balls up of things. (Not that he probably had any balls after Mustafar anyway).

 

[Adolfo]

well articulated points... Avatar is an example of a movie with an agenda that was well written and didn't feel preachy and was entertaining. TLJ on the other hand feels like they got in a room and KK said "here's my vision, I want the following messages in the film, now go put a script and cast around it... and don't feel pressured to stick to any plot lines that came before in the previous 7 movies... and make sure it's really really funny too. GO!"

She also said kill who ya gotta kill and destroy what ya gotta destroy for my message,..at all cost!...NOW FIRE EVERYTHING AT THOSE OLD MEN!!!!

 

[The Pawn]

Is there enough evidence to support that Rey is Vader?


Unknown parents being a key component.


Kylo tells her to let go of her past, be who you were meant to be, literally leading her right into the hole in the ground where she saw her own reflection like Luke saw his own in ESB inside the cave wth his head in Vader’s helmet.


Does let go of your past mean Vader letting go of the lightside and become Vader again.


Is that where this is all going the resurrection of Vader?

No. That would require too much thought on the part of the viewer. Disney makes kids movies that do not require any thought, coherent plot or logic. Just the way it is and will always be. Lol.


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[Lakhota]

I had no problem with Rey in TFA and agreed she didn't train or know the force but was so powerful because we didn't know who she was. You cant make 7 movies saying training and dedication is what makes you strong in the force, the easy path is the Darkside. Then toss all that **** out mid trilogy without explanation. I get it the millennials want everything for nothing , instant ****ing gratification with no work done, buy everything online without getting off of the couch while watching Netflix, texting on their 1,000.00 phones. If Trump wasn't elected president I know for a fact we would have got a different Star Wars movie, and that's what's ********.

 

[Craig Walker]

Your post is thoughtful and well articulated... but notice how you're now in a defensive position having to demonstrate that you're not a sexist by listing all the movies you like with strong female leads? this is the new PC culture...

Exactly, I ****ing hate this. They make you have to justify yourself by proving that you are not what they accuse you of being, instead of just arguing the quality of the art itself.

Boom. Exactly what I'm dealing with. "Sexist" etc

 

[Asta]

Again, back to the idea that if people have issues with female character portrayals, they are automatically sexist even if they don't want to admit it.
Even if they have perfectly valid points to make, still sexist. I'll let my girlfriend (who's kinda SJW actually) know.

I am vegan. I had issues with the animal rights messages in this movie. Does that make me not vegan? Do I need to pay more attention to what I eat because I'm actually eating meat every day without noticing? ****ing ridiculous.

If they'd written the screenplay with something more subtle than a sledgehammer, they could've put all their messages into the film without causing a backlash.

The messages would be there, even if they were subliminal or understated. They'd be there to find or see. You can't change opinions by hitting people over the head. You have to let them come to their decisions themselves, or at least let them think they got there on their own.

 

[Craig Walker]

New logo for Ep. 9 :

 

[a-dev]

The issue is that the entire movie is so badly written it makes the "message" (agenda, if you will) look and sound stupid and childish.
For all those who deride George Lucas' writing, remember how strong the female characters in the OT and PT were. Leia and Amidala/Padmé are great characters, they lead by example, they make difficult decisions, they have their own conflicts and overcome them. You want political messages? You want social commentary? Shades of grey instead of simple black and white? Emotional conflict? Anything in the OT or PT handled any of those things better than TLJ.
Hell, you don't even have to go that far: RO tackles all of those themes and makes a great movie.

TLJ is quite simply a badly written, badly directed movie. Quite incompetent, actually.

Agree about Leia....notsomuch about Padme - she was probably at her best in TPM but in AOTC and ROTS her character was really dragged down with the implausible love story and her pathetic demise.

 

[Adolfo]

Agree about Leia....notsomuch about Padme - she was probably at her best in TPM but in AOTC and ROTS her character was really dragged down with the implausible love story and her pathetic demise.

Still it was better than what we got here with TLJ

 

[Adolfo]

If they'd written the screenplay with something more subtle than a sledgehammer, they could've put all their messages into the film without causing a backlash.

The messages would be there, even if they were subliminal or understated. They'd be there to find or see. You can't change opinions by hitting people over the head. You have to let them come to their decisions themselves, or at least let them think they got there on their own.

Very well said I like that...well put...for me TLJ felt like the KGB about to break my door down compared to other films...

 

[Craig Walker]

If they'd written the screenplay with something more subtle than a sledgehammer, they could've put all their messages into the film without causing a backlash.

The messages would be there, even if they were subliminal or understated. They'd be there to find or see. You can't change opinions by hitting people over the head. You have to let them come to their decisions themselves, or at least let them think they got there on their own.

QFT. (have to spread reps before I rep you again )

 

[jye4ever]

Um didn’t Holdo tell Leia after Poe was stunned that she liked him being exactly who he was?

She never once said “You will go to jail until your behavior and inherit character traits are changed to be how I want you to be!”

No she told Leia that she liked him being who he was a much needed and appreciated spark.

Which i’m sure people will now point out that if she liked him like he was then why didn’t she trust him enough to just tell him her plan.

I don’t know about anyone here but i’ve been in plenty of situations where my superior officers have tested my character by keeping critical pieces of information from me or given me false information for their own motives or had me find out things on my own or just flat out said “need to know basis deal with it!”.

Sometimes my superiors would even show their dissatisfaction in the most round about mysterious way or even worse their appreciation in the most direct rude manner that left me scratching my head trying to figure out if I was being complimented or disciplined.

Not everyone gets everything they always want to know sometimes things are compartmentalized.

So yeah Poe was NOT emasculated by Holdo but if everyone wants to ignore her compliment about him then ok sure men suck.

Oh i’m sorry did I just destroy the ongoing narrative here i’m sorry lol

 

[aa909]

Exactly, I ****ing hate this. They make you have to justify yourself by proving that you are not what they accuse you of being, instead of just arguing the quality of the art itself.

How about I start accusing people who love the movie of actually hating Star Wars and being pro-child slavery?

Like I said, this is our new PC culture. The irony is the people who make these accusation claim they are “open minded and inclusive”, but by dismissing a counter perspective with attacks of “sexism and racism” they are being anything but open minded and inclusive. It’s a playbook designed to squash challenges to their position, and it works really well.