Star Wars: The Last Jedi (Dec 15th, 2017)

[Asta]

The Visual Dictionary's good.

It's already heavily discounted, maybe due to the reaction to the film. The RRP is £15.99, but my copy was only £6.95 including delivery.

I bought it from the Ebay seller, homeshoppingxpress, but the actual parcel was sent direct from Amazon in an Amazon cardboard packet, and including an Amazon packing slip for the day I purchased it (Boxing Day). Which was strange.


Working my way through the book I get to the pages on Snoke. And there's a paragraph headed, 'Heart of Darkness'. Well, hello darkness, my old friend.

 

[klwn]

The Visual Dictionary's good.

It's already heavily discounted, maybe due to the reaction to the film. The RRP is £15.99, but my copy was only £6.95 including delivery.

I bought it from the Ebay seller, homeshoppingxpress, but the actual parcel was sent direct from Amazon in an Amazon cardboard packet, and including an Amazon packing slip for the day I purchased it (Boxing Day). Which was strange.


Working my way through the book I get to the pages on Snoke. And there's a paragraph headed, 'Heart of Darkness'. Well, hello darkness, my old friend.

Damn that's cheap! Maybe I'm gonna end up paying for it Nah, I'll find a download eventually.

I saw the page about Snoke, his ring has obsidian from under Vader's castle, and writings linked to the four sages of Dwartii, aka the statues of the Sith philosophers in Palpatine's office. Cool stuff. I hope there is a proper book or comic book about him at some point. Such a waste.

 

[Asta]

Damn that's cheap! Maybe I'm gonna end up paying for it Nah, I'll find a download eventually.

I think Amazon must be using these fake Ebay seller names as way of off-loading stock without devaluing the listings on their own websites.

I buy the Visual Dictionaries for every film. I like seeing the props and costumes up close. It's funny looking at some of the photos, and the real world prop jumps out at you.

Hux's blaster still has the donor pistol's information stamped on the side.

I saw the page about Snoke, his ring has obsidian from under Vader's castle, and writings linked to the four sages of Dwartii, aka the statues of the Sith philosophers in Palpatine's office. Cool stuff. I hope there is a proper book or comic book about him at some point. Such a waste.

These books are necessary to explain the inexplicable things that happen in the films - such as dropping bombs in space.

The book makes it sound very feasible.



It makes a lot more sense than the film, and you don't get the real world politics, or Luke throwing his lightsaber over his shoulder.

It would also make a lot of sense if it was revealed in Episode IX that Kylo was adopted. That pathetic man child can't be the offspring of Han and Leia!

And if Jaina, Jacen and Anakin are still out there, but just not mentioned by anyone in TFA and TLJ. Because there's still 30 years of history between the end of ROTJ and the events of TFA and TLJ. Sadly we won't see Harrison's Solo have any of those live action adventures on screen.

 

[klwn]

Oh yeah I saw that part about the bombs being electromagnetically pushed from the ship into space or something.

That scene really drove people crazy. If only it could be the biggest issue with this movie...

 

[abake]

Been giving some thought as to why I feel these movies (ST) fail.
Here's some thoughts:

George Lucas is a man of the 60's and 70's; thus, his movies are anti-establishment. In the OT we have REBELS fighting an evil EMPIRE that wants to control the entire galaxy with its black and white uniformity. This is a fight for freedom against terrible odds to wipe out a tyranny. In the PT we get to see how the galaxy lost its way and ended up under the oppression of the Empire. It's a story about how our political system can fail, undermined by bureaucracy, corruption and greed. Both stories are about not conforming, about distrusting, questioning and, if need be, rebelling.

Overarching these themes there's the story of the Skywalkers: a young man who rises against all odds to become a hero in the OT, and the story of a young man who rises against all odds but is corrupted by the system in the PT.

Now look at the ST.

The main themes of SW are gone. That main idea of rebelling against oppression, not trusting the powers that be, is gone. There's a new/old threat coming in from the outside, and to add insult to injury, in TLJ we're actually told that blind obedience is what is expected (Holdo and Leia vs. Poe). Where once Luke's decisions to go his own way, trust his instincts and NOT do what his superiors told him where the essence of the hero, here we're told that you must obey in order to become a hero, and you're not supposed to question authority.
Furthermore, this isn't the story of the Skywalkers anymore. It's the story of Rey, and to a lesser extent, Kylo. As such, it really shouldn't be a main SW story. And Rey isn't even a good replacement for the Skywalkers. There's no inner struggle to her. KK and her writers/directors have failed to understand what SW is about. "Oh, Anakin was a slave boy, so we'll make our hero a lonely, forlorn child and that'll be her struggle!" No, that's not it! Anakin's struggle, as shown throughout the PT, was his fear of losing the little love he had in his life, and the failure of the Jedi to teach him how to embrace and control his emotions. A failure that Obi Wan and Yoda make again with Luke, except that he (ready for it?) REBELS! "Oh, Luke lost his mentor, so we'll kill off Rey's mentors too!" No, that's no it! The mentor has to actually teach something, he has to actually have an influence, otherwise the whole point is moot.

I think that's part of why the ST fails. It has all the elements, but it uses them wrong, without understanding the actual underlying issues and ideas.

 

[JAL4U2C]

I thought up a way for JJ Abrams to give the big F you back to Rian Johnson. Imagine an episode IX that starts off with Kylo in pursuit of the Falcon with it's few remaining resistance fighters on board. Cut to a scene of Spirit Luke telling spirit Yoda that even with what he had done at the end of TLJ, it wasn't enough to save the galaxy. Giddy as he was in Empire, Yoda asks again, "So certain are you?" With that Yoda disappears and is shown speaking with porgs. The porgs one by one communicate to each other even across huge distances and go into a meditative state. As each porg enters this state, reality seems to bend. The rebels on the Falcon notice a temporal shift but cannot pinpoint what's causing it. We find out that each porg is a part of the force but collectively has the force ability to alter time itself. More and more porgs add their presence, reality continues to bend. Luke starts to fade and can't figure out why. Just as Kylo is about to fire on the Falcon, the Falcon disappears. All the porgs save for two, a male and female still on Ach-To, become one with the force. This was a feat that can never be attempted again for many generations and risks the very existence of the porg race. Luke awakens and to his surprise, finds himself back at his Jedi Academy. Wasn't this all destroyed he asks himself? A young Ben Solo enters his hut asking if training will begin soon. Luke realizes that time has reverted and somehow he is back to the real world, given another chance to right a very large wrong...... This would be a huge opportunity for JJ to basically say to Rian, you threw away all my plot points so i am throwing away yours, also saving the franchise in the process. They could continue using the phrase, "This isn't going to end the way you think it is!" in trailers. And one of Rian's own creation, porgs, would be the thing that undoes his hideous movie. Just a thought anyways.

 

[klwn]

I thought up a way for JJ Abrams to give the big F you back to Rian Johnson. Imagine an episode IX that starts off with Kylo in pursuit of the Falcon with it's few remaining resistance fighters on board. Cut to a scene of Spirit Luke telling spirit Yoda that even with what he had done at the end of TLJ, it wasn't enough to save the galaxy. Giddy as he was in Empire, Yoda asks again, "So certain are you?" With that Yoda disappears and is shown speaking with porgs. The porgs one by one communicate to each other even across huge distances and go into a meditative state. As each porg enters this state, reality seems to bend. The rebels on the Falcon notice a temporal shift but cannot pinpoint what's causing it. We find out that each porg is a part of the force but collectively has the force ability to alter time itself. More and more porgs add their presence, reality continues to bend. Luke starts to fade and can't figure out why. Just as Kylo is about to fire on the Falcon, the Falcon disappears. All the porgs save for two, a male and female still on Ach-To, become one with the force. This was a feat that can never be attempted again for many generations and risks the very existence of the porg race. Luke awakens and to his surprise, finds himself back at his Jedi Academy. Wasn't this all destroyed he asks himself? A young Ben Solo enters his hut asking if training will begin soon. Luke realizes that time has reverted and somehow he is back to the real world, given another chance to right a very large wrong...... This would be a huge opportunity for JJ to basically say to Rian, you threw away all my plot points so i am throwing away yours, also saving the franchise in the process. They could continue using the phrase, "This isn't going to end the way you think it is!" in trailers. And one of Rian's own creation, porgs, would be the thing that undoes his hideous movie. Just a thought anyways.

**** that's good. I'd pay the price of ten tickets just to see Ruin Johnson's face after that.

 

[jye4ever]

I thought up a way for JJ Abrams to give the big F you back to Rian Johnson. Imagine an episode IX that starts off with Kylo in pursuit of the Falcon with it's few remaining resistance fighters on board. Cut to a scene of Spirit Luke telling spirit Yoda that even with what he had done at the end of TLJ, it wasn't enough to save the galaxy. Giddy as he was in Empire, Yoda asks again, "So certain are you?" With that Yoda disappears and is shown speaking with porgs. The porgs one by one communicate to each other even across huge distances and go into a meditative state. As each porg enters this state, reality seems to bend. The rebels on the Falcon notice a temporal shift but cannot pinpoint what's causing it. We find out that each porg is a part of the force but collectively has the force ability to alter time itself. More and more porgs add their presence, reality continues to bend. Luke starts to fade and can't figure out why. Just as Kylo is about to fire on the Falcon, the Falcon disappears. All the porgs save for two, a male and female still on Ach-To, become one with the force. This was a feat that can never be attempted again for many generations and risks the very existence of the porg race. Luke awakens and to his surprise, finds himself back at his Jedi Academy. Wasn't this all destroyed he asks himself? A young Ben Solo enters his hut asking if training will begin soon. Luke realizes that time has reverted and somehow he is back to the real world, given another chance to right a very large wrong...... This would be a huge opportunity for JJ to basically say to Rian, you threw away all my plot points so i am throwing away yours, also saving the franchise in the process. They could continue using the phrase, "This isn't going to end the way you think it is!" in trailers. And one of Rian's own creation, porgs, would be the thing that undoes his hideous movie. Just a thought anyways.

As a fan of TLJ I can honestly say your post is freaking epic probably my most entertaining anti TLJ post i’ve read. lol

Umm good job.

 

[spindrift]

That was the power of the Star Wars brand name ...

LFL have made a titanic shaped blunder with this release and it will be the box office for Solo and Episode IX that suffer as a result.

Trying to measure the 'success' of TLJ against the 'can it the break a billion' marker it's a bit nonsensical for this release for the following reasons:

(1) For a lot of people, TFA and RO suggested a return to form for the Star Wars franchise and it had regained the audience's "trust" that LFL and Kennedy were going to make good Star Wars movies;

(2) This is combined with the additional hype that TLJ is an "Episode" of the saga;

(3) TLJ was to showcase the much awaited return of Luke Skywalker;

(4) JJ set up a lot of interesting plot threads in TFA that had many speculating for two years about how they would be concluded;

(5) most people wanted to see the movie as soon as possible to avoid being spoiled in case any of the reveals (Rey's parents or Snokes background for instance) turned out to be TESB 'I am your father' sized twists; and

(6) Of course the critics hyped this up no end and pretended it actually was the second coming of TESB.

With this all combined it literally was the perfect recipe to break a billion regardless of the content or quality of the movie itself. If this was a good movie it would be carried up to 1.7 to 1.8 billion on repeat viewings but I really don't see this happening at all.

I have zero interest in Episode IX now (no dangling plot threads or cliff hangers that I want to see concluded) and I think that is true for a lot of people. The perceived mishandling of Luke, the force and the internal lore and logic of the Star Wars universe has also lost LFL and Kennedy the "trust" of a lot of the fanbase.

Perhaps worse for Bob Iger is that a lot of people who dislike TLJ keep blaming "Disney" when in reality TLJ was the product of LFL, Kathleen and Rian. I expect Kathleen and Rian are going to have a very uncomfortable meeting with Iger very shortly. Kathleen will likely get the "do not fail me again Kathleen" Darth Vader response from Iger but Rian will probably get force choked out of the door.

very good reasoning-I liked TLJ but i'm not sure how large the numbers are of audience that hated it- we are hearing from a few hundred or thousand vocal loyalists on social media. Many peiople I talked to like it. Hmmm. The box office drop may be more fatigue with SW than let down with the film

That meeting though- you are right !

 

[MaulFan]

One thing for me about this movie, is the feeling of needing Episode 9 to really form an opinion. As a stand alone movie, it has flaws, but, will 9 round out the overall story of the trilogy in a way that enhances the value of 7 and 8?

For me, this new trilogy is the first time I've experienced having to wait years to see where a story is going. I was born in 83 so I had the whole OT complete by the time I saw it, the PT was about waiting for the details but we knew the gist of where everything was heading because that was about explaining how things got here.

With these new films, where the story is ultimately leading is a big mystery, so there could be elements in the first films that will have value once their importance is realized.

 

[Adolfo]

One thing for me about this movie, is the feeling of needing Episode 9 to really form an opinion. As a stand alone movie, it has flaws, but, will 9 round out the overall story of the trilogy in a way that enhances the value of 7 and 8?

For me, this new trilogy is the first time I've experienced having to wait years to see where a story is going. I was born in 83 so I had the whole OT complete by the time I saw it, the PT was about waiting for the details but we knew the gist of where everything was heading because that was about explaining how things got here.

With these new films, where the story is ultimately leading is a big mystery, so there could be elements in the first films that will have value once their importance is realized.

Episode Nein will complete the circle where the OLD is 100% wiped out...The communist revolution starts invading Casino land...more women with color in their hair...there will be force wielders everywhere..prequel to Avatar last airbender cartoons. ..where lots of kids will have powers...Captain hook is born...Peter pan and lost girls are the new rebel leaders....

 

[crows]

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

That porg face!!!

*I mean Grace's*

 

[aa909]

I saw TFA 4 or 5 times in the theater. Treated 8 or 9 people with tickets. Loved it.

Saw RO twice. Meh. Boring characters.

Saw TLJ once. Never again.

Don’t care what happens next.

Many share your sentiment. And even though TLJ will make bank, IMO episode 9 has serious risk of failing to break $1B if early fan reviews are bad. The TLJ box office impact should be viewed broadly in terms of the impact it has on the next several movies starting with Solo in 2018. I bet many here will vote with their wallets and not see solo in theaters. I’m interested to see the impact since RO did $1.05B, and Solo is a beloved character that should in theory do better than RO.

 

[jye4ever]

You just watch yourself Clown, crows is a wanted man he has the death sentence in 12 forums.

 

[aa909]

Love this chick! Good review too

 

[JAWS]

One thing for me about this movie, is the feeling of needing Episode 9 to really form an opinion. As a stand alone movie, it has flaws, but, will 9 round out the overall story of the trilogy in a way that enhances the value of 7 and 8?
.

That is how I felt with Episode 7.. Had to wait and see if Episode 8 would help me like 7 more.. It did not.

Now I have to wait for 9 to see if it will redeem 7 and 8

 

[aa909]

51% now, what a fall, what a fall.

Bet this drops to 49% when all said and done

 

[crows]

That is how I felt with Episode 7.. Had to wait and see if Episode 8 would help me like 7 more.. It did not.

Now I have to wait for 9 to see if it will redeem 7 and 8

they will probably have to make another "Rogue One" in order to fix this trilogy
an in between movie where they fix the problems with this movie and the other one.

 

[klwn]

That is how I felt with Episode 7.. Had to wait and see if Episode 8 would help me like 7 more.. It did not.

Now I have to wait for 9 to see if it will redeem 7 and 8

I can't watch TFA anymore after knowing what happens next Thanks Ruin Johnson.