The Dark Knight Rises ***USE SPOILER TAGS***

[Nightwing]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

I never said that. You need to go back and read what I wrote. My posts were referring to Nolan's Batman being included by having Superman's public reveal happen after the events of TDKR, so it doesn't mess with the trilogy. I know the movie's already in the can and agree that it's too late in the game to add in stuff. My examples were inclusions in Man of Steel, having GL appear in an article in the Daily Planet and whoever's wearing the cowl at the end of TDKR appearing in a post-credit sequence in MoS, discovering Superman's identity.



My point was why recast the role? You can include Nolan's trilogy without ruining or compromising it. I'm sure if the story was good Bale would return and if JGL gets the cowl at the end, I'm certain he'd want to follow through with more. This way it could be a bridge between Nolan's trilogy and future DCU flicks.



But your point was wrong. The show was littered with Easter eggs referring to the larger DCU. I posted an example.

At the end of the film, someone could've given a speech about Batman (Gordon?) saying he inspired a city, nation, blah blah blah. While the voice over is being heard, someone could've bought a newspaper that has the headline "Man of Steel?", "Who is Superman?", or something similar to it written on the cover. It could have a photo that doesn't show superman very well at all.

For one, that alone would make some people wanna see the movie Man of Steel more, because they'd feel like it expands upon Nolans vision, and since Nolan is involved in it why not? If the teaser trailer is attached to the film, that would've been a huge bonus.

 

[crows]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

At the end of the film, someone could've given a speech about Batman (Gordon?) saying he inspired a city, nation, blah blah blah. While the voice over is being heard, someone could've bought a newspaper that has the headline "Man of Steel?", "Who is Superman?", or something similar to it written on the cover. It could have a photo that doesn't show superman very well at all.

For one, that alone would make some people wanna see the movie Man of Steel more, because they'd feel like it expands upon Nolans vision, and since Nolan is involved in it why not? If the teaser trailer is attached to the film, that would've been a huge bonus.

 

[Nightwing]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

^^^^ Its so clear why DC will always have to milk Batman to try and remain relevant now.



How about this. Imagine a world where all DC gives you is Batman movies for the next 40 years, while Marvel has all there characters in the same universe after buying everyone back.

DC will be too afraid to use any other superheroes because they're scared to take a leap of faith. Meanwhile, Marvel is far beyond them in a "been there, done that" situation towards anything DC dreams of doing.

Eventually, people begin to say, WTF all dcs been giving us is Batman movies for almost 50 years and nothing else. What if they begin to get sick of Batman because he's the only one Dc has the balls to try and work with? You can love James Bond and his 2000 movies, but he isn't part of a gigantic universe full of superheroes or other secret agents who need their own movies and spotlight.

 

[EVILFACE]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Didn't like Green Lantern and Jonah Hex? :/

 

[crows]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

^^^^ Its so clear why DC will always have to milk Batman to try and remain relevant now.



How about this. Imagine a world where all DC gives you is Batman movies for the next 40 years, while Marvel has all there characters in the same universe after buying everyone back.

DC will be too afraid to use any other superheroes because they're scared to take a leap of faith. Meanwhile, Marvel is far beyond them in a "been there, done that" situation towards anything DC dreams of doing.

Eventually, people begin to say, WTF all dcs been giving us is Batman movies for almost 50 years and nothing else. What if they begin to get sick of Batman because he's the only one Dc has the balls to try and work with? You can love James Bond and his 2000 movies, but he isn't part of a gigantic universe full of superheroes or other secret agents who need their own movies and spotlight.

They CAN do Justice League, they Can do Batman vs Superman (although, writing those words makes me )

What They should never do is add those things to this franchise, that would be so bad, adding a newspaper article about Superman to this movie at the end would destroy everything they have build up until now. thats why the sick smiley

but, they can do whatever they want, so far it has sucked, Jonah Hex was laughable, Green Lantern was slow and boring,

Marvel just had better luck at getting better writers and making better stories,

 

[thenammagazine]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Sigh. No it wasn't. I was clearly talking about BTAS (1992-1995) which stood on it's own, in it's own little Bat-universe. You posted an example from TNBA (1997-- post Superman intro and the establishment of the expanded Timmverse...of course they will start littering the series with easter eggs then)

You're welcome to claim "nuh-uh, they were the same continuity, same main actors...therefore same show!" but even if you do that, you cannot deny that the episodes that won the most fan acclaim and critics awards came from the first batch.

That first batch of 85-episodes is the longest running Batman series ever, even without including the TNBA episodes, which do heavily reference the expanded DCU.

You can "" all you want. You're failing to realize that longest running Batman series or not, Batman The Animated Series had little nods to the rest of the DCU throughout it's 85 episodes!

Wow, my daughter, at 6, is more mature.

 

[crows]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

all I can say is Thank God Nolan was in charge of this

 

[ironwez20]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Why the hell would you want batman being the only hero in a universe full of other hero's . It would be really cool if superman was referenced in tdkr. Think about the great expansion of that dark world. Batman would be the inspirAtion of all the new superheroes . Don't know why people want batman to be alone in his own universe.

 

[crows]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Why the hell would you want batman being the only hero in a universe full of other hero's . It would be really cool if superman was referenced in tdkr. Think about the great expansion of that dark world. Batman would be the inspirAtion of all the new superheroes . Don't know why people want batman to be alone in his own universe.

in the Nolan universe, not in general
batman already is part of the justice League, Why the hell would anyone want superman hints in Dark Knight Rises? that would make no sense, would add nothing to the story, it would cheapen the trilogy,
you think Nolan would build this trilogy or realistic universe and have it end like that?

I know maybe they can make superman go back in time and save Rachel while capturing Joker and then batman could fight a horde of Alien invaders with green lantern, yeah... awesome.

 

[ironwez20]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

If Superman appeared in either Dark Knight or Rises (even at the end)that would make the movie Worst than Batman and Robin... that would be one of the cheesiest things to ever happen,

Justice League, yes I get it it would be cool, I would see that.

Having a Batman movie with Green lantern or Superman coming around, sucked. and then you would question, Why wouldn't superman defeat Joker, Joker to Superman is like an Ant, or even green Lantern,
and then you would add to the Batman story all this Alien backstory, It would just ruin it for a lot of people, why would Gotham have any problems if Superman was around, at the same time, with Superman around you add all this Sci fi elements to the story,


I loved Iron man by himself, even if the avengers never happened, he would still be badass, and the movie would have been good,

That's simple. Gotham is batman territory or batman saving a city in tdkr would inspire superman to fight crime himself

 

[ironwez20]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

in the Nolan universe, not in general
batman already is part of the justice League, Why the hell would anyone want superman hints in Dark Knight Rises? that would make no sense, would add nothing to the story, it would cheapen the trilogy,
you think Nolan would build this trilogy or realistic universe and have it end like that?

I know maybe they can make superman go back in time and save Rachel while capturing Joker and then batman could fight a horde of Alien invaders with green lantern, yeah... awesome.

Ok let's be real for a second these movies aren't all that realistic . I'm pretty sure in real life Joker would have not gotten away with half the stuff he did. Batman would get shot and bane wouldn't be able to take over a whole city without the government stepping in. This is a comic book movie . Anything is possible. IMO I can see superman existing in this universe.

 

[DarkMagic]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

You can "" all you want. You're failing to realize that longest running Batman series or not, Batman The Animated Series had little nods to the rest of the DCU throughout it's 85 episodes!

Maybe, but besides the seriously de-powered Zatanna (she was only an escape artist/illusionist...not a practicioner of actual magic) , I can't think of one example from the initial 85 episodes, and your one example is from post those initial 85 episodes. If there are some more examples from the initial 85, great let's hear 'em. I won't "" it, but I certainly won't comb through them to help you prove your point.

Once again, all of the extended DCU superpowered characters (Superman and co.) and truly "magic" guys (the Demon Etrigan) were introduced after those initial 85 episodes. The most fantasy-magic-type character from the initial 85 was Ra's Al Ghul ....and he's a Batman-universe character more than he's an extended DCU character.

They CAN do Justice League, they Can do Batman vs Superman (although, writing those words makes me )

What They should never do is add those things to this franchise, that would be so bad, adding a newspaper article about Superman to this movie at the end would destroy everything they have build up until now. thats why the sick smiley

but, they can do whatever they want, so far it has sucked, Jonah Hex was laughable, Green Lantern was slow and boring,

Marvel just had better luck at getting better writers and making better stories,

Exactly. The Marvel Avengers franchise was planned from the start with Iron Man. They layed the structure and had their movies stick to the plan. They didn't tack it on after the fact like some are saying DC should do now.

^^^^ Its so clear why DC will always have to milk Batman to try and remain relevant now.


How about this. Imagine a world where all DC gives you is Batman movies for the next 40 years, while Marvel has all there characters in the same universe after buying everyone back.

DC will be too afraid to use any other superheroes because they're scared to take a leap of faith. Meanwhile, Marvel is far beyond them in a "been there, done that" situation towards anything DC dreams of doing.

Eventually, people begin to say, WTF all dcs been giving us is Batman movies for almost 50 years and nothing else. What if they begin to get sick of Batman because he's the only one Dc has the balls to try and work with? You can love James Bond and his 2000 movies, but he isn't part of a gigantic universe full of superheroes or other secret agents who need their own movies and spotlight.

Hit the nail on the head right there. Let a great writer-director team make these other heroes shine on their own. Or...we can have them ride Batman's coattails.

Ok let's be real for a second these movies aren't all that realistic . I'm pretty sure in real life Joker would have not gotten away with half the stuff he did. Batman would get shot and bane wouldn't be able to take over a whole city without the government stepping in. This is a comic book movie . Anything is possible. IMO I can see superman existing in this universe.

I was wondering when someone would bring up this argument. "Comics aren't realistic, not even Batman...in real life he'd be dead within a week....since he survives, he clearly lives in a universe where anything is possible, ergo a superpowered near invincible alien that shoots heat from his eyes and flies fits in his universe.".

Not true, and this is a really nuanced argument so bear with me. Batman's universe, specifically Nolan's Batman's universe, stretches plausibility to point, no doubt. The microwave emitter is bad science. There is just nothing in it that stretches plausibility all the way to Krypton if you catch my drift.

Besides, if Superman (or other superpowered heroes) exist in Nolan's Bat-universe, how could they sit idlely by when all of this bad stuff if going on in Gotham and do nothing to help?

Of course, Batman can exist in Superman's universe. It's just not a two-way street, especially with the rigid boundaries of Nolan's Batman. Superman's universe by definition contrasts him and his great power against the mere humans that he lives among. Batman's universe by definition is not at all dependent on the presence of super-powered characters.

Like blackmask said--of course we can have a JLA movie with Batman as a supporting character, no reason why it needs to be this. specific. Nolan. Batman.

 

[thenammagazine]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Not true, and this is a really nuanced argument so bear with me. Batman's universe, specifically Nolan's Batman's universe, stretches plausibility to point, no doubt. The microwave emitter is bad science. There is just nothing in it that stretches plausibility all the way to Krypton if you catch my drift.

Stretches? Or throws it right out the window? You forgot falling more than 30 stories with a woman and both literally walking away, rooftops supporting a 2-ton tumbler with little to no damage, the physics behind the Batpod fitting perfectly into the front end of the Tumbler, criminals absolutely refusing to shoot Batman in his exposed face, a villain who has fourth degree burns over 1/2 of his body but feels zero pain and has absolutely no risk of infection despite being exposed to the elements, an entire city, especially those who've been in close proximity to both, who can't recognize the correlation between Wayne and Batman despite both having the same height, eyes, build, mouth/chin and the most defining feature, the same speech impediment, etc., etc., etc., There are plenty of examples in Nolan's films where Batman is just as surrealistic as Superman or any other DC character.

 

[DarkMagic]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

Stretches? Or throws it right out the window? You forgot falling more than 30 stories with a woman and both literally walking away, rooftops supporting a 2-ton tumbler with little to no damage, the physics behind the Batpod fitting perfectly into the front end of the Tumbler, criminals absolutely refusing to shoot Batman in his exposed face, a villain who has fourth degree burns over 1/2 of his body but feels zero pain and has absolutely no risk of infection despite being exposed to the elements, an entire city, especially those who've been in close proximity to both, who can't recognize the correlation between Wayne and Batman despite both having the same height, eyes, build, mouth/chin and the most defining feature, the same speech impediment, etc., etc., etc., There are plenty of examples in Nolan's films where Batman is just as surrealistic as Superman or any other DC character.

I guess we're just going to have to agree to disagree on this point. All of things you mentioned are highly, highly, highly unlikely---no doubt--- but still not quite on the same level of impossibility as a bullet-proof man who flies and has the heat vision, super-speed and freeze breath.

 

[thenammagazine]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

I guess we're just going to have to agree to disagree on this point. All of things you mentioned are highly, highly, highly unlikely---no doubt--- but still not quite on the same level of impossibility as a bullet-proof man who flies and has the heat vision, super-speed and freeze breath.

 

[Deckard]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

I think "the Bat" vehicle in this new one pretty much throws realism out the window, it does a 180 over a building in the trailer.

The biggest flaw for me is and always will be Rachel being played by 2 actresses. IMO he's already ruined a shot at a perfect trilogy right there, watching BB and TDK back to back right after each other, and having everyone else the same, Bruce, Alfred, Gordon, Fox, but Rachel look blatantly sound and act blatantly differant will never work for me. Maggie > Katie everyday of the week but I would have much preferred Katie in TDK for continuity.

 

[Dr.Mirakle32]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

I think "the Bat" vehicle in this new one pretty much throws realism out the window, it does a 180 over a building in the trailer.

I thought ninjas with a super death-microwave in Begins already did that.

 

[Wolvy]

I think "the Bat" vehicle in this new one pretty much throws realism out the window, it does a 180 over a building in the trailer.

The biggest flaw for me is and always will be Rachel being played by 2 actresses. IMO he's already ruined a shot at a perfect trilogy right there, watching BB and TDK back to back right after each other, and having everyone else the same, Bruce, Alfred, Gordon, Fox, but Rachel look blatantly sound and act blatantly differant will never work for me. Maggie > Katie everyday of the week but I would have much preferred Katie in TDK for continuity.

That wasn't Nolan's decision. Katie didn't want to do a second one. Sure not having the same continuity sucked but it didnt hurt the movie that much IMO.

 

[Deckard]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

That wasn't Nolan's decision. Katie didn't want to do a second one. Sure not having the same continuity sucked but it didnt hurt the movie that much IMO.

No it doesn't "hurt" TDK at all.

It does hurt the trilogy alot.

Watching the two movies a few years apart it makes little differance. Watching both back to back the same day it makes all the differance especially because they went to so much trouble to make sure way bigger way better way more respectable actors like Caine, and Freeman were locked down. Imagine if they changed Leia in ESB, or that Elf Chick in LOTR suddenly looked sort of like she had down syndrome in the 2nd movie.

 

[thenammagazine]

Re: The Dark Knight Rises

That wasn't Nolan's decision. Katie didn't want to do a second one. Sure not having the same continuity sucked but it didnt hurt the movie that much IMO.

It was his decision. They dropped her because of what Tom Cruise was doing and for the fact that she can't act. And yea, it did hurt TDK because they replaced her with a woof.