The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC ( Comic and Un-aired Spoilers unwelcome!)

[Darth_Fatso]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

The "humanity" aspect is entirely subjective. The instinct for survival is just as human as the need for compassion.

 

[Michael Crawford]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

Before humanity could even beging to flourish again the threat would have to be neatralized. To do that, the brutality Shane and Darryl have shown would be needed. Simple as that.

Shane and Darryl are nothing alike. This has nothing to do with a willingness to kill zombies - almost everyone in the group does it with no remorse at this point. It's how they treat the other living humans that separates men like Shane and Darryl.

 

[pixletwin]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

Shane and Darryl are nothing alike. This has nothing to do with a willingness to kill zombies - almost everyone in the group does it with no remorse at this point. It's how they treat the other living humans that separates men like Shane and Darryl.

Reminds me of the half zombie girl in the park from season 1. Pity was the primary motivation for Rick when he shot her.

 

[Kuzeh]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

I'm not talking about Shane killing the zombies as his 'wrong', although how he did it was pretty stupid, since it put everyone at risk including Carl.

I'm talking about Shane taking the farm by force from Herschel, which is his point - killing the zombies was just an means to an end. When he left Lori, he left intending to take the farm. That's why he told Carl they would do whatever it took to stay, and that's why he went to the RV looking for the guns. He has no intention of stopping with clearing the barn (cm'on, do you think Shane is stupid enough to think Herschel is going to say "Oh, thanks so much for killng those zombies, please stay with us" now?), he intends on taking the farm for theirs no matter what that means, and by clearing the barn he's forced the situation. That's what I'm talking about as being the 'wrong' Shane has justified in his own mind.

Funny thing is, he's actually doomed Lori far worse by being rash and emotional. Lori needed Herschel more than she needs his farm - when it comes time to deliver, a doctor (even a vet) is going to be extremely important, and in very, very short supply.

And the instinct to survive is not 'human'. It's a basic animal instinct, unlike compassion. Being able to rise above animal instinct is what makes us human.

 

[thenammagazine]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

And the instinct to survive is not 'human'. It's a basic animal instinct, unlike compassion. Being able to rise above animal instinct is what makes us human.

Survival, while also an animal instinct, is just as human as compassion. The only difference is one is more pure (natural) than the other. The need for survival is built into our human DNA. The other, which essentially is guilt, is programmed afterward and not crucial to being "human."

 

[pixletwin]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

How is compassion essentially guilt?

 

[Mister Ski]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

I'm not talking about Shane killing the zombies as his 'wrong', although how he did it was pretty stupid, since it put everyone at risk including Carl.

I'm talking about Shane taking the farm by force from Herschel, which is his point - killing the zombies was just an means to an end. When he left Lori, he left intending to take the farm. That's why he told Carl they would do whatever it took to stay, and that's why he went to the RV looking for the guns. He has no intention of stopping with clearing the barn (cm'on, do you think Shane is stupid enough to think Herschel is going to say "Oh, thanks so much for killng those zombies, please stay with us" now?), he intends on taking the farm for theirs no matter what that means, and by clearing the barn he's forced the situation. That's what I'm talking about as being the 'wrong' Shane has justified in his own mind.

Funny thing is, he's actually doomed Lori far worse by being rash and emotional. Lori needed Herschel more than she needs his farm - when it comes time to deliver, a doctor (even a vet) is going to be extremely important, and in very, very short supply.

And the instinct to survive is not 'human'. It's a basic animal instinct, unlike compassion. Being able to rise above animal instinct is what makes us human.

As bad as Shane has been, I don't think he has reached that point where he would take the farm by force even if it meant killing Herschel and the others. For the sake of argument let's say that is exactly what he intended. It would fall flat because no one else from his group would ever go along with it. He can't take the whole farm by himself.

I think he was trying to get the others to act more like him by getting them to fight for their survival. He forced the issue by breaking opening the barn, so it was a trial by fire of sorts. It was simple kill or be killed mentality. However, once it got down to a zombie they knew, things got complicated again and that is where Rick stepped in. Shane will probably continue to gain momentum as he slides down the slippery ethical slope he is on, but he hasn't reached bottom yet. Until he does, there is still hope he will come around to the group's way of thinking. Otherwise, things are going to end tragically.

 

[pixletwin]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

I like how Glenn had asked for permission from Maggie before he started shooting. I wonder how that is going to play out with her papa.

 

[Kuzeh]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

How is compassion essentially guilt?

As bad as Shane has been, I don't think he has reached that point where he would take the farm by force even if it meant killing Herschel and the others. For the sake of argument let's say that is exactly what he intended. It would fall flat because no one else from his group would ever go along with it. He can't take the whole farm by himself.

I think he was trying to get the others to act more like him by getting them to fight for their survival. He forced the issue by breaking opening the barn, so it was a trial by fire of sorts. It was simple kill or be killed mentality. However, once it got down to a zombie they knew, things got complicated again and that is where Rick stepped in. Shane will probably continue to gain momentum as he slides down the slippery ethical slope he is on, but he hasn't reached bottom yet. Until he does, there is still hope he will come around to the group's way of thinking. Otherwise, things are going to end tragically.

Seriously this scene alone is one of the most heartbreaking scenes I have ever seen on film or tv... you could tell how all of them were completely taken off-guard by the reveal... and knowing what had to be done...

 

[thenammagazine]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

How is compassion essentially guilt?

The lack thereof triggers what response in you? At it's very heart, what makes you stop and drop change in a bum's cup?

 

[Matt S]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

This is the first time I agree with Shane insofar as the zombies needed to be eliminated from the barn. However, that is not how I would have gone about it.

Still bummed (a little) that they are deviating away from the comic. I have no idea what comes next and i've read every issue.

Sofia and Carl developed a pretty strong friendship in the comic - since they are the youngest - she got a pretty big crush on him and made it to the prison. That's all changed now...weird

 

[Mister Ski]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

This is the first time I agree with Shane insofar as the zombies needed to be eliminated from the barn. However, that is not how I would have gone about it.

Still bummed (a little) that they are deviating away from the comic. I have no idea what comes next and i've read every issue.

Sofia and Carl developed a pretty strong friendship in the comic - since they are the youngest - she got a pretty big crush on him and made it to the prison. That's all changed now...weird

Isn't that a good thing? This way you can be surprised again like you were with the comic.

I for one am glad they are deviating from the comic because it makes it less predictable and more enjoyable for me. I look at the comic and tv show as two separate entities.

 

[Kibagami]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

Isn't that a good thing? This way you can be surprised again like you were with the comic.

That part is nice.

But there are some things from the comic series I'd like to see played out on TV.

 

[plasmid303]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

They've deviated heavily since episode one, man. It's a balancing act for the writers I bet, trying to decide what elements to keep and which to eschew. So far, I think they've been less successful with this, though some things could lead to interesting developments. (Such as the case of Shane).

 

[Matt S]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

To be clear, just the inclusion of some new characters is a deviation since day one - and I love the characters. Guess I just wanted to see some of the things that happened in the comic play out in the show, since they are really strong moments. Comic is more intense than season 2 thus far, imo.

I really hope we see the hordes of zombies as we saw in the comic too - so far, season 2 has played it a little safe

That said, and while different, ending for Season 2.0 was pretty intense

 

[Mad Old Lu]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

You didn't hear Maggie say all the surrounding farms had been burned down?

I totally missed that!

 

[Matt S]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

I totally missed that!

They haven't made it real clear as to why this one farm survived and none of the other did not, other than it being more 'out of the way,' but thats how I've taken to it

 

[Mad Old Lu]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

Strange though I remember Hershell specifically telling Rick that he was "welcome" to take any other farm in the area, when they were discussing whether the group could stay or not.

 

[thenammagazine]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

Strange though I remember Hershell specifically telling Rick that he was "welcome" to take any other farm in the area, when they were discussing whether the group could stay or not.

Which, after Maggie's reply to him, makes me think he lied just to get Rick to leave.

 

[Mad Old Lu]

Re: The Walking Dead - TV Series on AMC

Makes sense. I don't know how I missed Maggie's line...