Those who disliked TLJ, are you still buying toys from it?

[medicomsucks]

Perhaps a better analogy would be like you going to a steak house, ordering a ribeye and getting a ribeye, but it tasting either better or worse than you were expecting.

Some people thought it tasted good, others didn't think it tasted as good as they were expecting it to.

Your analogy would be more akin to going into a theater that said it was playing TLJ on the marquee and therefore, expecting to see TLJ, but it started playing Jumanji instead.

Please put a shirt on....pants too

 

[SwedishHeat]

Star Wars fans are such a finicky bunch. You can't be too similar or you're just copying a la The Force Awakens but yet if a director takes a film in a direction that's different than what they have envisioned in their idealized mindset they hate that too because its too different. Honestly it seems like a damned if you do damned if you don't situation with a lot of fanboys.

I don't think that's what TLJ did.

I mean, TFA ends on this huge climactic moment of Rey handing Luke his old lightsaber that he'd lost in a duel with his father, full of emotion and memories.

And then TLJ opens with Luke tossing that saber over his shoulder, as thought it meant nothing.

TLJ didn't take the series in a new direction, it figuratively spit in the face of the movie that preceded it. If Rian Johnson didn't want to answer the questions JJ asked, he shouldn't have taken the job.

How would people have reacted if ESB opened with the Wampa killing Luke and then Han sets out to find him and then Han dies of hypothermia? I feel like that's the equivalent of what TLJ did.

At this point what happens if JJ opens Ep. 9 and it was all a Vision of the Force in Rey's head as Luke is training her on Anch-To? And then we get a real sequel to TFA. And we just flop back and forth as we retcon movies over and over again.

Anyways, I'm not buying any figures from this movie because none of them were memorable.

 

[Rijie78]

Nope, I don't consider any of the TFA/TLJ character designs in any way memorable or exceptional enough to want toys of them. That's an opinion largely divorced from my opinion of the new film itself, though as it happens I thoroughly disliked it for a host of reasons.

 

[Mike86]

I don't think that's what TLJ did.

I mean, TFA ends on this huge climactic moment of Rey handing Luke his old lightsaber that he'd lost in a duel with his father, full of emotion and memories.

And then TLJ opens with Luke tossing that saber over his shoulder, as thought it meant nothing.

TLJ didn't take the series in a new direction, it figuratively spit in the face of the movie that preceded it. If Rian Johnson didn't want to answer the questions JJ asked, he shouldn't have taken the job.

How would people have reacted if ESB opened with the Wampa killing Luke and then Han sets out to find him and then Han dies of hypothermia? I feel like that's the equivalent of what TLJ did.

At this point what happens if JJ opens Ep. 9 and it was all a Vision of the Force in Rey's head as Luke is training her on Anch-To? And then we get a real sequel to TFA. And we just flop back and forth as we retcon movies over and over again.

Anyways, I'm not buying any figures from this movie because none of them were memorable.

It deviated from what people expected. Luke changed over the course of thirty something years just like people do in real life. At the point he was at where being a Jedi ultimately led him down a path where he was alone and in his mind let down two of the people he cared most about the fact that he doesn’t just take his former weapon and join Rey on her crusade against the First Order makes sense. Just because it didn’t go the way people thought it would (just like Luke says in the trailer) doesn’t mean it’s bad.

As far as not answering questions the major ones really are Rey’s past which I think people are putting too much stock behind thinking that Kylo was for sure telling her the truth and the mystery of Snoke who was honestly set up pretty poorly in the first place and who’s fate I ultimately didn’t care about and think what Johnson did worked to make Kylo fully turn.

Ultimately the film didn’t go the safe route and that worked for some and not for others. I don’t think that’s a bad thing and especially when you have people whining about how the previous film was too much of a retread then what do you want?


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[LipSmack]

I might Grab TLJ Kylo Ren, really love the character and design, and can come up with my own head cannon when I play with it

 

[Mandible]

Wasn't planning to - particularly now, after seeing the film.

Only bought Kylo, Stormtrooper and Tie pilot from TFA, and with the way this trilogy has gone, I think I'm going to sell those three off. Snoke pointing out that Kylo's mask is "ridiculous" in TLJ, literally makes a joke of his whole look in Ep7, and leaves a bad taste in the mouth. So without him, the other two become useless in my collection

 

[SwedishHeat]

Luke changed over the course of thirty something years just like people do in real life.

I did read your whole post, I deviated from your thinking at this point.

Stating the obvious, Star Wars is not real life, as in, these characters are/were archetypes and shouldn't/wouldn't behave like "real people". Star Wars is fantasy.

I don't need these types of movies hitting me over the head with the political realities of war, in that someone else is funding these wars and getting rich off the ideological disagreement between two factions. If I want to see that type of thing, I 'll go watch a movie starring George Clooney or Matt Damon. Star Wars should be about 'good vs evil', simple black and white stuff.

I hope Rian gets to go off and make his 'hard' Star Wars trilogy and JJ comes back to make the mainline trilogy into the fun adventure stuff that Star Wars should be.

 

[Mike86]

Fantasy or not shouldn’t dictate the fact that people do change over time. It’s got nothing to do with politics or whatever you’re trying to bring into it but just a reality no matter who or what you’re referring to. That seems like a silly complaint about a valid point. If you don’t like what the film did then fine but I think it’s obvious Luke in The Last Jedi is just obviously in a different place than he was in the Original Trilogy. It’s pretty plain and simple.


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[SithThundercracker]

I don't think that's what TLJ did.

I mean, TFA ends on this huge climactic moment of Rey handing Luke his old lightsaber that he'd lost in a duel with his father, full of emotion and memories.

And then TLJ opens with Luke tossing that saber over his shoulder, as thought it meant nothing.

TLJ didn't take the series in a new direction, it figuratively spit in the face of the movie that preceded it. If Rian Johnson didn't want to answer the questions JJ asked, he shouldn't have taken the job.

How would people have reacted if ESB opened with the Wampa killing Luke and then Han sets out to find him and then Han dies of hypothermia? I feel like that's the equivalent of what TLJ did.

At this point what happens if JJ opens Ep. 9 and it was all a Vision of the Force in Rey's head as Luke is training her on Anch-To? And then we get a real sequel to TFA. And we just flop back and forth as we retcon movies over and over again.

Anyways, I'm not buying any figures from this movie because none of them were memorable.

I did read your whole post, I deviated from your thinking at this point.

Stating the obvious, Star Wars is not real life, as in, these characters are/were archetypes and shouldn't/wouldn't behave like "real people". Star Wars is fantasy.

I don't need these types of movies hitting me over the head with the political realities of war, in that someone else is funding these wars and getting rich off the ideological disagreement between two factions. If I want to see that type of thing, I 'll go watch a movie starring George Clooney or Matt Damon. Star Wars should be about 'good vs evil', simple black and white stuff.

I hope Rian gets to go off and make his 'hard' Star Wars trilogy and JJ comes back to make the mainline trilogy into the fun adventure stuff that Star Wars should be.

Can I quote every single word of both posts?

 

[SilverStar17]

It deviated from what people expected. Luke changed over the course of thirty something years just like people do in real life. At the point he was at where being a Jedi ultimately led him down a path where he was alone and in his mind let down two of the people he cared most about the fact that he doesn’t just take his former weapon and join Rey on her crusade against the First Order makes sense. Just because it didn’t go the way people thought it would (just like Luke says in the trailer) doesn’t mean it’s bad.

As far as not answering questions the major ones really are Rey’s past which I think people are putting too much stock behind thinking that Kylo was for sure telling her the truth and the mystery of Snoke who was honestly set up pretty poorly in the first place and who’s fate I ultimately didn’t care about and think what Johnson did worked to make Kylo fully turn.

Ultimately the film didn’t go the safe route and that worked for some and not for others. I don’t think that’s a bad thing and especially when you have people whining about how the previous film was too much of a retread then what do you want?


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Fantasy or not shouldn’t dictate the fact that people do change over time. It’s got nothing to do with politics or whatever you’re trying to bring into it but just a reality no matter who or what you’re referring to. That seems like a silly complaint about a valid point. If you don’t like what the film did then fine but I think it’s obvious Luke in The Last Jedi is just obviously in a different place than he was in the Original Trilogy. It’s pretty plain and simple.


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I more get the impression that Kylo really knows who Rey is, but doesn't want Rey to know. I wouldn't be surprised if by the end of the trilogy, she has a surname.

 

[Amanaman]

OT only. Always.

+1

I vote with my wallet. I'm not even proud of Disney getting a cut from OT collectibles that are being made now. I keep SW purchases to a bare minimum.

 

[Amanaman]

Fantasy or not shouldn’t dictate the fact that people do change over time. It’s got nothing to do with politics or whatever you’re trying to bring into it but just a reality no matter who or what you’re referring to. That seems like a silly complaint about a valid point. If you don’t like what the film did then fine but I think it’s obvious Luke in The Last Jedi is just obviously in a different place than he was in the Original Trilogy. It’s pretty plain and simple.


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No, it's lazy writing with a specific disdain for the OT fans. Disney wanted to write out the old cast as fast as possible to push their new commercial ambitions like the theme park expansions.

Even TFA hit the reset button on Han's development and made him some low-tier smuggler again. TFA failed to explain what happened in the 30 years since ROTJ, giving me the impression that they just didn't care to.

 

[SilverStar17]

No, it's lazy writing with a specific disdain for the OT fans.

You honestly believe they made this film with the specific intention of messing with OT fans because they have a disdain for them?

 

[Mike86]

No, it's lazy writing with a specific disdain for the OT fans. Disney wanted to write out the old cast as fast as possible to push their new commercial ambitions like the theme park expansions.

Even TFA hit the reset button on Han's development and made him some low-tier smuggler again.

Uh no. Disney didn’t have to bring back the Original Trilogy cast at all. Leia is still alive and I wouldn’t discount Luke back as a Force Ghost. Did you honestly expect three new films featuring Luke, Leia, and Han in their sixties and seventies getting all the spotlight? Luke and Han both had honorable deaths. Han was trying to redeem his son and Luke was trying to help Rey, Leia, and the Resistance at a bleak point and ultimately brought a sense of hope. He sacrificed himself for the greater good. Not honoring the characters would have had them not featured at all or doing nothing significant.

As far as Han went back to what he knew in my opinion. He lost his son which tore him and Leia apart and Luke had disappeared. He fell back into old habits probably to take his mind off of everything else.


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[Amanaman]

You honestly believe they made this film with the specific intention of messing with OT fans because they have a disdain for them?

I dunno, some execs like KK may, with their Force is Female shirts and other subversive crap. But for Disney at large, it's money that talks, and they believe the new fans will bring in the most money.

Mike86, I get your point, but all of this isn't explained on screen.

 

[SilverStar17]

I dunno, some execs like KK may, with their Force is Female shirts and other subversive crap. But for Disney at large, it's money that talks, and they believe the new fans will bring in the most money.

So you really believe that while sitting around the discussion table, at some point something along the lines of "You know, I really hate those OT fans. What's the best way we can really stick it to all those OT fans?", was said?

Like Mike said, if they really hated the OT as you say, don't you think they would have not cast any OT characters at all in the first place? They could have easily had this trilogy take place 50+ years into the future from the OT as opposed to 30, and just said they all died already.

 

[koonfasa]

Her T-shirt really says it all. I think it's starting to go to far. Although I like the fact Leia is now a Disney Princess.

I do find it amusing though as Star Wars fans it's fine to see this movie again to"see if we really like it or not" but in reality all we are doing is adding to the release day stats...

 

[Amanaman]

If your mind is able harmonize all three trilogies, then more power to you. Enviable, even.

I don't see eye to eye with the new ownership. While the prospect of a brand new, shiny SW with modern graphics was exciting in 2015, I just don't like their creative vision, and completely detest their postmodern moral posturing. I also think that Mark Hamill's disappointment with TLJ is a huge blow for many casual fans.

As long as you're happy, buy the toys that fuel your fandom, and not the ones that detract from it.

 

[Lakhota]

I dunno, some execs like KK may, with their Force is Female shirts and other subversive crap. But for Disney at large, it's money that talks, and they believe the new fans will bring in the most money.

Mike86, I get your point, but all of this isn't explained on screen.

Think about it , they are now doing 1 movie a year. They want to make as much money as possible per movie, they are not looking at the over all picture. They didn't even write the script or outline to 8 and 9 they are doing them one at a time. They are keeping it a certain demographic and hitting it hard year to year and not having to have a movie carry on toys and merchandise for 3 years time. They don't care about the hardcore fans they know they will make 2 billion dollar Star Wars movies every year.

 

[davejames]

I guess it must help that I was never too attached to the EU depiction of Han, Luke and Leia and those post-ROTJ years to begin with, as it all just felt a bit predictable and expected somehow. For me it's a whole lot more interesting to jump ahead to when they're all much older and things aren't going nearly as well for them anymore.

The idea of a down-on-his-luck Han or a disillusioned Luke just seems a lot more dramatically compelling than seeing them as a bunch of happy and respected leaders and generals and Jedi Masters leading a new Jedi Order or whatever.