WATCHMEN Movie Discussion (SPOILERS allowed)!

[CelticPredator]

Comic ends with a gigantic geneticly enhanced squid created by Veidt, and he unleashes it on New York, making everyone believe that the world is under attack by Aliens, so everyone bands together.

Movie is Ozy and Dr.M create a machine that can replicate Dr.M's powers to juice up the whole world. So, no energy loss.

But Ozy uses it and attacks a ton of places around the world causing everyone to band together to hate Dr. M.

 

[tomandshell]

Wow--didn't realize they changed things that drastically. Knew the squid was out, but not the rest.

 

[DarkArtist81]

I'm a huge fan. 300 was long one of my favorite Frank Miller works, only behind TDKR. While everyone was clamoring for Sin City to be made into a movie, I was sitting in a corner clutching 300 and hoping.

I remember how skeptical I was that they could pull off the graphic novel translation to film convincingly; I just wasn't sure the audience would buy that these guys were meant to be paragons of warriors, stripped down of armor in the graphic novel because they honed their entire bodies into weapons. Frank Miller himself said as much, that it's nowhere close to historically accurate, but isn't intended to be. Not history, but based on history and more akin to a myth or legend handed down over generations. That's a huge facet, hence the role of Dilios in the story. As a huge fan of the GN for so long, I was delirious with joy as to how Snyder translated to film. It's not meant to be Oscar caliber, it's not meant to make you think, what it is meant to do is portray fighting as honorable and even almost balletic in the way it can be orchestrated by skilled fighters... and Frank Miller did get that right. Hell, Sparta was the only Greek city-state that lacked walls; they believed the men of Sparta would be defense enough; and what's important to note is that they were right, considering what's known of battles in which Spartans fought, their culture, and the Agoge. If you're at all interested in the period and want to read an EXCELLENT story about the Battle of Thermopylae, I recommend the following...

Easily one of the best "surprises" I just picked up on a whim and became totally engrossed in. If you're into that era, it's an excellent book.

ANYWAY... I guess what I'm saying is that Snyder has earned my confidence that he can pull off a faithful adaptation with a degree of creative liberty. That said, 300 wasn't meant to make you think, and Watchmen is intended to be extremely thought provoking. Therein lies the crucial difference.

Well said man, I totally agree. And thanks for the recommendation on that book, I will definitely check it out.

As for Watchmen, I do worry about what my Wife will think of it... I remember having to explain to her how much better a comic V for Vendetta was than the film once we got out of it. So I hope that I don't have to do the same with Watchmen, especially now that I have blown it up to mega proportions for her.

 

[CelticPredator]

Wow--didn't realize they changed things that drastically. Knew the squid was out, but not the rest.

Well....the machine is called the Sub QUantum Intrinsic Device

 

[Khev]

Comic ends with a gigantic geneticly enhanced squid created by Veidt, and he unleashes it on New York, making everyone believe that the world is under attack by Aliens, so everyone bands together.

Movie is Ozy and Dr.M create a machine that can replicate Dr.M's powers to juice up the whole world. So, no energy loss.

But Ozy uses it and attacks a ton of places around the world causing everyone to band together to hate Dr. M.

Thanks for the summary!

 

[barbelith]

Comic ends with a gigantic geneticly enhanced squid created by Veidt, and he unleashes it on New York, making everyone believe that the world is under attack by Aliens, so everyone bands together.

Movie is Ozy and Dr.M create a machine that can replicate Dr.M's powers to juice up the whole world. So, no energy loss.

But Ozy uses it and attacks a ton of places around the world causing everyone to band together to hate Dr. M.

Yep. Except the whole world already justifiably hates Dr Manhattan, so it's garbled nonsense as a plot twist. It's clear in the final film nobody involved understood why the squid was in the book. But then this is a film where normal humans throw people through walls, so I think most of the thought went into "How can we make Rorshach's mask look cool?" than "What was Moore trying to achieve here?"

Great eye candy, though. I don't want to bash it. I think it's a C film.

 

[CelticPredator]

I disagree with ya there. Yeah, we all hate Dr. M....but who better to pin such a horrible act on?

And yeah, the squid has a good point in the book, a unknown terror...but the problem is, its just way too out there for mainstream.

But oh well. I dont have an issue with it. It could've been worse. Oh so much worse.

 

[Entropy]

The question isn't whether Dr. M could logically be a patsy, it's whether making him a patsy, and the destruction of a dozen or more major cities in the process, would logically preclude nuclear war between the US and USSR?

 

[darthviper107]

Really I wish they would have kept the squid, it doesn't seem much more "out there" than other stuff in the story. And it works perfectly. Really I don't think it's going to do all that well with mainstream audiences anyways, there really isn't that much action in the story.

 

[CelticPredator]

The question isn't whether Dr. M could logically be a patsy, it's whether making him a patsy, and the destruction of a dozen or more major cities in the process, would logically preclude nuclear war between the US and USSR?

Yes. Because Dr.M is the only thing stopping the war. With him choosing NO sides, and attacking everything, they dont need to fight anymore.

 

[CelticPredator]

Really I wish they would have kept the squid, it doesn't seem much more "out there" than other stuff in the story. And it works perfectly. Really I don't think it's going to do all that well with mainstream audiences anyways, there really isn't that much action in the story.

Snyder made the action longer....but the Squid, its out there. Hell, it was even out there when I read the book. Its a great concept, and I dont mind either way.

 

[DinoLast]

I don't like this ending

Spoiler

I can't see how it would stop World War III from happening

 

[CelticPredator]

And also, if there IS another War, DR. M will blow the hell out of the ones who start it. Ergo...no more war.

 

[Scar]

Yep. Except the whole world already justifiably hates Dr Manhattan, so it's garbled nonsense as a plot twist. It's clear in the final film nobody involved understood why the squid was in the book. But then this is a film where normal humans throw people through walls, so I think most of the thought went into "How can we make Rorshach's mask look cool?" than "What was Moore trying to achieve here?"

Great eye candy, though. I don't want to bash it. I think it's a C film.

I think there's a key difference between fear and outright vengeful hate. The former may lead to the latter, but just having mistrust of Dr. M would likely not be enough to marshall the world against a god. To motivate people out of their fearful cocoons, sometimes you need drastic action. It's a small step from mumbling angry things to taking action; a small step, but a difficult one. The death of millions would be the necessary galvanizing force to make people jump to their feet screaming for blood.

 

[Kabukiman]

So are we going to get Irish's review tonight?

 

[DinoLast]

And also, if there IS another War, DR. M will blow the hell out of the ones who start it. Ergo...no more war.

But I thought the only reason the Russians did not Attack the USA is because Dr Manhatten was on the USA's side.
Also I recall that in the book he says that he could not stop all the Nukes.

 

[scubasteve]

So are we going to get Irish's review tonight?

That's what I want to know!

 

[tomandshell]

Dr. Manhattan was so associated with America that worldwide genocide on his part would likely just turn the other countries even further against the US, not unite the world. Even a popcorn movie like Independence Day played with the idea of the world uniting despite their differences to battle a foe that was not of this earth, and it worked. An alien threat gives everyone a common enemy, with no politics or finger pointing or blame. Just humanity united against a threat that has no connection to earth or affiliation with any of it's nations. Manhattan was far too implicated and involved in US foreign policy and world history to be seen as an impartial third party and wouldn't evoke the kind of emotions from the world that the story requires--if the "alien" enemy had been America's superpowered bulldog all along, it would not have inspired the same response. The next step would be the world turning against the US so we never abuse our power again, with Nixon on the defense and the coldest Cold War yet.

So I'm interested in seeing how this all plays out in the movie.

 

[YoNoSe]

I'm still interested to see how this turned out, and certainly the visuals have built up a lot of good will, but these details are exactly what I didn't want to hear.
Personally, I never thought the squid would be any more difficult to accept than a 50 foot blue man with his junk hanging out. But even more bothersome to me is the very human characters displaying any superhuman type abilities like throwing people through walls, etc.
Watching 300 for the first time last week didn't help but I'm willing to give Snyder the benefit of the doubt until I see for myself....

 

[The Mike]

Manhattan was far too implicated and involved in US foreign policy and world history to be seen as an impartial third party and wouldn't evoke the kind of emotions from the world that the story requires--if the "alien" enemy had been America's superpowered bulldog all along, it would not have inspired the same response.

Here is the thing if Veidt's plan was to scapegoat Manhattan and show that even though he so closely related to the United States that through his furthering removal and disassociation with humanity that even his loyalities faulter, he could show that Manhattan himself doesn't even care about the United States. That would unite the people of the United States against Manhattan and give the world a common enemy since he is so powerful it would take every nation to combat him. I can see the same implications as the novel the thing is it'll have to be spelled out for most I'm sure.