Zack Snyder's Justice League - what's your wish list?

[Chris2k]

You need to do a bit more research mate. WB will never allow another blockbuster "movie". If anything it will be the parent company AT&T using HBOMax to have a Season 2 and Season 3 to round out the vision on TV. There he can easily have 4 hours of content. 6 x 45minutes = 4,5 hours or whatever. Yes the overall budget will need to be smaller, but that's the new rules which people will need to find a way. Just like Disney with The Mandalorian.

That said, also don't discount WB's own involvement in cutting down his movies and making them incoherent. Have you seen Suicide Squad ? Also a prime example of WB interference for editing the movie using a trailer editing company. That is almost unwatchable to me due to that.

But what does it matter, you're not going to be convinced by anything I or anyone says here.

Yea I understand that AT&T could decide to move it to HBO Max but I would be extremely surprised if they allocate all that money just to put it on a streaming service. They want Avengers-level money and the best way to do that is to release it in theaters where they?ll make more compared to streaming revenue. And if they do decide to release it on streaming they?ll have to cut down the budget like you said and that means they?ll have to scale down the epic ness that Snyder wants, thus sacrificing his vision for the 2 films, which just brings us back to square 1 of Snyder having to compromise his ideas because of budget and mandates.

And yes I also understand WB?s nonsensical choices when it comes to editing SS but that was almost a direct result of BvS being so divisive. They felt the need to be more involved because they couldn?t risk another critical flop, which of course happened regardless.

And there?s no need to make assumptions or be passive aggressive with that last sentence. I?m open to talking about the likelihood and logistics of the Snyderverse being continued.


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[aksimpson91]

Is it fair enough to say if Hot Toys were going to announce anything else they have by now?

 

[ArtDamage]

Is it fair enough to say if Hot Toys were going to announce anything else they have by now?

Not necessarily, I wouldn't doubt them waiting on reception until actually planning anything else. They could be working on prototypes now for comic con online time for all we know.

 

[Hoody999]

Yea I understand that AT&T could decide to move it to HBO Max but I would be extremely surprised if they allocate all that money just to put it on a streaming service. They want Avengers-level money and the best way to do that is to release it in theaters where they?ll make more compared to streaming revenue. And if they do decide to release it on streaming they?ll have to cut down the budget like you said and that means they?ll have to scale down the epic ness that Snyder wants, thus sacrificing his vision for the 2 films, which just brings us back to square 1 of Snyder having to compromise his ideas because of budget and mandates.

And yes I also understand WB?s nonsensical choices when it comes to editing SS but that was almost a direct result of BvS being so divisive. They felt the need to be more involved because they couldn?t risk another critical flop, which of course happened regardless.

And there?s no need to make assumptions or be passive aggressive with that last sentence. I?m open to talking about the likelihood and logistics of the Snyderverse being continued.

OK good you're at least open to some dialogue. So many people here online are not.

Sure everyone wants Endgame level income, but that's not going to happen any time soon through movie theatres.

These days it's more about investment in your streaming service to ensure you are still part of the game. Who knows if movie theatres will still be a thing going forward for a lot of people. This whole thing of watching entertainment in the comfort of your own home, at a time you choose etc really has the traditional cinema concept on the back foot. Especially with streaming where studios no longer have to pay percentages of their income to cinemas or distribution.

Don't get me wrong. I'm an avid cinema goer, but the model is changing.

There are a lot of different valuations out there, but the global streaming market value is worth several hundred billion dollars, with it increasing year on year. AT&T and HBOMAx definitely want a piece of that pie !

https://www.globenewswire.com/news-...Bolster-Growth-Fortune-Business-Insights.html

Amazon is rumoured to be spending close to a billion on 2 seasons for a new Lord of the Rings show. The Mandalorian ran at something like 10-15 million per show. If the prize can be billions of dollars from membership then show production cost can also rise for their tent pole shows.

Therefore it's big movies or series like Zack Snyders Justice League (which clearly have fans and viewers positive attention) which AT&T + WB need to get paid subscribers to join the service. It's either that, or they won't have any money to make anything going forward. Have you seen theatre box office numbers recently ?

Sure they need to be very cautious that it will work and go by the view numbers, social media chatter etc. But if WB doesn't interfere thinking they know best (like for ZSJL) then we've just seen what can happen.

All I want is JL 2 and JL 3. Anything more would be gravy to me.

 

[Hoody999]

Is it fair enough to say if Hot Toys were going to announce anything else they have by now?

Often Hot Toys will wait and see what the reception is for a movie or series before releasing more figures. Knightmare Batman rerelease and Black Suit Supes were an easy call for them. Quick to get images, costing etc out there, plus their social media could clearly see collectors asking for them.

As ArtDamage said they most probably are working on stuff now. They did have a prototype done (and shown) for Cyborg a few years ago. But he never made it to production. Probably after the characters role was severely cut from the Josstice League version.

Considering many collectors have the full team, minus Cyborg. It would be not surprising to see that show up at some point soon.

I'd argue that it wouldn't be a huge job for them to make a Darkseid using the existing Thanos underbody. But who knows. Perhaps they'll wait to see if JL2 or 3 will happen where he'll definitely be involved.

 

[The Buffinator]

Often Hot Toys will wait and see what the reception is for a movie or series before releasing more figures. Knightmare Batman rerelease and Black Suit Supes were an easy call for them. Quick to get images, costing etc out there, plus their social media could clearly see collectors asking for them.

As ArtDamage said they most probably are working on stuff now. They did have a prototype done (and shown) for Cyborg a few years ago. But he never made it to production. Probably after the characters role was severely cut from the Josstice League version.

Considering many collectors have the full team, minus Cyborg. It would be not surprising to see that show up at some point soon.

I'd argue that it wouldn't be a huge job for them to make a Darkseid using the existing Thanos underbody. But who knows. Perhaps they'll wait to see if JL2 or 3 will happen where he'll definitely be involved.

I wonder if Ray Fisher has any contractual rights regarding likeness approval and/or a cut of merchandising? If he's still on the outs with WB that could get awkward. Or WB could put the kibosh on it as a result...

 

[Chris2k]

OK good you're at least open to some dialogue. So many people here online are not.

Sure everyone wants Endgame level income, but that's not going to happen any time soon through movie theatres.

These days it's more about investment in your streaming service to ensure you are still part of the game. Who knows if movie theatres will still be a thing going forward for a lot of people. This whole thing of watching entertainment in the comfort of your own home, at a time you choose etc really has the traditional cinema concept on the back foot. Especially with streaming where studios no longer have to pay percentages of their income to cinemas or distribution.

Don't get me wrong. I'm an avid cinema goer, but the model is changing.

There are a lot of different valuations out there, but the global streaming market value is worth several hundred billion dollars, with it increasing year on year. AT&T and HBOMAx definitely want a piece of that pie !

https://www.globenewswire.com/news-...Bolster-Growth-Fortune-Business-Insights.html

Amazon is rumoured to be spending close to a billion on 2 seasons for a new Lord of the Rings show. The Mandalorian ran at something like 10-15 million per show. If the prize can be billions of dollars from membership then show production cost can also rise for their tent pole shows.

Therefore it's big movies or series like Zack Snyders Justice League (which clearly have fans and viewers positive attention) which AT&T + WB need to get paid subscribers to join the service. It's either that, or they won't have any money to make anything going forward. Have you seen theatre box office numbers recently ?

Sure they need to be very cautious that it will work and go by the view numbers, social media chatter etc. But if WB doesn't interfere thinking they know best (like for ZSJL) then we've just seen what can happen.

All I want is JL 2 and JL 3. Anything more would be gravy to me.

I don?t have much else to add in terms of Snyderverse but thanks for providing the link to the article. I think the biggest challenge to JL2 and 3 is the cast. Ray won?t be coming back until Hamada is gone which doesn?t seem very likely. No one has any idea on Cavill?s role as Superman and it?s been that way for a few years it feels like. And Affleck has recently expressed interest in returning for 2 and 3 but I think that largely depends on Flash?s performance as well.

Streaming has definitely been on the rise lately and the pandemic fast tracked that with theaters being closed and likely not opening to 100% capacity until the end of the year (and even that?s being generous tbh) so subscriptions are only going to keep going up. So I think short term profits are definitely going to be way up there for HBO Max?s films (ZSJL, Godzilla V Kong, MK, etc). But aside from that do we know how much money streaming movies actually make? Ik a lot of companies are sorta hush-hush on numbers and there?s really no way to verify if they?re as high as they say. Are profits only from subscriptions or is there secondary sources for profit?


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[Alatar]

It'll take a month to sift through the data for ZSJL worldwide. It appeared on lots of different platforms that HBO Max contracted with. But based on the early numbers I'd be amazed if talks aren't already underway.

Chris2K has a point that one of the biggest hurdles is to get the actors together for a long shoot of two seasons back to back. But as regards Ray Fisher, this HBO Max series will have nothing to do with Walter Hamada, it'll be overseen by Casey Bloys. So there's no problem for Ray Fisher.

Robert Meyer Burnett made a great point the other day. If you really want to empower Zack Snyder to continue the Snyderverse and complete the vision, watch the holy hell out of Army of the Dead and it's animated prequel on Netflix in May.

 

[Turtle882]

I don?t have much else to add in terms of Snyderverse but thanks for providing the link to the article. I think the biggest challenge to JL2 and 3 is the cast. Ray won?t be coming back until Hamada is gone which doesn?t seem very likely. No one has any idea on Cavill?s role as Superman and it?s been that way for a few years it feels like. And Affleck has recently expressed interest in returning for 2 and 3 but I think that largely depends on Flash?s performance as well.

Streaming has definitely been on the rise lately and the pandemic fast tracked that with theaters being closed and likely not opening to 100% capacity until the end of the year (and even that?s being generous tbh) so subscriptions are only going to keep going up. So I think short term profits are definitely going to be way up there for HBO Max?s films (ZSJL, Godzilla V Kong, MK, etc). But aside from that do we know how much money streaming movies actually make? Ik a lot of companies are sorta hush-hush on numbers and there?s really no way to verify if they?re as high as they say. Are profits only from subscriptions or is there secondary sources for profit?


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Ads. HBO is looking into a lower price tier that includes ads to help drive subscriptions, which apparently aren't doing as well as hoped.

 

[Hoody999]

I don?t have much else to add in terms of Snyderverse but thanks for providing the link to the article. I think the biggest challenge to JL2 and 3 is the cast. Ray won?t be coming back until Hamada is gone which doesn?t seem very likely. No one has any idea on Cavill?s role as Superman and it?s been that way for a few years it feels like. And Affleck has recently expressed interest in returning for 2 and 3 but I think that largely depends on Flash?s performance as well.

Streaming has definitely been on the rise lately and the pandemic fast tracked that with theaters being closed and likely not opening to 100% capacity until the end of the year (and even that?s being generous tbh) so subscriptions are only going to keep going up. So I think short term profits are definitely going to be way up there for HBO Max?s films (ZSJL, Godzilla V Kong, MK, etc). But aside from that do we know how much money streaming movies actually make? Ik a lot of companies are sorta hush-hush on numbers and there?s really no way to verify if they?re as high as they say. Are profits only from subscriptions or is there secondary sources for profit?

That's actually another point which Studios should actually like. With movie theatre Boxoffice numbers open to all, the press can determine if a movie is a success or failure based on what they write and the public read. That can directly effect the popularity of any given movie.

With streaming Studios can keep numbers to themselves and control the "success" or "failure" to themselves somewhat.

As far as income it of course won't be on a movie by movie basis as such. Monthly membership needs to be maintained and customers held onto. $15/month is a lot more than most people spend on movies every single month (minus the popcorn and all that stuff at the theatre).

As for other income streams WB could eventually also move to a PVOD model, meaning they could ask for a higher amount for a movie (equivalent of taking a family to the cinema for example) before it comes to the streaming channel.

Either way they will find a way to fund the movies and high quality TV shows which we are all used to.

In this case JL2 would be predominantly set in a Knightmare future. So filming desert style landscapes on green screen or using game engine tech like Mandalorian etc isn't crazy expensive.

edit : I just had a look at Netflix. They have over 200 million subscribers globally. Take $15/month = $36 billion per year income. That's a whole lot of money without ads, and way more than a couple of 1 billion dollar films which the studio doesn't see 100% of anyway.

 

[Alatar]

Ads are always an important ingredient but let’s face it, HBO Max (or any streaming service) needs exciting original content to draw subscriptions! Here they have a global phenomenon, the Snyder cut, ripe for further development. There’s nothing bigger than that on the horizon right now. I mean it’s such an obvious move that it would be stunning for it NOT to happen.

 

[Hoody999]

Ads are always an important ingredient but let’s face it, HBO Max (or any streaming service) needs exciting original content to draw subscriptions! Here they have a global phenomenon, the Snyder cut, ripe for further development. There’s nothing bigger than that on the horizon fright now. I mean it’s such an obvious move that it would be stunning for it NOT to happen.

Yep which also makes that article from Anne Sarnoff even more amazing. Did they really think it would bomb ? Or did they think they could stop the talk about it by trying to get in front of it and tell people that's it.

It actually created a massive spike in social media for the Snyder Cut !

Just shows how out of touch so called executives are from the real world. Time and time again they really prove that they deserve those massive salaries. (yes that's sarcasm)

 

[Dash]

Yep which also makes that article from Anne Sarnoff even more amazing. Did they really think it would bomb ? Or did they think they could stop the talk about it by trying to get in front of it and tell people that's it.

It actually created a massive spike in social media for the Snyder Cut !

Just shows how out of touch so called executives are from the real world. Time and time again they really prove that they deserve those massive salaries. (yes that's sarcasm)

It also proves how much they should keep their useless, talent-less hands out of the creative process altogether. These were the same type of blundering halfwits that chose to meddle in Snyder's original film and instead released Whedon's would-be Marvel Clone.

 

[Hoody999]

It also proves how much they should keep their useless, talent-less hands out of the creative process altogether. These were the same type of blundering halfwits that chose to meddle in Snyder's original film and instead released Whedon's would-be Marvel Clone.

Not to mention Suicide Squad and who knows how many others.....

 

[Mr.Tanker]

It also proves how much they should keep their useless, talent-less hands out of the creative process altogether. These were the same type of blundering halfwits that chose to meddle in Snyder's original film and instead released Whedon's would-be Marvel Clone.

It is worth pointing out that Geoff Johns was at least partially responsible for the mess that is DC films (specially, Justice League). It's why he was fired.

 

[Luisenigma1]

It is worth pointing out that Geoff Johns was at least partially responsible for the mess that is DC films (specially, Justice League). It's why he was fired.

Yes it's very much worth it. If he and all the other fools at Warner didn't butt into the snyder cut we wouldn't be so unsure of the future DC plan.

 

[MedievaL]

Robert Meyer Burnett made a great point the other day. If you really want to empower Zack Snyder to continue the Snyderverse and complete the vision, watch the holy hell out of Army of the Dead and it's animated prequel on Netflix in May.

Or just leave it running on TV while you do other stuff to make up viewership numbers.

I mean it’s such an obvious move that it would be stunning for it NOT to happen.

Don't be surprised how blind people can be to the obvious.

 

[Alatar]

Don't be surprised how blind people can be to the obvious.

True, although just to clarify my point is about HBO Max versus WB. WB knows but is willfully refusing to continue for whatever dysfunctional reason. HBO is the one that got ZSJL finished and released to begin with—with it ending on three cliffhangers—so they clearly know.

 

[Alatar]

This is a longish educational video that breaks down the rift between WB and AT&T, worth a watch to understand what’s going on. You can fast-forward through the reading of Variety’s interview with Ann Sarnoff that WB dropped last Monday if you’ve already read that and are familiar with it. But the rest of it is really intriguing. It’s interesting to see the civil war within the AT&T’s entertainment empire being called out like this.

 

[Hoody999]

Interesting video isn't it Alatar. I watched that on the weekend. Normally I'm a bit hestitant on the Midnights Edge, but this wasn't too bad.

In other news apparently Hot Toys will be doing Cyborg according to insiders. So look out for that in the coming weeks most probably.

Yes, that's the main one I wanted to at least round out the team !