1/6 Hot Toys - MMS275 -John Blake/ Jim Gordon with Bat-Signal Collectible Set

[YankeesFanboy]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

Pics from STGCC:

 

[BadMuthaDude]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

I think it's funny that I'm excited for a figure that comes with a stack of file folders.

 

[jedibear]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

I know what you mean...pics look great. Actually looking forward to both of them...the only "off" thing for me is....isn't Gordon "Commissioner" in TDKR? The name plate keeps referring to him as "Lt."....

 

[Pixelpiper]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

And "Robin" ? And… and… I was watching this release, but I'm quickly running out of room in my only Batman display, so I doubt I'll add either of these guys. The signal was always out of the question. These look like the weakest sculpts in the line too, so while I'd love to have Blake in my collection, especially given he'd be the only uniformed cop I own, he's not terribly difficult to pass up.

 

[Motuxmen]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

Again, that's a bet that you would lose.



The difference is, I don't feel that my work entitles me to everyone else's money by default, just because some people are convinced of its value. If I can't sell you on on the idea that my work has value, then I don't deserve your money - and I can't claim to have lost the money that I didn't make off of you.

You are right that success - and wealth - often change's ones line of thinking. But often is not always, and such changes are not always for the better.



Yes, and nothing in your reply argues against that. In fact, the majority of your reply seems to argue for the benefit of IP laws - but that's not necessarily something I ever argued against, so I'm not sure what the reason for your straw man argument is.



It deprives you of potential earnings.

And again, is that worse than if someone broke into your house, took the posters you printed, and sold those?



Excellent examples. So do the existence of bootleg DVDrips reduce the IP value of Marvel movies?

Do the existence of recasts reduce the IP value of Hot Toys figures?

Of course not - because the value is in having the genuine article!

Not only is this logical, it's backed by every reasonable study on the subject. For instance, studies have found that IP infringement and piracy often increase the overall sales for movies - and at worst, their negative effect is negligible.



I disagree - it has been abused by corporate America, against the interests of Americans. How ****** would the world be if Shakespeare wasn't in the public domain? You'd probably almost never hear of the guy or his works! What a shameful loss to the culture that would be.



Again, I disagree - the output of our culture is finite and is being kept away from us. If the law dictated that Shakespeare was now protected by IP laws, you'd probably be upset (maybe I'm wrong about that?). If so, are you equally upset that the law dictates that an old movie like "Snow White and the Seven Dwarves" is not in the public domain (over 70 years old!).

Great cultural works - which by now should belong to us as a people - have been kept out of our hands, due to abuse of IP laws by Corporate America. And we are worse off for it.



How can you guarantee that? How can you possibly suggest that every single artist is well paid, well-informed when signing contracts, and never taken advantage of?

How can you possibly believe that? It may have never happened to you, but I can't believe your imagination is so limited as to believe that it couldn't happen to anybody else either.



Ah, so if someone gets hoodwinked, it was their fault anyway? They had it coming and deserved it? How patronizing - and convenient! That's some nice victim-blaming. It must be that your success is due ONLY to your talent and not to any combination of both talent and fortunate circumstances - and that must be true for everyone!



I don't think you've really read my argument. Would be happy to see you quote anything in my previous posts arguing that IP infringement is "justified."

In fact, earlier in your post, you stated "Your fundamental argument is that Intellectual Property infringement doesn't rise to the same level of damage as literal physical theft." How is this the same as "your argument seems to be one of justifying IP theft?"

How can you not see that those are two very different arguments? Do you not see the contradiction in your own words?



Silencing a minority is never the best - or right - move. If you're scared of a subject, there's probably a good reason - and it's likely all the more reason for the need for an open, frank discussion.

You might understand the next time you have an opinion that, at least appears, to be unpopular.

Wow-

Your argument that because something is great and popular it should belong to the people is idiotic(ie Snow White) and that was tried. It's called communism. If you like it so much move to somewhere where that works-wait there is no where. But u could try Cuba.

You said that a DVD rip does not effect the value of the dvd(or hot toys or whatever). That's just as short sighted. If the rip offs where not there then what would you have to buy to get them? The actual product. So, sure, if you couldn't get the knock off you could just not buy/see/hear the real thing. But by eliminating a direct competing product at cheaper prices that ALWAYS increase either the value or sales of the remaining stock. You cite these "study's" to support your argument that piracy doesn't effect the value of original IP products...I've never heard of a single one that came to that conclusion. How about a name of the study or link. Since they "all" say that, shouldn't be hard.

You obviously have no understanding of how economics work. And why what you are campaigning for is illegal in not only the USA, but hundreds of countries.

Oh, and since it's such a crime that Disney, the creator of Snow White has evilly stolen it's own creation from the public, I looked on eBay and was shocked to find not one but dozens of copies of it for sale. So don't cry, I'll even send you a link if you need it.


Edit-here's a few links to real studies about piracy. Not made up ones.

https://portal.bsa.org/piracyimpact2010/studies/piracyimpactstudy2010.pdf

https://www.ipi.org/ipi_issues/detail/new-efforts-to-put-a-price-tag-on-film-piracy

 

[The Iron Koob]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

Pretty sure that guy got banned or isn't around anymore

 

[Motuxmen]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

Pretty sure that guy got banned or isn't around anymore

Can't say that bothers me.

The more I see this JGL figure and the bat signal the more I'm interested. I think the DC properties are so thin compared to Marvel that almost anything is an upgrade. There are two current franchises that are merging for the next flick. Though it will have 5-10 major DC characters in it, so that's good. But up till now it's (on the Hot toy side) been Superman (and zod) and Batman (and joker). Marvel has Iron man, Cap, Thor, wolverine, Spider-man ect. Plus villains/support. I just hope DC cinema starts producing so we can get both more film and as a result more figures. Fingers crossed

 

[denrep-lilium]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

I think it's funny that I'm excited for a figure that comes with a stack of file folders.

No, if you like the character not a cool looking toy (some people buy figures of characters they do not know, just for the look, and I do not get that).
I hope they could change both Commissioner Gordon on nameplate, and change his hair style a bit, and paint him a bit older with some grey in his hair:

 

[BadMuthaDude]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

Oh yeah, I'm looking forward to the commissioner look. I wasn't thrilled with the swat version. I'd actually prefer a detective version of Blake, like pictured.

 

[haytil]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

Your argument that because something is great and popular it should belong to the people is idiotic(ie Snow White)

That's not my argument. The concept of the "public domain" has nothing to do with popularity. Don't set up a straw man, it's disrespectful to both of us.

It's called communism.

That's not what communism is. You should look it up, you're broadcasting your ignorance of history, and I hope I'm not the only one facepalming right now.

You said that a DVD rip does not effect the value of the dvd(or hot toys or whatever). That's just as short sighted. If the rip offs where not there then what would you have to buy to get them? The actual product. So, sure, if you couldn't get the knock off you could just not buy/see/hear the real thing.

I bolded the key point here, which you seem to be missing. The kinds of people who pirate products are the kinds of people who simply will pursue another product/avenue of entertainment once piracy is no longer an option. They're not going to buy the genuine article, they're going to move on to something else.

You cite these "study's" to support your argument that piracy doesn't effect the value of original IP products...I've never heard of a single one that came to that conclusion. How about a name of the study or link. Since they "all" say that, shouldn't be hard.

First thing that comes up in Google: https://www.lse.ac.uk/media@lse/documents/MPP/LSE-MPP-Policy-Brief-9-Copyright-and-Creation.pdf

And why what you are campaigning for is illegal in not only the USA, but hundreds of countries.

No, the concept of "public domain" has been a part of the USA's laws for hundreds of years. What I am campaigning for isn't only NOT illegal, it's the way things were done for most of the USA's history. Indeed, it's a conceptual part of the American Constitution - I suggest you read it.

https://dfarq.homeip.net/2012/01/wh...rs-intended-to-be-in-the-public-domain-today/

Edit-here's a few links to real studies about piracy. Not made up ones.

https://portal.bsa.org/piracyimpact2010/studies/piracyimpactstudy2010.pdf

https://www.ipi.org/ipi_issues/detail/new-efforts-to-put-a-price-tag-on-film-piracy

First, let me ask you - did you actually read those? Be honest.

Those aren't studies, those are brochures and propaganda. They lack any actual science, and are created by people who have a private, commercial agenda.

The first is from the BSA, the second from the IPI (funded from the MPAA). Neither are independent, and both have a very vested financial interest in eliminating piracy. Is it any wonder that their idle speculation, masquerading as a "study," ends up supporting their point that piracy is ultimately harmful to society?

If Ford and Toyota both released "studies" that said commuter trains were bad for the economy - and that everyone should buy cars - wouldn't you be a little suspicious?

Now the study I linked you to? That's the London School of Economics - an independent body, which is highly respected in the academic world.

So truthfully, which do you think is more credible?

 

[denrep-lilium]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

I'd actually prefer a detective version of Blake, like pictured.

I was saying this all the time. Let's hope for some unofficial detective outfit, as it usually happens.

 

[YankeesFanboy]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

I think it's funny that I'm excited for a figure that comes with a stack of file folders.

The arrest warrant for "John Doe" is a nice little touch.

 

[haytil]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

The arrest warrant for "John Doe" is a nice little touch.

I think it's a reproduction of one of the viral marketing materials, you can probably find it easily online. It was pretty slick.

Sadly, TDKR's viral marketing paled in comparison to TDK's...

 

[YankeesFanboy]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

I think it's a reproduction of one of the viral marketing materials, you can probably find it easily online. It was pretty slick.

Sadly, TDKR's viral marketing paled in comparison to TDK's...

Thanks for the info, I think this is it.

 

[DarkMagic]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

I wouldn't worry about the incorrect name plate for Gordon on this proto -- after all, according to his figure stand, John Blake was in TDK. It's all going to be corrected for the final figures.

 

[DarkMagic]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

Never saw that one before. Only the other with the image of Bats.

I love it.

Batman supposedly kidnapped Gordon's family, made a mockery of the SWAT/GCPD, and killed all those people including Wuertz, a cop, and a beloved public official, Harvey Dent. They know his height, race, weight, eye color, not to mention Coleman Reese who, a day or two before the crimes told Gotham he knew this guy's identity annnnnd . . . the city does nothing about it for 8 years (or ever actually). No investigations, no man hunts, nothing. The cops don't want blood for Wuertz (Chicago and NYC police departments go ape**** when they lose one of their own), the city doesn't seem to care.

"We'll hunt him."

No you won't.

"Because he can take it."

No he can't.

Didn't Bruce retire being Batman in the years between TDK and TDKR? It's pretty hard to chase down Batman sightings when there are no Batman sightings. From Gordon's speech at the end of TDK (his "official" position as the commissioner, not his personal opinion since he knows the truth about Batman), to the mayor's remarks in TDKR about a "murdering thug in a mask" and the eagerness of Foley commanding every cop in the city to chase him over robbers the very first time he shows up again, there is nothing to suggest that the "city doesn't seem to care" at all. Where did you get that there hasn't been an investigation in the 8 years from? The trail just went cold. Batman stopped showing up. Basically what you see in that arrest warrant is ALL the known/best estimate info that the GCPD had on Batman. That's it? Not much to go on. Where are they going to get more info/evidence from if he doesn't show up?

The City of Gotham "officially" (and many cops --- though not all) definitely thought Batman was guilty and wanted to capture him. Besides Gordon and Blake, the older cop in that chase scene definitely seems to have more respect for Batman/give him the benefit of the doubt than his rookie partner who shoots at him (badly, an hits the EMP instead). I imagine there are plenty of others on the police force who had experience with Batman before TDKR and doubt the official story that he's a murderer of other cops and Dent. They chase him when he shows up because it's their orders to do so, not necessarily because their heart is in it.

 

[Kcreed]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

Didn't Bruce retire being Batman in the years between TDK and TDKR? It's pretty hard to chase down Batman sightings when there are no Batman sightings. From Gordon's speech at the end of TDK (his "official" position as the commissioner, not his personal opinion since he knows the truth about Batman), to the mayor's remarks in TDKR about a "murdering thug in a mask" and the eagerness of Foley commanding every cop in the city to chase him over robbers the very first time he shows up again, there is nothing to suggest that the "city doesn't seem to care" at all. Where did you get that there hasn't been an investigation in the 8 years from? The trail just went cold. Batman stopped showing up. Basically what you see in that arrest warrant is ALL the known/best estimate info that the GCPD had on Batman. That's it? Not much to go on. Where are they going to get more info/evidence from if he doesn't show up?

The City of Gotham "officially" (and many cops --- though not all) definitely thought Batman was guilty and wanted to capture him. Besides Gordon and Blake, the older cop in that chase scene definitely seems to have more respect for Batman/give him the benefit of the doubt than his rookie partner who shoots at him (badly, an hits the EMP instead). I imagine there are plenty of others on the police force who had experience with Batman before TDKR and doubt the official story that he's a murderer of other cops and Dent. They chase him when he shows up because it's their orders to do so, not necessarily because their heart is in it.

Get ready for battle with DiFabio.

 

[Khev]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

Coleman Reese who, a day or two before the crimes told Gotham he knew this guy's identity annnnnd . . . the city does nothing about it

Even Joel Schumacher went out of his way to tie up the loose end of the one guy that knew Batman's identity and could therefore be a potential whistle blower in future films.

Nolan would have been "eh, lets just pretend that Nygma didn't learn his identity and carry on from there."

 

[The Iron Koob]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

completely forgot about ramirez and maroni

 

[Kcreed]

Re: 1/6 Hot Toys - TDKR - Batman Spotlight w/ Robin and Gordon (Various Sets)

Yup!

Then Rameriez. Dent didn't even kill her, "live to fight another day officer". There's so many loose ends. Reese, SWAT team that overheard Gordon's conversation with Dent during the hostage crisis (remember, they all thought DENT was in that building). So many loose ends. Batman was RIGHT there saving the clown hostages and apprehending the Joker with numerous eye witnesses, yet somehow the cover up works. TDKR just passes over investigations and suspicions, i.e. the dramatic, thriller aspects that COULD have been mind blowing. Instead we get the 8 years bologna which is pretty much a "don't pay attention to the man behind the curtain" cop out to distract the viewers from questioning what happened in the last picture. I can see Joker, but not those other key players. When exactly did Batman find the time to kill Maroni and his driver? Who exactly are 5 people dead, two of them cops?

Bottom line, they wrote themselves into a corner and weren't smart or creative enough to come up with something for the sequel. What they came up with instead (Dent Acts, Dent Day, Blackgate that holds male and female prisoners, "peace time" and LoS 2.0) is just stupid. TDKR isn't as tight and well written as people think. There are better CBM that are much tighter.

What if these investigations and such did happen during the eight year after the events of TDK but obviously to no success.

Also, I don't think all law enforcement officers hated Batman. I'm sure Gordon probably shared the lie with a few of his trusted allies in the force. I read somewhere that Ramirez and Reese had quit their jobs and moved far away from Gotham due obviously to the events of TDK.