1/6 Hoy Toys - TMS 087 - The Bad Batch - Clone Force 99: Crosshair

[Fr0stbit3]

Why not? Nothing wrong with more people having something.

The aftermarket prices are ridiculous.

I say make more to satisfy demand, allow folk to complete the squad. I don't care if the aftermarket value of mine drops, I didn't buy it as an investment, I bought it to display, everyone else should have the opportunity to get one too. I missed the PO due to not having funds at the time, I scored mine for close to RRP after release, so I am super lucky otherwise I also would be missing the squad member.

I’m saying more as a “consequence” to everyone who said this was a fomo tactic by SS to create artificial demand.

When this guy went up for preorder, people were literally saying NOT to preorder it and now those same people are the ones crying they missed out.

They expected to get it on clearance like Hunter and echo, now they gotta pay premiums for it if they want it.

 

[chrisstbh]

I’m saying more as a “consequence” to everyone who said this was a fomo tactic by SS to create artificial demand.

When this guy went up for preorder, people were literally saying NOT to preorder it and now those same people are the ones crying they missed out.

They expected to get it on clearance like Hunter and echo, now they gotta pay premiums for it if they want it.

And some of us simply didn't have the means to pre-order it at the time and by the time I went to order him he was waitlisted. Never got a conversion and simply not paying those ridiculous aftermarket prices.

Cancelled my Hunter and Echo as a result and never bothered PO'ing Wrecker or Tech.

 

[Ramatuelle]

So, I trust everyone will apply these lessons when figuring out whether or not to PO Echo and Fives. Because when that edition closes there will be just as much wailing.

 

[Fr0stbit3]

So, I trust everyone will apply these lessons when figuring out whether or not to PO Echo and Fives. Because when that edition closes there will be just as much wailing.

Exactly. If you want it, preorder. Only way to guarantee you’ll get one (with the exception if you order from shady resellers).

 

[chrisstbh]

Crosshair was one if the first victims of this early waitlisting that has now become the norm. As far as I can remember he may have been the first.

Nobody could have predicted Hot Toys sudden shift in production quantities.

 

[Fr0stbit3]

Crosshair was one if the first victims of this early waitlisting that has now become the norm. As far as I can remember he may have been the first.

Nobody could have predicted Hot Toys sudden shift in production quantities.

It was Crosshair and peacemaker

The issue with it isn’t the fact no one could predict it, but the fact everyone INSISTED it was fake fomo to create artificial demand. So honestly the people who fell for that it’s kinda their own fault really.

 

[SOU7567]

Crosshair was one if the first victims of this early waitlisting that has now become the norm. As far as I can remember he may have been the first.

Nobody could have predicted Hot Toys sudden shift in production quantities.

Exactly, up until this and the AoTC anniversary figures, we had no idea that some figures would start to hit waitlist at Sideshow and stay there and never be in stock at all places.

It was safe to assume it was a way for Sideshow and others to drive up interest for these figures, why would anyone think otherwise, these figures were sitting around for so long, there was no reason to pre-order or pay full price.

Obviously things changed and all have adjusted. Now sure why @Fr0stbit3 is being so aggressive about it.

 

[Fr0stbit3]

Exactly, up until this and the AoTC anniversary figures, we had no idea that some figures would start to hit waitlist at Sideshow and stay there and never be in stock at all places.

It was safe to assume it was a way for Sideshow and others to drive up interest for these figures, why would anyone think otherwise, these figures were sitting around for so long, there was no reason to pre-order or pay full price.

Obviously things changed and all have adjusted. Now sure why @Fr0stbit3 is being so aggressive about it.

I don’t agree with this “it’s safe to assume that it was a way for sideshow to drive up sales” because all it was was a strawman so people could get figures on clearance.

I’m happy SS started doing this.

I am also not being “aggressive” about this, I just remember when he first hit “low stock” and EVERYONE was insisting it was “fake fomo.” You’d get laughed at for insisting otherwise.

If you want to assume it was a sales tactic then you unfortunately pay the price (literally) for it.

 

[jaztermareal]

HT created the problem by first over producing (creating shelf warmers that got deep discounts later) making people hold off PO'ing because they got burned so many times overpaying for mass produced figures, all because they were the good folk who ordered early.

HT then screwed folk over by UNDER producing figures in order to regenerate a false reputation for scarcity. Now those folk who decided not to PO after being burned so many times found themselves unexpectedly without the opportunity to buy the figure.

Other people do not PO on principle, preferring to wait for in hand final product pictures before ordering in stock product. Those people were screwed over.


Pre orders didn't use to be the norm. Once upon a time we got figures only once they released. Pre-ordering became the norm because it helps manufacturers tailor production numbers, not because it helps the consumer. HT and the distributers, mainly Sideshow, got greedy when demand went up during the Infinity War/Engame/Mandalorian boom and instead of PO quantity plus x percent extra (say 10% excess for in stock) they manufactured/ordered PO quantity plus y percent (say, 50% excess) resulting in the glut of product due to demand not actually being there.


HT underproduced in order to save their reputation as a highly collectible brand, because they, through their own choices, transformed the brand rep into mass produced overpriced Hasbro. Their overproduction and strong arm distribution tactics killed many small businesses in China for example as they had to order sometimes 10 of a figure if they wanted to stock it at all, then they were stuck with excess stock they could not sell.


The consumers should not be blamed for responding to HT's/Sideshows poor decision making but the consumer ended up being the ones screwed over.
HT knew they were underproducing certain figures as it is essentially a marketing tactic to refresh their image as a boutique luxury collectible company after they became the Hasbro of the 1:6 world.


As people get fomo and start PO'ing everything HT will start gradually increasing production runs until we see another bubble burst.

 

[Fr0stbit3]

HT created the problem by first over producing (creating shelf warmers that got deep discounts later) making people hold off PO'ing because they got burned so many times overpaying for mass produced figures, all because they were the good folk who ordered early.

HT then screwed folk over by UNDER producing figures in order to regenerate a false reputation for scarcity. Now those folk who decided not to PO after being burned so many times found themselves unexpectedly without the opportunity to buy the figure.

Other people do not PO on principle, preferring to wait for in hand final product pictures before ordering in stock product. Those people were screwed over.


Pre orders didn't use to be the norm. Once upon a time we got figures only once they released. Pre-ordering became the norm because it helps manufacturers tailor production numbers, not because it helps the consumer. HT and the distributers, mainly Sideshow, got greedy when demand went up during the Infinity War/Engame/Mandalorian boom and instead of PO quantity plus x percent extra (say 10% excess for in stock) they manufactured/ordered PO quantity plus y percent (say, 50% excess) resulting in the glut of product due to demand not actually being there.


HT underproduced in order to save their reputation as a highly collectible brand, because they, through their own choices, transformed the brand rep into mass produced overpriced Hasbro. Their overproduction and strong arm distribution tactics killed many small businesses in China for example as they had to order sometimes 10 of a figure if they wanted to stock it at all, then they were stuck with excess stock they could not sell.


The consumers should not be blamed for responding to HT's/Sideshows poor decision making but the consumer ended up being the ones screwed over.
HT knew they were underproducing certain figures as it is essentially a marketing tactic to refresh their image as a boutique luxury collectible company after they became the Hasbro of the 1:6 world.


As people get fomo and start PO'ing everything HT will start gradually increasing production runs until we see another bubble burst.

I do partially blame the consumers for this. Specifically the ones crying “fake fomo” and actively convincing other people NOT to preorder because it was a sales tactic.

Those people, imo, are the ones at fault for a lot of this. And new collectors took their advice and got burned.

 

[jaztermareal]

I do partially blame the consumers for this. Specifically the ones crying “fake fomo” and actively convincing other people NOT to preorder because it was a sales tactic.

Those people, imo, are the ones at fault for a lot of this. And new collectors took their advice and got burned.

Then you are ignoring the cause and only complaining about the symptom in an anti consumer way. Even in the case of those few "fake fomo, don't pay full price wait for sale" people, their actions were logical based on past experience due to HT/Sideshow's overproduction/over ordering decisions. We make choices all the time based on past experience, it is based on pattern recognition. HT could have solved it by putting out an announcement that production numbers on upcoming pre-orders would be reduced so people would know to pre-order, but they didn't as they needed to create the situation of people desperately scrambling for figures after missing out. That is why even some folk who DID PO it missed out when their PO's were cancelled as HT cut short production.

 

[Fr0stbit3]

Then you are ignoring the cause and only complaining about the symptom in an anti consumer way. Even in the case of those few "fake fomo, don't pay full price wait for sale" people, their actions were logical based on past experience due to HT/Sideshow's overproduction/over ordering decisions. We make choices all the time based on past experience, it is based on pattern recognition. HT could have solved it by putting out an announcement that production numbers on upcoming pre-orders would be reduced so people would know to pre-order, but they didn't as they needed to create the situation of people desperately scrambling for figures after missing out. That is why even some folk who DID PO it missed out when their PO's were cancelled as HT cut short production.

Maybe their actions were “logical” but why would Sideshow lie about items hitting waitlist? Theres zero benefit to that. People can still cancel preorders.

I was someone who was burning paying retail for things that ultimately went on sale, I still preordered Crosshair because I didn’t buy into the “fake fomo” bs. Even if SS did announce that production numbers were going to be smaller people would still gaslight themselves into believing it was a sales tactic.

I haven’t seen a single person who had their preorder cancelled so this is news to me.

 

[loki2371]

I don't remember which, but there were several figures a few years ago that went waitlisted, then like several weeks later were miraculously available to PO again after many waitlist conversions. Whether they did it or not on purpose, it did happen.

And I know, Cause I was one of them. So not hard to believe that some may think it was a sales tactic at the time.

 

[Fr0stbit3]

I don't remember which, but there were several figures a few years ago that went waitlisted, then like several weeks later were miraculously available to PO again after many waitlist conversions. Whether they did it or not on purpose, it did happen.

And I know, Cause I was one of them. So not hard to believe that some may think it was a sales tactic at the time.

which figure did you preorder that sideshow ended up canceling because they didn’t have enough? Can you share with the class?

 

[jaztermareal]

which figure did you preorder that sideshow ended up canceling because they didn’t have enough? Can you share with the class?

He didn't say that, he said that Sideshow wait listed some figures then they became available to order again. I recall that happening also so yes, people had reason to think at the time it was what was happening with Crosshair.

I was the one who mentioned cancelled PO's. I recall reading some posts online of folk bitter that their retailers cancelled their PO's as HT production was cut short. I do not recall which retailers were mentioned but I think it was not Sideshow but smaller retailers (and not toyswonderland).

 

[Fr0stbit3]

He didn't say that, he said that Sideshow wait listed some figures then they became available to order again. I recall that happening also so yes, people had reason to think at the time it was what was happening with Crosshair.

I was the one who mentioned cancelled PO's. I recall reading some posts online of folk bitter that their retailers cancelled their PO's as HT production was cut short. I do not recall which retailers were mentioned but I think it was not Sideshow but smaller retailers (and not toyswonderland).

It was very rare that a waitlisted figure came back to preorder status. I don’t recall that happening enough times to make the assumption that the same would be for Crosshair.

 

[momaw]

The fact that Hunter and Echo are still available right now says everything about the expectations Hot Toys set with respect to the availability of Bad Batch figures. Hot Toys absolutely knows they overproduced those and they absolutely knew they were underproducing Crosshair and not everyone who had bought Hunter and Echo would be able to continue with the full squad. Blaming consumers for being upset at a sudden unexpected change in production numbers that by the time they found out they had already missed a key figure in a team they had already bought two members of, is quite baffling to be honest. Hot Toys make announcements to consumers all the time. It would have been easy for them to advise that production numbers were being reassessed and excess production beyond received confirmed preorder numbers would be reduced. Some would have still missed out, but at least they would have been warned things were changing and putting in a PO is the best way to secure an order.

 

[Fr0stbit3]

The fact that Hunter and Echo are still available right now says everything about the expectations Hot Toys set with respect to the availability of Bad Batch figures. Hot Toys absolutely knows they overproduced those and they absolutely knew they were underproducing Crosshair and not everyone who had bought Hunter and Echo would be able to continue with the full squad. Blaming consumers for being upset at a sudden unexpected change in production numbers that by the time they found out they had already missed a key figure in a team they had already bought two members of, is quite baffling to be honest. Hot Toys make announcements to consumers all the time. It would have been easy for them to advise that production numbers were being reassessed and excess production beyond received confirmed preorder numbers would be reduced. Some would have still missed out, but at least they would have been warned things were changing and putting in a PO is the best way to secure an order.

Well then people can complete their team with Echo and Hunter lol

People clearly didn’t learn because Wrecker is following the same fate as Crosshair did and soon enough, Tech.

 

[chrisstbh]

Well then people can complete their team with Echo and Hunter lol

People clearly didn’t learn because Wrecker is following the same fate as Crosshair did and soon enough, Tech.

Look man, I get the point you are trying to make but it's coming acriss as just lumping everyone into the same basket here and basically saying the many should suffer for the sins of the few.

How does Wrecker and Tech being waitlisted mean that people didn't learn? Most figures go to waitlist now even regardless of high or low pre-orders. Hot Toys/Sideshow seem to just have a cutoff point now of when they stop taking new orders.

And many people aren't going to get Wrecker or Tech since they didn't manage to get Crosshair, and now can never have him for a reasonable price.

There's no Hot Toys figures that are worth almost $1000, and there are so few Crosshair listings on the aftermarket compared to other also waitlisted figures.

 

[Fr0stbit3]

Look man, I get the point you are trying to make but it's coming acriss as just lumping everyone into the same basket here and basically saying the many should suffer for the sins of the few.

How does Wrecker and Tech being waitlisted mean that people didn't learn? Most figures go to waitlist now even regardless of high or low pre-orders. Hot Toys/Sideshow seem to just have a cutoff point now of when they stop taking new orders.

And many people aren't going to get Wrecker or Tech since they didn't manage to get Crosshair, and now can never have him for a reasonable price.

There's no Hot Toys figures that are worth almost $1000, and there are so few Crosshair listings on the aftermarket compared to other also waitlisted figures.

We both clearly disagree on this issue. I think collectors gaslighting everyone into believing in fake fomo is no one’s fault but their own.

You believe that collectors had a right to believe it was a fake sales tactic. I disagree.

If you want it, preorder it. This hobby shouldn’t be based on trying to get everything at a discount. You aren’t collecting figures at that point, you’re collecting discounts.

Also, why can’t you get wrecker and tech without Crosshair? Season 1 and 2 Crosshair was nowhere to be seen other than the empire so it’s more than feasible to have a complete team without Crosshair.