1/6 Scale REDMAN TOYS Collectible Figure Accessory Lethal Weapon A & B

[Asta]

Dave has commented before about what he sees as a very clear distinction between those companies that produce unlicensed figures, and those that recast.

This thread...

 

[potato]

Dude... IT'S A COLLECTIBLE NOT A TOY...

The fact it isn't made in high volume with such great quality is what makes it desirable. Your argument is like telling a man that Rolls Royce aint worth a penny because you can own a Ford Taurus. "Oh, they both have 4 wheels."

that is why many people settled with Chrysler 300.

but you know the cost of making a Rolls Royce is huge compared to a Chrysler 300, and of course the quality difference is very big.

what about Iminime vs Redman? is the cost a huge gap between both? is the quality between both Heaven & Earth? we don't know for sure until someone makes a side by side comparison.

 

[potato]

Dave has commented before about what he sees as a very clear distinction between those companies that produce unlicensed figures, and those that recast.

This thread...

anyone can confirm Redman recasted Iminime's sculpt for Lethal Weapon? what we see are just abunch of separate photos.

even those Cowboy sculpts, are we for sure Redman recasted them from Iminime? Has there been a fair & square side by side comparison to verify this?

I remember the Spectre Bond thread someone was criticizing the same issue about recasting sculpt but end up someone put up another set of photos and says there's a difference even though it wasn't a side by side comparison.

So has anyone of you folks seen a Redman vs Iminime sculpt either on hand or a side by side photo to lay such claims that Redman indeed recasted Iminine's works?

 

[toyadventurer]

anyone can confirm Redman recasted Iminime's sculpt for Lethal Weapon? what we see are just abunch of separate photos.

even those Cowboy sculpts, are we for sure Redman recasted them from Iminime? Has there been a fair & square side by side comparison to verify this?

I remember the Spectre Bond thread someone was criticizing the same issue about recasting sculpt but end up someone put up another set of photos and says there's a difference even though it wasn't a side by side comparison.

So has anyone of you folks seen a Redman vs Iminime sculpt either on hand or a side by side photo to lay such claims that Redman indeed recasted Iminine's works?

This thread has now officially jumped the shark.

 

[Asta]

 

[cmiller99]

that is why many people settled with Chrysler 300.

but you know the cost of making a Rolls Royce is huge compared to a Chrysler 300, and of course the quality difference is very big.

what about Iminime vs Redman? is the cost a huge gap between both? is the quality between both Heaven & Earth? we don't know for sure until someone makes a side by side comparison.

Yes, there's a cost gap. Redman mass produce their figures while Iminime put together about 50 or 60 sets. That alone saves Redman cost in bulk.
Iminime commissioned the sculpts that they produced for these figures while Redman only had to pay factory costs to mass recast them.
Iminime also has to support the painters that they employ and make sure that they are payed enough to maintain their living.
Iminime also has to pay higher costs for making their accessories than Redman who, again, are saving in bulk.
Iminime buy less material for their outfits so they can't potentially save in bulk like Redman either.


I can't speak with 100% certainty for the quality of the figures, but:
Considering that they are recasts, the details on the sculpts will not be as fine as the details on the Iminime sculpts.
The paint, while Kuat has testified to its quality, is potentially not quite as good as Iminime's usual superb paintwork.
In all pictures I've seen of the Redman sets, the outfits don't look as finally tailored as their Iminime counterparts.
Being fair, the higher accuracy of the Redman accessories is a plus.
Both used ****** KO bodies for financial savings, I assume.

anyone can confirm Redman recasted Iminime's sculpt for Lethal Weapon? what we see are just abunch of separate photos.

I don't know why people keep bringing this up, of course it's a recast. Just google "Iminime Lethal Weapon". It's a recast, no question.

even those Cowboy sculpts, are we for sure Redman recasted them from Iminime? Has there been a fair & square side by side comparison to verify this?

Angel Eyes and Tuco are CERTAINLY recasts. Blondie looks to be a recast of an earlier bootleg on eBay which I've linked to earlier in this thread.

I remember the Spectre Bond thread someone was criticizing the same issue about recasting sculpt but end up someone put up another set of photos and says there's a difference even though it wasn't a side by side comparison.

That was me and a few others. And all it took was looking at a picture of the Eleven sculpt to refresh my memory, and I realised that the Guess Me figure wasn't a recast sculpt.

These sculpts, recasted by Redman, are nearly identical to the Iminime sculpts.

So has anyone of you folks seen a Redman vs Iminime sculpt either on hand or a side by side photo to lay such claims that Redman indeed recasted Iminine's works?

We don't need to put them side by side physically. Look at one photo - then another. Simple.

 

[Asta]

The paint, while Kuat has testified to its quality, is potentially not quite as good as Iminime's usual superb paintwork.

Yes, factory paint, even at Hot Toys' standards, is unlikely to be at the level of a small run such as Iminime's. So the originals will always have that, plus being the first casts from the mould.


Last year, before the release of their Josey Wales, Redman posted this on Facebook:

And then, before their Doc, this:

With the caption, "80% completed..."


And the following month, out of the blue, they showed the GBU trio.

So they seem to have recourse to sculptors, which is unsurprising since I believe Redman is just one brand name among many under the umbrella of a larger company.

 

[Snake Plissken]

This thread.

 

[Asta]

 

[potato]

Yes, there's a cost gap. Redman mass produce their figures while Iminime put together about 50 or 60 sets. That alone saves


We don't need to put them side by side physically. Look at one photo - then another. Simple.

question is how good Iminime is compared to Redman, no one can answer that unless they've seen both.

most people who've seen a Rolls Royce & a Chrysler 300 would know the big difference. would Iminime be so much better than Redman?

 

[Snake Plissken]

Sideshow Freaks forum, the source for all your Auto Trader needs.

 

[Asta]

Sideshow Freaks forum, the source for all your Auto Trader needs.

Iminime:

Redman:

 

[Snake Plissken]

But, that station wagon had tenacity.

 

[Asta]

But, that station wagon had tenacity.

It's a Redman trait.

They'll keep on trucking in spite of all the high brow motor press critics.

 

[siquisiri]

Yes, factory paint, even at Hot Toys' standards, is unlikely to be at the level of a small run such as Iminime's. So the originals will always have that, plus being the first casts from the mould.


Last year, before the release of their Josey Wales, Redman posted this on Facebook:

And then, before their Doc, this:

With the caption, "80% completed..."


And the following month, out of the blue, they showed the GBU trio.

So they seem to have recourse to sculptors, which is unsurprising since I believe Redman is just one brand name among many under the umbrella of a larger company.

Ive said this before. Redman obviously has access to excellent sculptors. Had they commissioned a sculptor to make a new sculpt for a few hundred bucks instead of knockin off IMM, this thread would be full of praises instead of this back and forth slap fest.

 

[yruh8n]

Ive said this before. Redman obviously has access to excellent sculptors. Had they commissioned a sculptor to make a new sculpt for a few hundred bucks instead of knockin off IMM, this thread would be full of praises instead of this back and forth slap fest.

This. Those GBU sculpts from Iminime were not that sculptor's best work. By a long shot. That Riggs was nothing to write home about either. Several custom sculptors on here have offered better Gibson portraits. Not sure what the going rate is overseas, but they would have to pay a good American sculptor more than a few hundred bucks for quality work. You do make a good point. They would get a lot more support by being a bit more upfront and trying to upgrade what has already been done instead of just copying it completely.

 

[cmiller99]

question is how good Iminime is compared to Redman, no one can answer that unless they've seen both.

You can get a very good idea from comparing photos and using common sense. I don't know why you keep insisting that one of us does an extensive side by side breakdown. It's unnecessary.

Ive said this before. Redman obviously has access to excellent sculptors. Had they commissioned a sculptor to make a new sculpt for a few hundred bucks instead of knockin off IMM, this thread would be full of praises instead of this back and forth slap fest.

I actually really like that Josey Wales sculpt and I'd be tempted to buy it, but I don't want to support Redman.

My only problem with Redman at the moment is that instead of working hard to create each individual piece that they produce, the resort to stealing work from Iminime and Rainman in order to make a quick buck. That's not ok in my book.

 

[greatlakes6]

You can get a very good idea from comparing photos and using common sense. I don't know why you keep insisting that one of us does an extensive side by side breakdown. It's unnecessary.






I actually really like that Josey Wales sculpt and I'd be tempted to buy it, but I don't want to support Redman.

My only problem with Redman at the moment is that instead of working hard to create each individual piece that they produce, the resort to stealing work from Iminime and Rainman in order to make a quick buck. That's not ok in my book.

 

[superado]

...the more accurate response to:

"Mass producing for profit, collectibles based on copyrighted property without obtaining permission from the rights owners is also stealing."

Now, tell me that's not true.

 

[PopCultKid]

I actually really like that Josey Wales sculpt and I'd be tempted to buy it, but I don't want to support Redman.

My only problem with Redman at the moment is that instead of working hard to create each individual piece that they produce, the resort to stealing work from Iminime and Rainman in order to make a quick buck. That's not ok in my book.

Exactly to the 10 fricken power! I mean, what are we talking about here? The whole issue is about them recasting, not making the same characters as other customizers. It would be a non-issue if they were making the same characters of their own design and quality level to offer at a lower price point. Well let me not say completely a “non-issue” because it’s still pretty lame that aside from all the heads they’ve STOLEN thus far (Iminime: Rick, Riggs, Harry, Good, Bad , Ugly. Rainman: Alex. Not sure if BH Blondie is a recast of Scott’s), the only 2 other characters that they actually used their own sculptor for (Doc & Josey) are pulled from Rainman and Velvet Morning’s catalog. LAME! No claim to originality whatsoever.

the collectors who live and breathe everything and anything about the hobby (hint: look at their post count); then don’t even make your once-a-year purchases (all you can afford I guess, lol, after buying your high-end customs)

Btw, what do you mean by "stolen work"? Did Redman burglarize Iminime's workshop and physically take anything? Should Iminime take Redman to court, will he have a case to stand on, based on "stealing" a likeness that in itself is unlicensed with the property owners? What would you call taking something that doesn't belong to you? In terms of right and wrong, creating a likeness without permission is no different from what you consider as stolen work and it cannot be made more simple as that.

You are making some wild assumptions my friend. Instead of taking embarrassingly wide swings and misses about what I live and breathe or what I’m able to afford, you should just stick to your crusade on making excuses for thieves and leveling wild accusations at the innocent originators of the works in question. You’re doing marginally better with that!

To answer your question about the Iminime casts; they are solid resin as are 99% of all custom casts. The necks were drilled to fit a neck peg. Before drilling they were solid down to the base of the neck so there’s nothing hollow about them.

And you’re obviously intelligent so don't say you just can’t grasp our angle. It's yours (or the argument you're sticking to) that we don’t grasp. Licensing infringement, intellectual properties, talks of breaking the law and whatnot… who gives a rat’s ass!!! Are you their contract attorney?? Are you making a single cent from defending them against people making unlicensed products (LIKE REDMAN DOES)? The whole law in itself is questionable. What about when they sign a bad deal and they don’t even have their own likeness rights because it belongs to the studio? The law. Illegal. Big friggin’ deal!! No one who buys recasts gives a crap about the law either, and that’s why that angle is and always will be paper thin horses__t to me. All that matters to them is they can get a knock-off of something they wanted that was out of their budget for a price that now fits their budget. ishothimsixtimes is probably the 100th member to explain the same exact thing: Talented artists who can sculpt create something, and someone else who doesn’t have the skill comes along and counterfeits it to profit from the original artists hard work, talent and skill. That’s theft! Point blank end of story! All other talk is hogwash.


The bottom line is:

I have no justification for buying the bootlegs, yet neither do I feel any more guilt than buying a Head Play recast of a Hot Toys' sculpt. And this must also go for those retailers who stock both Iminime and Redman products. They're interested in the profit, and I'm interested in the bargain.
I've tried to make myself feel guilty, but it doesn't work. I see only the price and the opportunity, and the fun of messing with three lower end figures for the price of one of the originals. And that, I suppose, is where the mileage varies. It's the value you place on the items that attract your money.

That and similar mentalities will always clash with avid custom fans who respect the artists and hold them in high regard. We’ll never agree with that and the people who will support recasts will never agree with other aspects that we accept like the high price of the official work. Same ol’ circle and it shall continue…

It’s not about viewing customs as the Rolls Royces of 1/6 because they are imperfect and not like we don’t recognize their flaws. We are as nitpicky and OCD in the custom threads as all the folks in the licensed threads. It’s about appreciating the artistry, craftsmanship and hand crafted skill that goes into what are essentially art figures. It’s about being fans, supporters and collectors of these artists’ work. The custom sect is a very different animal in many ways than the licensed world (which is why guys like Clipper King shouldn’t review customs while grading them against Hot Toys, especially without having more knowledge of how custom production works. But that’s a whole ‘nother argument). Especially on a forum like this where members are closely in touch with a lot of the artists, and there are many offerings that fellow Freaks had a lot of influence and a big hand in helping the customizers bring to life. There were 4 boardies that are responsible for pitching the GBU idea to iminime, and provided all the reference and suggestions needed. I’m sure they were just as pissed off as Denny was to see the Redman recasts.

I don't expect the people with opposite opinions to get it... and the circle spins on

Have you ever worked thousands and thousands of hours? If yes, good, and if it was exceptional work, all the more better.

He has, and exceptional is an understatement. He's one of the artists that make the custom world great. You should look him up

 

[superado]

To answer your question about the Iminime casts; they are solid resin as are 99% of all custom casts. The necks were drilled to fit a neck peg. Before drilling they were solid down to the base of the neck so there’s nothing hollow about them.

If you know anything about garage kit casting vs. factory casting, finished sculpts that are vinyl and hollow can only be made from machined and plated metal molds. Typical recasts are solid resin or even plaster. Therefore, if Iminime’s heads are solid resin while Redman’s heads are hollow vinyl or rotocasted PVC, it would actually seem that the recasting blame should be pointing the other way around.

And you’re obviously intelligent so don't say you just can’t grasp our angle. It's yours (or the argument you're sticking to) that we don’t grasp. Licensing infringement, intellectual properties, talks of breaking the law and whatnot… who gives a rat’s ass!!! Are you their contract attorney?? Are you making a single cent from defending them against people making unlicensed products (LIKE REDMAN DOES)? The whole law in itself is questionable. What about when they sign a bad deal and they don’t even have their own likeness rights because it belongs to the studio? The law. Illegal. Big friggin’ deal!! No one who buys recasts gives a crap about the law either, and that’s why that angle is and always will be paper thin horses__t to me.

Have you ever tried reading what you wrote out loud? Whatever my motivation could be doesn’t change the facts…and why can’t you grasp simple logic of what’s legal or not? The law is the law, at least here in America. Is it okay to understate your earnings for your tax returns? Is it okay to drive under the influence? Is it okay to buy or even produce pirated CDs and DVDs? Where have I said that Redman hadn’t done anything wrong? But why make a big deal about one kind of an ethical issue, when there are other ethical issues that led to the creation of copyright laws? Isn't that hypocritical of you to do that? Well, if breaking the law and what’s illegal is no “Big friggin’ deal!!” …then why go on and on about these poor artists who work millions of hours so they can give away their collectibles for free; them getting ripped off should also be no “Big friggin’ deal!!”

Talented artists who can sculpt create something, and someone else who doesn’t have the skill comes along and counterfeits it to profit from the original artists hard work, talent and skill. That’s theft! Point blank end of story! All other talk is hogwash.

Talented artists who can sculpt create something, but who neglect to obtain licensing from the copyright owners… That’s theft! Point blank end of story! All other talk is hogwash. When you learn how to use actual reason and logic to back up your arguments, we can talk, but for now, talk to the hand.