Avengers: Age of Ultron (May 1st, 2015)

[karamazov80]

Just the music? I don't remember much of anything...and I saw it like 12 days ago For a movie with so much action, although entertaining, most of it is easily forgettable. Hope Mad Max is more memorable

I think you make a good point here. If they hadn't crammed so much in, and could more strongly focus on getting the essentials right in the movie, I think the potential was there for it to be a really exceptional movie. As it stands, it strikes me as a good movie with exceptional action, but I can't even digest the damn thing. The pacing allows for the viewer to really digest and appreciate a film. Think about Die Hard, the way you had long periods in-between action scenes, and the scale was relatively small, but who here doesn't remember the great scenes from that film, with the Ho Ho Ho sign, Ellis's walkie talkie call, Carl Winslow talking about the kid he shot, etc. I saw a pic yesterday of Iron Man using his chest repulsor on the magnet thing, I completely didn't remember that and had to think about it for a few minutes before I even remembered it. Khev brought up Hulk's last line, which I also completely forgot. For that reason, this is not a film that is going to stick into the public consciousness in the way that others have. Sometimes more is less.

I also love Jazz.

DJ Jazzy Jeff.

Kidding, I love it.

So what you're saying is that Star Wars, Raiders, Batman 89 and STM should've had Jazz soundtracks then.

Yes, that's what I'm saying. Superman's theme should be Glenn Miller, Batman Duke Ellington, and Star Wars should be Ornette Coleman. *rages at the sky*

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

I totally forgot about the 3 of them tag teaming Ultron, Vision picking up the hammer, the Hulkbuster battle, the piece of earth being lifted to create a meteor, Cap's shield throws and motorcycle jump in a forest taking out 3 guys hiding behind trees, the hellicarrier saving the day, the party hammer scene, Visions talk with Ultron.

Such a forgettable movie isn't it.

You've seen it like 10 times already I forgot most of that I remember the Hulk vs IM, because it was in the trailer and because how can you forget those two characters, but the fight itself, I don't remember it very well.

 

[karamazov80]

I honestly forget the Helicarrier thing until someone brings it up, and nothing about Cap's shield really sticks out. I know he kicks it at Ultron because somebody here has it as their signature

 

[Khev]

Khev brought up Hulk's last line, which I also completely forgot. For that reason, this is not a film that is going to stick into the public consciousness in the way that others have.

I think you're right. That first viewing "assault" I think just overwhelmed a lot of people. I even remember posting here when I got back on opening day something to the effect of "It was good, Ex Machina [which I had seen a couple days before] was a lot better, holy crap that Force Awakens trailer." I was leaning toward not going back and after reading some of the comments here I realized that I too hadn't digested it all and people were calling out specifics that I had forgotten about that I wanted to go experience again.

And now I'm seeing a bit of a common theme as I peruse other sites like hometheaterforum.com that are not just full of Marvel fanboys. A lot of posts like this or starting off like this:

Sean, I saw it a second time tonight and it flowed better for me on second viewing.

I can second this. Definitely flows better on second viewing. Many of the issues it had were diminished when watching it a second time yesterday.

Couple of other random comments after the second viewing:

While as a fan of the comics version I would have liked to see the creepy, dead jack-o-lantern face on Ultron prime instead of the emoting facial movement, it works in the context of this film. Ultron thinks humanity needs to go, but he also views himself as being the next step in human evolution. His bodies mimic the human form, and his ego and desire to be a better human showed in his making a human, emoting face. This was taken even further in his attempt to make the perfect bio synthetic new body for himself, which he was never able to get into.

That last exchange between Ultron and the Vision was really well done. It went something like:

"They're doomed."
"Yes. But a thing isn't beautiful because it lasts. It's a privilege to be among them."

Whedon really crafted Hawkeye's role through the film to make the audience expect his death. Lots of little things along the way (starting from very early) sent up subtle flags for those familiar with the way things usually go in movies that he probably wasn't going to make it.

And his "No one would know. No one would know" bit was great.

So Cap's fear that was brought out by Wanda's wammie seems to be not having a life outside of being a hero or a soldier. It was kind of sad when he told Tony that he was "home" at the end, referring to the New Avengers facility. He said something like the man who thought he could have a life and a family never came out of the ice. Seems he's given up of the idea of getting a place of his own and finding someone to love. Thor can go back to Asgard and Tony can go off to any number of places but Steve doesn't really have anything other than the Avengers.

People usually give films like Memento a pass if they take two or more viewings to truly digest but often think that if you don't "get" everything about a superhero movie in one sitting that it's a "mess" or a failure. I disagree. Now I do think there's nothing wrong with watching it and going, "uh, that was good I guess, Thor hammer scene was funny and Hulkbuster scene was cool" and leaving it at that. And possibly a lot of people are because they don't realize that the movie does keep on giving. Might be a reason that it won't have the legs as its predecessor too. But I really am impressed with just how much more there is to this film.

 

[jye4ever]

In this corner weighing 525lbs of AOU greatness, Khev and jye....

In this corner weighing just 240lbs of AOU forced amnesia, Clown Prince of Alzheimer and karamazov800

Ding....Ding

 

[Khev]

Forced amnesia, lol.

This is more karamazov's speed:

 

[jye4ever]

You should see his movie purchasing habits.

 

[Sundowner]

In all seriousness I agree. Definitely nothing so far on the level of Williams' Superman score or Elfman's Batman.

Yeah I agree

Just the music? I don't remember much of anything...and I saw it like 12 days ago For a movie with so much action, although entertaining, most of it is easily forgettable,imo. Hope Mad Max is more memorable

Now that you mention it yes, it's easily forgettable

 

[jye4ever]

But the music counted when it was needed.

The music made the hair on my neck stand up when all 3 gangbanged Ultron.

 

[Khev]

Yeah, the cello or whatever stringed instrument that played when Widow tried to do her lullaby thing was very well done too.

 

[karamazov80]

People usually give films like Memento a pass if they take two or more viewings to truly digest but often think that if you don't "get" everything about a superhero movie in one sitting that it's a "mess" or a failure. I disagree.

I don't agree with you on this one. I saw Memento at the theaters, and loved it on the very first viewing. Obviously, I wanted to rewatch it so that I could understand the film in a new way, and I did--at the theater even! But it worked on the first time around because it succeeded as a film, on its own merits, telling its story in its way. Other films work this way, like some of those from Kubrick, Kurosawa, the Coen Bros., Cronenberg, Polanski. You don't get all that there is to get on first viewing, but you can recognize that they are great films. I'm not saying Avengers was a mess or garbage. I thought it was good. But it's not going to be great if a seasoned filmgoer can't appreciate it on a single viewing, or anticipate that it might be great, and is worthy of rewatching on a single viewing. It's not just about being able to better understand all that's going on, because no matter how many times you rewatch it a movie, certain aspects of filmmaking, and really storytelling aren't going to change. If you don't "get something," then there is definitely the opportunity to later appreciate it (this was the case for me with the Big Lebowski, Chinatown, even Pulp Fiction when I first saw it). But that's not the case here.

 

[jye4ever]

If people want to be slathered in AOU **** come see Khev and I assembled at our first off broadway MCU lolpalooza stage show.

"2 Men Assembled"

 

[jye4ever]

I don't agree with you on this one. I saw Memento at the theaters, and loved it on the very first viewing. Obviously, I wanted to rewatch it so that I could understand the film in a new way, and I did--at the theater even! But it worked on the first time around because it succeeded as a film, on its own merits, telling its story in its way. Other films work this way, like some of those from Kubrick, Kurosawa, the Coen Bros., Cronenberg, Polanski. You don't get all that there is to get on first viewing, but you can recognize that they are great films. I'm not saying Avengers was a mess or garbage. I thought it was good. But it's not going to be great if a seasoned filmgoer can't appreciate it on a single viewing, or anticipate that it might be great, and is worthy of rewatching on a single viewing. It's not just about being able to better understand all that's going on, because no matter how many times you rewatch it a movie, certain aspects of filmmaking, and really storytelling aren't going to change. If you don't "get something," then there is definitely the opportunity to later appreciate it (this was the case for me with the Big Lebowski, Chinatown, even Pulp Fiction when I first saw it). But that's not the case here.

MCU is a wacky beast, tons of movies building up to Thanos.

Imagine if Dr. Zhivago was about the Infinity Gauntlet.

 

[Khev]

I don't agree with you on this one. I saw Memento at the theaters, and loved it on the very first viewing. Obviously, I wanted to rewatch it so that I could understand the film in a new way, and I did--at the theater even! But it worked on the first time around because it succeeded as a film, on its own merits, telling its story in its way. Other films work this way, like some of those from Kubrick, Kurosawa, the Coen Bros., Cronenberg, Polanski. You don't get all that there is to get on first viewing, but you can recognize that they are great films. I'm not saying Avengers was a mess or garbage. I thought it was good. But it's not going to be great if a seasoned filmgoer can't appreciate it on a single viewing, or anticipate that it might be great, and is worthy of rewatching on a single viewing. It's not just about being able to better understand all that's going on, because no matter how many times you rewatch it a movie, certain aspects of filmmaking, and really storytelling aren't going to change. If you don't "get something," then there is definitely the opportunity to later appreciate it (this was the case for me with the Big Lebowski, Chinatown, even Pulp Fiction when I first saw it). But that's not the case here.

Well I didn't say that if you can't appreciate it at all on a single viewing that somehow viewing #2 will turn a negative into a positive. I'm just saying sometimes movies go from "good" to "great" on another viewing. So yeah, it sounds like we just disagree on that. The most extreme example of such a scenario for me would be FOTR. The first time I saw it I thought, "wow, that was really good, but did it live up to my expectations?" Then I went and saw it a second time and thought, "Yes!" I saw it a third time (in the theater) and finally walked away thinking it was one of the greatest movies I'd ever seen. So yeah, even quality itself can take two or more times to properly "get" based on my viewing experiences.

And it seems that when it comes to superhero films people kind of want to be able to make a definitive assessment right out of the gate and are a bit put off if they can't.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

In this corner weighing 525lbs of AOU greatness, Khev and jye....

In this corner weighing just 240lbs of AOU forced amnesia, Clown Prince of Alzheimer and karamazov800

Ding....Ding

Joss Whedon be like, enjoy AOU Now they'll have to see it again..Mwuahahaha!

 

[jye4ever]

Our ages have a huge impact on our current cinematic impressions.

Mind blowing to revisit movies 5-10-15-20-25-30-35 years later and getting an entirely different experience out of it then what you thought you knew about it.

Same for new movies, I watched AOU entirely different than my 14 year old nephew did.

He was too busy staring at Scarjo's ***!





Wait......

 

[jye4ever]

Joss Whedon be like, enjoy AOU

 

[karamazov80]

And it seems that when it comes to superhero films people kind of want to be able to make a definitive assessment right out of the gate and are a bit put off if they can't.

I can't speak for others, but I have felt that the first two Nolan Batfilms were borderline great films, at least. I haven't had that vibe from any of the Marvel stuff, or really any other traditional comic movies in general (History of Violence aside), even though I love some of these movies because I'm a comic geek. But I think a true, quality film is something that succeeds irrespective of that association. If we could pull Kubrick from the grave and get him to make a Speedball movie, I can imagine that it could be great. Whedon is good. I like Firefly, Buffy, and the Avengers movies. But he's not shown himself capable of making what I consider to be a "great" film yet. Fun, witty, even very good? Sure. But there's an element of artistic understanding and motivation that you need to transcend the mass of movies out there and come up with something that truly stands out.

 

[jye4ever]

I can only watch 2001 Space Odyssey once every 20 years.

I've watched Avengers a lot!

Hulk smashing Loki > Black Monolith

Not that I hate the monolith, its bad ***!

 

[cilantropants]

I was imagining I was Captain America the other morning. I had a pile in the backyard of branches from our palm tree that were blown off during a major windy day recently. I cut the fronds from the limb, and cut the limb from the base. The base looks like a large, brown pair of rabbit ears. In order to fit those into the garbage more easily, since they take up so much space, it's best to split them. It's awkward as hell to try and cut them, so I was ripping them all down the middle by hand and just kept seeing Cap doing that to a log in my head. Too bad I was wearing a Salad Fingers shirt and not one of my Cap ones.