Captain America: Civil War (May 6, 2016)

[jye4ever]

khev, jye

think you'll enjoy this quite a bit. thoughts? i can hum the avengers tune...

While this is not wrong, I do like the music from Cap 1 and especially TWS.

But remember that SW, Raiders, Bond, Jaws, Halloween, STM and Batman 89 are in a soundtrack league of their own.

Hell, I would even place Aliens, Predator, F13th, Close Encounters and TOHO Godzilla in that group of easily memorized movie music!

So yeah MCU is weak in that department but what movie isn't when compared to those greats.

 

[fosing]

BvS has this over over any marvel movie...


ha.

 

[Khev]

While this is not wrong, I do like the music from Cap 1 and especially TWS.

But remember that SW, Raiders, Bond, Jaws, Halloween, STM and Batman 89 are in a soundtrack league of their own.

Hell, I would even place Aliens, Predator, F13th, Close Encounters and TOHO Godzilla in that group of easily memorized movie music!

So yeah MCU is weak in that department but what movie isn't when compared to those greats.

Agreed on all counts jye. That guy could have said "Hum James Bond, okay now hum the music from True Lies or Jason Bourne and people would have gone 'huh?" Or even "Hum Star Wars, James Bond, Harry Potter. Now hum the music from ANY OTHER movie" and he probably would have gotten the same blank stares from those people.

There are classic and/or great films from all eras that don't have iconic tunes stamped into our psyches from Citizen Kane to Seven Samurai to Fisftul of Dollars to Die Hard. Who remembers the score from The Wizard of Oz apart from "Somewhere over the Rainbow?" Or any given Hitchcock or Kubrick flick? So many films would have failed that little Pepsi challenge. It doesn't mean their music was lacking or that they were slaves to temp tracks.

I do admit that it bums me out a little that of my three favorite trilogies; SW, LOTR, and Captain America that Cap definitely lags behind in the iconic music department (thought I can easily hum Silvestri's theme from The First Avenger) but the guy who created that video sounds like he's just trying to push the narrative that all Marvel films are generic and by the numbers and created a false dilemma to do it.

 

[ZaCHw117]

Agreed on all counts jye. That guy could have said "Hum James Bond, okay now hum the music from True Lies or Jason Bourne and people would have gone 'huh?" Or even "Hum Star Wars, James Bond, Harry Potter. Now hum the music from ANY OTHER movie" and he probably would have gotten the same blank stares from those people.

There are classic and/or great films from all eras that don't have iconic tunes stamped into our psyches from Citizen Kane to Seven Samurai to Fisftul of Dollars to Die Hard. Who remembers the score from The Wizard of Oz apart from "Somewhere over the Rainbow?" Or any given Hitchcock or Kubrick flick? So many films would have failed that little Pepsi challenge. It doesn't mean their music was lacking or that they were slaves to temp tracks.

yeah but those films aren't cultural phenomenons like the MCU or star wars/LOTR, like he said, the MCU is the highest growing franchise EVER now. you don't see little kids walking around with james bond shirts.

it's odd that the music has been so cookie cutter and generic. Marvel needs a great tune that as soon as you hear it you know what it is.

 

[jye4ever]

Actually I would place Good Bad Ugly in my primary list of classics.

Hmmm, LOTR would be in a 2nd tier category along with Cap1/TWS.

2nd tier meaning good soundtracks just not as easily memorable as the primary list.

 

[Khev]

yeah but those films aren't cultural phenomenons like the MCU or star wars/LOTR, like he said, the MCU is the highest growing franchise EVER now. you don't see little kids walking around with james bond shirts.

Technically Marvel is an anthology series of separate franchises, not really the same as Star Wars, Potter, or Bond. If you're going to just group all films that acknowledge one another together then The First Avenger made reference to Hitler searching for the Ark of the Covenant so now Indy's score "counts" as being part of the MCU.

As far as cultural phenomenon's go, eh, millions of kids wear all kinds of movie T-shirts. I'm sure those people in Vancouver wouldn't be able to recall any of the scores from world renowned Disney classics like Snow White, Pinocchio, or even Frozen outside of "Let it Go." Chances are regardless of the movie if it doesn't have a John Williams score it's a good bet your average person on the street can't hum the tune.

Even just sticking to superheroes you've got Williams' STM score and Elfman's B89 score and that's it as far as top shelf iconography. TDK was the first superhero to crack a billion worldwide but even though Zimmer's score is great it didn't imprint into the minds of an entire culture. Because few scores do.

With regard to Marvel their success is their own enemy in that regard because they're all getting diluted by the sheer volume of films. If Captain America: The First Avenger was the first Marvel superhero flick and it was released in a vacuum instead of the original X-Men or Raimi Spider-Man people would have **** themselves at how awesome it was and I'm sure they'd still be humming its theme today. Which is funny because I doubt the average joe does remember the scores of X-Men or SM.

I think in some ways "generic" and "by the numbers" has just become synonymous with "there's SO much awesome stuff right now it's hard for any one thing to stand out."

 

[Khev]

Actually I would place Good Bad Ugly in my primary list of classics.

That's why I was careful to mention FOD and not GBU.

Fisftul has AWESOME music...that no one remembers. And that's okay.

 

[jye4ever]

For a Few Dollars More has that great whistle and watch theme that I find to be as good as Ennio's Good Bad Ugly music.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Did you know it was Blondie's horse doing the whistling? That was one cool horse.

 

[jye4ever]

 

[ZaCHw117]

With regard to Marvel their success is their own enemy in that regard because they're all getting diluted by the sheer volume of films. If Captain America: The First Avenger was the first Marvel superhero flick and it was released in a vacuum instead of the original X-Men or Raimi Spider-Man people would have **** themselves at how awesome it was and I'm sure they'd still be humming its theme today. Which is funny because I doubt the average joe does remember the scores of X-Men or SM.

While agree with their being over saturation in the genre at this point, I don't think that's entirely the reason. As he said in the video A LOT of MCU composers were asked to pretty much "copy" other themes and notes from more prominent films.

think of inception's Mombasa (a great ****ing tune) and watch Thor's scene where they find the hammer.

2010



2011



it's uninspired and completely unoriginal. the MCU isn't the only one though, I feel the new X men movie have lame themes, a long with the TASM 1/2. That's one thing the DCEU has done right so far in comparison. MOS, BvS both had great scores. SS had an amazing soundtrack that topped the billboard charts. I've never once considered buying an MCU/Xmen OST/Soundtrack.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

IMO, a catchy theme doesn't mean the film has a great score/soundtrack though. Jurassic Park has an iconic catchy theme, but Schindler's List won the Oscar for best score because of how well it worked in the film, yet most people can't hum the music.

When it comes to Super Hero themes or heroic themes, the 78 Sups is king. Nothing comes close. As far as Science Fiction films go, Terminator has a great memorable theme, unlike other famous Sci-fi films like Aliens. When it comes to action movies, I like Jerry Goldsmith's Rambo score/soundtrack. It's sad and heroic somehow.

As far as "modern" scores, I think Pirates of the Caribbean is iconic and must people can hum that theme.

 

[jye4ever]

Oh snap I forgot to mention JP and Terminator!

While i'm at it let me add The Exorcist to that list.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Oh snap I forgot to mention JP and Terminator! :

Also Back to the Future and Robocop.

Oh and the already iconic Batman theme from BVS, "DUMB!!! DUMB! DUMB! DUMB! DUMB!!!!"

 

[kryptonianmutie]

khev, jye

think you'll enjoy this quite a bit. thoughts? i can hum the avengers tune...

I suppose this scene didn't fit his narrative.
From the 1:14


BTW, asking people if they can hum movie music is a pretty weak methodology to prove a point, especially from such a small sample size. Did he ask anyone to hum music from Schindler's List? I ****ing doubt it, but that's as emotionally engaging as it gets and I doubt you'd find 3 random people on the street who've seen it that can hum the theme.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Iron Man (2008) had a great soundtrack.

 

[jye4ever]

Also Back to the Future and Robocop.

Oh and the already iconic Batman theme from BVS, "DUMB!!! DUMB! DUMB! DUMB! DUMB!!!!"

Oh snap I forgot Robocop!

I am truly not worthy!

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Oh snap I forgot Robocop!

Don't ignore BTTF!!

 

[Khev]

SS had an amazing soundtrack that topped the billboard charts. I've never once considered buying an MCU/Xmen OST/Soundtrack.

Isn't that all you really wanted to say though? "I liked the music in Suicide Squad more than [insert any given Marvel movie.]" That video you posted just smacks of biased, agenda driven "I'm going to prove my why opinion is right" internet silliness. All of the "evidence" supporting his claim can easily be shot down. Music is inspired and "risky" if he can find three people on the streets of Vancouver who can hum the tune? How many did he interview? What would he have done if the first person hummed Cap's theme from The First Avenger? Play that person's clip? Yeah right. He gave a tiny, heavily edited example of a few people who support his theory.

Then there's his other examples. TWS had great music but he singles out the Smithsonian narrator who was actually being heard by the characters in the movie itself? Hardly indicative of the entirety of the MCU. That'd be like me showing a five second clip of R2 being hunted by jawas in order to bolster my claim that Star Wars has no music at all.

With regard to temp music he cites Star Wars and Harry Potter as shining examples of inspired music. And yet Williams himself lifted the droid factory music from AOTC and put it into the Quidditch Match of HP and the Chamber of Secrets. Stanley Kubrick ditched an entire two hour score in favor of public domain classical temp music for 2001. Every example of Marvel's musical "sins" have been praised or at the very least given a pass when done in other films.

Keep in mind that I *do* agree with you ZaCHw117 that Marvel doesn't have a truly transcendent theme like Superman or Star Wars. And I wish they did. But keep in mind that few films do and if you prefer SS's music over Marvel that's great but it's not like any random person would recall any themes from that movie either.

 

[Khev]

Oh snap I forgot Robocop!

There are so many great scores that would have failed the "random people on the street" test. I still get goosebumps when the main theme kicks in at the beginning of Conan the Barbarian and practically want to stand up and cheer due to the music when Conan and Subotai are running across the plains.