Deposits on Exclusive Pre-Orders: Sideshow's New Policy?

[Enigma]

read previous post about stopping flipping.

 

[thenammagazine]

read previous post about stopping flipping.

Sideshow is handing flippers the Golden Ticket with this new policy. Anybody who thinks otherwise, needs to wait until they get more than just their feet wet, to add their 2 pesos.

 

[Something Sexy]

Yea but don't most flippers get the benefit of currently being able to cancel if it doesn't sell on ebay right away? With no loss to them.

 

[Skiman]

The fact of the matter is... I simply DO NOT trust Sideshow's production QC nearly enough to pay a non-refundable deposit on any of their items at pre-order, ever. And the argument that you can return it is a non-starter since that happens after it has been charged, shipped and then you have to ship it back yourself.

Instead of sucking it up and buttoning down QC on their end (because I'm sure they have lost lots of orders... think RAMBO PF) ... they're trying to mitigate risk by implementing these deposits.

This new policy is FAIL.

If it wasn't for that policy I would of probably had a Vader 1:1 Ex bust from them but oh well....

They would be $1200+ richer

Not really my loss... I'll get him some day.

 

[The Mike]

Ooooookay. Despite all of the flaming going on here, it still leaves the topic at hand.

This will not deter flippers, I really wonder why people think that had anything to do with it? Honestly Sideshow is a company, do you really think they give a ____ if someone buys and pays for 17 of one thing only to flip it on eBay for profit? They've already been paid, I guarantee you while some employees might think it sucks, as a company overall they could care less. Not to mention those who are flipping know how to do it, at most it might deter someone from trying to do it but most who have tried (myself included) know that you are usually bitten in the ass right away and leave the thought all together. It took one purchase way back when I started collecting SS/HT to lose money on for me to give it up. Those who are still doing it, know how and they'll keep on doing it.

Second, in terms of ES we've heard over and over from Sideshow themselves that while the ES are TBA they have a magic number in mind, that is why the piece sells out because orders surpass that number. It might bring some ES down a little but in all honesty the question stands on how long they'll let an EX just hang out in ordering before putting up a Low Quantity Bar and finally closing the edition. If it last weeks but still goes 350 for example, I'm not sure the deposit policy is the reason, its all subjective piece by piece.

What the DOES effect is impulse buyers who get it and try to hold out to keep the order itself. This was a long time coming especially when they started asking why you were canceling an item, but it still sucks. I don't have much at Sideshow on order right now and with this new Ex policy I probably still won't. If I order a PF and pay the 10% let's assume its $30.00, then can't afford it for whatever reason (I use my bank account not credit like Lonnie) so I flex it to try and give myself more time (assuming its still available) then can't keep it before the first payment is out that is another $20. $50 just to have an exclusive on order isn't worth it. Especially when its just a nameplate or a white collector's stand. Even if I do keep it what if the QC is horrible and after I get it I have to return it? The shipping might dwarf that all together especially for overseas customers....

I'll be patiently waiting for Hastings.

 

[Enigma]

best thing against free flipping, if you can't see that you need your iq checked or you are a flipper yourself.

 

[thenammagazine]

Yea but don't most flippers get the benefit of currently being able to cancel if it doesn't sell on ebay right away? With no loss to them.

It's all in the flip. Returned products will cost shipping only. That could potentially be easily compensated by the profit margin of a flip that turns successful because of a low ES and decent paint.

 

[IrishJedi]

read previous post about stopping flipping.

First of all, Sideshow should always be more concerned with quality control on their products before anything else. "Flipping" should be one of the least of their concerns.

Also if this was a new policy designed to curtail scalpers/flippers, then it's even more ridiculous (for reasons that thenam, Mike and others have pointed out).

No... the only reason this is being put in place is so they can up their margins due to canceled pre-orders. It's nothing but simple risk mitigation. But the truly frustrating thing is that they wouldn't be in this quandary if a) they made better product choices, and b) they had decent QC in production.

I am not going to be paying for Sideshow's problems.

 

[The Mike]

Free flipping. Never heard that before...like I said it'll deter new guys trying it out but those who are already doing it will just continue doing it especially those who use eBay to do it since in reality some of those auctions like the SDCC Guardian Predator for example inflate and bloat so much that a 10% deposit won't effect them at all.

 

[Something Sexy]

It's all in the flip. Returned products will cost shipping only. That could potentially be easily compensated by the profit margin of a flip that turns successful because of a low ES and decent paint.

I always figured some flippers preordered then try to flip that preorder on ebay right away (I am sure that is against ebay policy but different argument) if they don't sell it right away or get the price they want they just cancel the order and don't have to deal with inventory.

 

[The Mike]

First of all, Sideshow should always be more concerned with quality control on their products before anything else. "Flipping" should be one of the least of their concerns.

Exactly. If Sideshow products looked exactly like protos, I guarantee you a lot less people would have an issue with it. Seeing Flint or even the SDCC Exclusive (which you know those will have it) Han in Stormie gear with flat black hair and yellow eyes, it just isn't worth it to pay outright only to have to deal with returns in any fashion. Even if they give me the 10% back, the real issue for SSC is QC and that should have been addressed waaaaaay before any kind of deposit policy implements.

 

[Seaward]

This is an interesting policy change, and I am not sure how it does anything to protect customers from much of anything. The quality control of Sideshow Products is still very hit and miss, especially given the price point of their products and while they still have a return policy that is very forgiving, the customer would still be out the cost of shipping. I can see this being very discouraging for all of the overseas collectors. I also wish Sideshow were more accurate with ship dates, as that is a huge concern when purchasing any item. It certainly won't discourage flippers/scalpers, though, as the reduced edition sizes due to the policy change will only help their businesses.

 

[thenammagazine]

I always figured some flippers preordered then try to flip that preorder on ebay right away (I am sure that is against ebay policy but different argument) if they don't sell it right away or get the price they want they just cancel the order and don't have to deal with inventory.

Flipping is all about scoring that rare collectible and "flipping" it for double, triple + your purchase cost. The means of doing so are trivial. Mike's right in that it'll be a detourant for new people trying to do this, but the pros who've been at this for a while will easily clear the hurdle. In the end, Sideshow will lose, because a large part of the collector community who're aware of the QC issues won't order the exclusives anymore and wait for the retailer discounts (or hit up a flipper, in which case Sideshow loses as they only get a single sale out of it). Sadly, it'll hurt them even more by encouraging and justifying the baby birds waiting for Hastings discounts. If there's no reason, and actually a punishment, for buying exclusives, why not find the best deal in town on the regular?

 

[IrishJedi]

the real issue for SSC is QC and that should have been addressed waaaaaay before any kind of deposit policy implements.

Exactly my point. Once again, the onus is put on the consumer and not the company that is making the products.

 

[The Mike]

It'll like Seaward said probably help them, with less people ordering or willing to take the chance, if it does keep ES low and suddenly the piece is revered, they'll have a field day jacking up the price for those who waited on the sidelines. A 750 EX piece that anyone can order might still be flippable but a 250 EX piece because of the new policy for argument's sake is very enticing to try and make a profit, it almost writes the auction tagline for you. Especially for those located "domestically" who can look to selling to overseas customers who will sit out due to shipping worries and deposit because they'll have no other choice.

 

[Something Sexy]

Flipping is all about scoring that rare collectible and "flipping" it for double, triple + your purchase cost. The means of doing so are trivial. Mike's right in that it'll be a detourant for new people trying to do this, but the pros who've been at this for a while will easily clear the hurdle. In the end, Sideshow will lose, because a large part of the collector community who're aware of the QC issues won't order the exclusives anymore and wait for the retailer discounts (or hit up a flipper, in which case Sideshow loses as they only get a single sale out of it). Sadly, it'll hurt them even more by encouraging and justifying the baby birds waiting for Hastings discounts. If there's no reason, and actually a punishment, for buying exclusives, why not find the best deal in town on the regular?

Well I think there are the short term flippers and long term flippers. I agree this policy will definitely help the long term flippers and I can see it hurting any of the short time flippers, even though those are more rare or it will deter people from even trying it.

 

[fuzzylojiks]

Ooooookay. Despite all of the flaming going on here, it still leaves the topic at hand.

This will not deter flippers, I really wonder why people think that had anything to do with it? Honestly Sideshow is a company, do you really think they give a ____ if someone buys and pays for 17 of one thing only to flip it on eBay for profit? They've already been paid, I guarantee you while some employees might think it sucks, as a company overall they could care less. Not to mention those who are flipping know how to do it, at most it might deter someone from trying to do it but most who have tried (myself included) know that you are usually bitten in the ass right away and leave the thought all together. It took one purchase way back when I started collecting SS/HT to lose money on for me to give it up. Those who are still doing it, know how and they'll keep on doing it.

Second, in terms of ES we've heard over and over from Sideshow themselves that while the ES are TBA they have a magic number in mind, that is why the piece sells out because orders surpass that number. It might bring some ES down a little but in all honesty the question stands on how long they'll let an EX just hang out in ordering before putting up a Low Quantity Bar and finally closing the edition. If it last weeks but still goes 350 for example, I'm not sure the deposit policy is the reason, its all subjective piece by piece.

What the DOES effect is impulse buyers who get it and try to hold out to keep the order itself. This was a long time coming especially when they started asking why you were canceling an item, but it still sucks. I don't have much at Sideshow on order right now and with this new Ex policy I probably still won't. If I order a PF and pay the 10% let's assume its $30.00, then can't afford it for whatever reason (I use my bank account not credit like Lonnie) so I flex it to try and give myself more time (assuming its still available) then can't keep it before the first payment is out that is another $20. $50 just to have an exclusive on order isn't worth it. Especially when its just a nameplate or a white collector's stand. Even if I do keep it what if the QC is horrible and after I get it I have to return it? The shipping might dwarf that all together especially for overseas customers....

I'll be patiently waiting for Hastings.

I don't think they are doing this to combat flipping directly, rather they are doing it because they have a ton of cancellations come shipping time leaving lots of product in their warehouse. That is in part due to flippers with multiple accounts driving the ES up, and in another part due to cancelholics that order everything and cancel when it's time to pay the piper.

Whatever it is, it will limit the ES and stop flippers from ordering multiples of products risk free. That in turn will reduce the amount of product in Sideshow's warehouse which is building up from these factors.

In the long run, the collectibles will hold the value better if they want to keep on this track, but I doubt they will anyways.

As for QC, you normally don't see the product until it ships anyways, and you would have already been charged.

They should however make it so the gallery pictures are a more accurate representation and a discrepancy would be a defect and thus would have free return shipping. I've hardly have any QC issues with Sideshow, and for the piece that did they offered to replace it for free. I haven't really heard of anyone so far on the boards with valid QC issues that had to pay for shipping back to Sideshow.

It's premature to think this is the norm anyways. It's one product which we know won't sell well so they are using the the low ES as a carrot to make sure it sells out.

 

[fuzzylojiks]

Well I think there are the short term flippers and long term flippers. I agree this policy will definitely help the long term flippers and I can see it hurting any of the short time flippers, even though those are more rare or it will deter people from even trying it.

Yep, it will deter the short term flips that order a ton then cancel when they can't sell. Which is one of the reasons for the bloated ES. If you think about long term flippers, they are actually in the exact same boat as the real collectors who sell their stuff later on when they need money.

 

[thenammagazine]

I think equating the growing stock in Sideshow's warehouse to flippers and cancelholics is a bit naive. There are uniquely justifiable reasons for each piece that's sitting there, rotting.

 

[IrishJedi]

But here's the thing: I don't give a damn about flippers or flipping or flipflops or whatever. What I care about is Sideshow putting their efforts into ensuring the items I receive look as close as possible to what I looked at when I ordered, and that they have commiserate QC on top of it. And they are absolutely failing there, so they can kiss my ass if they think I'm going to start shelling out non-refundable deposits on their products.

I think equating the stock in Sideshow's warehouse to flippers and cancelholics is a bit naive. There are uniquely justifiable reasons for each piece that's sitting there.

Indeed. Rambo PF anyone?