E3 LIVE

[plasmid303]

That's because Nintendo doesn't have many third party games...good games that the system supports.

I was one of those 50 million that bought one and I'm also one of those 45 million that lets his system collect dust, as are most of my friends as well. We bought into the hype and were let down as there focus is no longer on the core group of gamers.

We had two per household before I moved out my mother and sister bought one with wiifit...they hardly use it. I guess what I'm getting are these points:

Sure it's sold the most console but how many of those user actually play the console on a regular basis? I haven't turned my on for at least 6 months.

And Nintendo may be gaining fans that are tween girls, and children, and little kids, and grandparents, and 50 something year old women with brain age and games of passion. Nintendo may be doing well with sales and numbers but in terms of the core gamer they are focusing less and less on us. Pretty soon Nintendos not even going to really make video games for the masses. It's going to be Microsoft and Sony, and maybe even apple next gen? Nintendo is in a different league, one that doesn't really appeal to me.

And I wish they would because I love my older Nintendo systems.

I mean I watched all 3 press conferences. With Nintendo I saw 2 games that I want. SONY I want about 20. How long can Nintendo go on before they are mocked as the child system. The uncool kiddie system that use to reign supreme.

It's sad, I grew up with their systems. I was one of those hardcore gamers that helped make Nintendo what they are today. It just seems Nintendo's saying this: "Thanks to everyone who made us successful, since the Gamecube didn't do to well, since we made games that didn't appeal to the hardcore masses, and it sold poorly...we are not shifting to focus to non-gamers. And we are going to hook you in with this gimmick, and the promises of our successful popular franchises ever 4 years.

It's a trick. They pulled the blinders on us. We bought it, and now I'm stuck with a game system that appeals more to tween girls than us 20 something male gamers. It's sad and makes me very angry.

......AND BREATHE.....

You made a lot of points, and I'm too lazy to address all of them, so I'm going to distill it down to something small:

Nintendo has never had a good standing with third party publishers. They didn't on the N64, and they didn't on the Gamecube. Both of those systems were considered kid-friendly, a stigma that the Wii has managed to shake off because of its mass appeal across all age demographics. The Gamecube and it's predecessor were never knee-deep in third party hardcore games. Sure, they had a good share, but for the most part it was a dry well. Fast forward to the Wii, and hardcore games flounder on the system -- they just don't sell very well. Nintendo tried, and so did third party publishers. The hard fact is, the Wii's phenom status had a detrimental effect on how games would fare on the system. Out of those 50 million Wii owners, less than a third of them buy hardcore games. And within that 1/3, only some of them buy games on a regular basis. The hardcore crowd hasn't stood up and proved that they are indeed there, and that's why third parties have opted to make casual-friendly titles and Nintendo has picked up the slack with their own first party titles (as you've seen during E3). There's no one at fault except for the audience: Us, the hardcore gamers who cry out for more games suited to our demographic, but when the time comes, no one buys them. Who was there to buy No More Heroes? Not enough, that game flopped. Where were the hardcore gamers when Madworld was released? How about Okami? Even ZELDA TWILIGHT PRINCESS failed to sell as much as Nintendo wanted. WHERE ARE THE HARDCORE GAMERS? We're the ones to blame.

Is there any surprise as to why both Sony and Microsoft has upped the ante on casual games during their E3 presentations? And why Ubisoft and EA both have highlighted games for tweens in their E3 conferences? Because those sell when the hardcore games DON'T. Not every third party publisher has a high profile game like Gears of War or Resident Evil that can sell like hotcakes. Hardcore games have taken a nosedive in sales during 2008. LittleBigPlanet? Undersold. Dead Space? Undersold. Mirror's Edge? flopped. Resistance 2? Sold worse than Resistance 1. FEAR 2? Undersold. Those are all big-budget high profile HARDCORE GAMES that failed despite critical acclaim. Where are the hardcore gamers?

Has anyone noticed that the Wii is the first Nintendo console since the NES that has had more than one true Mario game? That's saying something. I can't believe some people have the nerve to say Nintendo has forgotten the hardcore gamers.

 

[FQRizzo]

Nintendo is doing infinitely better than Sega is now.


Let's see, we have:

Sonic's evil twin Shadow
Sonic as a Werewolf
Sonic in King Arthur's time

R.I.P Sonic

 

[plasmid303]

Nintendo is doing infinitely better than Sega is now.


Let's see, we have:

Sonic's evil twin Shadow
Sonic as a Werewolf
Sonic in King Arthur's time

R.I.P Sonic

HEY! You are so wrong. It's "Werehog".

 

[Starkiller]

You made a lot of points, and I'm too lazy to address all of them, so I'm going to distill it down to something small:

Nintendo has never had a good standing with third party publishers. They didn't on the N64, and they didn't on the Gamecube. Both of those systems were considered kid-friendly, a stigma that the Wii has managed to shake off because of its mass appeal across all age demographics. The Gamecube and it's predecessor were never knee-deep in third party hardcore games. Sure, they had a good share, but for the most part it was a dry well. Fast forward to the Wii, and hardcore games flounder on the system -- they just don't sell very well. Nintendo tried, and so did third party publishers. The hard fact is, the Wii's phenom status had a detrimental effect on how games would fare on the system. Out of those 50 million Wii owners, less than a third of them buy hardcore games. And within that 1/3, only some of them buy games on a regular basis. The hardcore crowd hasn't stood up and proved that they are indeed there, and that's why third parties have opted to make casual-friendly titles and Nintendo has picked up the slack with their own first party titles (as you've seen during E3). There's no one at fault except for the audience: Us, the hardcore gamers who cry out for more games suited to our demographic, but when the time comes, no one buys them. Who was there to buy No More Heroes? Not enough, that game flopped. Where were the hardcore gamers when Madworld was released? How about Okami? Even ZELDA TWILIGHT PRINCESS failed to sell as much as Nintendo wanted. WHERE ARE THE HARDCORE GAMERS. We're the ones to blame.

Is there any surprise as to why both Sony and Microsoft as upped the ante on casual games during their E3 presentations? And why Ubisoft and EA both have highlighted games for tweens? Because those sell when the hardcore games DON'T. Not every third party publisher has a high profile game like Gears of War or Resident Evil that can sell like hotcakes. Hardcore games have taken a nosedive in sales during 2008. LittleBigPlanet? Undersold. Dead Space? Undersold. Mirror's Edge? flopped. Resistance 2? Sold worse than Resistance 1. FEAR 2? Undersold. Those are all big-budget high profile HARDCORE GAMES that failed despite critical acclaim. Where are the hardcore gamers?

Ohh man a lot to address here. See that bolded sentence, your wrong. It's not because us hardcore gamers haven't stood up, it's that nothing appeals to us on the system. You cannot blame the gamers for not buying games that don't appeal to us, and thus that is why there is not third party support. That's a ridiculous claim. It's just simple fact that there are hardly any good third party titles on the wii, and developers are smart enough to know that if they will sell far more if developed for the PS3 and 360, than the Wii...because the install fanbase for Wii is not interested in third party games which are mostly aimed at the gaming crowd. Because most of those who own a wii are not hardcore gamers, and are hardly casual "gamers".

You cannot blame the gamers. You can blame the company for not putting out a system that ultimately bases it's sales on 1st party software as past Nintendo consoles have. Problem is these quality first party titles such as Mario, Zelda, Metroid, are far and few between. I mean this is the first gen since the SNES that two Mario games have been made. That stat right there says something about Nintendo and it's focus.

You cannot blame the third party games. Here: Little Big Planet sold fairly well for being the first of it's kind. Dead Space, was underrated and was GOTY material. Mirror's Edge was overrated and overhyped. Resisatnce 2 changed the successful formula of the first and suffered, and IMHO sucked balls. FEAR 2 was in the same league as games such a Dark Sector...they were solid okay games that weren't really expected to sell much. They are sort of the second stringers, games not expected to be great, but end up being alright.

The hardcore gamers are here. If you make a quality game aimed at us, and put the time, money, and effort in it we will buy it.

But blaming the gamers for lack of sales and not the companies putting out mediocre sequels, and over-hyped games, is just a ridiculous claim.

 

[Sick Boy 82]

Will you girls that that ^^^^ to another thread. None of us ^^^^ing care. Thanks.

 

[Kabukiman]

The Super Nintendo was so much better than the Genesis.

LIES!!! Genesis had "blast processing"!!!!!!!

 

[Starkiller]

Will you girls that that ^^^^ to another thread. None of us ^^^^ing care. Thanks.

It deals with the games, and E3. Deal with it. Stop being a lil whiney bia.

 

[plasmid303]

Ohh man a lot to address here. See that bolded sentence, your wrong. It's not because us hardcore gamers haven't stood up, it's that nothing appeals to us on the system. You cannot blame the gamers for not buying games that don't appeal to us, and thus that is why there is not third party support. That's a ridiculous claim. It's just simple fact that there are hardly any good third party titles on the wii, and developers are smart enough to know that if they will sell far more if developed for the PS3 and 360, than the Wii...because the install fanbase for Wii is not interested in third party games which are mostly aimed at the gaming crowd. Because most of those who own a wii are not hardcore gamers, and are hardly casual "gamers".

You cannot blame the gamers. You can blame the company for not putting out a system that ultimately bases it's sales on 1st party software as past Nintendo consoles have. Problem is these quality first party titles such as Mario, Zelda, Metroid, are far and few between. I mean this is the first gen since the SNES that two Mario games have been made. That stat right there says something about Nintendo and it's focus.

You cannot blame the third party games. Here: Little Big Planet sold fairly well for being the first of it's kind. Dead Space, was underrated and was GOTY material. Mirror's Edge was overrated and overhyped. Resisatnce 2 changed the successful formula of the first and suffered, and IMHO sucked balls. FEAR 2 was in the same league as games such a Dark Sector...they were solid okay games that weren't really expected to sell much. They are sort of the second stringers, games not expected to be great, but end up being alright.

The hardcore gamers are here. If you make a quality game aimed at us, and put the time, money, and effort in it we will buy it.

But blaming the gamers for lack of sales and not the companies putting out mediocre sequels, and over-hyped games, is just a ridiculous claim.

I can blame them and I'm not the only one who thinks so. The games I chose to mention above are from a wide range of genres and are only a small sampling to boot. You cannot say that the hardcore gamers don't buy hardcore games that don't appeal to them because of that. All of those games I listed garnered favorable to fantastic reviews, I made sure to do choose accordingly.

I will address the emboldened part in the quote now: You're saying that the Wii is a failure to our demographic because its survival ISN'T predicated on solely Nintendo's efforts? Are you actually reading what you're typing? The Wii has only been on the market for 3 years and already it has 2 core Mario games. There has been a Metroid game. A Zelda game. A Smash Bros. game. A friggin' Punch Out game. 2 Wario games. A Mario Kart. That breadth and variety already exceeds the Gamecube's efforts in first party. Hate to break it to ya, but for all of it's hardcore efforts, the Gamecube was close to failure in sales. If Sony relied on solely SCEA developed games or Msoft likewise with Microsoft Game Studios titles only, they would already have failed.

The way I see it, the Wii is in better shape than the Gamecube or N64 ever was. And I still blame the hardcore audience for not buying the games they should be.

But I digress. I'm too tired for this.

EDIT: This just in: Nintendo and Miyamoto plans to announce NEW ZELDA game for next year's E3. That makes 2 Zelda games for the Wii. You hardcore gamers better buy it.
https://kotaku.com/5276559/miyamoto-wants-to-announce-new-zelda-next-year

Will you girls that that ^^^^ to another thread. None of us ^^^^ing care. Thanks.

No. But I think I'm done now, so you can stop nagging, ma'am.

 

[Starkiller]

I can blame them and I'm not the only one who thinks so. The games I chose to mention above are from a wide range of genres and are only a small sampling to boot. You cannot say that the hardcore gamers don't buy hardcore games that don't appeal to them because of that. All of those games I listed garnered favorable to fantastic reviews, I made sure to do choose accordingly.

I will address the emboldened part in the quote now: You're saying that the Wii is a failure to our demographic because its survival ISN'T predicated on solely Nintendo's efforts? Are you actually reading what you're typing? The Wii has only been on the market for 3 years and already it has 2 core Mario games. There has been a Metroid game. A Zelda game. A Smash Bros. game. A friggin' Punch Out game. 2 Wario games. A Mario Kart. That breadth and variety already exceeds the Gamecube's efforts in first party. Hate to break it to ya, but for all of it's hardcore efforts, the Gamecube was close to failure in sales. If Sony relied on solely SCEA developed games or Msoft likewise with Microsoft Game Studios titles only, they would already have failed.

The way I see it, the Wii is in better shape than the Gamecube or N64 ever was. And I still blame the hardcore audience for not buying the games they should be.

But I digress. I'm too tired for this.



No. But I think I'm done now, you can stop nagging, ma'am.

No I'm saying the Wii is a failure because it's survival isn't predicated on third party support. You can slash punch out, wario games and mario kart from the list there bub., and 2 mario games? (Only one has been released to date) Just because you feel you can blame us gamers for Nintendo's choice on not to focus on more hardcore oriented games and the failure to latch on third party support. The thing is developers want to make games for SONY and M$ systems because they sell third party games while the Wii can't.

You have no right on thinking what games I *should* buy as a hardcore gamers, half the games you listed suck. Your stating opinions as if they are fact, give up kid.

A gamer saying it's the gamers fault is so contradictory it's crazy. A compnay makes a game thinking it will sell, they put a bunch of money behind it, hype it up, and ultimately it doesn't sell, and it's on the wii...and why didn't sell? Because the demographic they are targetting is playing on the other two consoles and why? Because Nintendo dropped the ball on thirs support with the GC and thus lost a lot of fans and support who went to sony and M$. The Big N just said ^^^^ it, I guess since we lost them, we won't try to get them back.

 

[plasmid303]

No I'm saying the Wii is a failure because it's survival isn't predicated on third party support. You can slash punch out, wario gams and mario kart from the list there bub. Just because you feel you csnblaim us gamers for Nintendo's choice on not to focus on more hardcore oriented games and the failure to latch on third party support. The thing is developers want to make games for SONY and M$ systems because they sell third party games while the Wii can't.

You have no right on thinking what games I *should* buy as a hardcore gamers, half the games you listed suck. Your stating opinions as if they are fact, give up kid.

Thanks for making my point. I knew you'd finally see it my way. developers want to make games for Sony and Msoft because hardcore gamers don't buy their games on Wii because the audience don't know WHAT they want.

The games I listed are all high quality. If you don't believe me, go check metacritic or gamerankings or Amazon's ratings.

You can look up everything I typed, they're all fact-checked. The fact that you're saying the games I listed "suck" merely proves that your opinions are just unsubstantiated, subjective, and retaliatory. The mere fact that you think that I'm telling YOU what games you should buy reflects that you're taking this personally when I'm remarking on the general hardcore audience. Thanks for calling me kid, I appreciate being insulted.

Will you girls that that ^^^^ to another thread. None of us ^^^^ing care. Thanks.

Actually, I think you were right. All of this does come off poorly.

 

[hairlesswookiee]

Thanks for making my point. I knew you'd finally see it my way. developers want to make games for Sony and Msoft because hardcore gamers don't buy their games on Wii because the audience don't know WHAT they want.

The games I listed are all high quality. If you don't believe me, go check metacritic or gamerankings or Amazon's ratings.

You can look up everything I typed, they're all fact-checked. The fact that you're saying the games I listed "suck" merely proves that your opinions are just unsubstantiated, subjective, and retaliatory. The mere fact that you think that I'm telling YOU what games you should buy reflects that you're taking this personally when I'm remarking on the general hardcore audience. Thanks for calling me kid, I appreciate being insulted.

i wouldn't waste your breath on this turd. i went through this with him a while ago and at the end of the day its like talking to the wall. every time i see his posts i hope he gets banned. its better to just ignore him.

 

[Punchy]

LIES!!! Genesis had "blast processing"!!!!!!!

"Genesis Does What Nintendon't"

 

[Starkiller]

Thanks for making my point. I knew you'd finally see it my way. developers want to make games for Sony and Msoft because hardcore gamers don't buy their games on Wii because the audience don't know WHAT they want.

The games I listed are all high quality. If you don't believe me, go check metacritic or gamerankings or Amazon's ratings.

You can look up everything I typed, they're all fact-checked. The fact that you're saying the games I listed "suck" merely proves that your opinions are just unsubstantiated, subjective, and retaliatory. The mere fact that you think that I'm telling YOU what games you should buy reflects that you're taking this personally when I'm remarking on the general hardcore audience. Thanks for calling me kid, I appreciate being insulted.

No it proves the facts that opinions are opinions. And just because you can't wrap your head around the fact that I don't like a game, that you think is good and it has to be good because because metacritic says so, is guess what? STUPID. I'm sure Amazon's rating are the basis of if a game is good or not, you must be a genius.

It's not your point, that's not what we are arguing. Your blaming us for poor third party support for the Wii, and I'm blaming the Nintendo. I know what I want, speak for yourself kid.

 

[plasmid303]

i wouldn't waste your breath on this turd. i went through this with him a while ago and at the end of the day its like talking to the wall. every time i see his posts i hope he gets banned. its better to just ignore him.

Right. I've seen his posts regarding Microsoft.

No it proves the facts that opinions are opinions. And just because you can't wrap your head around the fact that I don't like a game, that you think is good and it has to be good because because metacritic says so, is guess what? STUPID. I'm sure Amazon's rating are the basis of if a game is good or not, you must be a genius.

It's not your point, that's not what we are arguing. Your blaming us for poor third party support for the Wii, and I'm blaming the Nintendo. I know what I want, speak for yourself kid.

that's nice.

 

[Starkiller]

i wouldn't waste your breath on this turd. I went through this with him a while ago and at the end of the day its like talking to the wall. Every time i see his posts i hope he gets banned. Its better to just ignore him.

andddd....ignore list go!!!

Right. I've seen his posts regarding Microsoft.

Gasp!!! He doesn't like the M$ or the 360, he's such a tool then. He doesn't agree with us, kill the outsider!!!

This is not a debate about which system is better, talking to you trying to make you see the light is pointless. You can blame us all you want. It's ultimately Nintendo's fault for losing it's third party support.


And here I thought are debate was about Nintendo, now I guess it's about ganging up on me. It's cool, do what you must to make yourself feel better.

 

[karamazov80]

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[Starkiller]

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LOL, nice videos?

 

[karamazov80]

Just proving how awesome SNES was. This evidence is irrefutable.

 

[hairlesswookiee]

andddd....ignore list go!!!

fine with me. the less i see of you the better.

 

[Starkiller]

Just proving how awesome SNES was. This evidence is irrefutable.

Too true my friend.

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