General NBA Discussion

[WWEJedi]

Many professional sports writers consider Jordan not only the greatest basketball player of all time, but the greatest athlete of all time, even over Babe Ruth, Jim Thorpe, Pele, etc. (the AP poll from about a decade ago put him number 2 after Babe). I think it's a pretty objective fact that saying that he's better than Lebron is not over-rating him.

The greatest athlete of all time is Babe Ruth. Great pitcher, great hitter. Lifted the spirits of Americans everyday during the great depression and was seen as such an icon the Japanese would yell "to hell with Babe Ruth" while charging. No athlete has ever had such an impact on the American people as a whole as Babe Ruth.

 

[jstep13]

The Detroit teams from 03-08 went to six straight conference finals and beat a Kobe/Shaq/Phil led prime Lakers team in the Finals.
The Celtics, when healthy, went to three conference finals and beat another great Lakers team.

What made the Suns, Blazers, Sonics better than these Pistons and Celtics?

It's call parity. Again as everyone has pointed out, The East hasn't been relevant since Jordan left. It's not that difficult to dominate that awful conference. I'll give them the fact the Pistons were able to beat Lakers Reloaded, but as we've seen it often takes Super Teams more than a season to gel (case in point the 2011 Heat). And that Celtics team was basically a one year wonder. They were an aging squad that beat a Lakers team (they were in no way shape or form "great"). There's nothing memorable about the Pistons (how many hof from that team did they produce?) or the ancient Celtics team where they were all past their prime.

On the other hand, not only did MJ have to defeat the mighty Pistons, but then he had the task of taking on the Blazers (prime Drexler), Suns (prime Barkley, KJ) and Sonics (prime Glove and Kemp) - where all 3 teams have either produced bona fide hof or are in serious consideration to do become one. Most agree that 80-90's basketball is the Golden Age of the NBA (where defenses and rules were 1000% tougher than today's game) and MJ curbstomped all of them on the way to 6 titles (and possibly 8-9 titles had he not retired twice). If you go to any basketball forum and try and spit that the Millennial Pistons/Celtics were tougher than 90's Suns/Blazers/Sonics you would be laughed off the forum.

Sorry bub, you're in the minority here.

 

[Darth Madden]

I thought you were a Seattle/Tampa Bay fan.

I am but Seattle and Tampa Bay don't have NBA teams.

 

[jstep13]

The greatest athlete of all time is Babe Ruth. Great pitcher, great hitter. Lifted the spirits of Americans everyday during the great depression and was seen as such an icon the Japanese would yell "to hell with Babe Ruth" while charging. No athlete has ever had such an impact on the American people as a whole as Babe Ruth.

Greatest athlete eh?



If you're gonna play that multi-talent card (the rest of your statement is pure conjecture), then Babe Ruth has nothing on Jim Thorpe, Jackie Robinson or Bo Jackson...Babe was great no doubt but he did come a long at the right place, right time. And remember, it was during segregation. Imagine we had segregation today, how different the landscape would be for professional sports.

 

[mutant-man]

This thread is exhausting. To those saying Lebron is overrated: the series, and in a larger sense his career, is not over. And there's no point comparing him to MJ: different teams, coaches, eras and circumstances. Both are all-time greats.

 

[DinoDB1975]

^You must be new here .

This is what we do in the NBA thread.

 

[Darth Madden]

This thread is exhausting. To those saying Lebron is overrated: the series, and in a larger sense his career, is not over. And there's no point comparing him to MJ: different teams, coaches, eras and circumstances. Both are all-time greats.

Sounds about right... all you can really say about a guy is if he is the best of his era (and even that might be tough to do when comparing different positions.)

 

[sarakawa]

This thread is exhausting. To those saying Lebron is overrated: the series, and in a larger sense his career, is not over. And there's no point comparing him to MJ: different teams, coaches, eras and circumstances. Both are all-time greats.

Haha, it is exhausting right? But you are correct, this series is far from over. I'm interested to see how Game 2 goes. I have a feeling it will be a close game but the Warriors have to get more from the splash brothers to win. I'm actually surprised how well Love played...he's gonna disappear at some point in one of these games...

 

[WWEJedi]

It's call parity. Again as everyone has pointed out, The East hasn't been relevant since Jordan left. It's not that difficult to dominate that awful conference. I'll give them the fact the Pistons were able to beat Lakers Reloaded, but as we've seen it often takes Super Teams more than a season to gel (case in point the 2011 Heat). And that Celtics team was basically a one year wonder. They were an aging squad that beat a Lakers team (they were in no way shape or form "great"). There's nothing memorable about the Pistons (how many hof from that team did they produce?) or the ancient Celtics team where they were all past their prime.

On the other hand, not only did MJ have to defeat the mighty Pistons, but then he had the task of taking on the Blazers (prime Drexler), Suns (prime Barkley, KJ) and Sonics (prime Glove and Kemp) - where all 3 teams have either produced bona fide hof or are in serious consideration to do become one. Most agree that 80-90's basketball is the Golden Age of the NBA (where defenses and rules were 1000% tougher than today's game) and MJ curbstomped all of them on the way to 6 titles (and poissbley 8-9 titles had he not retired twice). If you go to any basketball forum and try and spit that the Millennial Pistons/Celtics were tougher than 90's Suns/Blazers/Sonics you would be laughed off the forum.

Sorry bub, you're in the minority here.

Jordan didn't retire. He was forced out of the league due to gambling. Then played terrible baseball.

Those Pistons teams are underrated. They, along with the Celtics, could beat the Blazers, Suns, Sonics. Actually.... I would rank that 2004 Pistons team as one of the best ever. I am bias in that ranking, but if you look at the stats and just the games they played... they were a terrific team. As far as HOFers from the Pistons... Sheed, Big Ben, Billups all have a case.

 

[Darkseed]

^You must be new here .

This is what we do in the NBA thread.

as old an irrelevant as the GOAT topic is...this statement is true. Muddle your way thru the weeds

 

[Sweet Rabbit]

Greatest athlete eh?

View attachment 268180

If you're gonna play that multi-talent card (the rest of your statement is pure conjecture), then Babe Ruth has nothing on Jim Thorpe, Jackie Robinson or Bo Jackson...Babe was great no doubt but he did come a long at the right place, right time. And remember, it was during segregation. Imagine we had segregation today, how different the landscape would be for professional sports.

Or Deion Sanders

 

[Sweet Rabbit]

It's call parity. Again as everyone has pointed out, The East hasn't been relevant since Jordan left. It's not that difficult to dominate that awful conference. I'll give them the fact the Pistons were able to beat Lakers Reloaded, but as we've seen it often takes Super Teams more than a season to gel (case in point the 2011 Heat). And that Celtics team was basically a one year wonder. They were an aging squad that beat a Lakers team (they were in no way shape or form "great"). There's nothing memorable about the Pistons (how many hof from that team did they produce?) or the ancient Celtics team where they were all past their prime.

On the other hand, not only did MJ have to defeat the mighty Pistons, but then he had the task of taking on the Blazers (prime Drexler), Suns (prime Barkley, KJ) and Sonics (prime Glove and Kemp) - where all 3 teams have either produced bona fide hof or are in serious consideration to do become one. Most agree that 80-90's basketball is the Golden Age of the NBA (where defenses and rules were 1000% tougher than today's game) and MJ curbstomped all of them on the way to 6 titles (and possibly 8-9 titles had he not retired twice). If you go to any basketball forum and try and spit that the Millennial Pistons/Celtics were tougher than 90's Suns/Blazers/Sonics you would be laughed off the forum.

Sorry bub, you're in the minority here.

And the Jazz had two Hall of Famers on it too

 

[Sweet Rabbit]

Jordan didn't retire. He was forced out of the league due to gambling. Then played terrible baseball.

Those Pistons teams are underrated. They, along with the Celtics, could beat the Blazers, Suns, Sonics. Actually.... I would rank that 2004 Pistons team as one of the best ever. I am bias in that ranking, but if you look at the stats and just the games they played... they were a terrific team. As far as HOFers from the Pistons... Sheed, Big Ben, Billups all have a case.

He retired the first time because his Dad was murdered

 

[filip629]

The Detroit teams from 03-08 went to six straight conference finals and beat a Kobe/Shaq/Phil led prime Lakers team in the Finals.
The Celtics, when healthy, went to three conference finals and beat another great Lakers team.

What made the Suns, Blazers, Sonics better than these Pistons and Celtics?

Edit: What makes those team better than the Warriors or Spurs teams faced by LeBron?

MJ is the GOAT. 6-0 in the Finals, 6 time Finals MVP, multiple Defensive player of the year awards, multiple NBA scoring titles, multiple League MVPs, and the BEST PER rating of any player in the NBA. Magic, Russell, Barkley, Baylor, Cousy, Shaq, West, and Pippen are all Legendary players who have played in different eras of the NBA. Do you know what all of these iconic players have in common? When EVERY one of them was asked publicly who is the GOAT of the NBA...EVERY one of them answered MJ. I'll take all the credentials I listed above and the opinion of the Legendary players of the NBA over anything you have to say any day of the week.

Oh, and by the way, Tom Brady never has been and never will be GOAT. You can't lose 2 Super Bowls to Giants teams that barely made the playoffs and get GOAT consideration (especially when you had an undefeated team in one of those Super Bowls). On top of that, he would have lost his last Super Bowl if the Seahawks would have been smart enough to just hand the ball off at the 1 yard line. He should be 3-3 in the big game. 4-2 is a bit better but just one step above average. 6-0 and being 6 time Superbowl MVP would have made Brady GOAT....just ask MJ.

 

[filip629]

He retired the first time because his Dad was murdered

Exactly. Just shows the lack of knowledge and understanding he has for the history of the game. His age is definitely showing.

 

[Sweet Rabbit]

Exactly. Just shows the lack of knowledge and understanding he has for the history of the game. His age is definitely showing.

I mean really...he's arguing with people that saw the **** live on tv and not on YouTube

 

[Sweet Rabbit]

Lebron is even too chicken **** to do a Slam Dunk Contest

 

[DinoDB1975]

MJ is the GOAT. 6-0 in the Finals, 6 time Finals MVP, multiple Defensive player of the year awards, multiple NBA scoring titles, multiple League MVPs, and the BEST PER rating of any player in the NBA. Magic, Russell, Barkley, Baylor, Cousy, Shaq, West, and Pippen are all Legendary players who have played in different eras of the NBA. Do you know what all of these iconic players have in common? When EVERY one of them was asked publicly who is the GOAT of the NBA...EVERY one of them answered MJ. I'll take all the credentials I listed above and the opinion of the Legendary players of the NBA over anything you have to say any day of the week.

Oh, and by the way, Tom Brady never has been and never will be GOAT. You can't lose 2 Super Bowls to Giants teams that barely made the playoffs and get GOAT consideration (especially when you had an undefeated team in one of those Super Bowls). On top of that, he would have lost his last Super Bowl if the Seahawks would have been smart enough to just hand the ball off at the 1 yard line. He should be 3-3 in the big game. 4-2 is a bit better but just one step above average. 6-0 and being 6 time Superbowl MVP would have made Brady GOAT....just ask MJ.

Is posting that Michael Jackson popcorn GIF still a ban-inducing offense?

I love sports.

 

[mikedanger]

I love the way WWE argues a point though.

I looked back and in 5 minutes I have determined that the 2015-2016 Orlando Magic could beat the 90's Suns/Blazers/Sonics so Lebron is the GOAT.

Then he asks you to argue that point, LMAO. What a character. Sure did miss the kid.

 

[filip629]

I mean really...he's arguing with people that saw the **** live on tv and not on YouTube

For real, and it's obvious. No one who watched the Pistons in the Bad Boyz era is going to say the Wallace lead Pistons are better. Who in their right minds would say the Pierce/Allen/Garnett Celtics are anywhere near the talent of the Bird/Parish/McHale/Ainge/Walton Celtics? It undermines anyone's credibility to say so.

I'm not above or below giving credit where it's due. The Duncan led Spurs were a great team. The Kobe/Shaq Lakers were no joke. However, each of those dynasties lost in the NBA Finals. That always leaves a blemish when GOAT conversations are had. LeBron's days are numbered. You can talk about lack of talent on his teams but the man made it to 7 NBA finals. So, his teams are either talented because he got there or he's not the GOAT because he lost 4 (this year is TBD). Bron fans can't have it both ways. If his teams sucked, he wouldn't have made it to the Finals 7 times. If he was GOAT, he wouldn't have lost 4 times (could be 5). Fans need to stop making excuses. If you want to be considered GOAT, you have to win championships. Getting there isn't enough, you have to win them when you're in them.